Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Disappointed with new PVR box

Last response: in Home Theatre
Share
August 30, 2004 1:55:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

After some months of waiting, Time Warner "upgraded" my folks' Pace HD tuner
with a Scientific Atlanta box with HDTV PVR.

Several problems are immediately evident: first and foremost, the picture
quality is noticeably worse. The picture is softer on static scenes and
pixellates very noticeably on any sort of motion. Watching NASCAR or diving on
the Olympics channel was headache-inducing. There are also occassional
glitches -- the picture stutters and the receiver mutes audio for a moment
while it re-aqcuires the digital audio signal. Adding insult to injury, I
spent a frustrating 45 minutes trying to figure out why my connection to the AV
outputs marked "archive out to VCR" didn't seem to work before calling tech
service and finding out that "that feature is not enabled yet". Archive to VCR
seems pretty important given the very limited depth of this PVR (seemingly only
a couple of hours of HDTV and 20 or so SDTV).

Right now my advice to them is to have TWC take it back until they can get it
right. Are there other options I should have them request or consider? Are we
the only ones with this observation?

Thanks

JGM
I'm JGM, and I approved this message.

More about : disappointed pvr box

Anonymous
August 30, 2004 1:55:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"JGM" <jgmclean0@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040829175501.22535.00001905@mb-m11.aol.com...
> After some months of waiting, Time Warner "upgraded" my folks' Pace HD
> tuner
> with a Scientific Atlanta box with HDTV PVR.
>
> Several problems are immediately evident: first and foremost, the picture
> quality is noticeably worse. The picture is softer on static scenes and
> pixellates very noticeably on any sort of motion. Watching NASCAR or
> diving on
> the Olympics channel was headache-inducing. There are also occassional
> glitches -- the picture stutters and the receiver mutes audio for a moment
> while it re-aqcuires the digital audio signal. Adding insult to injury, I
> spent a frustrating 45 minutes trying to figure out why my connection to
> the AV
> outputs marked "archive out to VCR" didn't seem to work before calling
> tech
> service and finding out that "that feature is not enabled yet". Archive
> to VCR
> seems pretty important given the very limited depth of this PVR (seemingly
> only
> a couple of hours of HDTV and 20 or so SDTV).
>
> Right now my advice to them is to have TWC take it back until they can get
> it
> right. Are there other options I should have them request or consider?
> Are we
> the only ones with this observation?

Strange... my Comcast SA8000HD DVR works beautifully - I can't tell any
difference from normal live HD streams.
Anonymous
August 30, 2004 4:42:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Scientific Atlanta's Explorer Club deals with the box
http://www.scientificatlanta.com/explorerclub/default.a...

--
Mike Lanzarotta
Crown City Brewery
ccbrew at sbcglobal dot net
"JGM" <jgmclean0@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040829175501.22535.00001905@mb-m11.aol.com...
> After some months of waiting, Time Warner "upgraded" my folks' Pace HD
tuner
> with a Scientific Atlanta box with HDTV PVR.
>
> Several problems are immediately evident: first and foremost, the picture
> quality is noticeably worse. The picture is softer on static scenes and
> pixellates very noticeably on any sort of motion. Watching NASCAR or
diving on
> the Olympics channel was headache-inducing. There are also occassional
> glitches -- the picture stutters and the receiver mutes audio for a moment
> while it re-aqcuires the digital audio signal. Adding insult to injury, I
> spent a frustrating 45 minutes trying to figure out why my connection to
the AV
> outputs marked "archive out to VCR" didn't seem to work before calling
tech
> service and finding out that "that feature is not enabled yet". Archive
to VCR
> seems pretty important given the very limited depth of this PVR (seemingly
only
> a couple of hours of HDTV and 20 or so SDTV).
>
> Right now my advice to them is to have TWC take it back until they can get
it
> right. Are there other options I should have them request or consider?
Are we
> the only ones with this observation?
>
> Thanks
>
> JGM
> I'm JGM, and I approved this message.
Related resources
August 30, 2004 6:45:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Randy Sweeney wrote:

>> Right now my advice to them is to have TWC take it back until they can get
>> it
>> right.

>Strange... my Comcast SA8000HD DVR works beautifully - I can't tell any
>difference from normal live HD streams.

There is no apparent difference between the recorded streams and the live
streams; all the problems I've mentioned are present in the "live" streams as
well (I think everything is cached to HF).

