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Looks like the delay is true

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February 23, 2007 1:35:15 PM

Well, the article is speculating that it could take 6 months to transition K8L (K10?) from server to desktop. That would be a big hit to AMD, if true.
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February 23, 2007 1:46:23 PM



Probably has to do with low yields of Barcelona at the clock speeds they need to be competitive. They might be getting decent yields at low clock speeds but why waste a bunch of silicon on making 2.0 GHz Barcelonas when you can make 2.6 GHz Brisbanes that are just as fast and smaller in size?

I'm predicting a paper launch in late Q2 with cherry picked parts benchmarked across the Web, but no real volume through 2007. Instead they'll go flat out on Brisbanes, reducing die sizes with new steppings and trying to boost clock. It'll probably keep them in the game for mobile, low end & mainstream desktops, and low end servers but forget high end desktop and server for the remainder of the year. And with Intel continuing to push the price pressure and probably get one or two more Conroe speed grades out this year, I see AMD bleeding big time especially in 2H07.

That prediction and a dollar will buy you a snack from the vending machine.
February 23, 2007 3:39:31 PM

Actually I don't think a delay on desktops would affect AMD nearly as much as a delay on servers. The reason is that servers are where the big margins are, as well as where I think K8L will shine, based on all the hints so far about its strengths.

While many enthusiasts do pay prices similar to single-socket server chips, AMD has charged a tremendous premium on multi-socket chips (think 50-150% for essentially the same silicon) primarily because it has shown better scalability than Intel's platforms - and these chips actually sell pretty well.
February 23, 2007 3:46:54 PM

Oh FFS. I'm ---> <--- this close to giving up on AMD.

R600 delayed till may, K8L won't be in volume until '08. Jesus.
February 23, 2007 3:48:56 PM

K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.
February 23, 2007 3:50:24 PM

Quote:
Not quite. This is old news. What they mean is that it will take that long to exhaust Windsor and Brisbane and have Kuma/Agena at 100% of new production.

That is to be expected since they can't just stop making Brisbane and Windsor.


Baron, what part of:

Hector Ruiz, Chief Executive for the company, has stated that K8L will not take off this year.

Do you not understand? 8O

When Scientia stated in the 2,3Ghz Barcelona Vs. 3Ghz Clovertown thread:

For example, why do people keep mentioning that 2.6Ghz won't be out until Q2 08? You get 2.5Ghz in Q3 07. The extra 100Mhz isn't going to matter that much.

You replied just a few hours ago:

Pretty god (sp) assessent as usual


(interesting that you refer to Scientia as a god! :lol:  )

How come it's old news just a few hours later???

Edited to add example
February 23, 2007 3:58:15 PM

Quote:
Oh FFS. I'm ---> <--- this close to giving up on AMD.

R600 delayed till may, K8L won't be in volume until '08. Jesus.


Even I'm starting to get uneasy about AMDs degree of pwnage of late :o 
February 23, 2007 4:14:07 PM

For their sake they'd better PRAY K8L is the 2nd coming of Christ. 'Cause if it's just marginally better than C2D, AMD is in biiiig trouble. 45nm Penryn's around going to be awesome due to the high-k crap.
February 23, 2007 4:17:12 PM

Heh I feel like an idiot for my last post now regarding AMD/Intel. Servers really are where AMD makes it money not off of fanboys/home users. Selling 10 chips per server at 15% marging or 1 to a picky consumer getting 7% marging or 100 to Dell at 1% margin. My percentages I guarantee are wrong. If AMD releases a processor that works well in servers/better than a C2D in servers but sucks in my gaming rig they'll still be here for a long time and in 5-6 years could pop a surprise on Intel for the home user.
February 23, 2007 4:17:48 PM

Quote:
Not quite. This is old news. What they mean is that it will take that long to exhaust Windsor and Brisbane and have Kuma/Agena at 100% of new production.

That is to be expected since they can't just stop making Brisbane and Windsor.


Baron, what part of:

Hector Ruiz, Chief Executive for the company, has stated that K8L will not take off this year.

