Carbon Dioxide Cooling Blocks

[apt403]

All you need to do to make liquid carbon dioxide is pressurize the gas, no cooling required. What about selling an enclosed copper block type thing filled with liquid carbon dioxide that you could attach to a phase change cooler? The freezing point of carbon dioxide is -78.5 °C, some phase coolers can get that low when under the temp load from a cpu, they can get even cooler when there not attached to a heat source. The phase change cooler wouldnt be under as much load since the now dry ice would be doing most of the work, all the phase cooler would have to do is keep the dry ice in an atleast semi solid state. So, is this idea valid? Or am i just slightly insane?

 

[tool_462]

Carbon dioxide has to be under extreme pressure to exist in a liquid state. It normally (under normal atmospheric pressure) goes directly from a solid to a gas, this is called sublimation (not sublimination .) I guess I don't really understand what you want to do though, so I cannot comment more on that.

 

[rockyjohn]

All you need to do to make liquid carbon dioxide is pressurize the gas, no cooling required.

I am not sure what the whole concept is here either. However the act of pressurizing a gas creats a lot of heat itself. It is expanding or depressurizing gas that is used to cool a refrigerator.

 

[stefx]

I'm a mechanical engineer, quite familiar thermodynamics and HVAC systems, but I can't figure out what you are suggesting or inquiring about.

 

[apt403]

Take a copper block, fill it with liquid carbon dioxide, then strap it to a phase change system, the phase change systm turns the liquid into dry ice, then you strap the entire thing to your pc, the phase change system is under less load because the now dry ice is handling most of the heat, all the phase change system has to do is keep the dry ice, ice.

 

[tehrobzorz]

i think he wants to use liqud nitrogen to kepp the tec cooler cool? i dont see how a pahse changer need to be cooled or am i comletely missing the point?

unless he wants to put liquid nitro gen in the pahse change cooler?


wtf man>! 8O

 

[apt403]

No, not liquid nitrogen, liquid carbon dioxide.


Somekind of crappy diagram

--------------------------------
| Phase change cooler block |
--------------------------------
---------------------------------
| Liquid filled copper block |
---------------------------------
-----------------------------------
| CPU |
-----------------------------------

See? The liquid filled block would go in between a phase change cooler and the cpu, the liquid carbon dioxide would turn into dry ice from the cold temps of the phase change cooler. The now dry ice filled block would dissipate most of the heat, all the phase change cooler would have to do is keep the dry ice in ice form. Less work for the phase change cooler, lower temps, happy days.

 

[tool_462]

Carbon dioxide is a gas...

When it "condenses" it goes straight to solid form...

You are confusing the world...

 

[nvalhalla]

Hey! Didn't I see you on a similar post yesterday? Let me ask you a question. Have you ever picked up a can of compressed air and noticed it's temperature? It feels a lot like room temperature... That's because, as I said yesterday, it's not until the gas is vented from the can, blowing the dust-bunnies from your case, that the can gets cold. A pressurized enclosed container of ANYTHING will not be cold. I think what you are talking about making would only work if you had a pressurized gas that could vent from it's container, the gas could be moved through a tube to a compressor, compressed, and the re-liquified gas could then be returned to it's original container to start the process over. That has already been invented, sort of, it's called a phase change cooler, aka a refrigerator.

 

[apt403]

Ok, take a block of dry ice, enclose it in a block of copper, strap it to your cpu, then use a phase change cooler to keep the dry ice in its ice form. Screw the liquid part. Just a block of copper with a dry ice core. Am i getting to any of you?

At this point ive drawn 3 conclusions

1. You guys still dont undsterstand what im saying.
2. Half of you know kinda what i mean.
3. Im retarted.

Im leaning towards either 2 or 3.

 

[nigelf]

that wouldnt work. the enery that needs to be dissipated by the phase change would be the same (or even more, as there is more area where heat from the outside can enter) as when it would be directly mounted onto the cpu. the dry-ice-block-thingy doesnt help with cooling unless it vents the dry ice (as CO2). the only usefulness i can see is if your phase change unit fails, you have a longer time until the CPU overheats

so its option 3

 

[croc]

Back to the drawing board...

 

[apt403]

Ok, next idea, 60,000W TEC cooler! You would need 30 wall outlets and the same number of 2000w psus, but i bet it would keep your computer super cool!

Although the other side of the tec might melt or something...i guess it would have to be made out of like titanium...

 

[CaptRobertApril]

Ok, next idea, 60,000W TEC cooler! You would need 30 wall outlets and the same number of 2000w psus, but i bet it would keep your computer super cool!

Although the other side of the tec might melt or something...i guess it would have to be made out of like titanium...

Better idea. Just get some real long keyboard, mouse and DVI extension cables and put your case in orbit. :lol:

Actually this is something that I've wondered about since Apollo. Space is Zero K. Yet, they kept saying that the astronauts on the moon were in temps as high as Zero C if they were in daylight. Zero C where? On the soil? Without atmosphere, the temp just above that soil should be Zero K! :?

