Demon Rig

[bassa]

Hey,

Alright, after a long time of hardware research and chit-chatting back and forth on these forums, I've put together my future box.

Yes, I know. It's a monster. And yes, I know, it's a pricey monster.

My question is this, though;

Would there be anything you guys would recommend to do instead, or are the various hardware just about perfect as they are?

I mean, putting that amount of money in a single computer really wants the other part of me to be pretty damn sure that I don't mess up and make a wrong purchase here and there.

Happy reading, I look forward to your answers.



Display: ViewSonic 23” WideScreen VP2330wb

Cabinet: Silverstone TJ09 Black

Power Supply Unit: Silverstone Zeus ST85ZF 850W

Motherboard: eVGA nForce 680i SLI

CPU: Intel Core 2 Extreme Processor QX6700

Cooling (CPU): Skythe Infinity

Memory: 4 x 1 GB Corsair XMS2 Xtreme Performance TwinX Matched / DUAL RAM / DDR II SDRAM / PC2-6400CL4 / 800 Mhz

Video Cards (SLI): 2 x eVGA GeForce 8800 GTX w/ ACS3

Cooling (VGA): Thermalright HR-03

Hard Drives: 2 x WD Raptor WD1500ADFD / 150 GB / 10000 RPM / 16 MB / Serial ATA 150 / 4.6 ms / RAID 1

Optical Drives: Samsung SH-S182D / DVD±RW (±R DL) / DVD-RAM 2 MB / 110 ms (CD) / 130 ms (DVD) / 48x (CD) / 16x (DVD) (R) / 48x (CD) / 18x (DVD±R) / 8x (DVD±R DL) (W) / 32x (CD) / 6x (DVD-RW) / 8x (DVD+RW) / 12x (DVD-RAM) (RW)

Sound Card: Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Platinum

Keyboard: Logitech G15 Keyboard

Mouse: Logitech MX Revolution

Headset: Undecided

OS: Windows Vista Business 64 Bit



Now, here's a few of my questions:

1. I haven't sorta been able to "find" the eVGA GeForce 8800 GTX w/ ACS3 card anywhere. At least, not with the "w/ACS3"-thingy, anyways. What does that "w/ACS3" mean? I think I remember it being some cooling sorta stuff. Is that correct?

2. I just casually picked out the Samsung SH-S182D optical drive. I mean, I'd like to read, write and re-write CD's and DVD's. Does that one do a good job for that?

3. I've switched over to the Raptor Harddrives. Originally, I put Seagate Barracuda drives on this list, but I heard that the Raptor's are much faster and are of really high quality. Was the switch a good choice, or should I switch back?

4. Thermalright HR-03. I have never been able to find this product on the web. Supposedly, it's a cooler for VGA cards, and I was recommended to take this product. But, if the cards have that ACS3 cooler on it (if it IS a cooling aid), should I then leave out this Thermalright HR-03 product?

I think that's about it then.

Looking forward to hear your voices and opinions, guys.

Have a great day!



Cheers,
Bassa[/b]

 

[jeff_2087]

Good heavens, man, that thing is an animal.

1. As far as I know, the ASC3 is just a different cover on the same Nvidia reference cooler. So it'll probably get you a few more MHz, but if you have to go on a two year quest and consult an oracle on a lonely mountain to find the thing, don't bother.

2. I don't know much about different optical drives. Samsung is a well known company, I'm sure it's pretty decent. Just google a review on it if you're concerned.

3. I personally don't see the point of Raptors outside of serious video editing. They won't help your FPS significantly, and for the price of 150GB or Raptor you could get 800GB of 7200rpm. I don't think Windows booting a couple seconds sooner justifies their price, but seeing as this computer is going to be ridiculously expensive anyway, it's your call. They're faster, that's for sure, but it's not crucial IMO.

4. I haven't heard of it either. I do know that the Nvidia 8800's stock cooler is pretty good. Again, if you have to go on another epic quest to obtain this thing, I can't imagine it making a world of difference.

 

[TStedel]

The 680i is a good motherboard. However, I ran into constant blue screens when I had it. To save you some trouble, this is due to the nVidia firewaill built in, and it was blocking a program or process called (DCOM).