JGM
I'm JGM, and I approved this message.
September 20, 2004 10:31:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Randy Sweeney" <rsweeney1@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<7cGdnZr2J5gez6_cRVn-vg@comcast.com>...
> "JGM" <jgmclean0@aol.com> wrote

> > After some months of waiting, Time Warner "upgraded" my folks' Pace HD
> > tuner with a Scientific Atlanta box with HDTV PVR.
> >
> > Several problems are immediately evident: first and foremost, the picture
> > quality is noticeably worse. The picture is softer on static scenes and
> > pixellates very noticeably on any sort of motion. Watching NASCAR or
> > diving on
> > the Olympics channel was headache-inducing. There are also occassional
> > glitches --

> Strange... my Comcast SA8000HD DVR works beautifully - I can't tell any
> difference from normal live HD streams.

Following up on this: we called the cable company and spoke to a
tech, who blamed "hardfile cache overload" issues (I don't think this
could be it since the problems seemed the same whether the unit was
single-tasking or dual-tasking), and promised that an upcoming
overnight software upgrade would fix the problems.

A couple of weeks later, things had not improved, and they called and
asked them to remove the SA PVR box and bring back a "regular" box.
The tech who came out wanted to try a different SA box first (same
model), and swapped it out. Within a few hours the same problems were
occurring. However, the folks report that a couple of days after
that, before they had a chance to call for another service
appointment, things suddenly got considerably better -- the glitches
and search for protocol have gone away.

Looked at some TV over the weekend -- most particularly the
Cowboys-Browns football on CBS -- and it does seem better for the most
part. In my judgement the overall picture is still inferior to the
Pace box: things like logos moving across the screen or panning shots
of crowds or water -- the usual test cases for digital compression --
still artifact noticeably. There were also some momentary breakup and
pixellization here and there, but it's hard to say how much of that
was the box and how much the signal.

A few questions are still in my mind:

- Is it just a fact that box with PVR capabilities is just going to
have more compression artifacts than one without? The TWC tech stated
that all programming output by the box is cached to the PVR hardfile
first; I know this creates a minor reduction in quality on my NTSC
PVR, perhaps it is just more noticeable on the high-def screen? If a
choice has to be made, I think my folks would prefer a better picture
to the PVR features. I wonder if TWC would consider setting them up
with a combination of the Pace box and an SD PVR running off the aux
outputs.

- Was there a known recent software upgrade release for the SA box
(model 8000 variant) that would explain the sudden improvement in the
glitching?

- Were the problems we saw during the football game part of the signal
or the fault of the box (did anybody else watching the game yesterday
notice any pixellization)?

JGM
Anonymous
September 20, 2004 6:12:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I have the Scientific Atlanta 3100HD digital box from Time-Warner. I could,
if I wanted, upgrade to a Scientific Atlanta PVR HD box.

Currently, I have a Panasonic E80 DVD/DVR recorder/player which I use to
record and time-shift TV programs via hard-drive. But it does not record or
play HDTV (480i & 480p only) and there is not output from the 3100HD box for
that, even if it would. I run analog cable into it via a splitter which
then passes though to the TV. Just like a VCR setup.

With the E80, I can watch programs later off the hard-drive, or wait a few
minutes for them to buffer and "chase" them while recording. But I don't
have to watch them off the HD, I can just let the signal pass through to the
TV and watch it directly. Only if I press PLAY do I watch the program as
recorded.

So, my question: Are you saying that the SA HD PVR box sends EVERYTHING to
the hard-drive, whether you want to watch it off the HD or not? There is no
way to let it "pass through" to the TV, so that you get the signal from the
cable via the box rather than from the cable>box>HD? If so, then I would
not want this box.

