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DS3, SATA II, bios question

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February 20, 2007 8:27:20 PM

My new build is up and running, but I don't think I have the bios right for the SATA II HD.

Right now I'm settin at:

1. SATA AHCI mode disabled
2. SATA Port 0-3 Native mode disabled
3. Onboard sata/ide device enabled
4. Onboard sata/ide control mode IDE

What are the proper settings? I don't think I'm 100% off, but real close. I also forgot to check to see if there was a 150 jumper on the seagate hd.

I read somewhere that if I enable AHCI, I will need a new driver to support it. What driver and where can I get it? Wouldn't it be on the MS install disk?

More about : ds3 sata bios question

February 21, 2007 11:43:11 AM

If you are running only a single drive your settings are fine.

Only alter the AHCI if your drive is capable, and also then you should format your OS too from what I've read. I got away with changing this setting and back again with no damage once but others have not been so lucky with file corruption.

You can toggle native mode safely as far as i've found without problems, but it made absolutely no difference to my drive speed in hdtach.

Leave settings 3 and 4, option 4 is only valid if you are running RAID anyway.
February 21, 2007 2:22:00 PM

Thanks. It bugs me that I don't have things right. This is a Seagate Baricuda 7200.10 and does support AHCI. The only thing Seagate talks about was the NCQ function.

This first build has been a great learning experience.
Related resources
February 22, 2007 2:23:17 PM

I had the exact same questions when I put my new system together, it seemed easier to make a raid setup with the amount on information in the manual!
February 22, 2007 2:59:11 PM

installing the sata II raid driver wouldn't require you to use the raid function, would it? You would get the sata performance function and the ability to use raid if desired. That's more of a question than a statement, but it makes sense.
February 22, 2007 6:03:18 PM

I second that! "First build is a learning expierence."


I have 2 SATA II's and my bios are what you described. Ive gotten replies that that is normal.
February 22, 2007 7:10:25 PM

I now have a new problem relating to all this. My DVD writer won't write. I've tried my old Sony writer, new IDE connector, checked master/slave all with no solution. After much research, fretting etc, I have found what I think might be the solution. The DVD is controlled by Jmicron GBB36a controller, the topic I was reading related to a JMB363 controller, but I assume they are probably the same. The controller is a SCSI/Raid controller that apparently redefines the IDE device to a SCSI device with the intention of supporting an IDE/SATA raid setup. Doesn't do much for my DVD writer. The device manager does show my samsung as a SCSI cd device. The basic conclusion of that forum was:

Don't connect an optical drive to Primary on the JMicron controlled IDE-channel

I only have one IDE connection and I'm connected as master, nothing on the slave connector. Some folks had success by installing the newest version of the sataIIraid driver. I downloaded it but haven't figured out what files to put on a floppy for the F6 install. They all won't fit.

Maybe this problem is worth a new topic, ya think?
February 22, 2007 9:12:57 PM

lol. What are your specs of your system? Ive heard some DVD's having issues with Jmicron. My $29.99 x16 DVD-RW dual-layered litescribe had no issues ;-)


I hooked it up to the IDE port, I believe I placed it as "master" and that was all she wrote. I just recently took out my floppy lol. I remember the 5.25" disks woooow :) 
February 22, 2007 9:38:57 PM

MB Gigabyte ds3
cpu intel c2d e4300
hd seagate baracuda 7200.10 320gb sata 3.0 (2nd ready to go in)
DVD samsung sh-s182d
mem kingston 2gb ddr2 6700
floppy/cd rdr mitsumi
psu ocz gamer 600
cpu cooler arctic cooling 7 pro
gpu xfx 7900gs
keyboard logitec g15
monitor lga l204wt
os xp home

I don't think it's the dvd, because I replaced it with my Sony 810 and had the same results. It has to do with the JMicron controller. First build, I've never overclocked so me and bios and drivers aren't busom buddys yet lol, especially the ones that make me start over with reinstall. Apparently, this has been found on the jmb36x controllers.
March 2, 2007 10:33:04 PM

I'm having settings problems too.

I have two Segate Sata2 300 Drives with perp storage. I have them plugged in to the standard ports and not the Jmicron and they are not raided. What do the settings need to be so that these things run faster? I am getting really slow throughput on them.
March 3, 2007 2:02:26 AM

Quote:
lol. What are your specs of your system? Ive heard some DVD's having issues with Jmicron. My $29.99 x16 DVD-RW dual-layered litescribe had no issues ;-)


I hooked it up to the IDE port, I believe I placed it as "master" and that was all she wrote. I just recently took out my floppy lol. I remember the 5.25" disks woooow :) 


I have solved my problem, sorry for the late response, but I've been re-installing XP and all apps and, oh yes, playing with my new rig.

The Gigabyte came with a JRaid ver 1.14.0.0. After much research, I found that JMicron made a fix for "optical drive writes" somewhere in ver 1.17.x.x. To complicate things, gigabyte's 1.17.x.x online still had ver 1.14.0.0 in it. I dl'd the JMicron ver of the driver and F6 installed and life is good. The old ver also supported the DVD drive as a simulated SCSI device, which meant no DMA, which made it very sssssslllllllllooooooowwwwwww.

The best I can come up with on the SATA drive situation is that if the HD is capable, Intell's drivers will use the 3 gig, AHCI support etc. Now, my only known problem on my new rig is that the 2nd HD, ordered a little later than the rest of the stuff, was doa. Did a RMA with Newegg and waiting. UPS is going to take a full week to git it delivered to Newegg. Not that I'm hurting with my 320 gig, it's just that I'd like to be done with this build now. I've had all the fun I can stand with it.