If you run into blue screens, try to disable/uninstall the nvidia firewall.

The blue screens that I was running into were:

MEMORY_MANAGEMENT
IRQ_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL(or something to that affect)
and random page faults. These all stopped after disabling the built in firewall.

 

[croc]

Uh... I don't think that Office is an OS.

and a 21" monitor is kind of underkill for the graphics cards.

 

[TStedel]

Well most people only think of Raptors helping boot time. For me it was different. I open a lot of programs, and throughout the day, I go through a lot of hard drive intensive tasks. Opening up dreamweaver/eclipse/anything goes quicker, opening up multiple documents renders and loads quicker, programs install quicker, archives decompress faster, games load faster, if you don't have enough memory the pagefile will seem significantly faster, uninstalling programs, defragging went faster, there was less "pauses" as I would go through folders, and one very important thing, is if you are downloading large programs that usually take a while to install, the time will be greatly reduced; there are many more factors to take into consideration than simply boot times. Generally, Raptors made my entire computer feel two to four times as responsive (Times taken to decompress .rar archives was often cut in four, also, this was a raid0 with two raptors.), etc.

Edit: not to mention internet explorer/firefox tabs open more quickly, pages that require plugins load more quickly, etc. I think you will be happier with the raptors.

However, this does remind me of something. The 680i southbridges raid controller seems to be lacking, in that it seems to cap out at about 120 mb/s. This isn't bad, but you won't feel extra responsiveness by throwing 3+ raptors in a raid array.

 

[chailvr]

Try getting a better monitor.,.21" is not enough

 

[av1on]

i like the build except for one little detail. Loose the logitech 350 headphones. I have them and frankly regret the day i purchased them. Ill give you a few reasons:

1. It is impossible to have them on your head longer then 20 minutes before having to move or adjust them a bit because of the aching of the earlobes. I have them on for hours and its quite a problem. You might say to just loosen them but trust me...it doesn't work, the padding sux.

2.The cord is different from the volume controller up to the headphones then it is down to the usb connector. After 3 months i started having problems with contact and couldn't get rid of the noise + the mic lost contact completely due the cord. The cord is pretty thin from the volume controller to the entry of the headphones.

I kinda looks like i am bashing too much but thats just me regretting the money i spent on them...there are loads of better headphones with same sound quality (which is good afaik) so i suggest you find others, or read some review etc...

best of luck
avion

 

[p3matty]

First off, the ACS3 KO edition EVGA card is just a different cooler on the same core. I think it's clocked just a bit more, but if you're looking into aftermarket VGA cooling anyway, what's the point?

Second, that's WAY too much GPU for the monitor you're thinking about. I'd just stick to one of those cards right now, and think about either getting a second in the future, or doing the evga step-up when the 89xx series comes out. Remember, it's a lot easier to add a second card later than to send an unneeded and unwanted card back after you've used it.

Also, using 2 two-slot PCI x16 video cards is only going to leave you with 1 PCI slot open, which you want to fill with the most expensive sound card on the planet. If you do this, you won't be able to add anything else into a PCI slot. If it were me, I'd start with one video card and no sound card. If either the sound or the video don't quite meet what you want, upgrade then.

I second what the guy says about the hard drives. Raptors are a bit much. If you don't mind spending the money, at least get a third larger 7200rpm drive that's a backup of the first two, and could add additional storage space. I assume you picked 2 raptors to put into RAID 0. In that case, if either goes, you're screwed.....

This whole set it is going to run you somewhere close to $3-5k, correct? You could easily spend half of that and not know the difference in any non-benchmark applications.......

 

[Mondoman]

-)Get a bigger wide-screen monitor (or two).
-)Stick with 2x1GB of RAM. Vista (32-bit) won't be able to address more than about 3GB, so you're just throwing away money to get 4GB unless you're running the 64-bit version.
-)Read up on stability/incompatibilities of the 680i MB
-)Look into whether your MB will have heat problems if you switch from the OEM Intel "flower"-style cooler that blows air down onto the MB and out in all directions (thus cooling the PWM area and other nearby components) to the "tower"-style Scythe.

