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Please help me choose a card for Oblivion

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January 30, 2007 9:46:31 AM

Hello buddies,
I bought a new system recently,
Core 2 Duo E6300
Intel 965RY
1 GB Corsair DDR2

I want to get a card which would play Oblivion in atleast 1024X768 resolution with antialiasing n af without any lag.
I have heard X1900GT/X1950 pro will be more than enough, but i cant fish out that much amount.

Will 7600GT suffice my need?

More about : choose card oblivion

January 30, 2007 10:13:39 AM

Quote:
Hello buddies,
I bought a new system recently,
Core 2 Duo E6300
Intel 965RY
1 GB Corsair DDR2

I want to get a card which would play Oblivion in atleast 1024X768 resolution with antialiasing n af without any lag.
I have heard X1900GT/X1950 pro will be more than enough, but i cant fish out that much amount.

Will 7600GT suffice my need?


Ooooh a toughie, maybe without AA/AF you might be ok, certainly inside, but when you get outside you might run into a bit more trouble. Save some more money up, and go with the 1950pro
January 30, 2007 10:25:08 AM

My system gets about 20-25fps outdoors in Oblivion with every MAX, no aa, no af.
Related resources
January 30, 2007 10:51:30 AM

I'm sorry but can someone tell me whats indoor/outdoor is?

Im from India buddy, so price range i can give you only in rupees & whats given in Dollars cant be taken into consideration as it will increase once it crosses borders :D 

How about F.E.A.R n HL2 & games of same level , will 7600GT be enough at 1024 X 768 resolution ?

Thanks in advance
a b U Graphics card
January 30, 2007 10:55:29 AM

Yeah, the X1950 pro spanks every other AGP card in Oblivion. It's not even close.

Have a look at the demanding outdoor foliage areas:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/xfx_geforce_7600_gt...
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/powercolor_radeon_x...

That's the area of the games that is going to limit your playable settings and you can see what you get for going $50 over a 7600GT AGP is a monterous performance leap for that game. Not to mention, with the 7600GT, (you mention using FSAA). This will mean turning off HDR as the 7600GT can't do both, the X1950 pro can. I did that with my 6800U AGP, unhappy at 1024x768 having to choose one or the other. (both look great)

Anyway, a X1650 pro would be a good cheap choice for Oblivion, but fall behind the 7600GT in just about all other games. Simply put, while a 7600GT and 7800GS are good cards, they don't provide good Oblivion bang for buck. And if Firingsquad had shared the minimum fps, the 7600GT would bottom out way below it's average while the X1950 pro will stay more consistent. $180 for a 7600GT or $230 for a X1950 pro for an Oblivion upgrade points me straight to the X1950. Again study those foliage charts.
January 30, 2007 10:56:33 AM

in oblivion you can enter buildings, this is indoors - which is a lot less hardware heavy so you'd get a decent Frame rate...

However, while out side there is a lot of data that needs to be drawn, and thus your FPS suffers.

For hl2 it should be fine at them resolutions.
January 30, 2007 11:11:03 AM

Quote:
Yeah, the X1950 pro spanks every other AGP card in Oblivion. It's not even close.

Have a look at the demanding outdoor foliage areas:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/xfx_geforce_7600_gt...
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/powercolor_radeon_x...

That's the area of the games that is going to limit your playable settings and you can see what you get for going $50 over a 7600GT AGP is a monterous performance leap for that game. Not to mention, with the 7600GT, (you mention using FSAA). This will mean turning off HDR as the 7600GT can't do both, the X1950 pro can. I did that with my 6800U AGP, unhappy at 1024x768 having to choose one or the other. (both look great)

Anyway, a X1650 pro would be a good cheap choice for Oblivion, but fall behind the 7600GT in just about all other games. Simply put, while a 7600GT and 7800GS are good cards, they don't provide good Oblivion bang for buck. And if Firingsquad had shared the minimum fps, the 7600GT would bottom out way below it's average while the X1950 pro will stay more consistent. $180 for a 7600GT or $230 for a X1950 pro for an Oblivion upgrade points me straight to the X1950. Again study those foliage charts.