Do you not understand? 8O

When Scientia stated in the 2,3Ghz Barcelona Vs. 3Ghz Clovertown thread:

For example, why do people keep mentioning that 2.6Ghz won't be out until Q2 08? You get 2.5Ghz in Q3 07. The extra 100Mhz isn't going to matter that much.

You replied just a few hours ago:

Pretty god (sp) assessent as usual


(interesting that you refer to Scientia as a god! :lol:  )

How come it's old news just a few hours later???

Edited to add example


Another example of Brood subjective reading. Hector said EXACLY what I said. The time they are talking about is to make Barcelona the majority of shipments.


Quote:
The new desktop chips will feature AM2+ form-factor and will, according to unofficial information, be compatible with existing AM2 infrastructure. By the Q4 of 2007 AMD’s product mix will include 20% of AM2+ processors, while by the end of Q1 2008 there will be “above 60%” of AM2+ processors among all chips shipped by AMD, according to earlier information.


From XBit

Quote:
If the information is correct, it will take AMD three quarters to shift 60% to 70% of its desktop products to the new infrastructure and micro-architecture. By comparison, it took Advanced Micro Devices about two quarters to shift virtually all of its desktop chips to AM2 infrastructure from 939-pin and 754-pin form-factors, meaning that the K8L will really have the biggest impact on AMD’s results in 2008, whereas in 2007 the company will have to use its K8 micro-architecture to compete.




Yet another verification.

Just decide to not buy AMD if you think you could handle a monopolist better.
February 23, 2007 4:34:38 PM

Baron, it's not so much us not wanting to buy AMD... it's more like does it make sense to buy AMD? Right now, very few processors in AMD's line up are "good buys." The low end is great... but their midrange and high end line up is just plain stupid. Since most of us are "power users" we're naturally going to migrate with whatever's best. That's how I operate anyways.

This 18 month gap between C2D and K8L is just a little too much and I'm frankly worried AMD won't have a competitive product 1 year from now. I keep saying to myself "well, I'll wait another couple months to upgrade." But now I can't because AMD keeps moving release dates back on all its products. Fcuking... nothing is on schedule! Meanwhile Intel is way ahead of schedule. Same goes forn nVidia... but the time R600 is out, nVidia will have the 8950GX2 out!

I think this ATI merger is starting to rear it's ugly head in the form of delays.
February 23, 2007 4:43:08 PM

Quote:
Not quite. This is old news. What they mean is that it will take that long to exhaust Windsor and Brisbane and have Kuma/Agena at 100% of new production.

That is to be expected since they can't just stop making Brisbane and Windsor.


Baron, what part of:

Hector Ruiz, Chief Executive for the company, has stated that K8L will not take off this year.

Do you not understand? 8O

When Scientia stated in the 2,3Ghz Barcelona Vs. 3Ghz Clovertown thread:

For example, why do people keep mentioning that 2.6Ghz won't be out until Q2 08? You get 2.5Ghz in Q3 07. The extra 100Mhz isn't going to matter that much.

You replied just a few hours ago:

Pretty god (sp) assessent as usual


(interesting that you refer to Scientia as a god! :lol:  )

How come it's old news just a few hours later???

Edited to add example


Another example of Brood subjective reading. Hector said EXACLY what I said. The time they are talking about is to make Barcelona the majority of shipments.


Quote:
The new desktop chips will feature AM2+ form-factor and will, according to unofficial information, be compatible with existing AM2 infrastructure. By the Q4 of 2007 AMD’s product mix will include 20% of AM2+ processors, while by the end of Q1 2008 there will be “above 60%” of AM2+ processors among all chips shipped by AMD, according to earlier information.


From XBit

Quote:
If the information is correct, it will take AMD three quarters to shift 60% to 70% of its desktop products to the new infrastructure and micro-architecture. By comparison, it took Advanced Micro Devices about two quarters to shift virtually all of its desktop chips to AM2 infrastructure from 939-pin and 754-pin form-factors, meaning that the K8L will really have the biggest impact on AMD’s results in 2008, whereas in 2007 the company will have to use its K8 micro-architecture to compete.