 

[jmd749]

at least a 24" monitor for that system, with hdmi for future use(ps3/blu-ray/native 1080p). benq have a lovely one FP241WZ it has composite, component, VGA, HDMI and DVI.

and i strongly advice to wait for the geforce 8900's, nvidia have a few tricks well up their sleeves.

 

[ibigfire]

I personally understand why he/she would want only a 21", I like 22" myself. Any larger is just... just too big, can't keep my eyes on it all at one time. 24 might be ok, but I defenitely wouldn't go any larger than that. Speaking of High Def though, what about getting a Bluray burner? Hmm....

 

[bassa]

Updated.

By the way, I really want that monitor.

http://www.viewsonic.com/products/desktopdisplays/lcddisplays/proseries/vp2330wb/

Also, it will be at least a month, or maybe 2 or 3, before I make the purchase, and things are bound to change, anyways. I may switch to the upcoming GeForce 8900's instead, by then.


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[Bobsama]

I'd say dump half of your demon-rig stuff... just get two or three sinner-rig's instead of a single demon-rig. I doubt that you will not notice ultra-fast components in comparison to very-fast components that are half the price.

The rig, as stated, will be "modern" (playing all games on high settings) for about 2-3 years. Save some money and bank with two high-end systems instead of a single number one!!!!!11!!!!one!111!! rig.

Intel Core 2 Duo E6600
Asus P5N32-E SLI Plus Motherboard (it's a hybrid motherboard; 650i northbridge and 590 southbridge, iirc)
If you want to overclock to 3ghz, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231110
If you want to overclock well beyond 3ghz, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231112
EVGA GeForce 8800GTX (single)
XClio A380 Case (2x25cm fans)
PC P&C Power Supply (550-watts should be more than enough)
Sceptre 20.1" LCD "Gamer" Monitors, 5ms response, DVI-D
DVD Burner, any kind (SATA would be cool, though not nearly necessary as the P5N32-E SLI Plus motherboard has IDE on the side, not the bottom)

That's pretty much what you're looking at... I'd recommend the second kit if you really want to overclock. 2x2GB DDR2 667 is good, 2x2GB DDR2 800 is great!

 

[sailer]

Like most have said, get a larger monitor if you're going SLI. As to the Raptors, I think it would be better to use only one Raptor and then have a Seagate or Western Digital as a second drive for data.

The Thermalright coolers look good, but you might also think about water cooling the videocards. Price out the difference and choose from there. Don't bother looking for the ACS3 video cards.

I take it that the Vista Premium version would be better than the Office version, especially when it comes to gaming. And yes, with the 64 bit OS, the 4 gig of ram is about right. You might consider ram from OCZ instead of Corsair. I've had trouble with the last two sets of Corsair ram and I found they changed their IC sets from Micron to Promos, which doesn't run as good.

 

[bassa]

I just wanted to add that I might do the following in order to save some money. After all, it's possible to save a few thousand US dollar and still get almost the same monster if I downgrade a few components.

1. 2 GB ram instead of 4GB.
2. Lower model CPU.
3. 1 GeForce 8800 GTX card instead of two. Can always upgrade.
4. I might add a 300GB Seagate Barracude harddrive just for the backup space. I WILL keep the two Raptor drives, though. And will set them up in RAID 1.

By the way, I thought that you'd have to have two cards of the same type in order to have them set up in SLI?

Also, if I buy the 64 Bit version of Windows Vista, will I then be able to run all my old programs and games (32 Bit)?

Is the memory modules and the motherboard the best choice for that particular system?

I never overclock.


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[p3matty]

Yes, you do have to have 2 of the same video cards to run sli. What I was saying is that you should just buy one 8800 now, as it won't make a difference to have a second with that monitor size. If for some reason it does, then buy a second 8800 later to run sli, or use the evga upgrade to swap the 8800 for a 8900 when they come out.

I agree that you should start with 2 gigs of memory. There are still 2 other slots open should you want to go to 4.

why run a raid 1 if you are going to have a 3rd drive for backup anyway?

Why not overclock the CPU and GPU if you are looking at aftermarket cooling already? Makes no sense....

