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GeForce 8800GTS, horrible stuttering!

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March 23, 2007 4:33:23 PM

I just bought a EVGA GeForce 8800GTS for my older system, thinking it would be a step up from my 7600GT. It certainly should be, but it's almost running worse! Games such as Dark Messiah, FEAR, and STALKER have horrible stuttering problems as bad as when I had my 7600GT.
It'll be running about 60fps and then something starts loading whenever I turn a corner and it freezes up and the sound stops for a second or two.

I run Windows Vista 32 bit, don't know what this plays into my issues either, but it didn't run so great on XP either!

Simply put, which parts do I need to upgrade for the best results? CPU? RAM? Mobo?
I've heard a crappy PSU can actually slow down performance considerably, is this maybe the case and it just can't handle the 8800?

I just want the stuttering to stop! Any advice is appreciated.

Specs are 450W Asys PSU (no idea of the rails, if any), Athlon 64 3500+ 939pin Venice, ASRock 939Dual-SATA2 mobo, 1GB Corsair ValueSelect PC3200, Seagate 160GB SATA2 7200rpm

More about : geforce 8800gts horrible stuttering

March 23, 2007 4:41:49 PM

Also wondering, with both my 7600GT and 8800GTS 320MB, dxdiag and display properties show total video memory as 511 and 540MB respectively, what in the world is up with that? vista doing something weird?
a b U Graphics card
March 23, 2007 4:56:29 PM

Sounds like a driver issue.
Did you do a clean uninstall/install of drivers after removing the 7600GT?

As for the memory reporting sounds like it's using some turbo cache extension of system memroy whcih isn't used just accessible, kinda like AGP aperture.

I've seen that in a few non-integrated PCIe systems. I'd have to check my own rig at home to know for sure.

But sound like a driver issue, especially stuttering. If it were instability I'd suspect a PSU, but stuttering is usually either malware/processes running in background, or drivers. However that's still a pretty weak PSU to be putting a GF8800 on. And you should open up your case and check the amperage.
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a c 301 U Graphics card
March 23, 2007 5:42:51 PM

I suspect that 1gb of memory is not enough. Try adding another 1g stick. Even if it does not solve the stuttering problem, vista will use all the available memory to perform better.
March 23, 2007 6:35:53 PM

as far as driver uninstallation, i didnt uninstall anything since both the 7600gt and the 8800gts both use the exact same driver set according to what ive seen on nvidia's site.

and ive no doubt 2gb of RAM would help out, but would perhaps dual channel XMS 1GB (2x512) do even better? im not running at high resolutions or anything
a b U Graphics card
March 23, 2007 6:40:36 PM

Whenever you change cards you clean drivers. Simple but effective rule.

The GF8800 is nothing like the GF7600 (why do you think they had GF7 series drivers for Vista, but none for the GF8 at first?)

Clean out the old drivers with driver cleaner pro, and then install the latest drivers. Until you do that you're going to be dealing with a layer of headache that should be removed first.
March 23, 2007 6:48:59 PM

i was wondering the same thing myself about separate drivers, but then the new drivers which i installed as soon as i got vista said they were for 6/7/8 series cards. ill be cleaning out and seeing what happens, thanks
a c 301 U Graphics card
March 23, 2007 10:22:44 PM

If you are short of memory, then there is NOTHING that will fix it except more memory. Single/dual channel, 553/667/800 speeds are minor issues compared to not enough memory. When the problem occurs, do you see an increase in hard drive activity? If so, then the problem is likely due to paging. You might also use the Vista performance monitor to record cpu/hdd/lan/memory events.
a b U Graphics card
March 23, 2007 10:59:35 PM

Yeah, I agree. Never pull the card without removing the drivers, even if it's the same series. I used to do it for GF4Ti to GF4ti switches, but that was about it and probably still not a wise idea.

The win XP 97.92 drivers I am using for the 8800GTS are GF8800 series only. You now pick between Geforce/TNT or Geforce 8800 series or Geforce Go 7 series when looking for XP drivers.


