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Will r600/n8900 outrun an E4300?

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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March 9, 2007 9:24:38 PM

I am asking this because I really, really want to buy a new system but want to futureproof as best as possible.

I am still running an AGP board, so unfortunatly, if I go with the processor I want now, I HAVE TO buy a PCIE card.

My plan is to buy processor/mobo and buy a mid-range video card in anticipation of dropping more coin on the r600/n8900 cards.

However, will these cards outrun an o/c'd 4300? Will my best laid plans only end up bottlenecked at the CPU (requiring yet another upgrade).

What do you guys think?
March 9, 2007 9:29:24 PM

Any modern dual core is fine.

You shouldn't worry, since getting a top-line CPU, like a X6800 might only bring a couple more framerates.
a b U Graphics card
March 9, 2007 10:21:27 PM

for now get you a 76gt or x1650 pci-e card.

then later,say 3 or 4 months get what ever pci-e card you want.

the sli/CF cards or the 8800,s can bottleneck most cpu,s.
but this is at extreme resolutions.
a b U Graphics card
March 10, 2007 1:19:19 AM

What on earth did you buy a second 8800GTX for? You've been telling us about your 60 fps with max details and 16XAA. Have you started gaming at 3840x1024 or something?
a b U Graphics card
March 10, 2007 1:35:55 AM

Quote:
Now with my SLI'd 8800GTX's


jeez man wasnt one enough :lol: 

ANIMAL 8O
a b U Graphics card
March 10, 2007 1:36:52 AM

are you still on the cent 5 case?

how do the 88gtx,s fit in that sucker?
March 10, 2007 1:51:16 AM

Quote:
for now get you a 76gt or x1650 pci-e card.

then later,say 3 or 4 months get what ever pci-e card you want.

the sli/CF cards or the 8800,s can bottleneck most cpu,s.
but this is at extreme resolutions.


nah, i'd say just don't buy anything now and then have more money later on for a better card. wait for like a month, and then whenever the r600 comes out (should be around that time i believe), you can pick up an e4300 for $113 :D  do you NEED an upgrade now? or can you save the ~$100 to $200 on a card that you'll just replace in a short bit?

i'm going for a similar build, and i'm just going to wait.
March 10, 2007 2:13:49 AM

Quote:
see, what I would do, is get an extremely cheap 3600 for $85, then, I would buy me a nice board like the crosshair I have with 2gigs of ram and a high end gpu. Finally, with the money I have saved on the cpu, I'd buy nice cooling for it, possibly water or ocz's upcoming phase change and take that up to 3+ghz like how the inquirer got a 65nm 5000 to 3.5ghz (validated) and then your bottleneck will be for the most part gone. Then once the k10 cpus come out, if you really need more speed, I'd get one of those, and vuala, eel supra of computers la cheepo


yep. i have heavily considered going AMD for this build, simply because i have such a shitty system now, anything will be amazing in comparison. however, the reason i want to go c2d is because my friend got one first and i have to prove who has a bigger e-penis....! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

just kidding.

the biggest selling point of AMD is that their motherboards are SOOOO perfectly cheap... its amazing. those are the kind of prices i was hoping 775 mobos would drop to, making my cheap, bottomfeeding ways pay off, so to speak... but thats not the case.

oh well. we'll see how it goes. i kinda need money though before i can build with EITHER proc as the brainz. :lol:  :cry: 
March 10, 2007 2:30:45 AM

Quote:
exactly, you can pull off the major upgrade (still k6?) with even one of the cheapest dualies on the market

well, I'm off to bed


yeah, thats the beauty of it: because EVERYTHING in my system is dated*, ANY rebuild/upgrade will knock my socks off. i just don't really wanna get limited future-wise, for obvious reasons. oh well. i think i may jump on an AMD deal. we'll see. i just need a better computer, i'm not pulling enough frames in minesweeper...!


:wink:


i think i'll go to bed too. your bed, that is. just kidding. you'd probably smell like tacos. heh. kidding again. damn, i'm hilarious. :|

*my rig:
skt. A sempron @ 1.9 ghz
768 megs ddr1 266 8O
agp radeon 9550 128meg
March 10, 2007 3:28:59 AM

Orwell,

I too was in a similar predicament and wanted to keep my agp card and upgrade to C2D, so i could wait for r600 and dx10 games to come out.