Appreciate your review pal.

Checked out the chart buddy, wow the difference in FPS is huge b/w 7600GT & X1950Pro, so can i consider this as an investment if I go for Radeon X1950Pro and wouldnt have to look back for the next 1-11/2 years ?

Any comments on X1900GT ?
January 30, 2007 11:17:41 AM

Quote:
in oblivion you can enter buildings, this is indoors - which is a lot less hardware heavy so you'd get a decent Frame rate...

However, while out side there is a lot of data that needs to be drawn, and thus your FPS suffers.

For hl2 it should be fine at them resolutions.


Ooh okiee, got it now, indoor n outdoor.
January 30, 2007 11:22:15 AM

Quote:
Any comments on X1900GT ?

Great! :D 

About same as a X1950Pro.
January 30, 2007 11:25:05 AM

Quote:

Any comments on X1900GT ?


It´s almost as good as the 1950 Pro, but it should be cheaper. It doesn´t have the new Crossfire connector (but who cares for crossfire?).
January 30, 2007 11:47:31 AM

Quote:

Any comments on X1900GT ?


It´s almost as good as the 1950 Pro, but it should be cheaper. It doesn´t have the new Crossfire connector (but who cares for crossfire?).

lol, not thinking abt sli/crossfire. right now wanna purchase an extremely good card :) 
a b U Graphics card
January 30, 2007 11:58:11 AM

Agree with all the other posts here. Oblivian favors the ATI cards.
If you want to play Oblivian, the X1950PRO will give the best performance for the money, and a small performace edge over the X1900GT.
It also runs cooler and uses less power than the X1900 series cards.
The X1950PRO has been available here for 180-220 US dollars.
I grabbed one at Microcenter a couple weeks ago for $199, and thinking about getting another one for and setting up crossfire. For $199, it is a very solid performing card.
January 30, 2007 12:07:17 PM

Quote:
Agree with all the other posts here. Oblivian favors the ATI cards.
If you want to play Oblivian, the X1950PRO will give the best performance for the money, and a small performace edge over the X1900GT.
It also runs cooler and uses less power than the X1900 series cards.
The X1950PRO has been available here for 180-220 US dollars.
I grabbed one at Microcenter a couple weeks ago for $199, and thinking about getting another one for and setting up crossfire. For $199, it is a very solid performing card.


Cool, saw the 199$ tag in microcenter buddy. But do they ship to India?
January 30, 2007 12:11:33 PM

Quote:
Agree with all the other posts here. Oblivian favors the ATI cards.

Unless it's a 8800. :wink:
a b U Graphics card
January 30, 2007 12:20:08 PM

Yep. :D  But they are still slightly out of his price range I think.
January 30, 2007 12:28:48 PM

The industry is transitioning to DX 10 so it's a hard time to recommend hardware...if you can wait a few months for vista to stabilize the DX 10 cards may be the way to go.

Otherwise go for the X1950 models...

When I build in a year I won't have less than a Geforce 8800, hopefully something from ATI.
January 30, 2007 12:38:31 PM

Quote:
Yep. :D  But they are still slightly out of his price range I think.


8800, out of question my friend :D 
January 30, 2007 1:02:50 PM

Dude is your system currently working or the parts are waiting to start working? I ask this because you should definately wait. Around March, maybe earlier, the nvidia 8600 should be available and it will kick the 1950 pro. Also you can consider the more expensive 8800 gts with 320MB memory for around 300$. Your choice but i would wait. Good luck.
January 30, 2007 1:24:54 PM

any idea on how much would a 8600 cost?
Its hard to find stores that would ship components to India :( 
January 30, 2007 1:28:43 PM

Quote:
Dude is your system currently working or the parts are waiting to start working? I ask this because you should definately wait. Around March, maybe earlier, the nvidia 8600 should be available and it will kick the 1950 pro. Also you can consider the more expensive 8800 gts with 320MB memory for around 300$. Your choice but i would wait. Good luck.