I'm totally not sure on the whole 64 bit 32 bit thing right now and was hoping someone could fill me in on that as well. I mean, if the hardware is 64 bit compatible (as most AMDs have been for some time, and all C2Ds are, why not get the 64 bit version?)

 

[bassa]

Well, I will probably end up with clocking the CPU and GPU a tad or two.

Never is such an aggressive word.

But anyway, I just found out that the Thermalright HR-03 won't even fit on the GeForce 8800 series, so I'll need to find another supereffective, supersilent cooling aid for the VGA card.


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[bassa]

Oh and by the way, does anyone know if the Skythe Infinity cooler is very silent?

I just wanted to make sure that ALL coolers are supersilent and supereffective, if that combination is possible. Hehe.


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[jitpublisher]

I just wanted to add that I might do the following in order to save some money. After all, it's possible to save a few thousand US dollar and still get almost the same monster if I downgrade a few components.

1. 2 GB ram instead of 4GB.
2. Lower model CPU.
3. 1 GeForce 8800 GTX card instead of two. Can always upgrade.
4. I might add a 300GB Seagate Barracude harddrive just for the backup space. I WILL keep the two Raptor drives, though. And will set them up in RAID 1.

By the way, I thought that you'd have to have two cards of the same type in order to have them set up in SLI?

Also, if I buy the 64 Bit version of Windows Vista, will I then be able to run all my old programs and games (32 Bit)?

Is the memory modules and the motherboard the best choice for that particular system?

I never overclock.


Cheers,
Bassa

For the money, that looks much better to me. That monster rig in your first post is not worth the expense for only a very small performance increase that you will only see running benchmarks.

 

[skyguy]

I own that Samsung optical....VERY GOOD. Quieter than my LG by ALOT, fast, cheap, looks good. I know it's a cheap item, but it's a good choice.

OH, and DEFINITELY get a backup hard drive. If/when one goes down you'll be crying when you lose your data. Programs can be resintalled, but data can't. Spend $100 and get a 300 gig drive for backup. Backup drive, your BEST friend.

 

[sailer]

I just wanted to add that I might do the following in order to save some money. After all, it's possible to save a few thousand US dollar and still get almost the same monster if I downgrade a few components.

1. 2 GB ram instead of 4GB.
2. Lower model CPU.
3. 1 GeForce 8800 GTX card instead of two. Can always upgrade.
4. I might add a 300GB Seagate Barracude harddrive just for the backup space. I WILL keep the two Raptor drives, though. And will set them up in RAID 1.

By the way, I thought that you'd have to have two cards of the same type in order to have them set up in SLI?

Also, if I buy the 64 Bit version of Windows Vista, will I then be able to run all my old programs and games (32 Bit)?

Is the memory modules and the motherboard the best choice for that particular system?

I never overclock.Cheers, Bassa

Ok, # 1 is good, as it will probably be months before any game or other software will need 4 gig or ram.

2. Can't say if that's good or not. New games and apps will be gettting written to fully take advantage of multicore cpus, so your original choice may be a bit better for the future.

3. Good choice, especially if you stay with your original monitor choice. Yes, the cards do have to be identical to work correctly. But as someone else posted, if you end up wanting more power later, a newer model single card may produce better results then getting another of the same type and going SLI.

4. Not sure of the sense of that. If you decide on three drives, I think I'd put the two Raptors in Raid 0 and leaves the third drive for data. But everybody has their own desire for their own reasons so I can't really argue against it.

The 64 bit version will run 32 bit programs and games. It has an emulator for that. Also, in my opinion, other than DX10 capibility, there is no good reason to use the 32 bit version of Vista if your cpu supports 64 bit. I compare it to to having a V8 car engine and taking out half the spark plugs, making it effectively a V4. Future games and other software will be getting written for 64 bit, though they will probably support 32 bit for a couple more years.

Sorry the Thermalright doesn't fit the video cards, but that still leaves water cooling as an option. I have had a water cooled video card and I like it. Much quieter than an air cooled with the loud fan.

 

[bassa]

#1 is good, as it will probably be months before any game or other software will need 4 gig or ram.

