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a sign of price dropping for nvidia?

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April 29, 2007 2:53:40 PM

Can this be a sign of nvidia getting our messages about "how suck their new 8600 cards are"?

http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=178...

$169.99 - $20 instant off in cart = $149.99
$30 MIR that will cut it into $119.99 with free shipping

http://www.circuitcity.com/rpsm/oid/180575/rpem/ccd/Reb...

Maybe it's the fear of AMD's new HD 2600 cards, in this case then god bless competitions. :D 
April 29, 2007 3:05:21 PM

Yeah with the prices dropping like that, the 8600 series might actually start to look like a good buy. Now if they would just drop the price of the 8800GTX...
April 29, 2007 3:25:38 PM

Last time I heard, nvidia's high end wasn't threaten by AMD's HD 2900 at all, I guess there is no reason for them to drop price.
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April 29, 2007 3:27:43 PM

i was just gonna post this, you beat me to it. lol. maybe the prices are gonna drop to where they should be. those new cards are overpriced. the 7600gt performs better and cost less than the 8600gt
April 29, 2007 3:41:14 PM

Quote:
i was just gonna post this, you beat me to it. lol.


Great minds think a like.
April 29, 2007 3:49:07 PM

Probably no sign, just some temporary deals for now.
April 29, 2007 4:16:07 PM

Quote:
Last time I heard, nvidia's high end wasn't threaten by AMD's HD 2900 at all, I guess there is no reason for them to drop price.

I know, but I can dream, right? :D 
April 29, 2007 4:33:14 PM

Quote:
Last time I heard, nvidia's high end wasn't threaten by AMD's HD 2900 at all, I guess there is no reason for them to drop price.

I know, but I can dream, right? :D 

Let's all dream about it, I'll see you in the dream world. :lol: 
April 29, 2007 4:52:50 PM

I'm not defending Nvidia but I don't see why we're putting the 8600GT against the 7600GT in the first place since it's much more like the 7600GS, and the 8600GTS is more like the 7600GT. The name game=WTF ever, to me.

I also wonder if they plan on adding 50 to the ends of the numbers much like ATI did with their stuff last gen for a performance boost. Much like 1650, 1550, 1950, and it's not just ATI since Nvidia made the 7950, but that was a whole different animal. Anyway it makes me wonder if they are just giving us a short stop so they can milk more money out of us later on the +50 stuff.

Although I think each generation should be better than it's previous one, I think all we're really getting for our money with these cards DX10 anyway. Is DX10 material even out? NO(except a demo). Is price/performance worth it...not really. I gotta admit though the 8800GTS320 is quite a tasty snack.
April 29, 2007 5:11:35 PM

Currently I own a Geforce 5200, I was going to buy the 8800 320MB but it's so expensive for me and even more considering the probable price drops, do you think that the 8800 will drop significantly in the next months or the price drops are more possible for the overpriced 8600 serie?,

actually I was going to buy a 8600 GT, but I'm really not sure, currently I'm not an avid gamer but I expect to become one :) 
April 29, 2007 6:11:18 PM

since we don't have dx10 games(except one from microsoft) i suggest to buy a dx9 card like a gforce7600GT best bang for the buck at this time and save the money
why bother right now buy a dx10 card
dx10 -vista and vista has for now a lot of issues...we have to wait to see better drivers and dx10 games...\
in my humble opinion ..i will buy a dx10 card when i will have a dx10 game!
April 29, 2007 6:21:58 PM

:(  I wish the local Best Buy would have deals like that, they are still charging $250 for the 8600. I can't wait until the HD 2600 cards come out, since they will probably charge $400 for the 2900's
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 29, 2007 6:39:21 PM

Quote:
I'm not defending Nvidia but I don't see why we're putting the 8600GT against the 7600GT in the first place since it's much more like the 7600GS, and the 8600GTS is more like the 7600GT.


Except that the GF8600GT costs more than the GF7600GT, err.., even the GF7900GS and X1950GT (and some X1950Pros) so that's why they are compared. The GF8600GTS costs as much as the X1950XT so that's why they are compared. The prices start to drop and then they will return to other competition levels that they perform similar to, and that's what the point of this thread is.

