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E4300 Overclocking wall?

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February 1, 2007 1:32:09 PM

OK, here's my question/dilemma. I recently bought an E4300, just to see how far I could push it with a decent setup. My problem is that I seem to have hit a wall at 3.1Ghz. The problem seems to be with my FSB which will not boot windows with anything greater than 350Mhz. I've seen people with similar setups reach over 500Mhz. My temps don't seem to be an issue as my range is 32c - 41c at 3.1Ghz. While I'm happy with 3.1Ghz I feel it could go a little further. Any suggestions? Thanks in advanced for any help!

---SPECS---
Intel E4300
Gigabyte 965P-DQ6
BFG 8800GTS
Zalman CNPS 9700
2 x Corsair 1G XMS DDR26400 (800Mhz) 5-5-5-12
OCZ 600W PSU
WD Raptor 74G

---BIOS---
BIOS - R7 (I know R9 is out but I wanted to let it burn in for a while, and I've herad R8 is terrible)
FSB set to 350Mhz
DDR2 Voltage 2.2V
MCH Voltage 1.55V
FSB Voltage 1.40V
CPU Voltage 1.40V
All other monitoring/performance settings disabled

FSB:RAM ratio set to 2.00 (1:1)
February 1, 2007 4:02:15 PM

I have a similar setup...
Corsair ram, same timings
GA-965p-ds3 rev2 (latest bios)
Tuniq 120 cooler
PCI 3dfx Voodoo Banshee (oldschool!)

You shouldn't need to boost the voltages for dram, mch, or fsb. I originally tried raising them as well, but it didn't seem to help any so I left it at its normal setting.
I also heard setting your PCI-E freq to 100mhz can help some.

If you need a reference of voltage/fsb combo's that seem to work, these are the ones I've found so far that are stable with Orthos CPU small FFT testing for at least 6 hours:
*Temps are from Speedfan, since CoreTemp seems to under report my temps by a good ~10c.

fsb 350x9
vcore 1.3625

cpu-z: 161837
fsb 358x9
vcore 1.3975v
load temp: 52c

cpu-z: 162155
fsb 362x9
vcore 1.40625v (-1 notch?)
load temp: 54c

cpu-z: 162524
fsb 366x9
vcore 1.43750v
load temp: 55c

cpu-z: 162840
fsb 372x9
vcore 1.46875
load temp: 58c

Going to do some longer testing this weekend. I know Orthos failed a blended test @ 7 hours on the last 372fsb x 9 setting.
February 1, 2007 4:57:09 PM

I've been having some trouble with my overclock here is my setup.

E4300
Scythe Ninja Rev.B
Gigabyte 965p-s3 F6
2GB 667 4-4-4-12
BFG 7600GT

I am currently running at 314x9 at 1.350vcore, +1 on my ram to meet it's 1.9 specs all other voltages are normal.

When I try going above 314 it fails orthos in a minute or 25 minutes depending on how far above 314 I go. I have tried raising the voltages several times but nothing has worked. The computer booted at 333x9 it passed memtest for 8 hours but once in windows it failed orthos. The voltage was anywhere from 1.350 to 1.450 nothing worked. I also tried +1 on FSB/MCH and setting PCI-E to 100 aswell as leaving it on auto.

I haven't had much luck figuring out my temperatures. At 314x9 idle I am 18c in speedfan, 25c in coretemp and 43c in TAT 8O After running orthos for 8 hours I was 49 speedfan, 57 coretemp and 71 in TAT! I'm not sure which to believe, I do have a feeling though that my AS5 had separated a bit, it seemed a little thick.

