Wait for Built-In Tuners or Buy Now Plus what about DVI an..

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Steve wrote:

> Oh! After years of stalling on my part, my wife shook loose my wallet
> and is remodeling the whole family room. After days of being covered
> in paint and spackle, we walked buy a display at a store with lots of
> wonderful large screen TV's and so I made my move.......
>
> I might actually have convinced here we should buy one, but despite
> being an computer engineer for 20 years, I'd have to say C programming
> is a lot easier to understand than the current set of television
> options.
>
> We were just about to buy one, when I read that the FCC is requiring
> all sets later this year to have built-in HDTV tuners? Is this really
> true? If so, then it would seem to be incredibly wasteful to buy now,
> if the tuner's will become commodity items that cost next to nothing?
> (i.e. you used to pay $200 for a good ethernet card, now their built
> into most machines, and you can buy an extra one for $10)
>
> I have a pretty nice antenna on my roof, and we have a low-end cable
> package as well
>
> We don't have digital cable, and we really don't want to spend the
> money on that.
>
> So if I wait until tuners are built-in will I be able to use my stodgy
> old cable service to receive HDTV. Or can I at least use my antenna?
>
> Also, which types of connections would allow the DVI output of my
> computer's video card to be displayed on the HDTV. I see references to
> HDMCP and HDMI (spelling?) but I'm don't understand if they are pin
> compatible with DVI?

You will always be able to buy a monitor with a separate receiver. If
you know that a integrated set has a 5th generation receiver built in
there should be no problem. There are none now.

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

zacware@mac.com (Steve) wrote:

>Oh! After years of stalling on my part, my wife shook loose my wallet
>and is remodeling the whole family room. After days of being covered
>in paint and spackle, we walked buy a display at a store with lots of
>wonderful large screen TV's and so I made my move.......
>
>I might actually have convinced here we should buy one, but despite
>being an computer engineer for 20 years, I'd have to say C programming
>is a lot easier to understand than the current set of television
>options.
>
>We were just about to buy one, when I read that the FCC is requiring
>all sets later this year to have built-in HDTV tuners? Is this really
>true? If so, then it would seem to be incredibly wasteful to buy now,
>if the tuner's will become commodity items that cost next to nothing?
>(i.e. you used to pay $200 for a good ethernet card, now their built
>into most machines, and you can buy an extra one for $10)
>
Even if integrated receivers were plentiful and cheap, I would prefer
separate tuners and display, at least for the primary, large-screen
display. The tuners available now are not mature in features,
operability or even reliability, and I wouldn't want to be locked into
the one that came with an expensive display.

>I have a pretty nice antenna on my roof, and we have a low-end cable
>package as well
>
>We don't have digital cable, and we really don't want to spend the
>money on that.
>
>So if I wait until tuners are built-in will I be able to use my stodgy
>old cable service to receive HDTV. Or can I at least use my antenna?

If you're getting good analog reception now, chances are you can get
good digital reception as well, but go to www.antennaweb.org and plug
in your zip (9-digit or street address is best) to see what's
available in your area, how far away and in what direction. If
reception is difficult you might want to wait for the 5th generation
receivers Bob Miller says will start to appear in a few months. I
have gangbusters reception on all local digital broadcasts, including
a low power one, but I have friends a few miles away who are not so
lucky. Maybe you know someone who'll loan you a digital receiver for
a test. Most, probably all, can be set to output NTSC, so you don't
need an HD display to see what you can get.

Most HD receivers handle two formats: over-the-air (OTA, a.k.a. ATSC)
and DirecTV, OTA and Dish Network, OTA and cable (QAM), etc. The
earlier QAM receivers handle only unscrambled cable, which MAY include
the local broadcast stations, possibly some advertising channels and
probably not much else you'd care to watch. Some recent receivers
have a CableCard slot, allowing you to rent a CableCard from your
cable company (typically under $2.00/mo.) and then receive whatever
digital cable programs you subscribe to.
>
>Also, which types of connections would allow the DVI output of my
>computer's video card to be displayed on the HDTV. I see references to
>HDMCP and HDMI (spelling?) but I'm don't understand if they are pin
>compatible with DVI?