Oh, And even with the latest specific drivers, I got the big 4-5 fps boost. :wink: whata upgrade. :x
March 24, 2007 5:29:41 AM

oh yeah, the hard drive goes crazy when its stuttering, ive tried increasing and decreasing the page file, and switching the drive its on, and it seems to do no good.. RAM certainly seems to be a high culprit here, though i kept reading elsewhere the difference between 2gb and 1gb were very minimal
March 24, 2007 6:13:53 AM

Quote:
Specs are 450W Asys PSU (no idea of the rails, if any)

GeForce8800GTS & a 450W PSU ???? 8O
Damn...
a b U Graphics card
March 24, 2007 8:07:25 AM

Quote:
oh yeah, the hard drive goes crazy when its stuttering, ive tried increasing and decreasing the page file, and switching the drive its on, and it seems to do no good.. RAM certainly seems to be a high culprit here, though i kept reading elsewhere the difference between 2gb and 1gb were very minimal


HD activity during a game means a new level/map is loading, which doesn't sound like that's the case, or the page file is being accessed because the RAM is too small. Notice any strange dips in older games, DOOM3 or HL2? They should do fine with 1 GB of RAM, but these newer games, I don't know. Clean the drivers like has been mentioned, virus/spyware check to make sure none of that's running, check the processes tab for unknown processes running. If none of that works look into another 1GB of RAM. Even if more RAM doesn't fix the problem, Vista will thank you for it.

I don't know where you were reading that 2 GB of RAM doesn't help, but it must not have been writen in the last 1-2 years. 2 GB is the norm for gaming computers now.
March 24, 2007 3:47:23 PM

HL2 and doom 3 and quake 4 all ran absolutely flawlessly, as they did with my 7600gt. even fear did, so long as i had AA off. dark messiah uses the HL2 engine, so i dont quite get why itd be running so crappy.. heavily increased image quality perhaps? supreme commander and C&C3 ran fine as well, stalker ran like crap no matter if it was on low or high settings, and everyone said that game was supposed to run okay on older hardware due to it being in development for so long!

i will most certainly be getting another gig of RAM and another PSU asap.
im looking at about a $90-100 range PSU, any recommendations? i dont need SLI, i just want to run my 8800gts and a few hard drives without a hitch. 500-600w should do it, right?

and is there any real difference between DDR2 667 and DDR2 533?
March 24, 2007 3:58:53 PM

That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.

The memory may be bottlenecking you occasionally but I wouldn't think it would cause the problems you described.

Vista also has a ton of problems in games right now, so yeah...
March 24, 2007 4:52:58 PM

I agree with the last assessment. A better PSU will go a long ways. The requirements are usually the minimum requirements needed, not always the recommended. Battlefield 2 is a huge example of this. Even though the minimum requirements are 512 mb of RAM, it runs best on 2 GB of RAM.

The system specs on your video card may require something like this:

425W PCI Express-compliant system power supply with a combined 12V current rating of 28A or more.

This requirement applies to the BFG Tech GeForce 8800GTS 320MB video card.

Also, from experience, the RAM upgrade to 2 GB will be a huge difference for XP. It will be largely noticeable. 4 GB with Vista 64 would be recommended for games, by a friend of mine who is currently using it.

Best of Luck :D 
March 24, 2007 4:56:56 PM

3 things....

1. Vista Eats Ram.

I have 4GB now and it manages to use up 1.5GB or so just sitting in Windows before I have even installed any programs.

MS have even said that with 1GB Vista will be slower than XP.



2. That Asys PSU is rated for 18A on the +12v rail, and 50A on the +5v rail.

This is because older CPUs (for example Athlon XP) drew power from the +5v rail.

THIS PSU IS NOT SUFFICIENT FOR AN 8800GTS.



3. 8800 Vista drivers suck bigtime. I was running Vista Ultimate on my 8800GTX, but even the Windows Texas Hold-Em game wont work, and any DirectX application crashes the display driver repeatedly. I have now gone back to XP Pro x64
March 24, 2007 5:00:17 PM

Thanks a ton to those that have responded! No doubt I'd seriously underestimated the PSU amperage, I'll be taking care of that and the RAM this afternoon. Though I can't pull 4GB yet, I'll be surely going with 2GB for now. And yeah, Vista, while potentially nice for DX10 much later this year, is crap for now and I'll be dual-booting with XP soon as I get my RAM and PSU.
Time for some Newegging!
March 24, 2007 5:04:16 PM

1) More RAM
2) better powersupply
3) Drivers
March 24, 2007 5:13:58 PM

Quote:
That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.


You guys are all such Power Supply snobs! I've been running my eVGA 8800GTS SC for months off of a PS I got for free after rebate!

It's an Ultra v500 with a single 12v rail at 28A and yes, it barely meets the 8800 GTS minimum recommendation. I actually am swapping up for an Antec EA500 but only because it was a good deal ($40 after rebate) and I plan to grab one of the new R600 or 8900 cards in the next few months.