I thought I had done my research pretty well, but the actual build showed me where I could have spent a little more time in some area's. It really was a learning experience. As soon as I get my 2nd HD, I get to jump in with my first OC!
March 3, 2007 2:21:08 AM

Quote:
I'm having settings problems too.

I have two Segate Sata2 300 Drives with perp storage. I have them plugged in to the standard ports and not the Jmicron and they are not raided. What do the settings need to be so that these things run faster? I am getting really slow throughput on them.


All I can tell you is what I have them set at, which was trial and error till I got them to work.

First off, you need to check to see if you have a jumper on your hd. If you do, it makes the sata II look like a sata I - 150gig instead of 300. Don't know how much that will affect performance, but it can't help, assuming your board supports sata II.

I have 4 sata definitions in bios and they are set at:

1. SATA AHCI Mode disabled
2. SATA Port 0-3 Native mode enabled
3. Onboard SATA/IDE Device enabled
4. Onboard SATA/IDE ctrl mode IDE

When conversing with gigabyte on my problem, they only meantioned to set the ctrl mode to IDE. As meantioned earlier in this topic, you probably want to make sure you have a JMicron sata/raid controller driver ver of 1.17.x.x, get it from JMicron, gigabyte doesn't have the current version. This ver is needed for IDE support of an optical drive, I believe.

Hope it helps. Good Luck.
March 3, 2007 1:50:08 PM

I don't have the jumpers on so it should go as a Sata2. I had AHCI on and was running in native mode; native mode made it way slower. I haven't tried turning AHCI off yet and turning on native mode.

Why do I want AHCI off? Should I be on the intel ports or the Jmicron?
March 3, 2007 6:03:35 PM

Quote:
Why do I want AHCI off? Should I be on the intel ports or the Jmicron?

Actually, it seems to me that the setting at the top of DS3 BIOS menu for SATA AHCI Mode should not actually be present. My reasoning for this is that the DS3 uses the Intel ICH8 southbridge, not the ICH8R and only the ICH8R is supposed to provide support for AHCI and RAID. So having the ability to supposedly turn on AHCI for the ICH8 does not make a lot of sense.

I have no idea what difference SATA Port 0-3 Native mode might make, but perhaps it is another BIOS option that really only has meaning when you've got an ICH8R southbridge. But I figure it shouldn't hurt to set it to enabled so I do.

I don't really have an opinion right now about whether to prefer using the Intel SATA ports or not. I'm using them at the moment on my rev 3.3 DS3 because I don't want to introduce any conflicts for my optical drive which is connected to the JMicron PATA port.

Yet even doing that, I still somehow ended up with the CD drive access mode being set to PIO. :? :(  I went into the Win XP Device Manager and deleted the "IDE Channel" the CD was hung off and rebooted and this seemed to be enough to get it redetected as a UDMA-2 device. But I still don't know why it ended up in PIO mode in the first place. I certainly wasn't trying any of the RAID or SATA combinations that I had heard can cause problems. I had three hard drives hooked up to the Intel SATA ports and the single DVD-ROM/CD-RW hooked up to the JMicron PATA connector.

Weird and unexpected behavior. :( 

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
March 3, 2007 6:16:00 PM

Quote:
I don't have the jumpers on so it should go as a Sata2. I had AHCI on and was running in native mode; native mode made it way slower. I haven't tried turning AHCI off yet and turning on native mode.

Why do I want AHCI off? Should I be on the intel ports or the Jmicron?


From what I read, the Intel drivers will support whatever options are available on the HD. You can use whatever ports you want, Gigabyte Jmicron or the Intel, they all support the Sata II. If you want Raid, then you need to plug into the Gigabyte (purple) ports. IMO, I don't have a lot of trust in JMicron and I'm not using Raid so I chose the Intel ports.

All 4 settings are very confusing and there is very little info on the proper settings for a non raid configuration. Everything I know about it, I've learned in the last few days during my setup. All I can do is give you my interpretation of the 4 setting relating to non raid setup. There are a lot more experienced folks that would probably disagree with me. This is Intel connections and gigabyte mb specific.

1. SATA AHCI Mode - If enabled, you must have a supporting driver installed. I did have a Jraid driver originally, but it was an old ver and had an optical (IDE) bug in it. I reinstalled with newer ver using F6 method and reinstalled windows, grudingly, but it fixed my optical drive write problem.

2. SATA port 0-3 Native mode - This can probably be switched on the fly, but I have not heard of anyone seeing any performance changes with it. It might depend on the HD manufacturer.

3. Onboard sata/ide device - It made sense to me to enable and I've never changed the setting.

4. Onboard sata.ide ctrl mode - I think this has mostly to do with raid. May not make a difference but I set it to IDE since that is how my HD's are running.

I hope someone a little more knowlegeable can correct me or verify my findings. I'm up and running and running stock right now. PCPitstop measured me as one of fastest rigs in my class, so I don't plan on changing anything, except a little OC'ing when my 2nd HD gets here.

I hope this helps. Good Luck.
March 3, 2007 9:26:38 PM

I turned off AHCI and went to native mode. The drives go a little faster but when I run Sandra to benchmark, they are only doing Sata 150 instead of 300. Any drivers you guys think need to be changed? What should th ebest version be?
March 3, 2007 11:30:49 PM

Quote:
1. SATA AHCI Mode

Strangely enough, if you look at the rev 3.3 DS3's owner's manual, this BIOS setting is not even included/shown. The discussion about the BIOS options available on the Integrated Peripherals menu simply starts with SATA port 0-3 in my DS3 user's manual.

If I enable this setting, then during the POST process the following additional messages appear
Serial ATA AHCI BIOS, Version iSrc 1.07 08042006
Copyright (c) 2003-2006 Intel Corporation
** This version supports only Hard Disks and CDROM drives. **
Please wait. This will take few seconds.
The AHCI BIOS then detects and list the hard drives attached to my Intel SATA ports and boots windows. Windows then tries to start but takes a "blue screen" error that immediately triggers a reboot. Most likely the error when starting windows stems from my not having installed the Intel AHCI driver. I've read that you can "trick" Windows into installing this driver, but don't know if doing so really accomplishes anything useful.