mack
austin


"JGM" <jgmclean@my-dejanews.com> wrote in message
news:163ccb18.0409200531.61fca592@posting.google.com...
> "Randy Sweeney" <rsweeney1@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:<7cGdnZr2J5gez6_cRVn-vg@comcast.com>...
> > "JGM" <jgmclean0@aol.com> wrote
>
> > > After some months of waiting, Time Warner "upgraded" my folks' Pace HD
> > > tuner with a Scientific Atlanta box with HDTV PVR.
> > >
> > > Several problems are immediately evident: first and foremost, the
picture
> > > quality is noticeably worse. The picture is softer on static scenes
and
> > > pixellates very noticeably on any sort of motion. Watching NASCAR or
> > > diving on
> > > the Olympics channel was headache-inducing. There are also
occassional
> > > glitches --
>
> > Strange... my Comcast SA8000HD DVR works beautifully - I can't tell any
> > difference from normal live HD streams.
>
> Following up on this: we called the cable company and spoke to a
> tech, who blamed "hardfile cache overload" issues (I don't think this
> could be it since the problems seemed the same whether the unit was
> single-tasking or dual-tasking), and promised that an upcoming
> overnight software upgrade would fix the problems.
>
> A couple of weeks later, things had not improved, and they called and
> asked them to remove the SA PVR box and bring back a "regular" box.
> The tech who came out wanted to try a different SA box first (same
> model), and swapped it out. Within a few hours the same problems were
> occurring. However, the folks report that a couple of days after
> that, before they had a chance to call for another service
> appointment, things suddenly got considerably better -- the glitches
> and search for protocol have gone away.
>
> Looked at some TV over the weekend -- most particularly the
> Cowboys-Browns football on CBS -- and it does seem better for the most
> part. In my judgement the overall picture is still inferior to the
> Pace box: things like logos moving across the screen or panning shots
> of crowds or water -- the usual test cases for digital compression --
> still artifact noticeably. There were also some momentary breakup and
> pixellization here and there, but it's hard to say how much of that
> was the box and how much the signal.
>
> A few questions are still in my mind:
>
> - Is it just a fact that box with PVR capabilities is just going to
> have more compression artifacts than one without? The TWC tech stated
> that all programming output by the box is cached to the PVR hardfile
> first; I know this creates a minor reduction in quality on my NTSC
> PVR, perhaps it is just more noticeable on the high-def screen? If a
> choice has to be made, I think my folks would prefer a better picture
> to the PVR features. I wonder if TWC would consider setting them up
> with a combination of the Pace box and an SD PVR running off the aux
> outputs.
>
> - Was there a known recent software upgrade release for the SA box
> (model 8000 variant) that would explain the sudden improvement in the
> glitching?
>
> - Were the problems we saw during the football game part of the signal
> or the fault of the box (did anybody else watching the game yesterday
> notice any pixellization)?
>
> JGM
September 20, 2004 8:45:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Mack McKinnon wrote:

>So, my question: Are you saying that the SA HD PVR box sends EVERYTHING to
>the hard-drive, whether you want to watch it off the HD or not? There is no
>way to let it "pass through" to the TV, so that you get the signal from the
>cable via the box rather than from the cable>box>HD? If so, then I would
>not want this box.

That's essentially what the phone tech told me, that the HD is always
buffering, that's why you can always "rewind live TV". The momentary drop
out/glitch problems were occurring with live programming being viewed as
directly as possible, and the tech blamed it on the HD.

At the very least, I believe that everything is compressed to the point where
it *could* go to the PVR section, since there seems to be no difference in
quality between live and delayed material.

JGM
I'm JGM, and I approved this message.
Anonymous
September 21, 2004 7:20:58 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Mack McKinnon" <MckinnonRemoveThis@tvadmanDeleteThisAsWell.com> wrote in
message news:szB3d.13525$1d6.561@fe1.texas.rr.com...
>I have the Scientific Atlanta 3100HD digital box from Time-Warner. I
>could,
> if I wanted, upgrade to a Scientific Atlanta PVR HD box.
>
> Currently, I have a Panasonic E80 DVD/DVR recorder/player which I use to
> record and time-shift TV programs via hard-drive. But it does not record
> or
> play HDTV (480i & 480p only) and there is not output from the 3100HD box
> for
> that, even if it would. I run analog cable into it via a splitter which
> then passes though to the TV. Just like a VCR setup.
>
> With the E80, I can watch programs later off the hard-drive, or wait a few
> minutes for them to buffer and "chase" them while recording. But I don't
> have to watch them off the HD, I can just let the signal pass through to
> the
> TV and watch it directly. Only if I press PLAY do I watch the program as
> recorded.
>
> So, my question: Are you saying that the SA HD PVR box sends EVERYTHING to
> the hard-drive, whether you want to watch it off the HD or not? There is
> no
> way to let it "pass through" to the TV, so that you get the signal from
> the
> cable via the box rather than from the cable>box>HD? If so, then I would
> not want this box.

why not?
bits is bits

who cares if they go both into a cache to enable pause/rewind at the same
time they exit to the HD monitor

having pause/rewind on live tv is a very useful feature
September 22, 2004 4:35:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Randy Sweeney wrote:

>"Mack McKinnon" <MckinnonRemoveThis@tvadmanDeleteThisAsWell.com> wrote

>> Are you saying that the SA HD PVR box sends EVERYTHING to
>> the hard-drive, whether you want to watch it off the HD or not?