I went with an ASROCK LGA 775Dual-VSTA motherboard. It allowed me to keep my 9800pro and DDR400 Ram while upgrading from my AMD64 3200+ to a E4300. I was even able to overclock it to 288FSB(which seems to be close to this board's limit) @ 2.6Ghz!!! The overclock was very simple to, never had to mess with any settings except for FSB freq.

When
you do get your r600/8900; upgrade to a Gigabyte DS3 mobo and then overclock the E4300 to 3Ghz+; which i'm sure would keep either card happy.

I only spent like $230 at Newegg for the upgrade and am certainly glad I did; I can run 1080p quicktime trailers, run Tversity for the xbox360 at 720p, and even game above 100fps in CS:Source( but not all at the same time unfortunately!!)

Hope this helps
March 10, 2007 3:56:38 AM

:lol:  :lol:  :lol: 


very =]
March 10, 2007 2:26:28 PM

Quote:
are you still on the cent 5 case?

how do the 88gtx,s fit in that sucker?


PICS soon bro :wink:

That would be cool. Cant wait to c pics of a case with the front cut out :p 
March 10, 2007 4:43:31 PM

Could you provide a link? I am a case mod fan my self and luv to look at other peoples work for inspiration :) 
March 10, 2007 4:47:30 PM

Actually the harder the task the more interesting the solution is. I would really appreciate it if you can locate the link.

Thanks in advance!
March 10, 2007 4:55:10 PM

Stupid me!!! (or lazy???) should have guessed that it is in the case mods section :oops: 

Thanks anyway!
March 10, 2007 5:11:10 PM

I don't notice anything at all :(  Guess I need to get my eyes checked 8)
March 10, 2007 5:29:15 PM

The FPS gain I uiderstand and is expected but I really don't c a difference in the images but my eyesight really is bad so I'll trust u on that one.
March 10, 2007 5:33:53 PM

Quote:

I didnt post the pics for an image quality comparison as there is no difference in image quality from one 8800GTX to two 8800GTX's. I really dont understand why anyone would think there would be.


My fault I misunderstood taco when he said

Quote:

Just wondering, can you tell a difference from one gtx to two yourself, I can tell a very slighty one, but not enough to justify $500


my bad :? or is it Taco is bad :roll:
March 10, 2007 5:45:10 PM

Maybe the CPU is the culprit in supreme commander? I mean with the amount of units on a map and the map size. It's not always the poor graphic card that slows a game
March 10, 2007 6:02:19 PM

Quote:
at stock, yes, but not if you take the cpu to 3ghz, that's what most tests have shown with conroes and the 8800 series



Taco Is right on the money and I have confirmed this myself with both the 8800GTX and my E6400 tested at different speeds.

You cant simply just pair up any modern dual core cpu with a 8800GTX and expect it to work well, its not that simple at all. An 8800GTX will smack around any of AMD's current CPU's pretty easily.

You have to get a good 3+ghz overclock and that is with a conroe to remove bottlenecking from a 8800GTX.

My friends Opteron 175@3ghz with his 8800GTX did not play as fast as my system when all I had was a single 8800GTX and my E6400 was clocked at 3ghz as well.



Now with my SLI'd 8800GTX's I am seeing gains all the way up to 3.7ghz on the cpu. 8OI think you overplay the significance of the CPU bottleneck; sure the Core 2s are better for it, but if you're already playing on the highest in game qualities with AA, AF, and Vertical sync, eliminating the CPU bottleneck doesn't do a whole lot more than look better in benchmarks. At the moment, I couldn't justify purchasing an entire new system for slightly better benchmarking performance. Also, I think you kind of went overboard with two 8800GTXs, but hey it's your money and I suppose that is the only way to make Oblivion perfect. :wink:
March 10, 2007 6:32:10 PM

Quote:
I think you overplay the significance of the CPU bottleneck; sure the Core 2s are better for it, but if you're already playing on the highest in game qualities with AA, AF, and Vertical sync, eliminating the CPU bottleneck doesn't do a whole lot more than look better in benchmarks.



Well like I said, I go by real life experiences and As I said before my friends 8800GTX is paired up with an opty 175@3ghz and running at 1680X1050 even with 16XAA and 16XAF his performance is not quite as good as mine was when my E6400 was at 3ghz and playing at the same settings.

Of course some games were affected more than others as some are more cpu dependent than others.

Quote:
At the moment, I couldn't justify purchasing an entire new system for slightly better benchmarking performance.