As I said before, I'm not sure this option is really supposed to be available on a DS3/S3. You certainly don't seem to be able to do anything useful with it. About the only thing I'm sure of is that this BIOS option concerns the AHCI for the Intel SATA ports. The Gigabyte/JMicron ports have separate BIOS settings (see below).

Quote:
2. SATA port 0-3 Native mode

This setting seems to pertain only to the four Intel ICH8 SATA ports. The best guess I've been able to come up with about what "Legacy IDE Mode" and "Native IDE Mode" may refer to is what is talked about in this Microsoft article: BIOS Settings for Native-Mode-Capable ATA Controllers. I only glanced at the article, but perhaps the reason changing the setting seems to have no effect is because Windows XP may switch the controller from Legacy IDE mode to Native mode. :? Or I could also be totally off in the wrong direction here ... :) 

Quote:
3. Onboard SATA/IDE Device
4. Onboard SATA/IDE Ctrl Mode

The user's manual pretty clearly states that these settings for the "Onboard SATA/IDE" only affect the Gigabyte/JMicron controller. You can also verify this by looking at how the Standard CMOS Features BIOS menu changes. When Onboard SATA/IDE Device is Enabled, the following six entries appear in the Standard CMOS Features BIOS menu.
IDE Channel 0 Master
IDE Channel 1 Master
IDE Channel 2 Master
IDE Channel 3 Master
IDE Channel 4 Master
IDE Channel 4 Slave
IDE Channel 5 Master
IDE Channel 5 SlaveWhen Onboard SATA/IDE Device is Disabled, all you get are the following four entries corresponding to the four Intel SATA ports.
IDE Channel 0 Master
IDE Channel 1 Master
IDE Channel 2 Master
IDE Channel 3 Master
-john
March 3, 2007 11:37:55 PM

Quote:
I turned off AHCI and went to native mode.

Where did you turn off AHCI? Did you change the SATA AHCI Mode BIOS setting for the Intel SATA ports or the Onboard SATA/IDE Ctrl Mode setting for the Gigabyte/JMicron SATA ports? Mostly I'm just curious. I am surprised that you saw SATA300 with AHCI and only SATA150 without it ... but I'm not that surprised. :) 

Whichever ports you're talking about ... Intel or JMicron ... I'd be curious to know what you get (without AHCI) on the "other" ports. SATA150 or SATA300?

-john
March 4, 2007 4:58:21 AM

Now that you meantioned it, I had the exact same startup error and messages at one time when playing with these settings. It must have been the AHCI setting that I then disabled to correct.

Quote:
The user's manual pretty clearly states that these settings for the "Onboard SATA/IDE" only affect the Gigabyte/JMicron controller. You can also verify this by looking at how the Standard CMOS Features BIOS menu changes. When Onboard SATA/IDE Device is Enabled, the following six entries appear in the Standard CMOS Features BIOS menu.

IDE Channel 0 Master
IDE Channel 1 Master
IDE Channel 2 Master
IDE Channel 3 Master
IDE Channel 4 Master
IDE Channel 4 Slave
IDE Channel 5 Master
IDE Channel 5 Slave
When Onboard SATA/IDE Device is Disabled, all you get are the following four entries corresponding to the four Intel SATA ports.

IDE Channel 0 Master
IDE Channel 1 Master
IDE Channel 2 Master
IDE Channel 3 Master


This is really interesting. My DVDW drive shows up on channel 4 Master, which verifies that ch 4 & 5 are the JMicron ports. If you installed your sata drives on the JMicron connections, they would have to show up as master on ch 4 & 5 and then you would need to make sure your cd had the jumper set to slave.

Quote:
Most likely the error when starting windows stems from my not having installed the Intel AHCI driver. I've read that you can "trick" Windows into installing this driver, but don't know if doing so really accomplishes anything useful.


While I was trolling for answers across the web, I run onto someone having the same dvd write error problem I was. I told him about the Jmicron ver upgrade needed. He came back and said he found the upgrade and it was marked as "hot", not needing an F6 install. I think he was using an MSI mb and it did solve his problem.

Is it possible that AHCI is raid related only? The bios settings, I mean. I know I had to install a newer ver of JMicron sata/raid to fix my dvdw write problem. The funny thing is, my drive is now running with a standard MS driver using UDMA 5 and is walkin and talkin.
March 4, 2007 3:04:45 PM

Quote:
I turned off AHCI and went to native mode.

Where did you turn off AHCI? Did you change the SATA AHCI Mode BIOS setting for the Intel SATA ports or the Onboard SATA/IDE Ctrl Mode setting for the Gigabyte/JMicron SATA ports? Mostly I'm just curious. I am surprised that you saw SATA300 with AHCI and only SATA150 without it ... but I'm not that surprised. :) 

Whichever ports you're talking about ... Intel or JMicron ... I'd be curious to know what you get (without AHCI) on the "other" ports. SATA150 or SATA300?

-john

The only way I am seeing that it is SATA150 is through a comparative benchmark; and that is me just basing it on the speed difference. Is there anything I can change in Windows to let the computer know it should operating at a faster speed?
March 4, 2007 5:21:12 PM

More direct question... (This is in Vista 32)

How is everyone else's transfer speeds for disk to disk? My SATA300 to SATA300 never gets above 30 MB/sec for file transfers. This is with single large (700 mb +) files. Just curious as to if other people are seeing similar speeds.