You argument is fine for a technology comparison, but no one buys a card because compared to the last one it's 10% better, they buy it because for the $100-200 the spend it's the best card they can buy. You argument would be like comparing the GF8600GT to the Radeon 9600 or FX5600 because they were in the same 'category/class', and there's no way you could get anyone to agree with that.

Quote:
I also wonder if they plan on adding 50 to the ends of the numbers much like ATI did with their stuff last gen for a performance boost. Much like 1650, 1550, 1950, and it's not just ATI since Nvidia made the 7950,


And it started with the FX5950.

Quote:
Although I think each generation should be better than it's previous one, I think all we're really getting for our money with these cards DX10 anyway. Is DX10 material even out? NO(except a demo). Is price/performance worth it...not really.


Like I said, DX10 support is worth about $20, whereas currently nV seems to be charging about $50-100 premium on performance if you look at it that way. The only significant value over the previous generation is if you use/watch HD video features.

Quote:
I gotta admit though the 8800GTS320 is quite a tasty snack.


And that wins on price/performance alone and has no need for a DX10 crutch to sell it. And that's all that it should be.

While the HD2600 is unlikely to be spectacular, if it's the same performance as the weak GF8600 series, it should learn it's lesson and not start with such a high launch price.
April 29, 2007 7:00:45 PM

HD 2600 are 65nm, they will have better yields than 80nm 8600. Hopefully this translates to cheaper HD2600 at least same performance as 8600 if not better.
April 29, 2007 7:10:07 PM

Quote:
HD 2600 are 65nm, they will have better yields than 80nm 8600. Hopefully this translates to cheaper HD2600 at least same performance as 8600 if not better.

I don't think that they are having very good yields with the 65-nm chips. Why else would avalibility for them get pushed back to middle of June?
April 29, 2007 7:11:49 PM

Quote:
HD 2600 are 65nm, they will have better yields than 80nm 8600. Hopefully this translates to cheaper HD2600 at least same performance as 8600 if not better.

I don't think that they are having very good yields with the 65-nm chips. Why else would avalibility for them get pushed back to middle of June?

Some believes that OEMs like Dell, HP are buying up all the low ends(HD2400 and HD2600). Well it's a matter of who you believes.
April 29, 2007 7:18:48 PM

Quote:
Can this be a sign of nvidia getting our messages about "how suck their new 8600 cards are"?


rofl, that grammar sounds like a chinaman XD
April 29, 2007 7:24:17 PM

Quote:
Can this be a sign of nvidia getting our messages about "how suck their new 8600 cards are"?


rofl, that grammar sounds like a chinaman XD

Why, you're a chinaman? I heard it takes "one chinaman to know another" :lol: 
April 29, 2007 7:38:48 PM

The prise of 8800 gts is going to come down, 8600 and 8500 depends on how good or bad ati's low end cards are. 8800 gtx has nothin to worry about, so no change in price... the only chance is that 2900 XT is selling much better than 8800 GTS. If so, they may pring GTX closer to 2900...
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 29, 2007 7:39:48 PM

Quote:
HD 2600 are 65nm, they will have better yields than 80nm 8600. Hopefully this translates to cheaper HD2600 at least same performance as 8600 if not better.

I don't think that they are having very good yields with the 65-nm chips. Why else would avalibility for them get pushed back to middle of June?

Some believes that OEMs like Dell, HP are buying up all the low ends(HD2400 and HD2600). Well it's a matter of who you believes.

And that may be it, but there's no guarantee that 65nm equals high yield.

You get more chips per wafer, but not necessarily more usable chips, which combine to give you the overall yield.

It depends alot on TSMC's abilities with the process. 80nm is a bit older for them, been around since the X1650/1950, and 65nm is relatively new, so there may be early issues.

However once the kins are worked out the 65nm chips should have a significantly lower cost number since it's a big saving, and should allow a variety of frequency scales due to it being a true new process and not an optical shrink like the 80nm half-node.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 29, 2007 7:45:53 PM

Quote:
The prise of 8800 gts is going to come down,


The GTS-640, but the 320 won't come down much short term, until there's a new GTS, or something in that price range like happened last generation.