>>If so, then I would
>> not want this box.
>
>why not?
>bits is bits
>
>who cares if they go both into a cache to enable pause/rewind at the same
>time they exit to the HD monitor

Bits is bits as long as they is. That is, as long as the actual bitstream
from the cable channel is what's being recorded. If (as I suspect is the case
from watching the results) the video must be compressed to give the HD PVR a
reasonable filesize, then you are sacrificing quite a bit, and largely
defeating the purpose of HDTV.

>having pause/rewind on live tv is a very useful feature

Yes it is. It's just a shame that we haven't been able to combine this useful
feature with top-notch video quality.

JGM
I'm JGM, and I approved this message.
Anonymous
September 23, 2004 5:52:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

JGM (jgmclean@my-dejanews.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> - Is it just a fact that box with PVR capabilities is just going to
> have more compression artifacts than one without?

No, this is not required to be true, at least not for digital channels. For
those, the box should take the incoming signal and store it on the drive,
then feed it to the MPEG decoder. For a regular digital cable box, the
sequence would be: take the incoming signal and feed it to the MPEG decoder.

Unless the PVR is re-compressing the digital channels, there should be *no*
difference in quality from the source. This is the way the DirecTV DVR and
Dish Network PVR operate.

--
Jeff Rife |
SPAM bait: | http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/ShermansLagoon/LoanedDVD.g...
AskDOJ@usdoj.gov |
spam@ftc.gov |
February 24, 2012 3:53:22 AM

How do you want to access your money? (check book, debit card, etc)3 These kinds of cards usually are not simply offshore, but a couple of major offshore banks issue these phones their international clients Depending upon the needs to the principals these legal vehicles can be build making sure that the names of the principals appear in no public document or registry providing a supplementary measure of privacy and asset protection Further examine the reporting requirements any sort of jurisdiction that you're interested in If you wish to learn more, please understand in contact around and we'll placed you in direct connection with a leading authority on these things he will be capable of help you, depending on yours or what you are promoting situation financially, in regards to to what works from your taxation, compliance, reporting and functional viewpoint . Thus offering the easiest offshore banking.

Offshore Banking

An offshore bank offers many financial services that expedite international trade Whichever option you prefer to take, it's good comply with some 'golden rules' of privacy: 1) Limit the number of folks that know about the offshore banking account to merely is possible Rest assured all of the big ISP's like MSN, AOL, ATT, COMCAST will save your log files permanently showing every website you went along to, every file downloaded, every email sent as well as whom, etc Most banks and brokerages will cost you for opening a brokerage account, but some may this totally free! From an investing account you should buy and sell shares in all the key markets- anonymously- as well as your bank account is offshore your gains can also be tax free! Fees fluctuate greatly counting on the brokerage, however the best ones will provide you with an online platform hence you may manage all of trades your convenience of your personal home, and with low overheads they'll manage to charge nominal premiums on each trade <a href=http://games-downloads1.blogspot.com/2011/03/legal-offs...;offshore bank account uk</a> Governments have used the excuse of stamping out international crime to erode a private?s right to privacy, confidentiality, anonymity and in many cases freedom of preference when it comes to money matters, in a bid to hold all money onshore and close by of tax authorities and ?your government?s? ever more invasive and intrusive gaze There instantly things you should know before opening an offshore bank account - things that may save you plenty of a serious amounts of frustration Anonymous companies (those who only maintain a non-public, internal register of directors) must sometimes provide other evidence How much money does the IRS say he hid? A whopping $90,000 What services does this bank offer?2 But, as you possibly can see, regarding this is often depending on misinformation The advance of the internet and secure site access means you'll be able to open your bank account remotely a while have independence to transfer money any kind of time time from anywhere on the planet However, offshore accounts can also be as well as securely opened outside of Europe
!