Any suggestions?
Related resources
February 1, 2007 5:04:39 PM

Thanks Slayer I'll try those out. I'd be happy to lower the RAM voltages sine they cost much more than the CPU :lol: 
Looking at your setup you were more aggressive with CPU voltages than I was so that might be a factor.
I also tried setting the PCI-e freq to 100 but that didn't make much difference for me either since 100 is the default for the MB.
February 1, 2007 5:11:00 PM

Hey Ardiry, just wondering what PSU do you have? Have you set your FSB:RAM ratio to 1:1? Those are the only things I could think of tthat would hold you back.
February 1, 2007 5:19:31 PM

FSB:RAM is at 1:1

As far as PSU goes I'm using HIPER-4K580-MS 580W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

Edit:
Oh one thing I was reading about DS3 and I saw someone say make sure you disable Virtualization Technology. I've looked through the S3 bios several times and could never find any VT. Does it not show in bios if the CPU doesn't support it?
February 1, 2007 5:39:28 PM

CAn you lower the multiplier? If so, what happens? Will it go higher?

Also - make sure your total FSB isn't going above 1066mhz. This is your FSB x your HT Link. If you've got it at x4, for instance, I could well imagine your mobo becoming unstable at around 1250mhz.

Basically, you just need to slacken everything else off and see how far you can push the basic FSB clock. It would be very weird for it to go no higher than 314, I'd have thought.
February 1, 2007 5:40:23 PM

Quote:
FSB:RAM is at 1:1

As far as PSU goes I'm using HIPER-4K580-MS 580W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

Edit:
Oh one thing I was reading about DS3 and I saw someone say make sure you disable Virtualization Technology. I've looked through the S3 bios several times and could never find any VT. Does it not show in bios if the CPU doesn't support it?


Remember in GA boards, 1:1 memory ratio is a 2.00 setting under memory clock or whatever. Your memory is also rated for ~333fsb so if you got some value memory it might just be from that.
February 1, 2007 5:48:38 PM

Quote:
Remember in GA boards, 1:1 memory ratio is a 2.00 setting under memory clock or whatever. Your memory is also rated for ~333fsb so if you got some value memory it might just be from that.


Yes I have it at 2.00, the ram I purchased is cheap but not value series. I read from a few review sites that it overclocked slightly so I figured it could atleast do 333 which it is rated for. It passed memtest for 8 hours at 333 so it wouldn't be the ram would it?

All I am aiming for is 3.0-3.2GHz I'm willing to settle for 2.8GHz if I have to. I built this computer to replaced my fried one and get be back into games. I plan on replacing this one in less then a year when I have more cash to spend.

The ram is:
OCZ S.O.E 667 4-4-4-12 OCZ2SOE6672GK
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1682...
February 1, 2007 5:54:06 PM

Quote:
CAn you lower the multiplier? If so, what happens? Will it go higher?

Also - make sure your total FSB isn't going above 1066mhz. This is your FSB x your HT Link. If you've got it at x4, for instance, I could well imagine your mobo becoming unstable at around 1250mhz.

Basically, you just need to slacken everything else off and see how far you can push the basic FSB clock. It would be very weird for it to go no higher than 314, I'd have thought.


I think this may be the problem, I'm at 1256mhz FSB right now. What is that option listed as under bios? I haven't seen it. Heh it's been years since I've overclock =(
February 1, 2007 6:21:26 PM

Were you really able to run orthos @ 8 hours with temps of 71 on TAT? that seems pretty high, i can't get my system to stay stable or not reset itself if my TAT temps are above 65C.
February 1, 2007 6:25:42 PM

Yes it was still running when I woke up. Is TAT even correct? 43c at idle while the others are reporting 18c and 25c, it seems way off.
February 1, 2007 6:40:30 PM

Quote:
I hope you guys are using multiple programs to check your cpu temps. Motherboard software such as Gigabyte are usually worthless. My Gigabyte 965P S3 has Easy Tune5 and its not even close. Nor is the bios recorded temps. It says my cpu idles at 26c and 34c full load.
Use a program called Intel Thermal Analysis Tool, it'll tell you your real temps, never trust mobo software.
ANyone reporting 18c and 25c is full of crap!