Quote:
8600 and 8500 depends on how good or bad ati's low end cards are.


No, they also depend alot on the other cards in that price range and the X1950XT destroys the GF8600GTS for the same price, and the X1950GT/GF7900GS/X1950Pro similarly beat the GF8600GT for less, the X1650 and GF7600 beat the GF8500 for less.

So unlike the GF8800s, the GF8600 and 8500 have alot of competition in their price range.
April 29, 2007 8:19:01 PM

Quote:
The prise of 8800 gts is going to come down,


The GTS-640, but the 320 won't come down much short term, until there's a new GTS, or something in that price range like happened last generation.

Quote:
8600 and 8500 depends on how good or bad ati's low end cards are.


No, they also depend alot on the other cards in that price range and the X1950XT destroys the GF8600GTS for the same price, and the X1950GT/GF7900GS/X1950Pro similarly beat the GF8600GT for less, the X1650 and GF7600 beat the GF8500 for less.

So unlike the GF8800s, the GF8600 and 8500 have alot of competition in their price range.

In game speed and pure force yes. People seems to forget that 8600 and 8500 have exelent videodecoder that makes them good home theatre system cards. From game speed aspect it's not much, but for some user there are not real competition to them at this moment. They seems to be even better than ATI's wia cards.. Some how that is thing that makes me wonder...
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2977

And yes, X1950 is excelent card indeed. I really agree you in that. It may be even better for a while, with some price drops. :) 
April 29, 2007 9:23:33 PM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:


In game speed and pure force yes. People seems to forget that 8600 and 8500 have exelent videodecoder that makes them good home theatre system cards. From game speed aspect it's not much, but for some user there are not real competition to them at this moment. They seems to be even better than ATI's wia cards.. Some how that is thing that makes me wonder...
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2977



Well, the situation might change as soon as HD2400 and HD2600 hits the market, I heard they got sound card built-in which will let them transmit data through HDMI making it true HDCP for vista. Please correct me if I'm wrong. :lol: 
April 29, 2007 9:58:41 PM

Quote:
since we don't have dx10 games(except one from microsoft)


Which one? If you are referring to FSX it has been pushed back to October to be patched to dx10.

I still think anyone buying a new card in this time frame is better to have a dx10 card. But in saying that I would never recommend a card that underperforms in every title you can currently play. The general consensus for the 8600 at it's release was that it fell short on price/performance.
April 29, 2007 11:28:14 PM

I agree that getting a DX10 card is kind of like throwing away some cash but if you know you're going to go DX10 in the next year or so it'd be worth it to get a DX10 card whenever. I got my 8800GTS because it's fricking awsome on DX9 content and I'm all set for DX10 whenever that comes. There is a demo from Nvidia, and an M$ game too. Not that 2 things make it worth it but you know more are on their way.

Does anybody actually have HDMI on their current monitor? and does your TV with HDMI have 1900x1200 res? It's like having 5000HP in a Honda Civic, yeah it's cool to say you have it but it's pointless. Same idea as having a QX6800 clocked at 9Ghz, yeah it's awsome but if it's not stable, there is no point.
April 30, 2007 2:14:54 AM

Quote:
Can this be a sign of nvidia getting our messages about "how suck their new 8600 cards are"?


Why people say that the 8600 suck ? At the price do you expect a killer gaming video card ? I hope you not. The big point of gaining a 8600gt or gts is not for gaming but HD video. This is the only card that have a HD decoder that make no stress on the cpu when playing HD, the gtx doesnt even have that. And the GT version can be OC to beat easy a 7900GS with low power consumation, very stable, quiet, cool temperature and DX10 capable, just need 3dmark 07 to see what are the diff with the 8800 series.
April 30, 2007 6:14:38 PM

Quote:
Can this be a sign of nvidia getting our messages about "how suck their new 8600 cards are"?