I know headroom is good and quality is important so that you don't damage other components, but I'm just saying you do NOT necessarily need a $100+ PS for this video card. 8800 GTX or SLI is a different story. My system draws a max of 252 watts in BF 2142 at 1680x1050 (measured with a killawatt meter) with my setup.

Granted, my system is pretty basic. Only one HD, one optical drive, C2D....

e6600 stock
2x1GB DDR2 667 4-4-4-12
DVD Burner
Seagate 7200.10 320MB
SoundBlaster Audigy 2
March 24, 2007 5:20:07 PM

Quote:
That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.


You guys are all such Power Supply snobs! I've been running my eVGA 8800GTS SC for months off of a PS I got for free after rebate!

It's an Ultra v500 with a single 12v rail at 28A and yes, it barely meets the 8800 GTS minimum recommendation. I actually am swapping up for an Antec EA500 but only because it was a good deal ($40 after rebate) and I plan to grab one of the new R600 or 8900 cards in the next few months.

I know headroom is good and quality is important so that you don't damage other components, but I'm just saying you do NOT necessarily need a $100+ PS for this video card. 8800 GTX or SLI is a different story. My system draws a max of 252 watts in BF 2142 at 1680x1050 (measured with a killawatt meter) with my setup.

Granted, my system is pretty basic. Only one HD, one optical drive, C2D....

e6600 stock
2x1GB DDR2 667 4-4-4-12
DVD Burner
Seagate 7200.10 320MB
SoundBlaster Audigy 2

Note I said "decent". You'll be telling a different story in six months when your PC gets blown up...

Besides, 450 watt offbrand != 500 watt Ultra.
March 24, 2007 5:35:24 PM

Quote:
That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.


You guys are all such Power Supply snobs! I've been running my eVGA 8800GTS SC for months off of a PS I got for free after rebate!

It's an Ultra v500 with a single 12v rail at 28A and yes, it barely meets the 8800 GTS minimum recommendation. I actually am swapping up for an Antec EA500 but only because it was a good deal ($40 after rebate) and I plan to grab one of the new R600 or 8900 cards in the next few months.

I know headroom is good and quality is important so that you don't damage other components, but I'm just saying you do NOT necessarily need a $100+ PS for this video card. 8800 GTX or SLI is a different story. My system draws a max of 252 watts in BF 2142 at 1680x1050 (measured with a killawatt meter) with my setup.

Granted, my system is pretty basic. Only one HD, one optical drive, C2D....

e6600 stock
2x1GB DDR2 667 4-4-4-12
DVD Burner
Seagate 7200.10 320MB
SoundBlaster Audigy 2

Note I said "decent". You'll be telling a different story in six months when your PC gets blown up...

Oh, you can see into the future? That's a great skill- you should be using it to fight crime and save the world, not giving advice on a forum.

Quote:

Besides, 450 watt offbrand != 500 watt Ultra.


Check the specs of the 500w Ultra. Far better than most "offbrand" units at the same wattage rating.
March 24, 2007 5:42:19 PM

Quote:
HL2 and doom 3 and quake 4 all ran absolutely flawlessly, as they did with my 7600gt. even fear did, so long as i had AA off. dark messiah uses the HL2 engine, so i dont quite get why itd be running so crappy.. heavily increased image quality perhaps? supreme commander and C&C3 ran fine as well, stalker ran like crap no matter if it was on low or high settings, and everyone said that game was supposed to run okay on older hardware due to it being in development for so long!

i will most certainly be getting another gig of RAM and another PSU asap.
im looking at about a $90-100 range PSU, any recommendations? i dont need SLI, i just want to run my 8800gts and a few hard drives without a hitch. 500-600w should do it, right?

and is there any real difference between DDR2 667 and DDR2 533?


As for right now, Dark Messiah doesnt work with this card under Vista.

Set your page file to 2000 MB Min and Max. this will prevent the pagefile from resizing itself. You really NEED 2 gigs to game in vista. All my troubles went away once I got my hands on the 2nd gig of ram.