Indexing is turned off on both drives and McAfee virus scanning is disabled for the tests.
March 4, 2007 6:06:31 PM

I just ran a benchmark using HD Tach on my single Seagate 320 SAT II.

The results were:

Random acess 13.2ms
avg read 68.2 MB/s
Burst speed 237.3 MB/s

This matched almost exactly with other benchmarks on this drive using the same tool.
March 4, 2007 7:46:05 PM

Mines a little slower than that

OS Drive ST3120811AS
Random access 17.2ms
Average Read 49.3 MB/s
Burst Speed 201.5 MB/s

Second Drive ST3250820AS
Random access 13.3ms
Average Read 68.9 MB/s
Burst Speed 214.6 MB/s

Both are Seagate Barracudas, different sizes but they are the same. The device manager shows them as ATA devices, should they say SATA? I also wonder if it may still be a Vista thing. I'll have to ghost my Vista install and try the same test under my XP image.
March 4, 2007 8:08:01 PM

One thing that shows is that with that burst speed, you have to be running greater than 150. I haven't followed Vista very much, but I seem to remember reading that there were some performance hits. I don't know if that reflects on HD's or not, but it would be interesting to se XP to compare.
March 28, 2007 3:54:05 PM

Quote:
How is everyone else's transfer speeds for disk to disk? My SATA300 to SATA300 never gets above 30 MB/sec for file transfers.

How did you measure the drive-to-drive transfer speed? Is this a Vista thing? :?

I've got Win XP and I don't of any way to get a direct report of what the transfer speed was when I "move" a file from one drive to another. I suppose I could try to catch the time it took to do the move and then do the arithmetic ... but it would be so much nicer to have software do this for me. :roll:

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
March 28, 2007 4:25:29 PM

Quote:
How is everyone else's transfer speeds for disk to disk? My SATA300 to SATA300 never gets above 30 MB/sec for file transfers. This is with single large (700 mb +) files. Just curious as to if other people are seeing similar speeds.

You are right to specify file size--otherwise the per-file overhead can modify results a lot.

My 965P-DS3 system has two Seagate 320 Gbyte SATA drives. I left all the motherboard BIOS settings at their defaults, so for many reporting purposes they are regarded as IDE drives. I did pull off the 150 jumpers, so for what it is worth (nothing on this test, I think) they are running as SATA300.

I just now tried a 1.4 Gigabyte test file, copied from drive D: to C:. I've rebooted since it was last touched, so no risk of disk cache effects.

It took 20.19 seconds by stopwatch, so I calculate 71,721,239 bytes/second. I've leave it to you whether you like to call that 68 Megabytes/sec, or something else.

On zjohnr's rate measurement question: if you have not already been there, you may like to try using Microsoft's "Performance" ap.

In WinXP, it can be found at:
Start|Control Panel|Administrative Tools|Performance

You have to configure it a bit, and sometimes things don't mean what they seem to.

For this purpose, you might like the result by adding a parameter from the "System" object named "File Read Bytes/sec" or "File Write bytes/sec"

If you have the update rate set to 1/sec, you'll be able to watch the transfer in each second for a test such as the above. You'll need to change from the default scale actually to see the graph. Try .0000010 for this hard drive parameter.
April 5, 2007 9:31:16 AM

XP pro with SP2
Same Motherboard (Revision 3.3, BIOS f10)
Same Hard Drive (only one) on Jmicron connector (IDE 5 Master in BIOS)
IDE DvdRW (only one) on Jmicron IDE connector (IDE 4 Master in BIOS) with Jumper set to Master
Same DVD burn problem

Origonal Setup in the Bios was the same
Because that's the default.
Although, you didn't specify which port you had the HDD was put in.
From your posts about Intel chipset,
Quote:

The best I can come up with on the SATA drive situation is that if the HD is capable, Intell's drivers will use the 3 gig, AHCI support etc.

First off, you need to check to see if you have a jumper on your hd. If you do, it makes the sata II look like a sata I - 150gig instead of 300.


I assume you placed it in the Intel SATA slot?
And did you have to make the jumper change?
I started with the HDD in the top Jmicron slot (IDE 5 Master in the BIOS)
and the DVD on the Master in the IDE connector (IDE 4 Master in the BIOS).

Quote:

I have solved my problem,
The Gigabyte came with a JRaid ver 1.14.0.0. After much research, I found that JMicron made a fix for "optical drive writes" somewhere in ver 1.17.x.x. To complicate things, gigabyte's 1.17.x.x online still had ver 1.14.0.0 in it. I dl'd the JMicron ver of the driver and F6 installed and life is good.


I have tried this as well.
From another forum I learned that the Gigabyte drivers from America and Asia(China) are 1.14 notable by 132KB download size
And instead of Europe and Asia's are 50.9KB, which is the 1.17 version (at least it says so in the Setup Information file of the downloads).

I have downloaded them all and I believe the Gigabyte versions from Europe and Asia are the same as from Jmicron. But I tried the Jmicron ones first, because they are the one's responsible for this mess.
Did you follow Jmicron's README and use the ones in the Floppy32 folder like I did? (with no success for me)

When F6 installing your Drivers which of them did you choose?
I have a list of RAID 366, 363, down to 360
and I have a list of AHCI 366, 363, down to 360
My f6 will only let me choose one
I have tried both 366 and 363 for both AHCI and RAID
with f6 installs. (that's 5 installs of windows total, fun fun)

As for BIOS settings:
Quote:

All I can tell you is what I have them set at, which was trial and error till I got them to work.

I have 4 sata definitions in bios and they are set at:

1. SATA AHCI Mode disabled
2. SATA Port 0-3 Native mode enabled
3. Onboard SATA/IDE Device enabled
4. Onboard SATA/IDE ctrl mode IDE


Thank you for posting your results. I will have to cross my fingers and hope this setup isn't something I have already tried.