Yet another verification.

Just decide to not buy AMD if you think you could handle a monopolist better.

This is very bad, :cry:  AMD doesn't have till next year to launch K8L the money well dries up in about six months maybe a little faster after Intel pulls the rug out on Core2Duo prices in April. Without K8L or an R600 launch that generates revenue not just a paper launch I fear the end is nearer than we would like to admit.

Prepare for the new BOHICA (Bend Over Here It Comes) processor line from Intel starting at $1,500 for the celery version up to 10,000 for the extreme edition.
February 23, 2007 4:56:59 PM

Quote:

Just decide to not buy AMD if you think you could handle a monopolist better.


What operating system are you running again? ...Oh Windows Vista you say? You should erase your hard drive immediately as you don't want to be supporting a monopolist now would you?

Why the double standard between Microsoft the true monopolist and intel the wannabe monopolist?
February 23, 2007 4:57:13 PM

The time has come.

It is time for us to move on...to another company...for our processors...

LONG LIVE VIA!

[/most sarcastic comment EVER]
February 23, 2007 5:00:51 PM

Quote:
The time has come.

It is time for us to move on...to another company...for our processors...

LONG LIVE VIA!

[/most sarcastic comment EVER]


Didn't VIA stop making processors?
Also if VIA or someone was to make processors after AMD died(doubt will happen). Intel could then be a monopolist and squash it. However if it was a US company the Democrats who are going to take over would probably veto any buyout. Do I have a point.. probably not.

Moreso just curious does VIA even make anything these days other than chipsets which have been non-impressive lately.
February 23, 2007 5:07:17 PM

Quote:
K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.



The big thing is that X1950 in CrossFire is still POWERFUL and even G80 is useless in that there aren't any DX10 games. Even CrySis got pshed back.
February 23, 2007 5:10:31 PM

Quote:

Just decide to not buy AMD if you think you could handle a monopolist better.


What operating system are you running again? ...Oh Windows Vista you say? You should erase your hard drive immediately as you don't want to be supporting a monopolist now would you?

Why the double standard between Microsoft the true monopolist and intel the wannabe monopolist?

MS is just lucky I guess. There is only one platform to run Visual Studio 2005 on. There are two platforms to run Windows on.

Is that clear now? If a new DX10/OpenGL 2.0 OS comes out that runs Visual Studio MS is out.

I don't see that happening so........
February 23, 2007 5:12:43 PM

Quote:

Didn't VIA stop making processors?
Also if VIA or someone was to make processors after AMD died(doubt will happen). Intel could then be a monopolist and squash it. However if it was a US company the Democrats who are going to take over would probably veto any buyout. Do I have a point.. probably not.

Moreso just curious does VIA even make anything these days other than chipsets which have been non-impressive lately.


Yes, but it's top secret. Strictly need-to-know.

The performance isn't great-it's not even good. They just don't want Intel to know. :wink:
February 23, 2007 5:15:52 PM

Quote:
This is very bad, AMD doesn't have till next year to launch K8L the money well dries up in about six months maybe a little faster after Intel pulls the rug out on Core2Duo prices in April. Without K8L or an R600 launch that generates revenue not just a paper launch I fear the end is nearer than we would like to admit.

Prepare for the new BOHICA (Bend Over Here It Comes) processor line from Intel starting at $1,500 for the celery version up to 10,000 for the extreme edition.


it's bad that you can't seem to be able to understand simple statements. Barcelona is releasing in Q2 but if Fab36 is only at 50% then some of that has to be Brisbane and Lima they can't possibly get more than 50% Barcelona before 08.

AMD should have gone out of business when they were at 10% or 15%. 25% of 200 million PCs is 50 million PCs. I think they're safe.

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.
February 23, 2007 5:28:00 PM

Quote:

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.


This coming from the root source of all FUD here makes me :lol: 
February 23, 2007 5:34:49 PM

True, that AMD will get more monetary value from the server sector, but with a delay to desktops, that will do nothing but give reason to jump ship and find another source for desktop computing, ie. Intel.

