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Futureproofing: AM2 or 775?

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February 16, 2007 5:26:01 PM

Hey there,

I've been out of the loop for a while, but I'm planning an overdue upgrade of my Athlon XP platform, which served me well for the last 4 years.
So, I'd like your constructive comments on the future of sockets AM2 and 775.

Thanks.

More about : futureproofing am2 775

February 16, 2007 5:30:40 PM

Quote:
Hey there,

I've been out of the loop for a while, but I'm planning an overdue upgrade of my Athlon XP platform, which served me well for the last 4 years.
So, I'd like your constructive comments on the future of sockets AM2 and 775.

Thanks.


Both of them will not support new CPUs in 2008 or later.
But if you wait for a few months for Socket AM2+, then the socket can be used in 2009... :wink:
February 16, 2007 5:46:20 PM

Socket AM2+ CPUs will be backward compatible with socket AM2, so I'm not too concerned about that.
Related resources
February 16, 2007 5:50:05 PM

Quote:
Socket AM2+ CPUs will be backward compatible with socket AM2, so I'm not too concerned about that.


If the transition to DDR3 is fast, Socket AM2 will become obsolete rather fast.
February 16, 2007 6:04:13 PM

So will Socket 775.
I don't want to build a PC in 2008 or 2009, but in the next weeks.
So I guess either one (AM2/AM2+ or 775) is good since they will both get phased out at about the same time.
February 16, 2007 6:06:42 PM

Quote:
So will Socket 775.
I don't want to build a PC in 2008 or 2009, but in the next weeks.
So I guess either one (AM2/AM2+ or 775) is good since they will both get phased out at about the same time.


Yes if you will not change CPU before 2009.
February 16, 2007 6:18:51 PM

For AM2: I think there's an easy upgrade path for those that are conservative with money, but want to be in the upper tier (top 20%) all the time.

If you built with AM2 right now (for the cheap MBs and $110 X2 3800 for instance), or already have it, and except for constant video encoding or big screen play on just a couple of games, a low end dual core (3800 or 4200) are fine, or an opty if you like to overclock, then....

In a year you could upgrade to one of the low end quad cores from AMD via drop-in into your AM2 board, because....in another 6 or 12 months you buy an AM3 MB (skip the AM2+)....and another 6 or 12 months after that, finally an AM3 type cpu. This avoids buying too often, and when you get the AM3 board, at that point, your other component purchases could be future proofed at that level (this is why you'd get the AM3 board earlier than the cpu). etc.

This is a path that reduces costs, but keeps you reasonably up there with a powerful system.
February 16, 2007 6:20:46 PM

With AMD's known plans for socket shifting and Intel's still very unknown plans with 45nm 775 chipset support, I'd say AMD has the minor edge for platforms right now, simply because we know what they're going to give us, and it's shaping up to be pretty decent. There is still the possibility, though, that current 775 chipsets (some of them, anyway) may support 45nm. Early test samples worked on them, but we don't know about the final revisions.

edit - but current C2D are very good anyway, ;) 
February 16, 2007 6:41:42 PM

Thanks for your input guys.
I was leaning towards AMD, but wanted to see other people's views.
I know C2Ds are top notch, but I don't particularly need over the top frame rates.
I think I'll see a fairly good difference anyways when switching my Barton 3200+ for an X2 5200+.
Thanks.
February 16, 2007 7:24:21 PM

If you get a good intel motherboard it will support a quad core chip. You could put an E4300 or E6300 in there for now and go quad when it comes down in price. Also, the core 2 duos are amazing overclockers.

Note that the E4300 and E 6300 are sub $190.

Also, you are contradicting yourself a little. You state that you don't need over the top framerates, yet you want something future proof. Correct me if I am wrong, but shouldn't your build give you some room to grow?

What games are you playing and do you plan on playing? I understand that Supreme Commander has just made the 8800 gtx video card "just enough" We should look at benchmarks relative to what games you are interested in to determine if your custom build is good for YOU.

PS I did upgrade from an athlon xp 2100 back in october to a core 2 and I love it.