 

[nvalhalla]

I think 3 is a little harsh, you just aren't completely understanding the nature of dry ice, N2, CO2 ect...

Making an enclosed container of dry ice would be very dangerous as it would likely cause a catastrophic failure at a weld and explode inside your computer. The energy(heat) absorbed by the dry ice has to go somewhere; in the case of dry ice in open air the energy leaves as evaporated CO2. The dry ice would be trying to do that in your enclosed container and it would cause too much pressure for your container to hold. Even if your container could hold the pressure, the pressurized gas would then change to it's liquid state and we would be back to my previous post about how liquid CO2 is not cold. Get what I'm saying?

By the way, even if the physics were different you were able to keep dry ice solid, it's only about 10c colder than a good phase change system is capable of.

 

[nvalhalla]

Ok, next idea, 60,000W TEC cooler! You would need 30 wall outlets and the same number of 2000w psus, but i bet it would keep your computer super cool!

Although the other side of the tec might melt or something...i guess it would have to be made out of like titanium...

Better idea. Just get some real long keyboard, mouse and DVI extension cables and put your case in orbit. :lol:

Actually this is something that I've wondered about since Apollo. Space is Zero K. Yet, they kept saying that the astronauts on the moon were in temps as high as Zero C if they were in daylight. Zero C where? On the soil? Without atmosphere, the temp just above that soil should be Zero K! :?

The air, or lack of it, is indeed 0 K, however their suits, which absorb energy from the sun like all other matter, is capable of reaching 0 C, or any temp really.

 

[apt403]

Yeah, i have no idea what would happen to a computer in space, ive wondered alot about that. Since hard vacuum cant really hold a temp. Like if an astronaut just decided to rip off his helmet in space it would take like a minute for him to die of asphyxiation, he wouldnt just flash freeze or something. I guess it might run cool, or it might just overheat and die. Lets try it. Who wants to loan me the billion to design and launch a rocket with me and a pc in it?

 

[nvalhalla]

It would overheat. The heat is transfered from matter by matter. Vacuum equals no way for heat to leave. By the way, the astronaut wouldn't suffocate, the change in pressure from 1 atmoshere in his suit to 0 would cause him to explode. That's the reason spy plane pilots have to wear pressurized suits. I've seen what water does at 60,000+ feet and it's scary to think that would happen to your blood.

 

[apt403]

OK, change "rips his head off" to "slowly depressurizes his suit then takes his helmet off".

 

[nvalhalla]

Then change "explodes" to "slowly expands until he bursts". Water, again like all matter, changes it's phase change temps depending on pressure. In a vacuum, water rapidly boils at room temp, which his body would be warmer than.

 

[apt403]

OK, so we can both agree that under all circumstances: The vacuum of space + Human = Bad.

 

[nvalhalla]

lol, yes, hence the need for suits. Are you really looking at phase change for cooling or was this an "exploratory committee"?

 

[apt403]

Exploratory committee, whenever i come up with a crazy idea like this i post it here to see if its even feasible, a couple of them have been, although most of them are completly absurd like this one turned out to be.

 

[CaptRobertApril]

Exploratory committee, whenever i come up with a crazy idea like this i post it here to see if its even feasible, a couple of them have been, although most of them are completly absurd like this one turned out to be.

Hey, I'll volunteer to chip into the Fund To Send apt403 Into Space - One Way...

JUS' KIDDIN'! :lol:

 

[HotFoot]

I think I'm understanding the idea you have about the carbon dioxide container sandwiched between your phase-change cooler and the CPU. First off, I'm not saying option 3) that you're a retard. You can have ideas that don't work and still not be a retard. It's just an idea.

Which leads me to my next point: the idea won't work. Think of the energy balance. The amount of heat going into the container of CO2 must equal the amount of heat coming out of it plus the heat consumed (or - heat produced) inside. The only way the CO2 will consume or produce heat is if the volume of the container is changing (for all intensive purposes it's not), or if the CO2 is undergoing a chemical reaction (not) or if the CO2 is changing state. If it's changing state (it starts as dry ice and sublimates, for instance), it can temporarily absorb some heat, but once the solid all turns to gas you're back to the old energy balance of what goes in must come out. It won't reduce the amount of work the phase-change cooler must do unless you're constantly swapping in new cartridges of dry ice.

As for other points, CO2 can be a liquid. This is studied in high-school physics, at least where I come from. As the OP said, it requires pressurisation. Look up "triple-point" and I believe you'll find what I'm talking about. At atmospheric pressure, CO2 goes straight from solid -> gas. At very high pressures, it will go through all three states. It gets me when posters ridicule others' supposedly idiotic science when the others were correct to begin with.