While not as damaging as in the server sector, when defections start, some vendors (ie. HP, Dell, Acer, etc), might also slow it's purchases of CPUs from AMD, until a newer CPU is available for desktop, or simply keep AMD's low/mid range, and not even consider mid to high range CPUs. That's where it could hurt AMD, imo.
February 23, 2007 5:36:41 PM

Quote:

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.


The Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt are coming from AMD itself, there's no need for anyone to spread it.

Fear from looking at AMD's balance sheet, their falling margins, and Intel's upcoming price cuts.
Uncertainty from the lack of any K10 or R600 benchmarks.
Doubt from the failure to meet the R600 release dates and the lack of explanation for the delays.

The ATI acquisition looks ill timed indeed right now, and CPU market share won't matter if they run out of cash.
February 23, 2007 5:49:24 PM

I am sure AMD will do just fine even if it takes until 2008 to release the K10. After all it is RUMORED that the K10 can beat a processor that Intel released in Mid-2006. :roll:

And to think, BM had me soooo close buying an AMD system that could upgrade to the K8L this summer because this summer was when AMD would rule the CPU market.

Oh wait, that was some other person that BM talked in to wasting money on east german WWII surplus computer hardware technology that will be outdated by the time AMD gets it to market. :cry: 

So here's to Baron Matrix, protector of free market Competition and defender of AMD. :trophy:
February 23, 2007 5:52:13 PM

Quote:
K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.


Ok, speaking as an AMD stockholder, lets say that there are a lot of very unhappy stockholders out there that would like to fire everybody in the boardroom and find some new group who knows how to run a business, other than into the ground. My take is that either K8L, and perhaps the R600 were either fakes made up to fool the public or some people down in their R&D labs have been smoking some of those funny sounding drugs and made a bunch of junk that doesn't work.

Think about it, AM2 was supposed to be a step up in performance. It wasn't. The FX70-74 series was supposed to work wonders. It didn't. The move to 65nm was supposed to help. It didn't. Recent offerings in cpus have been just more of the same. Oh yes, slight increases in advertised mhz, but nothing new and exciting when it comes to total speed, especially when tweaked by overclockers.

I don't know the real answer here, but how am I expected to buy a product that supports the company I invested in when there is no product, nothing new to give me reason to buy it? And so I watch the stock prices tumble, knowing that there is no good answer in sight. Oh by the way, does anybody have a sword or something I can fall on?
February 23, 2007 6:00:04 PM

Quote:

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.


This coming from the root source of all FUD here makes me :lol: 


I don't spread fear, uncertainty and doubt. Typos don't count as FUD. Neither do mistakes in references (unless it's purposeful and negative).

Makng up crap liek he did is FUD.
February 23, 2007 6:06:54 PM

Quote:
K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.



The big thing is that X1950 in CrossFire is still POWERFUL and even G80 is useless in that there aren't any DX10 games. Even CrySis got pshed back.

How is having the most powerful DX9 card useless??
February 23, 2007 6:07:27 PM

Quote:
K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.


Ok, speaking as an AMD stockholder, lets say that there are a lot of very unhappy stockholders out there that would like to fire everybody in the boardroom and find some new group who knows how to run a business, other than into the ground. My take is that either K8L, and perhaps the R600 were either fakes made up to fool the public or some people down in their R&D labs have been smoking some of those funny sounding drugs and made a bunch of junk that doesn't work.

Think about it, AM2 was supposed to be a step up in performance. It wasn't. The FX70-74 series was supposed to work wonders. It didn't. The move to 65nm was supposed to help. It didn't. Recent offerings in cpus have been just more of the same. Oh yes, slight increases in advertised mhz, but nothing new and exciting when it comes to total speed, especially when tweaked by overclockers.

I don't know the real answer here, but how am I expected to buy a product that supports the company I invested in when there is no product, nothing new to give me reason to buy it? And so I watch the stock prices tumble, knowing that there is no good answer in sight. Oh by the way, does anybody have a sword or something I can fall on?