===After reinstall with f6'd Jmicron latest drivers, HDD on intel 0 slot, dvdrw on Gigabyte IDE (4 master), BIOS as above.===
Nothing changes, Dvds still don't burn
... Does f6 actually DO anything, other than add the drivers from the floppy to the ones Windows CDs have on them? Because I have NEVER been able to get the Raid Controller to show up in Device Manager without the 3MB setup.exe from Gigabyte(disk or download) or Jmicron.

P.S.-
Quote:

This first build has been a great learning experience.


Quote:
I second that! "First build is a learning expierence."


This is my 3rd Computer built in the past 3 years, it's still a crazy (but great) learning experience!! Things have changed so fast.
April 5, 2007 2:52:48 PM

I'm just a newbie, I don't have answers, I just have theories, but I'll try to theory through your questions.

Yes, My HD's are in the Intel SATA slots. My OEM had the jumpers on them, so I removed them. I guess many OEM HD don't come with a jumper even if you need it.

I missed that ver info on the drivers when I was looking, but Gigabyte had the driver upgrade labeled as 1.17.x.x. I must have blundered into my DVD fix, cause I got to checkin recently, and there is no trace of the SATA/RAID drivers (Jraid and Jgogo I thnk they were called) in my os drive. So either I missed an error msg on my os install or didn't get one during my F6 install. But when I was finished, the DVD was no longer SCSI and the controller was UDMA mode 5 and everything worked.

I had a question when I was doing my install - exactly what all needed to be on the floppy. I used the floppy32 folder and I seem to remember moving some of the files also (too lazy to look it up right now). Sorry, I don't remember the option for sure. I think somewhere, either on the instructions or the manual, it said if you set bios to AHCI, select AHCI 363 I think it was. I've seen some suggestions that if you install the drivers, go ahead and install raid, it activates AHCI and you would be ready to configure raid if you ever wanted to. Of course I found this after the fact.

I don't think anything meantioned above resolved your problem though. From what I've read, AHCI and NCQ doesn't have enough performance gain to go through a os reload, it could even be negative due to overhead. If you have a heavy I/O application running most of the time, then caching commands would benefit. That may not be the exact scenario, but I'm happy with my setup the way it is.

Here's a seat of my pants thought. I wonder if you could go the the Device manager and upgrade the driver, when asked, point to the atapi.sys driver located in windows32/drivers? That's the one I'm using now. Might be worth a try especially if your going to possibly reload xp anyway.

Don't know if any of this help, but I guess it's the best I got right now.
April 5, 2007 6:21:54 PM

Quote:
When F6 installing your Drivers which of them did you choose?
I have a list of RAID 366, 363, down to 360
and I have a list of AHCI 366, 363, down to 360

The Gigabyte DS3 uses the JMicron 363 chip so you'd want either the AHCI 363 or RAID 363 depending on which you wanted to enable.

FWIW, I remember during at least one "install scenario" running into a conflict between the Gigabyte drivers for the JMicron controller and the JMicron drivers. As far as I can tell from the comparing the driver files, when the versions match then both use essentially the same driver code. However, Gigabyte in an act of apparent arrogance has insisted on renaming the JMicron drivers. As a result I ran into a situation where Windows would "detect new hardware" and then insist on trying to install BOTH the Gigabyte AHCI 363 and the JMicron AHCI 363 drivers.

In hindsight I think what I did wrong when switching between the drivers was installing them separately. I did not have problems when I opened the properties of the the currently installed driver in Device Manager and then used the "Update Driver" option to switch between the Gigabyte and JMicron drivers.

The problem I never found a solution for was how to revert from AHCI back to just IDE mode for the JMicron controller. Once I had set the JMicron to AHCI mode in the BIOS and installed the drivers, they stayed installed. Setting the BIOS back to IDE mode made now difference. The JMB363 (or GBB363) AHCI driver remained in Device Manager. When I would uninstall it, Windows would redetect it and reinstall the driver the very next time it scanned the hardware. :?

Only way I found to revert from AHCI to IDE mode was to reinstall Windows after setting IDE mode in the BIOS. :( 

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
April 6, 2007 5:08:00 AM

hello im new in this forum ....

i have the ds3 v 3.3 with bios f10 with cpu e4300 and seagate barracuda 320gb and lite on dvd-rw sata drive ...all in complete new system ....

the problem is ds3 cant detected the hard disk but detected the dvd drive
all in bios is stock and hard drive is complete new (no operation system )

in all 100% of boot i see bootscreen of gigabyte (picture 1)with 4 optios
but only work tab button to enter a dos screen(picture 2)detected a dvd-r drive only ... i press del and enter go to the BIOS but some time not detect nothing and frezze in dos screnn

PIC 1
PIC 2

CAN HELP ME PLEASE ???
April 6, 2007 6:05:03 AM

I don't know what the BIOS lockup is.
Probably Something with the DVDrw, try BIOS setup without it, to make sure.


Messing around I found out what causes you to be able to install both Jmicron and Gigabyte 386x...
Starting with my non-working setup as above, I install the setup.exe
then uninstall the DVD and the Raid Controller, go to bios
Turn everything on, AHCI and RAID/ATA
When you reboot (provinding it doesn't crash) you see the Jmicron or Gigabyte setup.exe pop up asking you to choose a driver (this is to replace the Standard Dual Channel IDE controller with Jmicron or gigabyte's) if you want to you can choose the 386x Raid Controller driver too... it doesn't work
But I did have under SCSI/RAID Controllers both of them installed and listed.

But this is going the opposite way of where I want to go.
What about the Jumper of the IDE? do you think maybe this is cause a problem?
I will probably try the F6 install of the Jmicron AHCI driver with the above setup. But I seriously am having doubts that this works.
April 6, 2007 8:14:04 AM

Quote:
I don't know what the BIOS lockup is.
Probably Something with the DVDrw, try BIOS setup without it, to make sure.