Also, what is your budget? How are you going to allocate your budget among RAM, video card, and processor? Do you plan to do video editing and encoding?
February 16, 2007 7:51:44 PM

I don't think I'm in any contradiction. I just wish to have some room to upgrade down the road. I'm not going with FX-76 right now.

Budget wise, I'd like to keep it around CDN$2000. I want to go with a decent CPU, 2 GB RAM and an upcoming X2xxx card (in March). To leave cash for the R600, I was contemplating going with an inexpensive but reliable AM2 platform like the Asus M2R32-MVP with an X2 in the 4000+ to 5000+ range.
Keep in mind that I also need an X-Fi soundcard, a new case (Antec Nine hundred), a new PSU (PCP&C Silencer 750) and that I want a Raptor 36Gb for fast booting. The hell with Vista though, I'm sticking with XP (wishing Linux would get more love from game publishers)!
Oh yeah, I'm not really into overclocking!

I mainly play Guild Wars and NFS Carbon, but the main reason for this upgrade is (you said it) Supreme Commander. I play at 1600x1200 on a Samsung 225bw widescreen and would like to keep it that way.
February 16, 2007 7:58:57 PM

Look at the new version of the Raptor at 74 Gigs also, to compare, and check the review of it here on Tom's Hardware.

Personally, I don't think Raid is worth the bother, but for $2000, you can surely have 2 or 3 drives, and use one for video storage, and if you'd like to save some movies or seasons of shows, don't think less than 320gigs on the video hard drive. I have 2, and 1 is full of things I want to keep.
February 16, 2007 8:07:51 PM

I currently have three 80Gb SATA HDDs (all the same from Seagate) which I will set up in RAID0 once I get that Raptor, which will be used solely for fast booting. Don't really need the 74Gb Raptor for the purpose intended.
I save some TV shows for future viewing, but not much more than that, except for music download.
February 16, 2007 8:34:36 PM

sounds like you'll do fine. enjoy!
February 16, 2007 8:44:53 PM

The X2 5000 is a good value, its close in preformance and in somethings faster than the E6400. They seem to be equally priced, that being said you'll be happy with either. It wasn't long ago that the x2 5000 was overpriced and the core 2s killed it in terms of value. The price has really come down on AMDs.

When I first read the thread I thought you were getting an x2 3800. Hence the current room for improvement remark. Good Luck.
February 16, 2007 8:49:04 PM

Go Socket LGA775, def better then the AM2 wich its always discontinued ( amd made the Quad FX on their Socket F ) LGA775 can deliver lots of performance, Quad Core Extreme edition , you can OC it to get the max performance and ( i think it will be good for years because even the new intel cpu incoming, there no software that can use really 4 core ) So its going to be useless and Core Quad will be good for a long time. Get that and Vista and 4GB ram and 8800gtx or ati 2xxx when it come, i think this will fit into a 2000$ budget and you will keep that for like 5 year and more. Yes DDR3 will be coming soon but again, ddr2 will be just fine for a bit.
February 16, 2007 9:57:14 PM

Since none of the compelling reasons to go with 775 are compelling enough to you, one can safely conclude that you are a fanboi of AMD. So why did you even bother to post this, when you already have a closed mind on the subject?
February 16, 2007 10:06:05 PM

Yeah,... you should choose any brand of LGA775 either 975X, 965P or G, Nvidia 680i motherboard because they are long term till likes 2009 or 2010 because they will work new 2008 processor at 1333 MHz FSB with 45nm. Eventhough 975X and 965 motherboards are 1.066 GHz FSB, you can overclock these motherboard to 1333 MHz but have to have least 667 MHz of RAM because u have to decrease 133MHz the RAM speed. Then it will work properly. I just have heard from the review about that. Please don't think I am wrong,..... it's just from Review, sorry I forgot which site.

Anyway, in the case, I suggest you to buy LGA775 either 975X, 965P or G, Nvidia 680i motherboard and buy entry-processor E4300 or E6400. Then you will be fine with it long lasting before u want to buy quad cores processor.

I still have ASUS P5W DH and E6400 since last fall. Lucky, I can get quad cores processor when price goes down in future. More quad cores processors should come in 2008.