AM2 was just suposed to intro DDR2 AMD NEVER said it would increase performance. QFX was said to be a Mega-tasking platform and it is. You can run encoding, decoding, etc WHILE plaing a high res game.

Why did you even buy AMD stock if you are this concerned that they are "liars" or "on crack?"

The stock price is falling because of the uncertainty Intel is promoting with this price war ( or should I say Core 2 predatory pricing).

AMD has proved that they have the balls and the know-how to overtake Intel in perf and platforms. WHat's the problem? Rampng a new architecture with only two Fabs and a contract is not a 5 minute process.
February 23, 2007 6:11:44 PM

Quote:
K10 to 08. Holy crap. Wouldn't have believed it. What does this do, push K10 2.6 Ghz to 09? R600 is now May, will it slide further too?

Ladles and germs... You can flame me all you want, but I absolutely insist that there must be some huge chaos going on inside AMD's boardroom that we are not privy to. That's the only possible explanation for this suicide policy.



The big thing is that X1950 in CrossFire is still POWERFUL and even G80 is useless in that there aren't any DX10 games. Even CrySis got pshed back.

How is having the most powerful DX9 card useless??

The best thing it can do for nVidia is make it harder to sell 7900GTX. Even if R600 were out now there are no DX10 games.

I might be inclined to wait also. I still expect to see it at CeBit next month. Someone said they may cancel but I wouldn't. It is suposedly at final silicon.
February 23, 2007 6:15:55 PM

I'm sorry that most of you who post here are complete idiots. Jesus. It's Not delayed by any means. This just says that AMD doesn't launch like Intel. When Intel launched Core 2 Duo, they launched a ton to the desktop segment first. With AMD, it will launch to the server segment, and then it will start to ramp desktop in Q3 and Q4. This doesn't mean that k8l desktop parts won't be available. AMD was ramping brisbane and you could still by brisbanes on newegg in early january. This is not a dealy, it's how AMD prioritizes cpus. Servers first, then desktops and mobile. Whoever wrote delay should be stripped of his or her keyboard.
February 23, 2007 6:17:05 PM

Quote:

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.


This coming from the root source of all FUD here makes me :lol: 


I don't spread fear, uncertainty and doubt. Typos don't count as FUD. Neither do mistakes in references (unless it's purposeful and negative).

Makng up crap liek he did is FUD.
http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam...
http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam...


Obviously I need to post the definition of FUD since dancing in the club and talking about being a developer have NOTHING to do with fear, uncertainty and doubt.


Quote:
FUD was first defined by Gene Amdahl after he left IBM to found his own company, Amdahl Corp.: "FUD is the fear, uncertainty, and doubt that IBM sales people instill in the minds of potential customers who might be considering Amdahl products."[1] The term has also been attributed to veteran Morgan Stanley computer analyst Ulrich Weil.

As Eric S. Raymond writes: "The idea, of course, was to persuade buyers to go with safe IBM gear rather than with competitors' equipment


I posted code snippets and links to my rap album and links to my published article on developent techniques. I could post them again if you need to be slapped around some more.
February 23, 2007 6:22:41 PM

Quote:
I'm sorry that most of you who post here are complete idiots. Jesus. It's Not delayed by any means. This just says that AMD doesn't launch like Intel. When Intel launched Core 2 Duo, they launched a ton to the desktop segment first. With AMD, it will launch to the server segment, and then it will start to ramp desktop in Q3 and Q4. This doesn't mean that k8l desktop parts won't be available. AMD was ramping brisbane and you could still by brisbanes on newegg in early january. This is not a dealy, it's how AMD prioritizes cpus. Servers first, then desktops and mobile. Whoever wrote delay should be stripped of his or her keyboard.


LOL! Talk about spin. I suppose the R600 isn't delayed either. It's just being "reprioritized", right?