18c is speedfan, 25c is coretemp, have never used Easy Tune5.
February 1, 2007 7:01:17 PM

I think the newest version of Easy tune is more accurate because it's more inline with the other utilites I use. They all report a realistic 38-43 range.
BTW anyone have anymore suggestions on my original question? :lol: 
February 1, 2007 9:17:58 PM

Sorry. I was talking crap. I'm an AMD user, where you can alter this particular multiplier. The FSB on an Intel machine is always x4 your base fsb, so the reason it's at 1256 is simply that it's 314x4.

I think the best thing to try is simply to upgrade the bios. The CPU supports 1333Mhz FSB, but your mobo doesn't unless you have revision F8 or later. Here's a link: http://tw.giga-byte.com/Support/Motherboard/BIOS_Model....

I doubt it has anything to do with temps.
February 1, 2007 9:27:12 PM

Sorry BadGuy didn't mean to hijack your thread.

F8 1333MHz support is for Rev3.3 board which is not out yet I have Rev1.

I did lower the multiple to x8 and I was able to go higher then 314FSB. I did 350x8 2.8GHz 1400FSB it ran stable in orthos for 35min and passed memtest. Later tonight when I get home from work I will try to push it further. possibly try some other bios versions.

The only thing I can conclude so far is that I might have got a dud processor.

Thanks for the help
February 1, 2007 9:38:18 PM

Damn I'm on fire today... not. Sorry, should have noticed that! On the CPU compatibility chart it does say you need F8 or later to run the E4300, however, so it's got to be worth a shot.

Also, isn't there a host of options for upping the voltage on the mainboard components? Giving more juice to the Northbridge might help. (I probably shouldn't have said this: I'm bound to be wrong!)
February 1, 2007 9:43:40 PM

4 for 4, wait no are you up to 7 yet? lol I've tried upping the other voltages and it changed nothing. Thanks for the tip on F8 I didn't see that, will give it a shot.
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 1, 2007 9:45:35 PM

Try 1.45v core and FSB.
February 1, 2007 11:26:54 PM

Wow, when I overclocked that one E4300, none of this happened. True, I did not torture test it or anything, but hell, an E4300 wall?

Hmm, of course the Zalman fan over the processor is pwnage, did you try a fan over than fan? For instance my case has a fan that will blow outside air right onto the processing fan.
February 2, 2007 1:03:46 AM

Quote:
OK, here's my question/dilemma. I recently bought an E4300, just to see how far I could push it with a decent setup. My problem is that I seem to have hit a wall at 3.1Ghz. The problem seems to be with my FSB which will not boot windows with anything greater than 350Mhz. I've seen people with similar setups reach over 500Mhz. My temps don't seem to be an issue as my range is 32c - 41c at 3.1Ghz. While I'm happy with 3.1Ghz I feel it could go a little further. Any suggestions? Thanks in advanced for any help!

---SPECS---
Intel E4300
Gigabyte 965P-DQ6
BFG 8800GTS
Zalman CNPS 9700
2 x Corsair 1G XMS DDR26400 (800Mhz) 5-5-5-12
OCZ 600W PSU
WD Raptor 74G

---BIOS---
BIOS - R7 (I know R9 is out but I wanted to let it burn in for a while, and I've herad R8 is terrible)
FSB set to 350Mhz
DDR2 Voltage 2.2V
MCH Voltage 1.55V
FSB Voltage 1.40V
CPU Voltage 1.40V
All other monitoring/performance settings disabled

FSB:RAM ratio set to 2.00 (1:1)


Bump your CPU voltage up some. I've seen where the E4's stock voltage is 1.3xx v where the E6's are 1.2xx v. running 400 mhz on my AB9 pro, I've got MCH @1.4v and ICH @ 1.6v. Try pulling your multiplier down to see if you can increase the clock speed. I've also read where there are "dead zones" in the frequencies, some reviewers have gained stability by going a little higher. Go figure.