Benchmarking performance? lol. My games that I play the most have doubled in performance. Its not just for benchmarking purposes.

Quote:

Also, I think you kind of went overboard with two 8800GTXs, but hey it's your money and I suppose that is the only way to make Oblivion perfect. :wink:


Im sure a different toon will be sung when crysis is out.I'm probably just jealous because I'm a tightwad and after spending $570 on my 8800GTX, you go out and get a second one. :wink:
March 10, 2007 10:43:37 PM

Quote:
that's pretty cool right there, I wish I had that kind of money


yeah, me too 8O i've been oggling at that site for like 30 min now, no joke, just looking at all the differences in all the games

maybe not the money jsut the gear, if you know what i mean :wink:

i won't even say what resolution i play FEAR on :oops:  but its sure got nothing on 3840x1024 :cry: 
March 10, 2007 11:07:14 PM

Quote:
lol, I probably could buy that stuff, but that means my college fund is down the drain, and I'd rather go to college and make tons of money without student loans and then buy the crap once I'm rich instead :D 


.... i don't even have a college fund.

:lol:  / :cry: 

i do have a 4.0 gpa. i hope that'll cover me. because i AM going to college.

and what this has to do with r600s, 8900s, and the graphics forum, i DON'T know.

but e4300s are nice processors. like other people said.
a b U Graphics card
March 11, 2007 3:21:14 AM

Quote:
that's pretty cool right there, I wish I had that kind of money

I hear ya. To do it right you need 3 LCD's, an 8800GTX or two, and the $300 matrox triplehead2go box. Imagine this on 3 LCD/DLP projectors, with zero bezel apart from maybe a little overpill of light.
a b U Graphics card
March 11, 2007 3:27:59 PM

cool. looks likes there is plenty of room for the bottom card.

my 68gt cooler wouldnt fit in the bottom slot, it is thicker
than the stock 88 cooler 8O

when i was running sli i had the stock cooler on the bottom card.
but there was too much heat for my taste.

i have the 88gts now and am happy with it.

but you make me want to get another one now.
March 11, 2007 3:33:04 PM

Man that's one monster rig you have there.
[Dumb question warning] Besides the cool factor do the fans on the ram really help ? [/Dumb question warning] I've seen them on a couple of rigs and always thought that it was overkill. :?
March 11, 2007 4:45:57 PM

You really should buy a larger monitor. :lol: 
March 11, 2007 4:52:27 PM

yeah but did the fans help with overclocking? Did you do a b4 and after test? (Sorry for bugging you but this is rather interesting)
March 12, 2007 2:21:30 AM

if u run 8800gtx sli, ull be playing 1280x1024 maxed out dx10 gfx for a long time and then some, so these ppl saying its a waste are idoits, u dont need huge resolutions to enjoy great gfx (as long as ur not running under 1024x768* lmao, well if u hav a moniter that bad i doubt u coudl afford 8800gtx sli with a quad core anyways

look at is this way, with ocing ur proc, u wont need to upgrade for as long as dx10 lasts, 5 years starting now
March 12, 2007 2:54:38 AM

Quote:
I am asking this because I really, really want to buy a new system but want to futureproof as best as possible.

I am still running an AGP board, so unfortunatly, if I go with the processor I want now, I HAVE TO buy a PCIE card.

My plan is to buy processor/mobo and buy a mid-range video card in anticipation of dropping more coin on the r600/n8900 cards.

However, will these cards outrun an o/c'd 4300? Will my best laid plans only end up bottlenecked at the CPU (requiring yet another upgrade).

What do you guys think?


I don't think it is possible to answer this, as neither card is purchaseable or benchmarked. The query is moot.
-Ace
March 12, 2007 7:53:33 PM

Well, the human eye can detect a couple hundred fps, but it's generally accepted that 60fps is perfectly smooth to pretty much everybody.

Of course, you'll start bouncing off of your monitor's refresh rate at 60-85 anyway, so anything above that will only cause tearing.
March 12, 2007 9:29:02 PM

well, the thing is, you can't see 300 fps, but you don't really need to. the fact that a card may run a game with more fps than say 60 or 70 doesn't necessarily make it a waste of money, that to me means that it'll be a stronger card and it'll last longer. in theory.

too bad i can never afford a card like that :wink:

but the top-o-the line 8600s look DAMN sexy for me. DAMN sexy. DAMMMMMN sexy. just thought i'd emphasise how DAMN sexy they were. for graphics cards, that is.
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