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my first build... lots and lots of queries....

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April 17, 2007 7:56:32 AM

hi...

this is my first post to this forum...
planning for a new build (my first one)
need some advice and also have a lot of questions...
i have two options for my build..

the first one:
E6300 on a MSI P965 Platinum Platform (or ASUS P5B Deluxe(not the Wi-Fi edition)... ur suggestion here pls... or rather pls suggest a best P965 motherboard around 120-130$)
in this case, as the E6300 has a FSB of 1066MHz, should i take a
DDR2-800MHz RAM or 667MHz RAM ??? cos i guess there's
some bandwidth problem with the INTEL processors (i m nt familiar with)
also, can anyone pls xpln this bandwidth thing and the overclocking part of the RAM and the CPU.. like... which shud be overclocked ? the multiplier or the bus speed of the processor ?
and when should RAM be overclocked ?
i'l do a lil' overclocking(may be 2.4GHz).... but not to the insane levels...

the other case:
AMD 64 X2 5600+ or something in the price range of E6300
also need a suggestion on the motherboards for AMD processors... cos i am not familiar with AMD chipsets' and the motherboards for them... need a mainstream chipset and a lowcost motherboard in the range of $120-$130)
also, i feel that the bandwidth of AMD processors in memory utilization is higher than compared to INTEL processors.... so which RAM shud i opt here ? the 800MHz one or the 667MHz one ??


If I choose AMD over INTEL, wil i hav any adv. cos the higher memory bandwidth on the AMD processors ?

the other components i'll be choosing are:
Samsung 940BW
Sony DVD Writer.. DRU 830A
may be 320GB HDD (not decided much company... will check for the bst with my dealer)
8800 GTS - 320MB model... (i'll wait for the pirce drops and then take the video card.. may be after 2months...)
PSU: around 500W
i guess i m okay with the stock cooler... as i dont overclock much....

i use this build for movies, occasional gaming, and for my work (includes oracle 10g much and a bit of java)

i m frm india so... newegg and tigerdirect sites aint gonna help me...

pls guys/gals(if any) i serioously need ur help...
April 17, 2007 8:10:18 AM

Welcome to Tom's Forumz. We try to help people help themselves.

First rig Your case will be different as your supplier might not have certain brands. Your two choices are good, another good one if you can find them are the gigabyte P965 either s-3 or DS-3.
For Intel, you try to match the FSB speed to the memory. e6300 has a 7x multiplier (think thats right) so the FSB will be higher to get the CPU Clock you want, You might get by with 667, and if it is lots less I would, but 800 is always good and will handle higher speeds.
LIke I kind of said, you adjust the FSB and then get the voltages to hold the CPU stable. Over clocking RAM gets to extreme o/c'ing

Second rig, same brands make good boards, not sure on exact model there.
You will want 800 RAM as AMD uses memory different and works bests with that speed. O/C is more pump up the vlotage untill it gets too hot. Real technical huh? 8O I am not that up on all the AMD stuff.

Good luck and come back with your input on parts
April 17, 2007 9:25:27 AM

thnx for the post...
the main parts that are to be concerned with is the mobo, proc and then the RAM...
so.. i guess i can get go off easilywith the remaining stuff....

okay... so we have another mob.. the DS3...
can u suggest the best amongst the three... cos i've read there are some pbms associated with MSI...
i dont wanna change my system for around 2years... so i need a reliable one.. (much future proofing isnt a pbm cos nothing is future proofed)

and coming to OC' to raise the proc frequency, i just need to increase the bus speed or the multiplier ??? (without OC'ng RAM).. also is there any math associated with this ?

and abt the AMD thing, it uses memory effectively.. does that mean.. i need to get an AMD machine instead of an INTEL one ?
Related resources
April 17, 2007 11:17:35 AM

Soujnds like Gigabyte DS3 is one for you.

O/C an Intel CPU you raise the Front Side Bus. The multiplier is fixed. I think this how it goes, be sure and ask the experts before you actually do it. You set the FSB to 400 and the e6300 multiplier is 7 so 400 x 7 = 2800 or 2.8 Ghz. The Ram is set to match the FSB so 400 x 2 (double data rate) is 800 so DDR2-800 Works at desired 1:1 ratio.

AMD uses RAM differently, It is not set by the FSB like Intel. Not really sure you could call either one better.
April 18, 2007 5:31:06 AM

But i guess i like MSI P965 Platinum, may be for its firewire ports or for its sexy black outfit [:p]..
anyways.. i guess i m done with my selection of proc... E6300...
but i need a lil' more advice abt the mobo..
i've even read in these forums that DS3 has excellent overclocking abilities.. but its getting crashed...
pls suggest something on mobos pal.. i m banging my head.....

and coming to the multiplier, i guess its not locked.. i believe that the multiplier is unlocked on the proc, but locked on some of the mobos...
and raising the bus speed to 400MHz... i guess i wont make a barbeque out of the proc....
so.. DDR2-800MHz (400*7) = 2.8GHz (1:1)
DDR2-667MHz (334*7) = 2.3GHz (1:1)

is this it ???
April 18, 2007 5:50:36 AM

Quote:
Soujnds like Gigabyte DS3 is one for you.