I wouldnt worry about the power supply, I've got an E6700 with your card, 2 hard disks, and 2 opticals on a 400w and its runnin great.
March 24, 2007 5:43:02 PM

i say you overclock ur amd processor a bit too. When i run my e6300 and 8800gts i see huge fps differences in vista with overclocking the cpu, i have heard that vista prevents ntune for allowing a gpu overclock. Anyone kn ow of anyway i can overclock my 8800gts on vista?>
March 24, 2007 5:48:08 PM

Quote:
i say you overclock ur amd processor a bit too. When i run my e6300 and 8800gts i see huge fps differences in vista with overclocking the cpu, i have heard that vista prevents ntune for allowing a gpu overclock. Anyone kn ow of anyway i can overclock my 8800gts on vista?>


Indeed, your 8800 is going to be waiting around for that AMD PoS to send it data. But, let's work on getting that puppy stable first, shall we? Plenty of time to fine tune later.
March 24, 2007 5:48:28 PM

to be honest my guess it that it might have something to do with Vista, although it could be anything anyone else has mentioned. If you can try your card in someone else's machine.
March 24, 2007 7:29:56 PM

Quote:
That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.


You guys are all such Power Supply snobs! I've been running my eVGA 8800GTS SC for months off of a PS I got for free after rebate!

It's an Ultra v500 with a single 12v rail at 28A and yes, it barely meets the 8800 GTS minimum recommendation. I actually am swapping up for an Antec EA500 but only because it was a good deal ($40 after rebate) and I plan to grab one of the new R600 or 8900 cards in the next few months.

I know headroom is good and quality is important so that you don't damage other components, but I'm just saying you do NOT necessarily need a $100+ PS for this video card. 8800 GTX or SLI is a different story. My system draws a max of 252 watts in BF 2142 at 1680x1050 (measured with a killawatt meter) with my setup.

Granted, my system is pretty basic. Only one HD, one optical drive, C2D....

e6600 stock
2x1GB DDR2 667 4-4-4-12
DVD Burner
Seagate 7200.10 320MB
SoundBlaster Audigy 2

Note I said "decent". You'll be telling a different story in six months when your PC gets blown up...

Oh, you can see into the future? That's a great skill- you should be using it to fight crime and save the world, not giving advice on a forum.

Damn, you're right, I should. *Dons cape*.

Quote:


Besides, 450 watt offbrand != 500 watt Ultra.


Check the specs of the 500w Ultra. Far better than most "offbrand" units at the same wattage rating.

My point exactly. His PSU is considerably worse than yours, so why are you advising him to leave it alone when it clearly is not good enough for an 8800GTS? Yours probably is, at least in the short term, but his almost certainly is not.
March 24, 2007 7:49:06 PM

Quote:
That PSU is NOT sufficient. You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of. I'd suggest the Corsair 520 watt, or the Silverstone 560. This could be causing your problems.


You guys are all such Power Supply snobs! I've been running my eVGA 8800GTS SC for months off of a PS I got for free after rebate!



His PSU has a single +12v rail rated at 18A.

This is not sufficient.

Your PSU has quite a bit more headroom.
March 24, 2007 11:31:00 PM

Quote:
Damn, you're right, I should. *Dons cape*.


LMAO! Nice.

Quote:
My point exactly. His PSU is considerably worse than yours, so why are you advising him to leave it alone when it clearly is not good enough for an 8800GTS? Yours probably is, at least in the short term, but his almost certainly is not.


I do completely agree with you on that point. I never said that his PSU was sufficient. I could have been more clear about that though. I agree that 18 amps on the 12v rail is not enough.

The PSU snob comment came directly from this:

Quote:
You really need to spend $100+ to get a decent PSU to run an 8800GTS off of.


That I don't agree with. There are plenty of decent PSU's in the $70 range that would be perfectly fine for an 8800 GTS. He certainly could spend $100+ for one of the higher-end PSUs that you listed, but he doesn't need to. That's all.

For example, here is an Antec unit with 31 amps (max) on the 12v rails and it's 30 bucks after rebate:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

It's not as respected as the brands you listed but it would be enough for that card and a bit of headroom.

-G
March 24, 2007 11:38:05 PM

I just have trust issues with certain brands :)  If it's going to be shooting that much power through my expensive, fragile parts, I like to be absolutely sure it's reliable enough to do it without causing my problems in the future.
March 25, 2007 1:50:36 AM

Quote:

For example, here is an Antec unit with 31 amps (max) on the 12v rails and it's 30 bucks after rebate:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


I would not pair that POS up with an 8800GTS. Tested less than 80,000hrs for efficiency which is less than 70% and the temps in which the PSU was tested is not even listed.

Good grief I am so sick of people recommending these crappy PSU's with high end GPU's :roll:


Besides my friend had this same brand PSU but it was a stronger more expensive model and it couldn't even properly power his old system which was a 4400 X2 along with a X1900XT.




This is what I would recommend and if you can afford a 8800GTS then you can afford a half way decent PSU.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


GPU's such as the G80 do best with single strong 12v rails such as this silverstone.