I'd actually disagree with waiting now, especially considering the price range. I've always found that buying at the end of a hardware cycle to be the most cost efficient way to get good performance. You can find excellent prices on hardware that was twice as much just a couple months ago, get mature drivers and support, and have a good life-span. Currently, your looking at at least 1 - 1 1/2 years before dx9 cards become unsupported with new games. You can pick up a 1900gt for well under $150 which will give you good performance in OB (although Oblivion in atleast 1024X768 resolution with antialiasing n af without any lag is a stretch with any dx9 card in that price range).

Sure, you can spend $250 - 300 on an 8600 when it comes out next month, but it appears for the original post that this is not an option. Also, your looking at a 15-25% mark-up in India.

A little off topic, but why can't those outside the US/Can not buy from online dealers like Newegg, TigerDirect etc.? Probably a stupid question, but I never really understood that. Do they not ship outside of the States?
January 30, 2007 1:36:03 PM

Quote:
any idea on how much would a 8600 cost?
Its hard to find stores that would ship components to India :( 


My guess would be $250 - 280 since Nv is matching it against the x1950xt.
January 30, 2007 1:42:08 PM

Of course they ship, but many of us don't have credit cards or payplal accounts. Well at least they ship in Europe, not sure about India. As for waiting, i agree with your strategy but i think it applies better in previous generation high end cards. Previous gen mid to high cards won't cut it when it comes to performance now and especially in two or three months. I suggested 8600 not for the DX10 but for the great DX9 ability especially compared in modes with HDR and AA combined. The 8600's unified shaders are just superior then previous gens efficiency. If you want it that way, wait till march when R600 is out and hit a X1900XTX for about 200 ~250 range in ebay. Still better than a fast purchase of a 1950 pro tomorrow.
January 30, 2007 1:43:37 PM

Also, your looking at a 15-25% mark-up in India >> absolutely true my friend.

I guess newegg & tigerdirect do not ship to India :( 
January 30, 2007 2:05:37 PM

Quote:
My system gets about 20-25fps outdoors in Oblivion with every MAX, no aa, no af.


thats odd. I have a very similar system to yours.
E6400, asrock dual vsta, 1gb ddr400, msi x1950 pro 256mb (pci-e).
and I get 40-45fps average at 1280*1024 with hdr.
January 30, 2007 2:06:04 PM

by the way, do i need to have any special PSU if im going for cards like X1900Gt or X1950 Pro?
January 30, 2007 2:08:22 PM

What PSU do you currently have?
January 30, 2007 2:20:32 PM

It should be a generic 400W one buddy
January 30, 2007 2:44:33 PM

I agree with minim3


I am also having a similar system
E6400, 1GB ram, 400w psu, gecube 1900GT

I am able to run oblivion with both HDR n antialiasing turned on at
1024X768 resolution . Even though that resolution is horrible by a gamer's standard.

Atleast I am able to feel the vibrant oblivion outdoors'
a b U Graphics card
January 30, 2007 5:06:35 PM

Quote:
Dude is your system currently working or the parts are waiting to start working? I ask this because you should definately wait. Around March, maybe earlier, the nvidia 8600 should be available and it will kick the 1950 pro.


You're basing this on what, hopes and dreams or unicorn dust?

So are you going based on the 256bit hope, which would likely be realistic, or the 128bit hope which currently looks like the format, but is less likely to 'kick' the X1950, may be closer to tieing, especially once higher rez/AA limits bandwidth.

Quote:
Of course they ship, but many of us don't have credit cards or payplal accounts. Well at least they ship in Europe, not sure about India.


Actually NewEgg does not ship outside the US, in fact they don't even ship within the US with a foreign CreditCard. You have to use a US destination address and a US dollar us located Credit Card to order anything. TigerDirect ay be different (never bothered buying from TigerDirect in the US, they have a stor in Toronto), but NewEgg is anal about shipping to the US.