O/C an Intel CPU you raise the Front Side Bus. The multiplier is fixed. I think this how it goes, be sure and ask the experts before you actually do it. You set the FSB to 400 and the e6300 multiplier is 7 so 400 x 7 = 2800 or 2.8 Ghz. The Ram is set to match the FSB so 400 x 2 (double data rate) is 800 so DDR2-800 Works at desired 1:1 ratio.

You're dead on for most Intel processors. The only exception is the "extreme" series processors, like the X6800 and QX6700, where the multiplier is adjustable("unlocked"). Here are the C2D mutlipliers and (stock FSB) if you are curious:
e4300: x9 (200 Mhz)
e6300 x7 (266.7 MHz)
e6400 x8 (266.7 MHz)
e6600 x9 (266.7 MHz)
e6700 x10 (266.7 MHz)
X6800 x11 default, x6-x12 settable (266.7 MHz)
April 18, 2007 6:01:37 AM

Quote:
But i guess i like MSI P965 Platinum, may be for its firewire ports or for its sexy black outfit [:p]..
anyways.. i guess i m done with my selection of proc... E6300...
but i need a lil' more advice abt the mobo..
i've even read in these forums that DS3 has excellent overclocking abilities.. but its getting crashed...
pls suggest something on mobos pal.. i m banging my head.....

and coming to the multiplier, i guess its not locked.. i believe that the multiplier is unlocked on the proc, but locked on some of the mobos...
and raising the bus speed to 400MHz... i guess i wont make a barbeque out of the proc....

is this it ???

The multiplier is locked on the procs (excluding the X6800/QX6700). That's one reason a lot of people like to OC the e4300 instead of the e6300 - higher multi - same as an e6600 (x9). Just switch the FSB from 200 to 266 and instant half-price e6600 (less some cache). And by the time you get an e4300 or e6600 up to 400 MHz FSB (DDR2-800), you're at 3.6 GHz. You can get high clocks out of an e6300 as well, but it requires a high FSB speed. I know the DS3 can handle those speeds, but I'm not familiar with that MSI board, sorry can't help you there.
Quote:
so.. DDR2-800MHz (400*7) = 2.8GHz (1:1)
DDR2-667MHz (334*7) = 2.3GHz (1:1)

Your math is correct. DDR2-667 is a reasonable choice for the high multi processors like the 6700 or 6800 where you might run into the thermal wall relatively quickly before you can get the FSB up past 333, but you want at least DDR2-800 if you're going to OC a 6300. Oh and you can OC good RAM a bit, many people get quality DDR2-800 up to about 900 (450 doubled) by relaxing the timings and raising the voltage.
April 18, 2007 10:49:31 AM

oh.. so both the proc. and RAM are okay with me...
DDR2-800 (dont need the super duper extreme hi-fi series... a cheap and a good one will do fine)
and coming to the proc., E6300 cos.. i need intel VT as unfortunately E4300 doesnt have that.. as VT helps me with my work with out reebooting my machine.. my work environments uses Windows 2000 pro also planning to have Windows XP and Vista tooo

just now read some posts in the mobo section and ppl are getting pissed off by the MSI P965 Platinum. so, i guess i have to go with the DS3 and P5B Deluxe.. also there are some stability issues with the DS3 althought its a good overclocker... (ur comments pls on the DS3).. or the ASUS P5B Deluxe (which is a bit high priced)

and one more thing.. after i've got all my parts.. i guess i'll need to raise the busspeed to (400MHz * 7) to get 2.8GHz on stock cooler... (ur valuable commentsions and suggestions here plssss)
i guess i'll have 1:1.. and no plans on OC'ng RAM as 2.8GHz on 1:1 is okay with me...
April 18, 2007 10:54:42 AM

How old are the comments about the DS3? The newer rev's have been rock solid as far as I know.?
Stock air, depends on the rest of the cooling and the room tempatures, a stock fan cant work wonders :wink:
April 19, 2007 9:15:59 AM

okay.. so i guess i m done with the following parts:
E6300
P5B Deluxe / DS3 (considering the availability and price)
but can u pls lemme knw which ver of DS3 is stable and rock solid ?
i guess i'll have a CPU cooler not the stock cooler to achieve 1:1 ratio (2.8GHz / DDR2-800MHz)
and does the above mobos support 1:1 for DDR2-800MHz ???? :?:

and finally... which 8800 GTS (320MB) should i opt for ?
considering.. i need all the cables and accessories bundled...
amongst ASUS/BFG/XFX/eVGA.. not the factory OC'ed ones pls..
(the included game is optional.. if i need to choose, i'd prefer FPS games rather than strategy ones'..)
April 19, 2007 9:30:15 AM

The current and best rev. for a DS-3 is 3.3, gives you Quad support and 1333 FSB.

I would always choose eVGA they are the best service wise and they offer a step up program to trade their card for a better model (90 days, must be complete, so save all the boxes)
!