You are the epitome of a Power Supply Snob.

Again, that 8800gts does not need a $100+ (or in your case, a $138) PSU.

Again, you can certainly spend that much if you wish.

-G
March 25, 2007 1:19:30 PM

The best PSUs I know of in the 50-70$ dollars range can deliver a combined maximum of 26A in the best case. For a 8800GTS there is a recommended minimum of 30A at least, I believe. So though it might run without any problems on an PSU that does not meet this guideline, obviously when you're planning for a particular card you don't want to take needless risks.
March 25, 2007 2:37:33 PM

I have a 8800gts 640mb on a 485W Enermax Noisetaker model # EG495P-VE SFMA. I have absolutely no problems with power on this setup. BTW: look at my specs, I'm not running a bare-bones, either. But the amperage is a real problem with yours.

Honestly, it sounds to me like you have a memory and/or PSU issue, but I am going to go out on a limb and say that you might want to test your memory. Corsairs are notorious for losing a bank after about 6 months or so, so if you've had it for a while, I'd check them out. I had two matched sets of XMS memory go out on me in less than 4 months due to one chip corrupting out. (lots of memory reference problems and stuttering in games). Just my opinion... might want to check it out.

5200+ x2, 2gb Corsiar Dominator XMS 800 4-4-4-12, 485W Enermax Noisetaker, 2x300gb Western Digital Sata3g in RAID 0, 8800 GTS 640 mb at 600/900 running at 51C on stock cooling under full load, SB Audigy (1!!!) Platinum with Drive
March 26, 2007 8:27:00 AM

Quote:

For example, here is an Antec unit with 31 amps (max) on the 12v rails and it's 30 bucks after rebate:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


I would not pair that POS up with an 8800GTS. Tested less than 80,000hrs for efficiency which is less than 70% and the temps in which the PSU was tested is not even listed.

Good grief I am so sick of people recommending these crappy PSU's with high end GPU's :roll:


Besides my friend had this same brand PSU but it was a stronger more expensive model and it couldn't even properly power his old system which was a 4400 X2 along with a X1900XT.




This is what I would recommend and if you can afford a 8800GTS then you can afford a half way decent PSU.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


GPU's such as the G80 do best with single strong 12v rails such as this silverstone.

You are the epitome of a Power Supply Snob.

Again, that 8800gts does not need a $100+ (or in your case, a $138) PSU.

Again, you can certainly spend that much if you wish.

-G

Call me what you will but most people that build a high end system with a G80 in it then can probably afford a half way decent PSU.

If you think Im some sort of snob then so be it, I'd rather have a working functional system than one that will likely go out on me sooner or later due to lack of insufficient power.

I have built a good 10 gaming rigs now and my first one started out with a 4400 X2@2.7ghz and an X1900XT and guess what? I went through 2 dirt cheap dual rail PSU's that were actually better than the one you recommended and neither one would power the system longer than a couple of hours before shutting the system down :roll:


I was a noob just like you back then and didnt know any better. After doing some research that Silverstone PSU that I posted a link of was my next purchase and all my problems were gone after that.



People like you who try to skim out on the most important part of their systems are the same ones who will end up spending more $$$ in the long run when either 1 of 2 things happen or both-


1.PSU-damages components due to lack of power and takes your system with it.

2. You end up purchasing yet another PSU in the near future because the one you bought to skim by with cant support any add on's.

I have to agree with ROBX2 on this one if you can afford to buy high end parts for your PC, you need to get a high PSU as well .


I have a superclocked EVGA 320 8800 GTS paired with a HX 620 WATT CORSAIR 50 A 3 RAIL psu.

The reason i have this Psu which comes with a 5 year warranty :)  is that i know i am at peace if i ever want to go SLI or change components in my PC .

It is a investment safe and secure for atleast 5 years . :D 

SO if you want high end peripherals in your PC you have to get a Top end Power supply . Also Robx2 has a lot of experience about this i would imagine as he owns a wicked machine 8) so he is giving you good advice .
March 26, 2007 8:54:52 AM

Quote:
I just bought a EVGA GeForce 8800GTS for my older system, thinking it would be a step up from my 7600GT. It certainly should be, but it's almost running worse! Games such as Dark Messiah, FEAR, and STALKER have horrible stuttering problems as bad as when I had my 7600GT.
It'll be running about 60fps and then something starts loading whenever I turn a corner and it freezes up and the sound stops for a second or two.

I run Windows Vista 32 bit, don't know what this plays into my issues either, but it didn't run so great on XP either!