AM2+ is okay, but you will always have to replace motherboard when there is new socket and buy new processor,... waste too much money.

LGA775 saves your money and your time.... when u want to buy better motherboard and u can use the same processor,... then buy better processor later.

It's up to you.

:) 
February 17, 2007 8:11:30 AM

Quote:
Since none of the compelling reasons to go with 775 are compelling enough to you, one can safely conclude that you are a fanboi of AMD. So why did you even bother to post this, when you already have a closed mind on the subject?


Are you people searching posts to reveal some small detail so you could call someone a fanboi?Why dont you just ignore him?And anyway someone might have decide but needs confirmation from lots of other people (quite common in the forums , several posts are all about it).That doesnt make him a fanboi or anything. :?
February 17, 2007 8:43:04 AM

go for the low end dual core x2 3800+....so it will be possible to upgrade with a k8l dualcore part...going for the c2d don t worth it, as the next intel processor will not bring much better performance than the c2d...
February 17, 2007 2:22:39 PM

Quote:
go for the low end dual core x2 3800+....so it will be possible to upgrade with a k8l dualcore part...going for the c2d don t worth it, as the next intel processor will not bring much better performance than the c2d...


Why going into am2 ? for about the same price or lower you can get a e4300 that you can overclock stable and get a better performance of any amd proc on the market. The C2D is upgrade from K8L not downgrade. Going for K8L would be a big loss, because you can get c2d for the same price.
February 17, 2007 2:37:59 PM

Quote:
go for the low end dual core x2 3800+....so it will be possible to upgrade with a k8l dualcore part...going for the c2d don t worth it, as the next intel processor will not bring much better performance than the c2d...


Why going into am2 ? for about the same price or lower you can get a e4300 that you can overclock stable and get a better performance of any amd proc on the market. The C2D is upgrade from K8L not downgrade. Going for K8L would be a big loss, because you can get c2d for the same price.

I don't think the prices are similar. Check the price online.
February 17, 2007 2:40:57 PM

Not the same but about 50$ difference. 50-70$ for 4x,5x speed.
February 17, 2007 2:44:40 PM

Quote:
Not the same but about 50$ difference. 50-70$ for 4x,5x speed.


Where do you find 4x or 5x speed? :?:

I just bought a x2 3600+ at ~$95.
February 17, 2007 2:54:56 PM

E6300 OC benchmark ( couldnt find the e4300 ) on those benchmark you see that its outspeeding the X6800
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/01/11/core-2-duo-overt...

Now you just have to compared the x6800 stock to what ever amd processor to see that amd is slower and for 50-60$ extra it worth it to swtich to intel and have a 600$+ processor speed~ performance oc.
February 17, 2007 2:56:15 PM

Quote:
E6300 OC benchmark ( couldnt find the e4300 ) on those benchmark you see that its outspeeding the X6800
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/01/11/core-2-duo-overt...

Now you just have to compared the x6800 stock to what ever amd processor to see that amd is slower and for 50-60$ extra it worth it to swtich to intel and have a 600$+ processor speed~ performance oc.


Not everyone will OC their processor.
February 17, 2007 2:57:21 PM

If you are looking for performance, yes you will oc it. Since the e4300 is made to be Oc anyway.
February 17, 2007 3:00:14 PM

Quote:
If you are looking for performance, yes you will oc it. Since the e4300 is made to be Oc anyway.


I don't think so. Why bother limit yourself to OC?
If OP plans to OC, he should buy E4300, but does he indicate that he will OC?
February 17, 2007 3:05:18 PM

I dont see your point to reply my post each time, im saying if hes looking for performance, Oc is a good way to lead to it.......................... Sure he can go Stock speed , but you can get those speed with air cooling , and stable as stock...... Why just not do it, sure amd cant be oc as well, but if you had a c2d you would know there no risk really to oc. So yeah even stock the e4300 beat am2 processor and for future if its other pc part can fallow the performance , he just can Oc it and get the speed of a X6800. That is my point, that a am2 3800 will not bring to you, you will have to change CPU and pay a lots more for a close performance ( less ) then the X6800.
February 17, 2007 3:06:30 PM