Why people say that the 8600 suck ? At the price do you expect a killer gaming video card ? I hope you not. The big point of gaining a 8600gt or gts is not for gaming but HD video. This is the only card that have a HD decoder that make no stress on the cpu when playing HD, the gtx doesnt even have that. And the GT version can be OC to beat easy a 7900GS with low power consumation, very stable, quiet, cool temperature and DX10 capable, just need 3dmark 07 to see what are the diff with the 8800 series.

Some people says that 8600gt sucks because it has failed the legacy of x600gt. Remember 6600gt and 7600gt? They were both able to kick the previous generation's ultra high end asses for much less amount of money. 6600gt vs. 5800ultra and 7600gt vs. 6800gt/gs.
I do understand what you meant by 8600 was design to be more of htpc and stuff like that. I guess people are just disappoint to see a such small performance boost delivered by the new 8600.
Of course it's all my opinion, and it is probably wrong too.

ps: I heard that only 8600gts has built in HDCP compatibility, the 8600gt and 8500gt have HDCP as optional, so how is that htpc ready? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
a b U Graphics card
April 30, 2007 6:26:41 PM

Quote:
Some people says that 8600gt sucks because it has failed the legacy of x600gt. Remember 6600gt and 7600gt? They were both able to kick the previous generation's ultra high end asses for much less amount of money. 6600gt vs. 5800ultra and 7600gt vs. 6800gt/gs.

While I agree with what you are trying to say, you are exaggerating about the 7600GT. The 6600GT did beat the best prior high end card in most benchmarks (9800XT). The 7600GT did not beat the X850XTPE that same way, but at least was a pretty equal card to the 6800U and the top X800's and X850's. The 8600GTS would have to match the 7900GTX and do well against the X1950XTX to be considered equal to what the 7600GT accomplished. It would have to beat the X1950XTX in almost everything and sometimes by alot, to be equal to the 6600GT.
April 30, 2007 6:34:12 PM

Quote:
Quote:
The 8600GTS would have to match the 7900GTX and do well against the X1950XTX to be considered equal to what the 7600GT accomplished. It would have to beat the X1950XTX in almost everything and sometimes by alot, to be equal to the 6600GT.


Exactly, I believe most people are expecting 8600gts to be close to 7900gtx. But we all know that it's rubbing shoulders with 7900gs instead. Which is the reason why people saying it's a disappointment.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 30, 2007 6:35:42 PM

Quote:

In game speed and pure force yes. People seems to forget that 8600 and 8500 have exelent videodecoder that makes them good home theatre system cards.


They do, but a better one is coming (with VC-1 acceleration, plus audio) so why pay extra now if you don't have to? Only if you need one for an HTPC that you need to build this week is it a good buy,otherwise the prices will drop (most people don't buy these for HTPCs), and there will be another option to check out too. So I wouldn't by one noe for even thei HD acceleration, unless you just bought or were given an Xbox HD-DVD drive or something.

Quote:
From game speed aspect it's not much, but for some user there are not real competition to them at this moment. They seems to be even better than ATI's wia cards.. Some how that is thing that makes me wonder...
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2977


Well there is still competition, it's not as good, but sufficient for a solid X2 or C2D system, however if underclocked or lighter proc for heat/sound concerns, then it definitely helps, but I'd also take those benchies with a grain of salt on the AMD side of the fence since the results don't match up with everyone else's, although it's not like the old ATi's make up any ground against the new GF8600s, but they are neck and neck with the GF7s. Main thing is now that the gaming sales is what's going to push prices down considerably, as we've already seen, so I wouldn't just rush in an buy, heck the difference is about 2 BR/HD-DVD titles, and it'll be interesting to see what the hardware VC-1 acceleration does too, and even compare Audio to Creative surround processing (as a throw away bonus).

Quote:
Why people say that the 8600 suck ? At the price do you expect a killer gaming video card ? I hope you not.


I expect it to game at least as well as something that costs $50 less.

Like I said I give the DX10 support about $20 grace, and video decoding is dependant on the buyer, as there's no equivalent right now, but how much is it worth depends on the setup.

Quote:
The big point of gaining a 8600gt or gts is not for gaming but HD video.