Let's cut thru the bullshi*t here. It's DELAYED. I guarandamntee you that consumers won't see K8L this year.
February 23, 2007 6:30:20 PM

Quote:
I'm sorry that most of you who post here are complete idiots. Jesus. It's Not delayed by any means. This just says that AMD doesn't launch like Intel. When Intel launched Core 2 Duo, they launched a ton to the desktop segment first. With AMD, it will launch to the server segment, and then it will start to ramp desktop in Q3 and Q4. This doesn't mean that k8l desktop parts won't be available. AMD was ramping brisbane and you could still by brisbanes on newegg in early january. This is not a dealy, it's how AMD prioritizes cpus. Servers first, then desktops and mobile. Whoever wrote delay should be stripped of his or her keyboard.


LOL! Talk about spin. I suppose the R600 isn't delayed either. It's just being "reprioritized", right?

Let's cut thru the bullshi*t here. It's DELAYED. I guarandamntee you that consumers won't see K8L this year.
Why would you say R600 isn't delayed? It most certainly is. How can you "guarandamntee" me that consumers won't see K8L this year? Are you an insider? I could put an easy bet that they definitely would.
February 23, 2007 6:33:23 PM

Quote:

Why did you even buy AMD stock if you are this concerned that they are "liars" or "on crack?"


I bought the stock last fall when it looked like the R600 was coming out by December and the K8L was still on track. And yes, I've taken a bath on it. I keep hoping that AMD will do something right so the price goes back up, but they don't seem to know what right is. Fortunately my other stocks are doing well, so I'm financially secure.

So AM2 was only about getting into DDR2 ram and nothing else. Then what was the point of it, other than to get people to spend a lot of money for no real gain? IF my 939 base computer runs just as fast, then there is no reason for change. And the QFX is a monster. Would have been better to never advertise it as a gaming machine, but to simply left it to the server market.
February 23, 2007 6:44:42 PM

Quote:

But continue spreadng doubt, fear and uncertainty.


The Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt are coming from AMD itself, there's no need for anyone to spread it.

Fear from looking at AMD's balance sheet, their falling margins, and Intel's upcoming price cuts.
Uncertainty from the lack of any K10 or R600 benchmarks.
Doubt from the failure to meet the R600 release dates and the lack of explanation for the delays.

The ATI acquisition looks ill timed indeed right now, and CPU market share won't matter if they run out of cash.

What are you alkng about? When you by a company for $5B, it actually costs $5B. They have released several new platforms for everything from cell phones to DVRs to HTPCs to OLPC and embedded.

Core 2 was released in Jul/Aug and benches showed up in April. From the way people post here you would say they were lying.

I'll believe there's a problem when the OEMs start saying it. So far they are just buying up every X2/Radeon there is.

After all, X2 still gets the same fps, etc, so with lower prices you can only complain that they haven't blinked in the face of a predatory monopoly.

Obviously this business is NOT for the faint of heart.
February 23, 2007 6:48:06 PM

Has anyone even bothered to read the actual interview with Ruiz the CEO of AMD??

http://www.crn.com/sections/special/reports/sellingsmb.jhtml?articleId=197007770&pgno=1&queryText=

It sheds light on a lot of things. AMD is not dead. And the CPU war is alive as ever. Here are some great excerpts from the interview:

Quote:
CRN: Intel is said to be regaining a big lead in performance over AMD and gaining mind share with the channel. What do you say to that?

RUIZ: In spite of all the hype and hoopla, there is not really such thing that Intel has leapfrogged AMD. It's quite the contrary. As a matter of fact, despite all the perceptions of Intel closing the gap, half the time they do a little bit better and the other half we do. And all of that will end with the introduction of Barcelona because it's such a significant jump in performance and quality. I'm confident we will lead in that respect.

CRN: You mentioned the importance of Barcelona. What will be its impact on AMD this year?

RUIZ: This is an incredibly important product transition. We don't expect the ramp [this year] to be dramatic because it's a new core, new micro architecture and platform. The biggest impact it will have is that we'll see a large number of customers and partners align themselves behind the technology. We expect that ramp to follow along the same lines as when Opteron began to get adopted. So I expect it to follow the same patterns. Over 2007, it will have a significant impact on what I call design wins. People are committed to the architecture and product, and [it will be] a very significant part of revenue and earning in 2008.