DVI and HDMI cables use different connectors, but they are similar
ways to send digital video from a tuner to a display. There are
adaptors to convert between them. HDMI can also carry audio, which
will become very handy when the digital equivalents of A/V receivers
start to appear. HDCP (high definition copy protection) works with
either cable type to make sure you can only make the kinds of copies
the content providers want to allow you to make. I am not aware of
any type of recorder that accepts either DVI or HDMI input.

There is one other way to make an HD connection: component, which
converts the signal to analog and feeds it over 3 cables. All
displays except CRTs must convert it back to digital, resulting in
some loss of quality.

We're used to being able to record the shows we can't watch when they
air, either with a VCR or a hard drive recorder. If we want to record
several shows at once, we can buy several VCRs; they're cheap. But
most VCRs can't record HD, and you won't be happy with their playback
on a large screen. So you need a way to record HD, and right now
there are basically two: hard drive or D-VHS. And, since the MPAA has
done everything in its considerable power to make recording as
difficult as possible short of outlawing it altogether, you basically
need a recorder integrated with each separate tuner. A few allow
archiving programs to D-VHS over Firewire, but most do not, so you
have to start erasing things when the hard drive fills up. Figure
about $1000 per HD receiver/hard drive recorder combination, although
prices are dropping already.

I don't expect D-VHS to ever become popular, and it will disappear
when something better comes along (probably a writeable HD DVD format
or very cheap hard drives), but right now it's the only game in town
for long-term HD storage.

Whether you get a display with or without an integrated tuner, try to
get as many HD inputs as possible, because you'll probably soon start
collecting devices to connect to them.

Del Mibbler <mibbler@nycap.rr.com>

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Del Mibbler <mibbler@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message news:<abpnj0htu9nlsr42dd8b9218s711uk1sv7@4ax.com>...
> zacware@mac.com (Steve) wrote:
>
> >Oh! After years of stalling on my part, my wife shook loose my wallet
> >and is remodeling the whole family room. After days of being covered
> >in paint and spackle, we walked buy a display at a store with lots of
> >wonderful large screen TV's and so I made my move.......
> >
> >I might actually have convinced here we should buy one, but despite
> >being an computer engineer for 20 years, I'd have to say C programming
> >is a lot easier to understand than the current set of television
> >options.
> >
> >We were just about to buy one, when I read that the FCC is requiring
> >all sets later this year to have built-in HDTV tuners? Is this really
> >true? If so, then it would seem to be incredibly wasteful to buy now,
> >if the tuner's will become commodity items that cost next to nothing?
> >(i.e. you used to pay $200 for a good ethernet card, now their built
> >into most machines, and you can buy an extra one for $10)
> >
> Even if integrated receivers were plentiful and cheap, I would prefer
> separate tuners and display, at least for the primary, large-screen
> display. The tuners available now are not mature in features,
> operability or even reliability, and I wouldn't want to be locked into
> the one that came with an expensive display.
>
> >I have a pretty nice antenna on my roof, and we have a low-end cable
> >package as well
> >
> >We don't have digital cable, and we really don't want to spend the
> >money on that.
> >
> >So if I wait until tuners are built-in will I be able to use my stodgy
> >old cable service to receive HDTV. Or can I at least use my antenna?
>
> If you're getting good analog reception now, chances are you can get
> good digital reception as well, but go to www.antennaweb.org and plug
> in your zip (9-digit or street address is best) to see what's
> available in your area, how far away and in what direction. If
> reception is difficult you might want to wait for the 5th generation
> receivers Bob Miller says will start to appear in a few months. I
> have gangbusters reception on all local digital broadcasts, including
> a low power one, but I have friends a few miles away who are not so
> lucky. Maybe you know someone who'll loan you a digital receiver for
> a test. Most, probably all, can be set to output NTSC, so you don't
> need an HD display to see what you can get.
>
> Most HD receivers handle two formats: over-the-air (OTA, a.k.a. ATSC)
> and DirecTV, OTA and Dish Network, OTA and cable (QAM), etc. The
> earlier QAM receivers handle only unscrambled cable, which MAY include
> the local broadcast stations, possibly some advertising channels and
> probably not much else you'd care to watch. Some recent receivers
> have a CableCard slot, allowing you to rent a CableCard from your
> cable company (typically under $2.00/mo.) and then receive whatever
> digital cable programs you subscribe to.
> >
> >Also, which types of connections would allow the DVI output of my
> >computer's video card to be displayed on the HDTV. I see references to
> >HDMCP and HDMI (spelling?) but I'm don't understand if they are pin
> >compatible with DVI?
>
> DVI and HDMI cables use different connectors, but they are similar
> ways to send digital video from a tuner to a display. There are
> adaptors to convert between them. HDMI can also carry audio, which
> will become very handy when the digital equivalents of A/V receivers
> start to appear. HDCP (high definition copy protection) works with
> either cable type to make sure you can only make the kinds of copies
> the content providers want to allow you to make. I am not aware of
> any type of recorder that accepts either DVI or HDMI input.
>
> There is one other way to make an HD connection: component, which
> converts the signal to analog and feeds it over 3 cables. All
> displays except CRTs must convert it back to digital, resulting in
> some loss of quality.
>
> We're used to being able to record the shows we can't watch when they
> air, either with a VCR or a hard drive recorder. If we want to record
> several shows at once, we can buy several VCRs; they're cheap. But
> most VCRs can't record HD, and you won't be happy with their playback
> on a large screen. So you need a way to record HD, and right now
> there are basically two: hard drive or D-VHS. And, since the MPAA has
> done everything in its considerable power to make recording as
> difficult as possible short of outlawing it altogether, you basically
> need a recorder integrated with each separate tuner. A few allow
> archiving programs to D-VHS over Firewire, but most do not, so you
> have to start erasing things when the hard drive fills up. Figure
> about $1000 per HD receiver/hard drive recorder combination, although
> prices are dropping already.
>
> I don't expect D-VHS to ever become popular, and it will disappear
> when something better comes along (probably a writeable HD DVD format
> or very cheap hard drives), but right now it's the only game in town
> for long-term HD storage.
>
> Whether you get a display with or without an integrated tuner, try to
> get as many HD inputs as possible, because you'll probably soon start
> collecting devices to connect to them.
>
> Del Mibbler <mibbler@nycap.rr.com>