No it's not. That may be the only redeeming quality it has left, but the main thing and the main thing it will still be bought for is gaming. If people are primarily interested in video then save the money and spend it on dedicated cards like the upcoming MicRacer (whihc I was amped about, but now seems to do everything my laptop might be able to do, and I get to play).

Quote:
This is the only card that have a HD decoder that make no stress on the cpu when playing HD,


No it's not, and it's about to be joined by another contender.

Quote:
And the GT version can be OC to beat easy a 7900GS with low power consumation,


I doubt that, because in order to beat the GF7900GS it neds to be at GTS speeds, adn in order to do that it needs GTS power level, which are higher than the GF7900GS, marginally, but they still are.

Quote:
very stable, quiet, cool temperature


It's hardly what I'd call quiet, unless you get a passive one, and then it's hardly what I'd call cool either;
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/geforce8...

and btw waste hot air is sent back into the case not out like some other designs

Quote:
just need 3dmark 07 to see what are the diff with the 8800 series.


Forget that, you need 3Dmk07 to see what the diff is with ATi's offerings, that's going to be the imortant thing, because anyone considering a GF8600 that could buy a GF8800GTS-320, probably is already doing that now, knowing that the GF8600 and HD2600 are both 128bit cripples. But 3Dmk07 and such are needed to compare archiectures, not stripped down versus strapped up because we know that the GF8800 should pants the 8600, but we have no idea of the relative DX10 strengths of the two different GF8600/HD2600 or G8x/R6xx designs.
April 30, 2007 7:39:12 PM

Even though its Fudzilla, looks like the 2600 series is delayed till June. Looks like no entire R600 lineup all in one in March errr May 14th.
April 30, 2007 8:35:39 PM

Quote:

In game speed and pure force yes. People seems to forget that 8600 and 8500 have exelent videodecoder that makes them good home theatre system cards.


They do, but a better one is coming (with VC-1 acceleration, plus audio) so why pay extra now if you don't have to? Only if you need one for an HTPC that you need to build this week is it a good buy,otherwise the prices will drop (most people don't buy these for HTPCs), and there will be another option to check out too. So I wouldn't by one noe for even thei HD acceleration, unless you just bought or were given an Xbox HD-DVD drive or something.

Quote:
From game speed aspect it's not much, but for some user there are not real competition to them at this moment. They seems to be even better than ATI's wia cards.. Some how that is thing that makes me wonder...
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2977


Well there is still competition, it's not as good, but sufficient for a solid X2 or C2D system, however if underclocked or lighter proc for heat/sound concerns, then it definitely helps, but I'd also take those benchies with a grain of salt on the AMD side of the fence since the results don't match up with everyone else's, although it's not like the old ATi's make up any ground against the new GF8600s, but they are neck and neck with the GF7s. Main thing is now that the gaming sales is what's going to push prices down considerably, as we've already seen, so I wouldn't just rush in an buy, heck the difference is about 2 BR/HD-DVD titles, and it'll be interesting to see what the hardware VC-1 acceleration does too, and even compare Audio to Creative surround processing (as a throw away bonus).

Quote:
Why people say that the 8600 suck ? At the price do you expect a killer gaming video card ? I hope you not.


I expect it to game at least as well as something that costs $50 less.

Like I said I give the DX10 support about $20 grace, and video decoding is dependant on the buyer, as there's no equivalent right now, but how much is it worth depends on the setup.

Quote:
The big point of gaining a 8600gt or gts is not for gaming but HD video.


No it's not. That may be the only redeeming quality it has left, but the main thing and the main thing it will still be bought for is gaming. If people are primarily interested in video then save the money and spend it on dedicated cards like the upcoming MicRacer (whihc I was amped about, but now seems to do everything my laptop might be able to do, and I get to play).

Quote:
This is the only card that have a HD decoder that make no stress on the cpu when playing HD,


No it's not, and it's about to be joined by another contender.