CRN: What will be the performance of Barcelona vs. Intel's quad-core?

RICHARD: It's in the speculation stage. [But] we know that we expect performance gains in the 40 percent to 70 percent range, and we know the scalability of our architecture is better than the competition. And it's no secret they have to introduce a new architecture at some point, so we know Barcelona will perform exceptionally well and will be outperforming the competition. The program is on track.
February 23, 2007 7:01:43 PM

Quote:

Why did you even buy AMD stock if you are this concerned that they are "liars" or "on crack?"


I bought the stock last fall when it looked like the R600 was coming out by December and the K8L was still on track. And yes, I've taken a bath on it. I keep hoping that AMD will do something right so the price goes back up, but they don't seem to know what right is. Fortunately my other stocks are doing well, so I'm financially secure.

So AM2 was only about getting into DDR2 ram and nothing else. Then what was the point of it, other than to get people to spend a lot of money for no real gain? IF my 939 base computer runs just as fast, then there is no reason for change. And the QFX is a monster. Would have been better to never advertise it as a gaming machine, but to simply left it to the server market.


MS is the perfect example of the stock not reflecting value. MS pockets $1B per month and their stock is crap. Analysts insist on making Intel's every move a factor in AMDs stock price ( even while their shae continues to grow).

That's why the price went down. If they really looked at the business model they would see that AMD is doing better than it ever has.
They secured Dell, Sun is winning HPC contracts like crazy with Opteron, China has picked up on AMD in a big way, AMD chipsets are the best in mobile, etc.
That's the signs of a strong company not a weak one. I would lke their stock price to reflect the highest market share in their history and their deployment in 80%(according to the CRN interview) of the Fortune 500.

Of course the wierd symbiotic relationship people have with Intel is a factor so I am not surprised. I even understand why.
February 23, 2007 7:28:23 PM

Quote:
CRN: What will be the performance of Barcelona vs. Intel's quad-core?

RICHARD: It's in the speculation stage. [But] we know that we expect performance gains in the 40 percent to 70 percent range

"in the speculation stage"??? Does anyone else infer this to mean they don't even have functional silicon to test yet?
February 23, 2007 7:45:34 PM

Quote:
Has anyone even bothered to read the actual interview with Ruiz the CEO of AMD??

http://www.crn.com/sections/special/reports/sellingsmb.jhtml?articleId=197007770&pgno=1&queryText=

It sheds light on a lot of things. AMD is not dead. And the CPU war is alive as ever. Here are some great excerpts from the interview:


Ok, I read through it. Ruiz admits to some mis-executions. Problem is, when there is one mis-execution after another, something seems very wrong. Instead of announcing a release date for a product, and then delaying it time after time after time, maybe they should try building a product that works and then stating when it will be on the market, rather than giving a release date and then saying it is delayed, again and again and again. What's the real problem; bad manufactering, bad quality control, bad software and drivers?

We've all heard about the problems Nvidia has had getting their 8800 series cards to work with DX10. I'm sure AMD does not want to have those problems with its product. At the same time, I'd think that it would be better to get the product out and say that DX10 drivers are still being developed and will be issued in a future patch then it is to just let Nvidia have the market all to itself. That looses sales, and people who buy Nvidia cards will more likely buy another Nvidia card, whether to go SLI or to upgrade. If the problem isn't in software, drivers, etc, then question has to be raised if the card is any good at all.

AMD may have gained some market last fall, but if they continue to screw up, they will loose that market share. People like me will get impatient waiting for a promised sometime in the unknown future product and will buy what is available now from someone else.
February 23, 2007 8:01:32 PM

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Of course the wierd symbiotic relationship people have with Intel is a factor so I am not surprised. I even understand why.