Messing around I found out what causes you to be able to install both Jmicron and Gigabyte 386x...
Starting with my non-working setup as above, I install the setup.exe
then uninstall the DVD and the Raid Controller, go to bios
Turn everything on, AHCI and RAID/ATA
When you reboot (provinding it doesn't crash) you see the Jmicron or Gigabyte setup.exe pop up asking you to choose a driver (this is to replace the Standard Dual Channel IDE controller with Jmicron or gigabyte's) if you want to you can choose the 386x Raid Controller driver too... it doesn't work
But I did have under SCSI/RAID Controllers both of them installed and listed.

But this is going the opposite way of where I want to go.
What about the Jumper of the IDE? do you think maybe this is cause a problem?
I will probably try the F6 install of the Jmicron AHCI driver with the above setup. But I seriously am having doubts that this works.


you see the Jmicron or Gigabyte setup.exe pop up asking you to choose a driver (this is to replace the Standard Dual Channel IDE controller with Jmicron or gigabyte's) if you want to you can choose the 386x Raid Controller driver too... it doesn't

WHERE I SEE SETUP.EXE ??

IM TRYING WITH BOOT DRIVE FROM CD OF MOBO ..COPY PASTES DE FILES AND EXTRACT TO FLOPPY TO USE IN F6 WITH WINDOWS CD BUT NOTHING WORK ...IN FINAL I SEE THIS SCREEN ...
April 6, 2007 9:29:18 AM

1. Where do you have the sata cable connected on your mb? Yellow or purple port?

2. When you get to the bios, what are the 4 sata settings?

3. Check your sata cable connection and power connection, make sure you have a good connection, no bent pins and cables solidly connected at both ends.

I'm not sure of your timing in your description of the problem. Sounds like you can get into bios sometimes. When you freeze on the dos screen, do you still have the message at the bottom - "prepare to enter bios"?
April 6, 2007 3:17:30 PM

Quote:
the problem is ds3 cant detected the hard disk but detected the dvd drive
all in bios is stock and hard drive is complete new (no operation system )

To start with you have not mentioned what happens when you attempt to boot and enter the BIOS under different scenarios. If you know you are having problems when both the DVD drive and the hard drive are connected, the next step I would want to take would be to attempt to isolate the problem.

I suggest booting under the following three scenarios and seeing what happens in each case:
1) Boot with only CPU, memory, and video installed. (Disconnect the power cable to both the optical and the hard drives).
2) Boot with CPU, memory, video, and DVD (optical) drive installed.
3) Boot with CPU, memory, video, and hard drive installed.

If your system fails to boot properly when you attempt to boot without any IDE devices, then I would wonder if you have a defective motherboard.

OTOH, if you only have problems when the hard drive is installed, then I would suspect the hard drive. I assume the optical drive is PATA. Is the hard drive also PATA or is it SATA? (The few times I've seen IDE related boot failure it usually happened because a PATA cable was plugged in incorrectly ...)

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
April 6, 2007 3:24:39 PM

Quote:
But this is going the opposite way of where I want to go.
What about the Jumper of the IDE? do you think maybe this is cause a problem?

To be honest, Deathscythe, at this point there's been so much posted that I'm not sure exactly where it is you DO want to head. :oops:  Are you just trying to get AHCI mode working for the JMicron SATA ports?

And what "jumper of the IDE" are you referring to? :oops: 

-john
April 6, 2007 5:29:05 PM

thankss help

both hd and dvd are sata
April 6, 2007 5:30:15 PM

I believe he is referring to the sata 2 jumper that reduces it to 150 vs 300. I think that is the only thing that would have a jumper except the master/slave on the DVD. It would not have an effect on the install issue.
April 6, 2007 5:33:16 PM

Quote:
But this is going the opposite way of where I want to go.
What about the Jumper of the IDE? do you think maybe this is cause a problem?

To be honest, Deathscythe, at this point there's been so much posted that I'm not sure exactly where it is you DO want to head. :oops:  Are you just trying to get AHCI mode working for the JMicron SATA ports?

And what "jumper of the IDE" are you referring to? :oops: 

-john

someone say to me put all enable .. and is jumper of sata hd
April 6, 2007 5:38:42 PM

Quote:
I believe he is referring to the sata 2 jumper that reduces it to 150 vs 300. I think that is the only thing that would have a jumper except the master/slave on the DVD. It would not have an effect on the install issue.


exactly
April 6, 2007 6:11:43 PM

Quote:
I believe he is referring to the sata 2 jumper that reduces it to 150 vs 300. I think that is the only thing that would have a jumper except the master/slave on the DVD. It would not have an effect on the install issue.

Agreed. I would not expect the 150/300 jumper to affect whatever problems DeathscytheHELL is having with the drivers for the AHCI (or RAID?) mode of the JMicron controller.

@broncopr:
I seem to be having a slight communication problem. My question about the jumper was actually directed @DeathscytheHELL. :oops:  But for what it's worth, it shouldn't make any difference in your case either. If your hard drive does have a jumper for 150 mode, changing it shouldn't make a difference. The DS3 motherboard should be able to handle 300MB/s SATA with no problem on any of the SATA connectors. (It should also be able to handle 150MB/s SATA with no problem).

FWIW, if changing the interface speed jumper does make a difference and allows you to boot, then something is still very wrong. The first thing I'd do in that case is to run the manufacturer's diagnostics on that drive.

But unless someone has a better suggestion for you, broncopr, I think trying to isolate the cause of your problem is probably your best next step. No?