Also are we talking about AGP or PCIe, I didn't find quick specs on the board with a google blast, and not bothering while at work?
But, I've seen AGP mentioned, and then some PCIe-only cards offered along with dual format offferings as well.
January 30, 2007 5:43:36 PM

Well we can't be sure but there are supposed to be two versions of 8600 the GT and Ultra. The ultra one will have 256 bit memory bus and come in 256- 512 versions. Thing is that 8600U will feature 64 unified shaders. So good luck beating that with 36 pixel and 8 vertex reserved shaders.
January 30, 2007 6:09:30 PM

Quote:
My system gets about 20-25fps outdoors in Oblivion with every MAX, no aa, no af.


thats odd. I have a very similar system to yours.
E6400, asrock dual vsta, 1gb ddr400, msi x1950 pro 256mb (pci-e).
and I get 40-45fps average at 1280*1024 with hdr.

Don't mean to be rude, but are you just saying that, or have you actually benchmarked it? At max quality, there is no way an X1950pro could get those frames outside.

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics.html?modelx=33&m...
x1950xtx gets 20fps avg outdoors
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2858&p=7
Not quite max quality, and only 22fps avg. Also a quick look, you'll notice they cut grass distance to 50%, as that takes a huge performance hit.

Ontop of these benchmarks, the Asrock 775 dual vsta has a PCI-E slot that runs at 4x. While it doesn't effect games that much, it's still another variable. Also the PT880 chipset isn't the most efficient either. DDR400 also isn't as fast as some good DDR2 800 memory.

In short, there are so many variables that disprove your exact comment. Oblivion 1280x1024 + x1950pro + HDR = 45fps avg? Bulls***
January 30, 2007 6:10:03 PM

Sorry for double post.
a b U Graphics card
January 30, 2007 10:10:15 PM

Quote:
But, I've seen AGP mentioned, and then some PCIe-only cards offered along with dual format offferings as well

:oops:  That was my mistake in bringing up AGP. Was thinking of another thread I just read and have no idea why AGP stuck in my head while replying to this one. (must have contracted luditinosis) :roll: Yeah, PCI-e broadens the choices alot, but because it's for Oblivion I still say avoid the 7600GT.
January 31, 2007 10:18:18 AM

Thanks for the replies guys.

So as a final word, is it worth to wait for 8600GT taking into account it offers Dx10 flexibility?

And how much would the price range be, 250-275 $ ?
February 1, 2007 2:43:25 PM

I do not know how accurate these are, but these were posted in an earlier thread and shows the 8600 Ultra at about $179.

http://www.guru3d.com/newsitem.php?id=4834

http://www.nordichardware.com/news,5442.html[/quote]

Wow, hadn't seen that. Should be a good deal, especially if it beats or equals the 1950xt. Plus, you've got dx10 support.[/quote]

Absolutely, if thats true, Oh boyy !!! then there's so much action to be had.
Then Hopefully the price of other high end cards which doesnt support dx10 should drop too. Fingers Crossed :D 
February 1, 2007 2:59:24 PM

Quote:
Any comments on X1900GT ?

Great! :D 

About same as a X1950Pro.

Much better overclocker too!
February 1, 2007 5:14:21 PM

Just wanted to offer another option, the X1650 XTs are cheap and do really well with the tough oblivion outdoor scenes, where it counts.

Check these outdoor benches... it killed the 7600 GT, and was pretty close to the X1950 PRO and 7900 GS:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-x...

You can get the X1650 XT for $120 on newegg nowadays.
a b U Graphics card
February 1, 2007 5:21:34 PM

Good price.

And considering Oblivion, dontcha think that XT and another 256 MB (system memory) is the way to go?

I understand people's anticipation of the GF8600 series, but there's no way he's getting anywhere near that performance while remaining stuck on 256MB IMO.
February 1, 2007 5:59:01 PM

WTF? He only has 256mb of system memory?

Jesus murphy.
February 1, 2007 6:12:37 PM

No, he has 1GB.

I'd say get another gig of ram though, and then buy a video card. Oblivion snorts ram like a cokehead.
February 1, 2007 6:22:50 PM

Oblivion likes more, but I've run all my oblivion testing with 1gb. Works pretty well, IMHO.
February 1, 2007 6:31:27 PM

Quote:


Appreciate your review pal.

Checked out the chart buddy, wow the difference in FPS is huge b/w 7600GT & X1950Pro, so can i consider this as an investment if I go for Radeon X1950Pro and wouldnt have to look back for the next 1-11/2 years ?