Oh, on the game part definitely yes, but seeing as I probably haven't said this before, I'll let you all know right now. I'm a professional graphics artist and webdesigner, and I spend a lot of time working in Photoshop with 600dpi images that take well over 2 gigabytes of space for just one file, so. In my case, 4GB will definitely be helpful. The only reason as to why I downgraded the memory department was only to save some money when I make the first buy. If I feel that I need the last 2 GB Ram modules, I can always purchase them and add them to the rig.

2. Can't say if that's good or not. New games and apps will be gettting written to fully take advantage of multicore cpus, so your original choice may be a bit better for the future.

The chance for me to downgrade the CPU is very small. It's one of the few things in a future-ready rig that will need close consideration. I'll probably stick with the QX6700, but if I don't, I'll get a dual-core instead. I think it's the Q6800, if I remember correctly.

3. Good choice, especially if you stay with your original monitor choice. Yes, the cards do have to be identical to work correctly. But as someone else posted, if you end up wanting more power later, a newer model single card may produce better results then getting another of the same type and going SLI.

Makes one wonder what exactly the benefit of SLI is, huh?

But anyway, by the time I will be making the purchase, perhaps the GeForce 8900 has been released, and then I might even go SLI with 2 GeForce 8900 cards.

4. Not sure of the sense of that. If you decide on three drives, I think I'd put the two Raptors in Raid 0 and leaves the third drive for data. But everybody has their own desire for their own reasons so I can't really argue against it.

Well, I plan on using the two raptor drives for the OS, Software and Games. Someone just mentioned that adding a third drive would be a good idea, so I thought about doing just that and using the third one for backups of my work along with music, movies, and other "non-important" stuff.

Also, by judging from the negative experiences done by others, I'd prefer not to go with RAID 0. Because that's the setting that will give you faster speed, but also wear down your drives faster, enhancing the risk for damaged drives, ie. lost data. And I generally try to stay the hell out of the way of "lost data".

RAID 1 seemed a better solution for me at the time we we're discussing it, but honestly though, I can't even remember what the RAID 1 setting did. Heh.

The 64 bit version will run 32 bit programs and games. It has an emulator for that. Also, in my opinion, other than DX10 capibility, there is no good reason to use the 32 bit version of Vista if your cpu supports 64 bit. I compare it to to having a V8 car engine and taking out half the spark plugs, making it effectively a V4. Future games and other software will be getting written for 64 bit, though they will probably support 32 bit for a couple more years.

Yes. I lean more and more towards purchasing the 64 Bit Vista solution. Though, you make it sound as if the 64 Bit solution doesn't support the new DirectX 10 technology. Is that true?

Sorry the Thermalright doesn't fit the video cards, but that still leaves water cooling as an option. I have had a water cooled video card and I like it. Much quieter than an air cooled with the loud fan.

I've thought a lot of getting a water cooling system for the rig, but truth be told, the noise difference between water cooling and cooling effective, and silent, heatsinks + fans seem more "me". I am hardhearing on top of that, so "a little" noise wouldn't really bother me, anyhow.


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[Bobsama]

If you want quad-core, go with a Q6600 and overclock it to specs of QX6700; not a big jump.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819115017
It saves you $150.

You might want to look at 2GB modules for memory... you can run 4GB in dual-channel for about $400 with two more DIMMs available for another 4GB kit (again, $400).

DDR2 667, 4GB kit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231110
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820144056

DDR2 800, 4GB kit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231112

Take a look at those...

If you go for over 2GB of RAM, you'll want the 64-bit OS (iirc, the 32-bit versions don't support over ~3gb).

 

[bassa]

And what would be the absolutely best RAM modules to purchase for my new rig? I just want high-end memory. Price is of no concern. But of course, value for money IS a priority.

I thought about these, maybe?

1. OCZ FlexXLC Edition 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1150 (PC2 9200)

2. G.SKILL 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)

And by the way, someone please enlighten me here.

1. Cas Latency (CL) = ???

Lower is better, right? CL4 is usually faster, or more reliable, than CL5?

2. PC9200 is better than PC6400, correct?

Higher is better?


Cheers,
Bassa

 

[Bobsama]

Then you could go with 8GB out of the gate... just pick up 2 of the 4GB kits! Don't forget Vista 64bit...