Simply put, which parts do I need to upgrade for the best results? CPU? RAM? Mobo?
I've heard a crappy PSU can actually slow down performance considerably, is this maybe the case and it just can't handle the 8800?

I just want the stuttering to stop! Any advice is appreciated.

Specs are 450W Asys PSU (no idea of the rails, if any), Athlon 64 3500+ 939pin Venice, ASRock 939Dual-SATA2 mobo, 1GB Corsair ValueSelect PC3200, Seagate 160GB SATA2 7200rpm


i have that same problem it doesnt seem to matter how old the games i got constant juttering
i am running vista 32bit and to get games to run "smoothly" i had to install them all on a seperate hard disk
to be honest if i was you i would deleate vista and install xp as im about to do
vista looks pretty but it sucks for gaming it does lots of tings in the background which took me a long time to stop as there isnt a "off" butten
March 26, 2007 2:44:17 PM

Heh.. gone are the days that you can simply plug a new component into a system w/out upgrading other parts of it....


As for all this PSU talk, is there a good write-up about PSUs? I've always been a bit confused about numbers and things when it comes to them and I'd like to learn for myself...

Thanks!
March 26, 2007 3:29:33 PM

Hate to sound like a noob, but does anyone here know if it is possible to run a 8800gts on my 420wat Tagan Ixeye?
I have
c2d 6400
gigabyte 965gm-s2
2 harddrives, 1 optical drive
no independent graphics card yet.

It doesnt pull much so the wattage requirements are there, but i am worried about the amperage...
420 ixeye has 22A on +12v rail, and i hear that the 8800gts needs 30A
Any input appreciated.
March 26, 2007 3:55:28 PM

Quote:

420 ixeye has 22A on +12v rail, and i hear that the 8800gts needs 30A
Any input appreciated.



The 30amp requirement is assuming a loaded system as the 88800GTS does not pull 30amps itself.

If your psu only has 22amps avail on the +12v rail then I think you just answered your own question which is a BIG FAT NO.

okay here is where im really confused now. a poster above said he had a 485w enermax noisetaker PSU, and it is rated at +12V@18A, and he runs an 8800GTS as well as plenty of other quality parts. whats the deal here? i know several people with an 8800 that have PSUs rated at 18A each 12V rail...

yet my EVGA 8800GTS says "Minimum of a 400 Watt power supply.
(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 26 Amps)"

26 amps where? on a single rail? what kind of PSU even has that?

my 7600GT said "Minimum of a 350 Watt power supply.
(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 18 Amps)"

...and it ran perfectly fine for 7 months on my crappiest of crappy PSUs...
March 26, 2007 4:03:25 PM

Quote:

okay here is where im really confused now. a poster above said he had a 485w enermax noisetaker PSU, and it is rated at +12V@18A



Thats why I asked if you were talking about total +12v amperage on your psu, do you mean 22amps on a single rail or 22amps on dual rails?. The enermax 485w is probably dual 12v rails rated at 18amps each.


Bottom line is if your PSU is 22amps on each rail then you should be fine. If you are however talking about only 22amps total then its not enough.


okay then, my PSU is certainly not 22A each rail, its 22A total. and yes that enermax is 18A on 2 12V rails, so that totals 36A?
March 26, 2007 4:07:58 PM

I have the 8800 GTS, and I've had a few problems related to it that resulted in 'stuttering'.

The first, I had EasyTune 5 (A utility for the motherboard) running, which caused stuttering.

Second, I chose to "Override application settings" and force Anti-aliasing in battlefield 2 and SupCom, which caused glitching, stuttering, and pixel-popping.


Just FYI.
March 26, 2007 4:13:45 PM

#1 drivers for 8800 in Vista is still horrible. Everybody getting BSODs, and/or worst performance to a game not even running (Like Dark messiah that comes with my 8800).

#2 everything else is a bottleneck, memory, cpu, etc.

#3 Insufficient power may cause video card to go into lower performance state. It may still run. When running higher end graphics card you will need a STABLE, not jumping around, power output PSU for stable operation.
March 26, 2007 5:10:38 PM

Quote:

okay here is where im really confused now. a poster above said he had a 485w enermax noisetaker PSU, and it is rated at +12V@18A



Thats why I asked if you were talking about total +12v amperage on your psu, do you mean 22amps on a single rail or 22amps on dual rails?. The enermax 485w is probably dual 12v rails rated at 18amps each.