Any comments on X1900GT ?


The X1900GT uses alot more power than the X1950Pro, but they perform similarly
a b U Graphics card
February 1, 2007 6:41:01 PM

Quote:
WTF? He only has 256mb of system memory?

Jesus murphy.


DAMN, I'm mixing threads again! :oops: 

Thought this was the previous one where we discussed Oblivion and a simialr set of cards. Dand, need to do an 'All' page view sometimes. :x

Here's the other thread;
http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam...
February 2, 2007 12:41:30 PM

So, taking into consideration that i have only 1 GB of RAM , should i go for X1900GT or is it better to wait until they release the 8600 series with Dx10 capabilities ?

I wont be restrained to OBlivion alone, I enjoy lotsa FPS action too.
Wanna play FEAR,HL2,DOOM3 n all.
February 2, 2007 1:07:55 PM

Actaully there have been many reports that the prices should be in the $150-$180 Range since it is actually replacing the 7600. (Which now sells in the $100-$140 Range.)

The 8600 will come in two flavors with the lower end one running the $150 while the higher one at $180. This price, however, will likely take a couple weeks to settle with the 1st shipments going at a much higher price.
February 2, 2007 1:20:17 PM

Quote:
My system gets about 20-25fps outdoors in Oblivion with every MAX, no aa, no af.


thats odd. I have a very similar system to yours.
E6400, asrock dual vsta, 1gb ddr400, msi x1950 pro 256mb (pci-e).
and I get 40-45fps average at 1280*1024 with hdr.

Don't mean to be rude, but are you just saying that, or have you actually benchmarked it? At max quality, there is no way an X1950pro could get those frames outside.

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics.html?modelx=33&m...
x1950xtx gets 20fps avg outdoors
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2858&p=7
Not quite max quality, and only 22fps avg. Also a quick look, you'll notice they cut grass distance to 50%, as that takes a huge performance hit.

Ontop of these benchmarks, the Asrock 775 dual vsta has a PCI-E slot that runs at 4x. While it doesn't effect games that much, it's still another variable. Also the PT880 chipset isn't the most efficient either. DDR400 also isn't as fast as some good DDR2 800 memory.

In short, there are so many variables that disprove your exact comment. Oblivion 1280x1024 + x1950pro + HDR = 45fps avg? Bulls***

I used fraps. The cpu is overclocked at 2.35 (as this mobo doesn't allow anything over 300mhz fsb). The gpu is clocked@620mhz (original 580mhz) and memory@1500mhz (instead of 1380). Still I don't know why you have so low fps. There's article at anandtech that tested ddr800 and ddr400 at this mobo and didn't see any noticable difference. (5%). I can find it if you want.

here's a test for you. Whats your score in 3dmark06 @1280*1024 with standard tests? Mine is 4992. I will post a screenshot if that will make you happy!
February 2, 2007 1:22:42 PM

if you can wait for 8600ultra go for it. If you can't wait, I would suggest 1950xt ot 1950pro. Whatever suits your budget. They will serve you well.
February 2, 2007 1:27:08 PM

Seems like I shud go for a low end card like X1600 XT or whichever you buddies suggest and wait for the release of 8600 series.
Coz taking a X1900GT / X1950 Pro might be a waste of money now.

X1900 GT was priced 350$ here in India , approx 16K Rupees,
X1950 Pro was priced 320 $ approx 14K Rupees, I know its insanity

But with few or no major online stores shipping to India, for us, its a disaster. We ll have to either wait for the price to settle or buy the chocolate bars by giving the marked up price which the retailer puts up :cry: 
February 2, 2007 1:31:16 PM

damn. India. Crazy prices. But I don't think 1600xt will cut it. 1950pro will serve you for more that a year even if you buy it now. If you wanna see reasonable performance in your pc I think you gonna have to bite the bullet.

quote "X1900 GT was priced 350$ here in India , approx 16K Rupees,
X1950 Pro was priced 320 $ approx 14K Rupees, I know its insanity"

wtf? 1950pro>1900gt and they still sell the gt for more money?? that makes no sense.
!