Quote:
And the GT version can be OC to beat easy a 7900GS with low power consumation,


I doubt that, because in order to beat the GF7900GS it neds to be at GTS speeds, adn in order to do that it needs GTS power level, which are higher than the GF7900GS, marginally, but they still are.

Quote:
very stable, quiet, cool temperature


It's hardly what I'd call quiet, unless you get a passive one, and then it's hardly what I'd call cool either;
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/geforce8...

and btw waste hot air is sent back into the case not out like some other designs

Quote:
just need 3dmark 07 to see what are the diff with the 8800 series.


Forget that, you need 3Dmk07 to see what the diff is with ATi's offerings, that's going to be the imortant thing, because anyone considering a GF8600 that could buy a GF8800GTS-320, probably is already doing that now, knowing that the GF8600 and HD2600 are both 128bit cripples. But 3Dmk07 and such are needed to compare archiectures, not stripped down versus strapped up because we know that the GF8800 should pants the 8600, but we have no idea of the relative DX10 strengths of the two different GF8600/HD2600 or G8x/R6xx designs.

Well you linked a 8600GTS link wich not telling the power consumation of the GT. And on my XFX 8600GT XXX edition clocked to 710mhz core and 850mhz memory, the idle temp is 53c and load is 65c. At those speed i am doing 5600 3Dmark06 score wich its superior to a stock GTS. And no one say its was a gaming extreme card, if you want to go for gaming just go with a 8800... If you want to go mid gaming with HD video withou using all your cpu power, then only the 8600gt, gts give you this at this price, yes ati is coming but i doubt it will be at the 149 price range. There only 40$ difference between a 7600GT and a 8600GT that you can clock to a gts and be about performant as the 7900GS wich cost about 10$ more then the 8600gt withou HD decoder.
a b U Graphics card
April 30, 2007 9:17:09 PM

Quote:
There only 40$ difference between a 7600GT and a 8600GT that you can clock to a gts and be about performant as the 7900GS wich cost about 10$ more then the 8600gt withou HD decoder.

Yeah, but if you max OC the 8600GT, then do the same to the 7900GS, which also overlocks well. The 7900GS is going to win and for less money. Of course, the $119 8600GT at CC is a good deal if it OC'es well. But these $160 GT's are too expensive.
April 30, 2007 9:24:13 PM

While it's being discussed, does anyone have an idea when 3D Mark 2007 is likely to be released?
a b U Graphics card
April 30, 2007 9:28:54 PM

No but rumor is it's Vista and DX10 only.
April 30, 2007 9:45:36 PM

Quote:
There only 40$ difference between a 7600GT and a 8600GT that you can clock to a gts and be about performant as the 7900GS wich cost about 10$ more then the 8600gt withou HD decoder.

Yeah, but if you max OC the 8600GT, then do the same to the 7900GS, which also overlocks well. The 7900GS is going to win and for less money. Of course, the $119 8600GT at CC is a good deal if it OC'es well. But these $160 GT's are too expensive.

Yeah but even the 7900GS oc it will not beat a 8600GT oc in 3dmark 06 +, 7900GS doesnt have a HD decoder and no DX10. But yeah, when crysis will be out we will see if the 8600GT will be good enought to play with good visual in dx10 or a better card like 7950GT will be better quality in dx9 then a 8600GT in dx10.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 30, 2007 10:54:12 PM

Quote:

Well you linked a 8600GTS link wich not telling the power consumation of the GT.


Of course, because in order to beat a GF7900GS, the GT needs to be overclocked to GTS speeds, like I said, that overclock makes it worse. What, did you think your overlock came at no power cost? :roll:

Quote:
And on my XFX 8600GT XXX edition clocked to 710mhz core and 850mhz memory, the idle temp is 53c and load is 65c. At those speed i am doing 5600 3Dmark06 score wich its superior to a stock GTS.


And that assumes the other cards can't overclock as well.

Quote:
yes ati is coming but i doubt it will be at the 149 price range.


Why wouldn't it be in the same price range? It's a smaller process even, so who knows could even be cheaper, and considering the acceleration chip is based on their Xilleon technology, it may be easy/cheap for them to add to even the low end HD2400 series, we just don't know do we.