Quote:
I dont see your point to reply my post each time, im saying if hes looking for performance, Oc is a good way to lead to it.......................... Sure he can go Stock speed , but you can get those speed with air cooling , and stable as stock...... Why just not do it, sure amd cant be oc as well, but if you had a c2d you would know there no risk really to oc. So yeah even stock the e4300 beat am2 processor and for future if its other pc part can fallow the performance , he just can Oc it and get the speed of a X6800. That is my point, that a am2 3800 will not bring to you, you will have to change CPU and pay a lots more for a close performance ( less ) then the X6800.


Please read message #11.
February 17, 2007 3:09:47 PM

future proofing will never be for more than 6 months in the future.
February 17, 2007 3:09:55 PM

Ive read it and yeah read my other post, it would be a error to go with AM2 x2 processor..... Seem you are a amd fan boy.!
February 17, 2007 3:12:50 PM

Quote:
Ive read it and yeah read my other post, it would be a error to go with AM2 x2 processor..... Seem you are a amd fan boy.!


I don't know why you insist on overclocking.

Honestly I am an AMD supporter, but I don't think I give biased opinions on this.

If he will buy in a week, x2 series are of better values.
If he will buy after April, C2D series are of better values.
February 17, 2007 3:15:04 PM

Why buy amd x2 now, and change for a c2d, he will just lost more money from switching board, cpu then buy a c2d Now, price arent going to drop more then 10-20% ~. Not a smart buyer.
February 17, 2007 3:17:03 PM

Quote:
Why buy amd x2 now, and change for a c2d, he will just lost more money from switching board, cpu then buy a c2d Now, price arent going to drop more then 10-20% ~. Not a smart buyer.


Whether the current boards can support 45nm products is still unknown. But you can expect any Agena / Kuma / Rana CPU can be plugged in the current AM2 boards.
February 17, 2007 3:21:04 PM

So what, who know the performance for the Agena / Kuma / Rana. Who care about 45nm , its just question for power/consumation. Quad Core is pretty much the best around and he will be able to get that. Sure to get past that you will have to pay more then 1000$ for the cpu for new incoming product, why not just pay now for a e4300 and oc in the future to get the same performance as the Quad Core. I dont get why you deny this, its just logic.
February 17, 2007 3:54:21 PM

I hope someone pointed out that the "K8L", or K10 as it is now to be named, isn't benchmarked yet, so any statements about it's performance vs C2duo have to be based on AMD's statements, which say it will have a "40% advantage", but doesn't specify if that is per clock cycle, or per watt.

The K10 chip will drop in to the AM2 board as an upgrade, and likely the AM2 HT speed won't matter a lot for typical games and home use (as distinct from the different needs of a server type computer).
February 17, 2007 4:04:40 PM

its kinda bullshit that amd say its will be 40% faster but there not showing us the benchmark or anything. Maybe its in only 1 test, but its lies , because honestly, they wouldnt say that they got be again by intel. Hostestly amd dont know what to do, just see what happen to their Quad FX. Wich its in reality a server processor and 2 CPU ( lol ). Maybe their ATi Radeon X28xx that coming will be good for them, Otherwise they need to react fast.
February 17, 2007 4:31:29 PM

Quote:
Hey there,

I've been out of the loop for a while, but I'm planning an overdue upgrade of my Athlon XP platform, which served me well for the last 4 years.
So, I'd like your constructive comments on the future of sockets AM2 and 775.

Thanks.


Personally I would wait with any new purchase until either K10 (april) or new Intel Bearlake chipset debuts (ddr3 support).