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
April 6, 2007 6:17:34 PM

broncopr

There are at least two seperate issues being discussed in this thread at this time and it's starting to get confusing who'se responding to whose problem. Watch the reply to field, and maybe next time you might want to open your own topic. It would be less confusing and allow many more knowledgable people to be aware of your problem and respond.
April 6, 2007 6:38:07 PM

excuse me guys

thankss
April 6, 2007 10:29:21 PM

good plan.
April 7, 2007 5:17:56 AM

I am staying on topic, well at least the second problem that Billyc had.
Which was my DVDrw won't burn, because of the Jmicron/gigabyte Raid Controller.

I was talking about the Master/Slave/CableSelect jumper on the DVDrw
(wondering if I should have the DVDrw's jumper on Cable Select or have it matching the IDE connection as Master or removing it all-to-gether) Or if this would have any impact whatsoever.

And because everyone suggests that you have to pre-windows-install 1.17 drivers from either Gigabyte or Jmicron
I was also Trying to figure out if a pre-install of the Jmicron drivers (the 3.0MB 1.17 drivers from Jmicron's web, from the x32 folder and onto the Root directory of a Floppy like it says to do) actually Did anything.
Or if mine didn't do the right thing.
Because, for me when I did the f6 pre-install with the JM836x RAID or AHCI(366 and 363) the SCSI/RAID controller didn't show up in Device Manager. Here the DVDrw is registered as IDE, but doesn't burn. It doesn't make any sense to me that I would pre-install a Raid controller driver or AHCI controller driver and the device that uses the driver, doesn't actually become active.

The only way I can get the SCSI/Raid Controller to show up, is by running the Setup.exe from either Gigabyte or Jmicron, AFTER windows is installed.
And when That is done, the DVDrw is once again registered as SCSI, and still doesn't burn.
Turning off the Jmicron SCSI/RAID controller in device Manager, makes the DVDrw once again appear in device manager as an IDE device, but it still crashes when trying to burn.
-- I don't really care at this point whether the SCSI/RAID Controller shows up, I want to be able to BURN DVDs, and hopefully get the best transfer rates of the 3Gb/s of the HDD.

By doesn't burn, I mean:
I can get Windows to pop up "write these files to CD" and when I do it says there is an unexpected error that prevents me to burn try again or cancel.
If I use NERO, it gets to 82% no matter the size of the file(s) being burned, then just becomes inaccessible, I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL to shut it down.
I think it's because the IDE DVDrw is being registered as a SCSI device on whats supposed to be running as an IDE controller.

I am also searching among posts to find out what Working configurations of similar setups are.
I have the lastest BIOS and the latest Gigabyte and Jmicron drivers(1.17), as Setup.exe 's and as f6 pre-windows install Floppys.
I have 1 Hard Drive Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (I have tried it on the Purple Gigabyte Controller and the Yellow ICH8)
I have 1 IDE LG Super-Multi DVD GSA-H42N-BK on the Master of the 4th IDE device (I suppose this would be Primary Master of the Gigabyte Controller)

I have tried the many BIOS settings, from default, to everything turned on relating to the raid controller and SATA devices. To the combinations in between that made sense.
I have made my way through about a dozen different variations of Windows installs with drivers and setups in Bios. *yes at least 12 installs of windows!

This is why I jumped in Billyc's thread.
He has the closest setup, and actually succeeded.
But I still haven't.
So tonight I am gonna try something not related to MB or Raid controller.
I am gonna try out my older DVDrw, maybe it's the DVDrw's fault. But I doubt this is the case. EDIT-no success with this-
And hopefully, in the meantime someone can help me out with the RAID controller f6'd driver issue.

For now, Billyc, can you post the filenames and sizes from the pre-install floppy of the Raid Controller Driver that you used?
I want to make sure that they match the ones I am using. * :beg:
April 7, 2007 8:03:46 AM

No problem. That's one of the first things I did after a couple failures, replaced the DVD w my old one - same problem. Then I replaced the cable - same problem.

Quote:
I was talking about the Master/Slave/CableSelect jumper on the DVDrw
(wondering if I should have the DVDrw's jumper on Cable Select or have it matching the IDE connection as Master or removing it all-to-gether) Or if this would have any impact whatsoever.


The master/slave rules do apply with any IDE cable type device. So make sure you are jumpered to master and use the connector on the cable closest to the end.

Quote:
And because everyone suggests that you have to pre-windows-install 1.17 drivers from either Gigabyte or Jmicron
I was also Trying to figure out if a pre-install of the Jmicron drivers (the 3.0MB 1.17 drivers from Jmicron's web, from the x32 folder and onto the Root directory of a Floppy like it says to do) actually Did anything.
Or if mine didn't do the right thing.
Because, for me when I did the f6 pre-install with the JM836x RAID or AHCI(366 and 363) the SCSI/RAID controller didn't show up in Device Manager. Here the DVDrw is registered as IDE, but doesn't burn. It doesn't make any sense to me that I would pre-install a Raid controller driver or AHCI controller driver and the device that uses the driver, doesn't actually become active.


I have no explanation, but that matches my results exactly, only I ended up w/ DVDw working. The only justification I had for trying these drivers is that the Jmicron controller is the controller that the DVD is attached to. The Sata/Raid driver is the only driver I found for that controller and I found a reference in Jmicron site that 1.17.0.0 had a fix for a DVD write problem. One explanation I found for the SCSI identification of the DVDrw was that Jmicron was using SCSI emulation for PATA devices to support a SATA/PATA raid combo for HD's.

Quote:
The only way I can get the SCSI/Raid Controller to show up, is by running the Setup.exe from either Gigabyte or Jmicron, AFTER windows is installed.
And when That is done, the DVDrw is once again registered as SCSI, and still doesn't burn.
Turning off the Jmicron SCSI/RAID controller in device Manager, makes the DVDrw once again appear in device manager as an IDE device, but it still crashes when trying to burn.