The thing is, Baron, that I've bought Intel products in the past, but with one exception, I haven't bought an Intel cpu for 6 years. I had first planned on buying a FX74 powered machine last fall, but that cpu didn't do what I expected. Instead, it did everything worse than I expected. I then looked forward to building a new computer for gaming this spring and moving my present one to the office, replacing the one Intel cpu machine that I have. But now AMD keeps delaying the cpu and video card combo that I was planning. Where does that leave me?

Its not that I want to buy an Intel powered computer, but when there is nothing from AMD that's comparible, and there won't be anything comparible for an unknown length of time. I'm not going to just sit around and wait for a year or two for AMD to decide to bring something to market. Sure there is AM2, but from what I've seen, that doesn't give me anthing positive over the 939 machine that I already have. And that's what I and a lot of other people need, a positive, compelling reason to buy an AMD cpu or ATI video card.
February 23, 2007 8:28:13 PM

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I'm sorry that most of you who post here are complete idiots. Jesus. It's Not delayed by any means. This just says that AMD doesn't launch like Intel. When Intel launched Core 2 Duo, they launched a ton to the desktop segment first. With AMD, it will launch to the server segment, and then it will start to ramp desktop in Q3 and Q4. This doesn't mean that k8l desktop parts won't be available. AMD was ramping brisbane and you could still by brisbanes on newegg in early january. This is not a dealy, it's how AMD prioritizes cpus. Servers first, then desktops and mobile. Whoever wrote delay should be stripped of his or her keyboard.


LOL! Talk about spin. I suppose the R600 isn't delayed either. It's just being "reprioritized", right?

Let's cut thru the bullshi*t here. It's DELAYED. I guarandamntee you that consumers won't see K8L this year.

So if it comes around in June, then what? I'm sure someone will mention why R600 was pushed back since partners already had demos (according to the Inq).

AMD execs even mentioned the fairweather friends you guys are.
February 23, 2007 8:35:11 PM

Quote:

Of course the wierd symbiotic relationship people have with Intel is a factor so I am not surprised. I even understand why.


The thing is, Baron, that I've bought Intel products in the past, but with one exception, I haven't bought an Intel cpu for 6 years. I had first planned on buying a FX74 powered machine last fall, but that cpu didn't do what I expected. Instead, it did everything worse than I expected. I then looked forward to building a new computer for gaming this spring and moving my present one to the office, replacing the one Intel cpu machine that I have. But now AMD keeps delaying the cpu and video card combo that I was planning. Where does that leave me?

Its not that I want to buy an Intel powered computer, but when there is nothing from AMD that's comparible, and there won't be anything comparible for an unknown length of time. I'm not going to just sit around and wait for a year or two for AMD to decide to bring something to market. Sure there is AM2, but from what I've seen, that doesn't give me anthing positive over the 939 machine that I already have. And that's what I and a lot of other people need, a positive, compelling reason to buy an AMD cpu or ATI video card.


WHat does comparable mean? level of OC? Min fps in games? what? I have a 4400+ and my SW runs amazngly fast. Even my lowly TurionX2 is handling my usage patterns very well even with a 5400RPM HDD.

I was thinkng about QFX also, but I need it to support 8GB RAM. Did you know that you canget Opteron 2210s for QFX and use regular RAM?

That should alleviate yu rpower problems and the latest ASUS BIOS fixes CnQ. The mobo is also down to $359 now. But then I don't need to upgrade as Vista runs great with my current system.
February 23, 2007 8:45:35 PM

well let us hope that amd kicks intels butt again in 2008.it doesn't matter that amd is taking its time.in fact I approve of their method of taking a little longer.they have to produce a core that will exceed everyones expectations,and blow core2duo out of the water.I firmly belive that this will happen.not as quickly as most would like,but still it will happen.as i've said in the past,amd took the performance crown from intel once,it can do it again.

Dahak

AMD X2-4400+@2.6 S-939
EVGA NF4 SLI MB
2X EVGA 7800GT IN SLI
2X 512MB CRUCIAL BALLISTIX DDR500
WD300GIG HD
ACER 22IN WIDESCREEN LCD 1600X1200
THERMALTAKE TOUGHPOWER 850WATT PSU
COOLERMASTER MINI R120
!