You might want to check this review...
http://www.techspot.com/review/40-core2-e4300-vs-e6300-overclocking/
February 2, 2007 3:53:47 AM

Thanks all for the advice!! I just got back home so I'll try all of that [/quote]out in the AM.

Quote:
Damn I'm on fire today... not. Sorry, should have noticed that! On the CPU compatibility chart it does say you need F8 or later to run the E4300, however, so it's got to be worth a shot.


Quote:
I think the best thing to try is simply to upgrade the bios. The CPU supports 1333Mhz FSB, but your mobo doesn't unless you have revision F8 or later. Here's a link: http://tw.giga-byte.com/Support/Motherboard/BIOS_Model....


Really? wow I guess I should've read the manual before I jumped in. I'd kick myself if it was that simple.

Quote:
Bump your CPU voltage up some. I've seen where the E4's stock voltage is 1.3xx v where the E6's are 1.2xx v. running 400 mhz on my AB9 pro, I've got MCH @1.4v and ICH @ 1.6v. Try pulling your multiplier down to see if you can increase the clock speed. I've also read where there are "dead zones" in the frequencies, some reviewers have gained stability by going a little higher. Go figure.


I've heard about those "dead zones" I tried bumping the FSB past 400 but no luck there. I'll keep it in mind should the bios updates work.

Quote:
Sorry BadGuy didn't mean to hijack your thread.

NP I prob. would have done the same to yours
February 2, 2007 1:38:53 PM

I just built a new system 3 weeks ago and i have a rev 1 board and it had the f4 bios on it the very first thing i did was bump the bios up to f10 and have no probs whatever the f10 has updates for FSB stability. But dont update through the internet @bios nothing but trouble. download and copy to a floppy and update through the bios.
February 2, 2007 6:24:13 PM

I updated my BIOS to R9, that didn't solve the problem but did improve the usability.
I lowered the multiplier and was able to boot up with a 8 x FSB500 however cpu-z and other utilities only recognized the proc as 8 x FSB390. It seems no matter how high I push the FSB only 390Mhz and below are recognized :x
When I set the multiplier back to 9 I'm not able to boot with anything higher than 355-360
February 4, 2007 12:34:13 AM

Quote:
OK, here's my question/dilemma. I recently bought an E4300, just to see how far I could push it with a decent setup. My problem is that I seem to have hit a wall at 3.1Ghz. The problem seems to be with my FSB which will not boot windows with anything greater than 350Mhz. I've seen people with similar setups reach over 500Mhz. My temps don't seem to be an issue as my range is 32c - 41c at 3.1Ghz. While I'm happy with 3.1Ghz I feel it could go a little further. Any suggestions? Thanks in advanced for any help!

---SPECS---
Intel E4300
Gigabyte 965P-DQ6
BFG 8800GTS
Zalman CNPS 9700
2 x Corsair 1G XMS DDR26400 (800Mhz) 5-5-5-12
OCZ 600W PSU
WD Raptor 74G

---BIOS---
BIOS - R7 (I know R9 is out but I wanted to let it burn in for a while, and I've herad R8 is terrible)
FSB set to 350Mhz
DDR2 Voltage 2.2V
MCH Voltage 1.55V
FSB Voltage 1.40V
CPU Voltage 1.40V
All other monitoring/performance settings disabled