I never used Setup.exe. Probably would have if I new of it at the time. What driver is associated with your IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers? I think that is the first Primary IDE channel in the list. Mine is "atapi.sys". That is windows default driver and it should work fine with any DVD.

Quote:
By doesn't burn, I mean:
I can get Windows to pop up "write these files to CD" and when I do it says there is an unexpected error that prevents me to burn try again or cancel.
If I use NERO, it gets to 82% no matter the size of the file(s) being burned, then just becomes inaccessible, I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL to shut it down.
I think it's because the IDE DVDrw is being registered as a SCSI device on whats supposed to be running as an IDE controller.


You have slightly different symptoms than you, but probably close enough to indicate the same problem. If I double click the drive from My Computer, I got an error message "F is not accessable. invalid function". I also use Nero and if I used a DVD already formated, it would sometimes work but I could not write to a new DVD that required formatting, getting basically the same error msg or something similar.

Quote:
For now, Billyc, can you post the filenames and sizes from the pre-install floppy of the Raid Controller Driver that you used? I want to make sure that they match the ones I am using. * :beg:


Sure. I may have mine screwed up and that's why it worked???? These are the files I put on the floppy, I was confused as to what all was required exactly and went with this:

jgogo.sys 7kb
jraid.cat 22kb
jraid.sys 43kb
jraid_f.inf 4kb
txtsetup.oem 4kb

If you don't have those files and want them, I could email them to you. If you want, send me your email @ in a PM.

I know at least one other person used my solution with good results. I would at least try to upgrade the driver of your dvd to the atapi.sys, if it isn't already using it. What have you got to loose?

I know I don't have much help to offer in this response, but I hope it helps and I wish you good luck.
April 7, 2007 9:52:02 AM

I have those drivers from Jmicron, and was pretty sure those were the ones you were using
And the setup.exe drivers From the 1.17 Gigabyte Setup.exe seems to be the same, except the jraid_f is renamed xraid_f and is a little larger

I had the same error message, but recently, I have been checking working status with drag drop files onto empty dvd-r, and that brings out my error

And I figured it should be the same as a normal for the DVD jumpers

Today:
A clean install, no pre-install drivers
yeilds the
A Primary IDE I assume its the one the DVDrw is on, is running in DMA-5
A Primary IDE I assume its the one the HDD is on, is running in DMA-2

As it is almost 6am, Tomorrow I will try messing with the drivers without using the setup.exe. I really don't think F6 Pre-installing drivers does Anything other than place them into folders that windows uses when Auto-searching for new hardware and drivers.
April 7, 2007 5:42:51 PM

Quote:
A clean install, no pre-install drivers
yields
A Primary IDE I assume its the one the DVDrw is on, is running in DMA-5
A Primary IDE I assume its the one the HDD is on, is running in DMA-2

Actually, I would assume it to be the other way around. While I obviously don't know for certain, I doubt there are any (PATA) optical drives out there which support DMA-5 (aka ATA-100). This is much more likely to be your hard drive. The DMA-2 (aka ATA-33) IDE is probably your optical drive.
(link to "Ultra DMA (UDMA) Modes" section on www.pcguide.com for anyone who is curious)

FWIW, while I have fooled around with AHCI drivers for the JMicron on the DS3, I never actually tried to burn anything to DVD while I had that configuration. I always assumed it would work, but I never explored it.

But then I never needed to. I have two optical drives sharing the same PATA cable which is connected to the JMicron PATA connector on my DS3. I have the JMicron set in the BIOS to IDE. I've successfully burned over 35 DVDs with that configuration using my Plextor 760 (master). If there is a problem in the JMicron controller with supporting optical drives, it is not a pervasive problem.

Have you considered RMA'ing and replacing the board? Maybe you just happened to get one with components that were slightly "off" ... :?

If you don't want to go the RMA route, another possibility that may work for you is to purchase an inexpensive name-brand PCI PATA controller. I got mine, a ("obsolete") Promise Ultra100 TX2 on eBay for $15. I had to update the firmware on the PCI card (requires a floppy drive I think) to enable 48-bit LBA addressing, but it's worked great for me ever since. Unfortunately, I've only used it with two hard drives so I can't speak from experience as to how it would work with optical drives. :oops: 

In previous posts, I've also suggested people try a PATA-to-SATA converter dongle. While that may work in your case, I am actually not suggesting it. I have my doubts about how well the PATA-to-SATA converters work with optical drives. They have worked very, very well for me with hard drives. With optical drives, I've seen some timeout, "bad block", and other error events show up in the Windows system event log. (Hmmmmmmm ... I looked just now and I see I have 13 "bad block" error events over a 2 minuted period for my Plextor around 4 days ago. Maybe I'll consider hooking my opticals up to my PATA PCI card after all ... :? :( )

You may also want to look at your windows event log to see what sort of errors are being logged when you DVD burn fails. You can display it by entering the command eventvwr.msc in the Run dialog box (or in a windows command prompt). Look at the System events. You might also want to use View->Filter... to select only the non-information events to cut down on the numbers of event entries to browse through.

Can you recreate the error using a simulated burn? I hope so. It would really suck if the only way you can investigate this is to create expensive failures. :( 

-john, the ostensibly clueless redundant legacy-in-transition dinosaur
April 9, 2007 10:25:26 AM

Well I have been trying with a FujiFilm DVD-Rs(cheap and ugly) and Verbatim -RW because the Erase function is there
and I have also used the Window's Drag, drop, write option for testing to see if things are recognized as they are supposed to be.
Because:
Nero fails after the writing has begun.
Window's doesn't even get started before it fails.

Soon I wil try a SATA DVD-RW drive, if this fails, Mobo goes back.
!