Quote:
the 7900GS wich cost about 10$ more then the 8600gt withou HD decoder.


Yeah and the reason they are cheaper is because they are weak, you asky why people rag on it, then you talk about the price difference after they've started droping in response to the poor performance, which is the point of the thread. :roll:

Like I said before, only AFTER these price drops are they worthwhile before that they're overpriced.

Quote:
Yeah but even the 7900GS oc it will not beat a 8600GT oc in 3dmark 06


Who cares? It's a raw 3Dmark score. 3Dmark is for testing features, it's not a game, and games show not as good performance overall. Bungholiomark performance is for GeforceFX lovers. :roll:

Quote:
7900GS doesnt have a HD decoder and no DX10.


Which may or may not matter. Considering that the GTs you're talking about don't have HDCP support, while some of the sub $150 GF7900GSs do, you might as well forget about the HD acceleration anyways. As for DX10, still need to see if the GF8600s are even useable in DX10 games with the features turned on.
April 30, 2007 11:10:28 PM

Are you like a nvida hater or ati fan boy ? Yes the 7900GS can be overclocked but wont beat the gt oc. The 8600gts cant be really oc because its at is maximum or close to., basically from what ive read everywhere, the GTS is a GT overclocked. Lets not talk about future, ati s**K balls, months have been past and they can't even beat the gtx nothing to say about the new nvidia card that coming up. With all the money they are losing amd they wont sell video card for long, better take a extra guaranty protection. If you had a choice right now, choosing between a 7600GT or 8600GT wich one would you take ?

139$ 8600GT
119$ 7600GT
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
April 30, 2007 11:57:33 PM

Quote:
Are you like a nvida hater or ati fan boy ?


Why don't you read my posts and find out.
I recommend the GF8800GTS-320 and GF8800GTX, and for this price range I also recommend the X1950XT/X1950Pro/GF7900GS/X1950GT/X1650XT/GF7600GT all outshine their relative competition. I criticise the X1600 the way I do the GF8600, because I think both were/are underwhelming and overpriced at launch. Got a problem with the logic, then give me a counter argument that doesn't rely on points that aren't even worthy of posting.

Quote:
Yes the 7900GS can be overclocked but wont beat the gt oc.


According to what objective benchmarks?
Do you have any?

Quote:
The 8600gts cant be really oc because its at is maximum or close to., basically from what ive read everywhere, the GTS is a GT overclocked.


So what's your point then? You're saying the GT can't OC much beyond a GF8600GTS, yet the GTS loses to a reference GS more often than not, and then you can by the insane OC'ed XFX and eVGA at NewEgg as their two cheapest optons at $140. So what's your point other than proving mine that the GF7900GS can also overclock so it pull away again. Care to explain?

Quote:
Lets not talk about future, ati s**K balls,


Now who's the Fanboi? :roll:

Quote:
months have been past and they can't even beat the gtx nothing to say about the new nvidia card that coming up.


And months have passed while ATi reaped the rewards of dominating the $100-250 price range, and nV had all this time to hit the target, yet missed with the GF8600 that gets beat by cheaper cards. So really, are they so different?

Quote:
With all the money they are losing amd they wont sell video card for long, better take a extra guaranty protection.


Actually if you think about it, AMD is selling alot of video cards, and if it weren't for their ATi acquisition they'd probably have only a smattering of things interesting to people, not the X1950 and X1650 seris whic still sold well up to the questionable GF8600 launch. So considering the value of that $100-250 segment that ATi has been beating nV is, it's interesting that the GF8600 is the card nV decided to try and take it back with.

Quote:
If you had a choice right now, choosing between a 7600GT or 8600GT wich one would you take ?

139$ 8600GT
119$ 7600GT


I'd chose to shop elsewhere, since the link above has the GF8600GT for $119 and I can find the GF7600GT for under $100 on NewEgg without looking, and out of the two I'd take neither, and instead go with the X1950Pro which has HDCP and outperforms both in games for only slightly more money (less than your GF8600GT above). And even a $105 X1950GT would be more attactive for less than even the CC price;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Seriously, it doesn't take a genius to see that the GF8600 series needed to come down in price to offer any attraction to savvy buyers, and the price cut this thread was based on is just about right.
May 1, 2007 12:00:19 AM

srgess ...