Biostar showed an intresting board based on this new chipset a couple of days ago http://www.chilehardware.com/foro/intel-p35-t63221.html
February 17, 2007 4:47:51 PM

Yeah but again does the ddr3 memory itself worth it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3

# PC3-6400: DDR3-SDRAM memory stick specified to run at 400 MHz using DDR3-800 chips, 6.40 GB/s bandwidth
# PC3-8500: DDR3-SDRAM memory stick specified to run at 533 MHz using DDR3-1066 chips, 8.53 GB/s bandwidth
# PC3-10600: DDR3-SDRAM memory stick specified to run at 667 MHz using DDR3-1333 chips, 10.67 GB/s bandwidth

#PC2-6400 400 MHz DDR2-800 6.400 GB/s

And we all know there ddr2 higher then 800. At the top you gaining like 2gb transfers speed but you losing latency also with ddr3. So the memory is not a reason to wait. Unless you are doing heavy heavy application. But for gaming even with the incoming DX10 game ddr2 will be more then sufficent and in my opinion not worth it to change to board for ddr3 unless its for a cpu reason.
February 17, 2007 5:20:19 PM

at amd current rate of new sockets - am2 is due to replaced in 7 to 9 - 07
February 17, 2007 5:25:05 PM

Reason I leaned towards AMD was purely based on price.
I couldn't care less about the name on the chip.
Heck, I'd choose a Transmeta Crusoe if it provided the qualities I'm looking for.
February 17, 2007 5:27:02 PM

Quote:
future proofing will never be for more than 6 months in the future.


AM2+ should be good for well over a year, supporting AM2, AM2+ and AM3 processors.
February 17, 2007 5:47:33 PM

I never would have thought hitting such a sensitive nerve.
I never would have thought being called an AMD fanboi either :lol: 

Basically, I want decent price/performance for gaming without overclocking.
Don't come telling me that I should overclock, that overclocking is awesome and that I'm an idiot if I don't overclock. I'm well aware of the benefits of overclocking. I just don't want to bother with that.

Anyways, reaching consensus in this forum is as hard as trying to fit an elephant trunk in a USB plug.

Thanks to all who provided constructive input.
February 17, 2007 5:54:03 PM

For a budget wise of 2000$ you are doing very low with a x2 3800. And for price / performance its def. a Core 2 Duo. Anyway you will cry when game like Crysis is coming and you will have choosed a AM2. And i dont see your point Withou Overclocking, if you havent tested out the Core 2 Duo Overclocking ability then you def. dont know what are you talking about. You can gain like 600mhz for 2-4c heat. With a cheaper cooling like artic cooling 7 pro. You can oc it to 3ghz and be lower then the stock temp with stock intel cooling. And Stable 100%.
February 17, 2007 6:46:47 PM

The original question was about futureproofing. AM2 offers no more futureproofing than 775.

If its price / performance, then except for the very lowest end procesors, the current crop of AMD processors tend to get left behind by the current c2d's. The c2d is also tolerant of cheaper memory, so to me the choice is a no-brainer. Go with AM2....
February 17, 2007 7:21:11 PM

Quote:
For a budget wise of 2000$ you are doing very low with a x2 3800. And for price / performance its def. a Core 2 Duo. Anyway you will cry when game like Crysis is coming and you will have choosed a AM2. And i dont see your point Withou Overclocking, if you havent tested out the Core 2 Duo Overclocking ability then you def. dont know what are you talking about. You can gain like 600mhz for 2-4c heat. With a cheaper cooling like artic cooling 7 pro. You can oc it to 3ghz and be lower then the stock temp with stock intel cooling. And Stable 100%.


I think the reason he asked about future proofing is so he could choose a platform now and upgrade later, id est, he could drop in a K10 or Penryn when they come out.
February 17, 2007 7:34:50 PM

Yeah but who know if the next amd processor will be better then the curent C2D.
February 17, 2007 7:38:17 PM

Quote:
Yeah but who know if the next amd processor will be better then the curent C2D.


Doubts are low that it won't at least equal C2D. I expect it to be pretty even.
February 17, 2007 7:45:42 PM

No one know, so yeah future proofing now mean, Future crap or Future equal to C2D or future good. The best would be get a C2D because you will have it longuer then your amd am2. Even if amd create a better processor then the C2D, if you are a gamer you wont see much difference because most of game are still Single Core, some are incoming Multi but still, that going to take years before new processor will be using in game and am2 will be the past. Its just like the socket 754, 939, 940 when they came out, you know what happen...
!