Bottom line is if your PSU is 22amps on each rail then you should be fine. If you are however talking about only 22amps total then its not enough.

power and cooling units have BIG FAT single rails, of over 60 amperes..
March 26, 2007 5:24:13 PM

Quote:

For example, here is an Antec unit with 31 amps (max) on the 12v rails and it's 30 bucks after rebate:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


I would not pair that POS up with an 8800GTS. Tested less than 80,000hrs for efficiency which is less than 70% and the temps in which the PSU was tested is not even listed.

Good grief I am so sick of people recommending these crappy PSU's with high end GPU's :roll:


Besides my friend had this same brand PSU but it was a stronger more expensive model and it couldn't even properly power his old system which was a 4400 X2 along with a X1900XT.




This is what I would recommend and if you can afford a 8800GTS then you can afford a half way decent PSU.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


GPU's such as the G80 do best with single strong 12v rails such as this silverstone.

You are the epitome of a Power Supply Snob.

Again, that 8800gts does not need a $100+ (or in your case, a $138) PSU.

Again, you can certainly spend that much if you wish.

-G

Call me what you will but most people that build a high end system with a G80 in it then can probably afford a half way decent PSU.

If you think Im some sort of snob then so be it, I'd rather have a working functional system than one that will likely go out on me sooner or later due to lack of insufficient power.

I have built a good 10 gaming rigs now and my first one started out with a 4400 X2@2.7ghz and an X1900XT and guess what? I went through 2 dirt cheap dual rail PSU's that were actually better than the one you recommended and neither one would power the system longer than a couple of hours before shutting the system down :roll:


I was a noob just like you back then and didnt know any better. After doing some research that Silverstone PSU that I posted a link of was my next purchase and all my problems were gone after that.



People like you who try to skim out on the most important part of their systems are the same ones who will end up spending more $$$ in the long run when either 1 of 2 things happen or both-


1.PSU-damages components due to lack of power and takes your system with it.

2. You end up purchasing yet another PSU in the near future because the one you bought to skim by with cant support any add on's.

I guess it comes down to the fact that you and I have just simply had different experiences with PSU's. Interesting that you call me a noob. I could list my qualifications for you, but in my experience, I built well over 100 PC's when I worked for a customer computer company about four years ago before I started my own company. I'm certain I have at least as much building experience as you. Now most of those systems were for offices and didn't have higher end components. But we used the ultra crappy PSU's that came with Enlight cases back then. When that company folded, I took the client list and went out on my own. I still service some of those computers although most have been replaced by now. Here's my point- I can remember only having to replace two of the power supplies in all of those computers. And believe me, they were much lower quality than Antec.

Of the computers I've built for myself over the years which did have higher-end requirements, I have never spent more than $50 on a PSU, and that includes my current system, for which specs are listed earlier in this thread. I personally haven't had a PSU die on any of my computers. My brother did have one die after two years, and it was a crappy enlight 300w single 12v rail design which powered an AMD 3000+ and a Radeon 9800 Pro with no problems at all while it worked.

Of course, the G80 is a power hog and it doesn't directly relate to most of what I've posted, except that I do have a $40 PSU running my system right now which does have a G80. I'll let you know when it dies, but I've had no problems with it for three months of medium-heavy use.

Don't take the snob remark so personally. It's just that I know you don't need a $137 PSU like you recommended to run an 8800 GTS. You can argue that all day and night, but you just don't. Yes, it's possible that lesser PSU's will burn out sooner or will cause crashes, but there are decent units on newegg going for as little as $70 or less if there is a rebate attached.

I can't help the fact that you seem to burn up any power supply that doesn't have a brand name you don't like. For every example you list where someone's PSU died because it was, in your words, a cheap dual rail, there are probably ten success stories. Of course some people will have problems, but do you actually have any idea what the percentage is? And you can't just fly through reviews at newegg or on forums and add them up because lots of people only post a review if the product is defective.

You wrote that if someone can afford a G80 system, they can afford a high end PSU. That's the only thing you've written in this thread that is objective and verifiably true. But I'll post again what I've been saying all along:


That 8800gts does not need a $100+ (or in your case, a $138) PSU.

You can certainly spend that much if you wish.
March 26, 2007 6:27:44 PM

Quote:
I do have a $40 PSU running my system right now which does have a G80.


Any credibility you just had went right out the window.

I'm not claiming to have credibility. I'm simply sharing my personal experiences in the industry.
March 26, 2007 6:30:52 PM

Quote:


That 8800gts does not need a $100+ (or in your case, a $138) PSU.

You can certainly spend that much if you wish.