And to answer the question about getting HDTV over cable, go to your
cable website, which should have info. In almost all cases, you will
use the cable box supplied by your cable company, which typically is
part of a digital package. Then what you get and whether it's free or
extra depends on the cable system.

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

The built in tuners will be mostly off air only and may offer less
features than standalone DTV tuners.

Even if the TV has one, you will end up paying for it weather you use it
or not, so you may be ahead by skipping the integrated model unless you
dislike the though of a settop box.

------------------------------------

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http://www.digitalinsurrection.com




Steve wrote:
> Oh! After years of stalling on my part, my wife shook loose my wallet
> and is remodeling the whole family room. After days of being covered
> in paint and spackle, we walked buy a display at a store with lots of
> wonderful large screen TV's and so I made my move.......
>
> I might actually have convinced here we should buy one, but despite
> being an computer engineer for 20 years, I'd have to say C programming
> is a lot easier to understand than the current set of television
> options.
>
> We were just about to buy one, when I read that the FCC is requiring
> all sets later this year to have built-in HDTV tuners? Is this really
> true? If so, then it would seem to be incredibly wasteful to buy now,
> if the tuner's will become commodity items that cost next to nothing?
> (i.e. you used to pay $200 for a good ethernet card, now their built
> into most machines, and you can buy an extra one for $10)
>
> I have a pretty nice antenna on my roof, and we have a low-end cable
> package as well
>
> We don't have digital cable, and we really don't want to spend the
> money on that.
>
> So if I wait until tuners are built-in will I be able to use my stodgy
> old cable service to receive HDTV. Or can I at least use my antenna?
>
> Also, which types of connections would allow the DVI output of my
> computer's video card to be displayed on the HDTV. I see references to
> HDMCP and HDMI (spelling?) but I'm don't understand if they are pin
> compatible with DVI?

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 16:25:02 GMT, Jeff B <fake@addy.com> wrote:

>I got the set top box
>from sears cause I knew I could return it for a full refund,
>so that was, "borrowed".

LOL... come on man, be cool and at least hold onto it for 6 months
before you return it. Sears whacks us with a chargeback if you return
it before 6 months, so next time you "borrow" from us, please don't
come in ranting and raving about "Your Satisfaction Is Guaranteed!"
until your salesman has deposited his/her cut into the bank, too...
LOL.