FSB:RAM ratio set to 2.00 (1:1)


http://www.thetechrepository.com/showthread.php?t=30

Read that article....it helped me.
February 4, 2007 8:31:14 PM

Hello everyone,

i jumped on the Fry's deal of $149 for E4300 tray + ECS p4m800pro combo, and then went and got the following:
- Biostar tforce 965pt (using beta bios 119 to get 400Mhz for memory)
- arctic cooling freezer 7 pro
- APEX AL-B500E ATX 500W
- Antec sx-635
- corsair xms2 2gb (675, 4-4-4-12)
- geforce 6100 turbo cache (yes, i know... saving up for X1950Pro)

after 2 days of tweaking, this is where i am at:
9x334, 1.45 vcore (system wont POST with 333x9 for some reason)

orthos blend full load temp: speedfan 57c, core temp shows 5-10c lower?!, TAT wont run "error enumerating on demand clock modulation support")
idle temp: 30c speedfan

i am at 1.4 Vfsb and 1.45 Vmch, and 2.2 vdimm 5-5-5-15, trying to get highest OC on CPU

could someone give me some pointers on how to get the vcore/temp down (and perhaps push OC up some more) or i am SOL on this chip?

thanks in advance
February 6, 2007 1:11:17 AM

Thanks for the article. If I read it correctly I should be able to hit 8x500 but I don't appear to be getting anywhere near that. I also noticed that my MB doesn't resond to any FSB setting higher than 390.
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 6, 2007 1:22:45 AM

Try jumping to around 405, there's a sticky spot around 380-400 due to the Northbridge being overclocked (different ratio of FSB to NB, called "boot strap").
February 13, 2007 9:16:27 PM

Did you clear the CMOS and LOAD FACTORY DEFAULTS after flashing?

The BIOS will do funny things if you don't clear/reset after you upgrade.
February 15, 2007 2:07:34 AM

Well, all I can tell you is that I haven't yet hit the 3.1 GHz wall, but please let me post what I have, and hopefully I can use this as a baseline for everyone else to see what I can do to improve.

System :
Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3 rev 1.0 BIOS F10
CPU : E4300
Cooler : stock
RAM : OCZ PC2-6400 Platinum XTC (2 * 1 GB Dual-C) 4-5-4-15

Settings :

Core speed : 2.97
Mult : 9
Bus : 330
Rated FSB (according to cpu-z) : 1320

Ortho test : 7 hours --------> stable

Have yet to push it past this.

All other MOBO settings are set to Auto, including voltages. I have not played with any other setting than the mult and bus speed.

If anybody has any suggestions, comments, etc.. I would be pleased to entertain them. Anyhow, this is what I'm running, and in the next couple weeks, I hope to be able to surpass the 3.0 GHZ (possibly even 3.1)

Temps, after hours of Orthos, are in the 50s C, and I find TAT is very high (about 10-15 C higher than others), and I suspect it's reading the Northbridge temp vs. the CPU temps. Comments?

Thanks.
February 15, 2007 2:30:31 PM

I am hitting the wall here,




IN9-32MAX (680i SLI) board with stock cooling, I'm seriously thinking it can go further than the 400fsb mark....

I'm interested to see what additional cooling would yeild.
February 15, 2007 2:38:42 PM

Quote:
I am hitting the wall here,




IN9-32MAX (680i SLI) board with stock cooling, I'm seriously thinking it can go further than the 400fsb mark....

I'm interested to see what additional cooling would yeild.


temps lol?
February 15, 2007 3:01:12 PM

50c after orthos ran for a few hr's
39c or so idle
February 15, 2007 3:04:04 PM

Quote:
50c after orthos ran for a few hr's
39c or so idle


39 degrees using stock cooling on 100% OC seems right,but 50 in load?are you sure?
February 15, 2007 3:30:38 PM

Yep, it fluctuates between 48 - 52c but mostly sat at 50c
February 15, 2007 4:06:52 PM

BadGuy,

You might want to start here:

Core 2 Duo OverClocking Guide

Alot of good info... I am not sure if it is updated for the E4300 or not.

The deal with the OC on the 4300 is it will allow a 1:1 on the OC which when done right can result in fantastic numbers.

Hope this helps...
February 16, 2007 4:42:16 PM

i'm not sure w/ that mobo...
but i use bad axe 2,
i got my e4300 to hit 3.7ghz.
so i believe there is no wall @ 3.1 ghz...
!