I love how you argue about price without even knowing wtf you are talking about. :roll:

That makes no sense. Even someone who doesn't know what they are taking about can argue about price since it's not a variable. Specs aren't either. They exist or they don't, and if they exist, they are fixed. Nice try though.
March 26, 2007 6:36:51 PM

Quote:


Purchasing a solid PSU to begin with is a guarantee based on 2 facts-

1. It saves money in the long run because you dont find yourself going from one sh1tty psu that just skims by to the next every time you upgrade or add a new component.

2. Gives peace of mind that your nice rig that you spent all that $$$ on is getting sufficient power at all times and the risk of failure which could take all your components out is greatly reduced.


To the first point, you again have not proved it just by saying it. Your definition of sh1tty seems to be anything less then the PSU you posted earlier, which is not true. There are far worse PSU's than Antec.

To the second, I agree that the risk is probably greater but if we're only talking about a couple of percentage points, you have to weigh that with the cost involved.
March 26, 2007 6:40:29 PM

Quote:

Don't take the snob remark so personally.


Dont take the noob comment so personally.

Funny how you say that and then use it again later in bold! Speaking of credibility...

Quote:


Everyone agrees that you should not skim out on the psu when building a high end rig and no one is agreeing with you that you should purchase a psu that is just enough to skim by. Its not worth the risk.

And I should have known when I stated that I had built 10 gaming PC's that you would say you have built 100 :roll: good comeback. :lol: 


What I've done is what I've done. I have no reason to lie about it. If it makes you feel better, I've also probably only built about ten gaming PC's. It makes neither of us an expert.
March 26, 2007 7:19:24 PM

Actually, if I can chime in a moment...

I've been building systems for a number of years now (in small amounts... maybe 5 a year). For a while I neglected the PSU, and had to learn some hard lessons.

One system, the PSU died and took out the Video card. From then on, it could no longer keep time (in a comical, "I fried my computer retarded" kind of way ;)  ) and the BIOS corrupted every other day.

Other times, cheap PSU's simply lead to artifacts in my 3D games and random crashes. For the longest time, I RMA'ed parts that I thought were defunct, but simply weren't getting enough juice (or didn't like dropping rails or volatile voltages).

Not to mention, a PSU's wattage rating is based on total combined throughput on ALL rails, which is why people tend to look at Amperage on the 12v rails rather than the wattage of the PSU when considering video cards.

The point is, you can be ignorant of problems caused by your PSU for a long time, since the symptoms of a bad/poor PSU tend to surface through problems with other components.

Good advice is to tell someone to get a PSU that has ~25% headroom on the 12v rail and ~35% headroom with regards to wattage. A system with an 8800GTS should consume about 300 watts under load. That means you should buy a PSU rated at 450W or higher, minimum. Everything I've read about PSU's, name-brand or not, is that the rated power output is usually less than what it actually delivers.

Anyway, it's pretty common knowledge that a cheap PSU is a bad investment, both for existing components and upgradability. If you don't want to invest in a good PSU, that's your prerogative, but it's best that you don't recommend it to others.
March 26, 2007 7:45:07 PM

Quote:


That makes no sense.



Some how im not surprised that it doesn't make any sense to you carver_g :roll:

Your a moron if you cannot comprehend the fact that its cheaper in the long run to spend a little more $$$ up front for a good psu that will get the job done without having to worry about insufficient power and at the same time allow for future upgrades or expansions rather than having to constantly upgrade to that next psu that will just barely get by every time you want to upgrade a component or add to your system.

One good PSU such as the $138 silverstone I mentioned will guarantee you rock solid stability and you will be able to keep the PSU for quite a long time before you need to upgrade to a better PSU as long as you are running a single card configuration.

And BTW $138 is not a lot of money for a good solid PSU you cheap ass :roll: Anyone purchasing an 8800GTS or GTX should not be worrying about spending 100-140$ for a good psu.



The 560watt silverstone with 38amps on a single 12v rail is a damn fine combination for either a 8800GTS or 8800GTX.


I cant wait till your system blows in your face from pairing up a G80 with a $40 psu :roll:

I'm sure you can't. That shows your maturity level and, as you mentioned, credibility.

That Silverstone is a great PSU, no doubts about it. But it's overkill, even by Whizzard9992's standards. He recommended 25-35% headroom. The Silverstone, by his measurements of a G80 system, is well over 100% extra headroom.

And when you are calling someone a moron, and you use the incorrect usage of your (should have been you're), it sort of has the opposite effect.
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