You seem blinded in justifying Your purchase of the 8600gt. It looks good in 3dmark but in games it behaves inconsistently - in some it surpasses the 7900gs and in some it is severely beaten. There is no clear picture of 8600gt being better than a 7900gs with current prices and at stock settings. The point is that at the moment the <b>8600gt IS NOT GOOD VALUE</b>. Do not brag about the decoder because anyone buying a computer now (4300 is entry level, right? :)  ) can have his CPU do that.

Untill dx10 games become available - that is q4 07 - there will be many better deals on dx10 hardware with the 2600 and a possible refresh of 8600 (anyone fancy a 8650 omg edition?) and that's not even taking the 2900 vs. 8800gt possible price war in the account.
May 1, 2007 12:19:03 AM

Oh well i don't have mine at stock setting, its like buying a e4300 but only use it at stock setting. Maybe the reason that the 8600 gt is good in 3dmark 06 and not in game is the driver which s**k atm.
May 1, 2007 1:31:29 AM

Quote:
Oh well i don't have mine at stock setting, its like buying a e4300 but only use it at stock setting. Maybe the reason that the 8600 gt is good in 3dmark 06 and not in game is the driver which s**k atm.


Please do not mention 8600gt or talk about graphic cards on forums or in real life beacause that may incur the risk of a sudden reality shock. I understand that You have been saving for a long time and that 8600 is only 200 slower than a 8800, that it is a generation above the 7's and has a nice picture on the box but judging by the benchmark results and the current pricing the card is less than tempting. We all learn on mistakes.
May 1, 2007 1:48:56 AM

I did not saving for a long time for that card, i was tired to wait for ati to be reported again and again, im not gonna buy a gtx or gts 8800 because i don't know how they perform actually in DX10 and it would be a BIG waste of money because ati will make drop the price. I was tired of not playing game with my 7300GS on that rig,so i just buyed a card that actually perform pretty good in all games. When crysis will come out, im just gonna throw it away and buy the best for that game.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 1, 2007 2:16:02 AM

Quote:
I did not saving for a long time for that card, i was tired to wait for ati to be reported again and again,


Yeah whereas that GF8600 was likety-split on the market. :roll:
Talk about jumping in with both feet to avoid the problem of choices.

And that's the problem, it's not a carefully considered purchase your GF8600 was essentially an impulse buy. You didn't NEED it for a new build that needed something ASAP. So you bought a new GF8600 at the height of their price, and squeezing in before the AMD info to ensure that should they in fact launch a competant card (hey the second card to market last generation was the best and worth waiting for), then you can be oh so happy you rushed your decision in getting the #2 card.

Seriously, you complain about my objectivity, when it's clear you didn't use any to make your GF8600 decision.

I could understand if it was months we were talking about (like the G80vR600 [where I told everyone to buy a GF8800GTX and worry about later later]) or even many many weeks until info came out. But seriously the GF8600 has be out 2 weeks, and the AMD news is just about to burst onto the scene and voila must buy now because there's so little I know about either of them it's so compelling to decide today!

If Crysis wasn't even on your timeframe and you're going to throw it away anyways, then what's the value of DX10 you keep refering to?

The only strength of the card is the HD decoding and without HDCP, IMO that's a half-strength.

Like I told others, if the price in their area is different (and it may just be so in Montreal like most of Canada) then they are acceptable buys within competing price ranges/products. However, not once is that even the way you approached it, instead talking about unreleased cards sucking before you even see them. And talking about ATi's delays in a segment of the market where nv's time to market is nothing impressive. The GF8800s are not the GF8600s.

Seriously man, I know the HABs got knocked out of the playoffs by the Leafs, but if that's gonna make you grumpy all summer you really need to start thinking about watching mini-putt or ski-doo on RDS. GO Sens GO !! :twisted:
May 1, 2007 2:45:06 AM

Quote:
I did not saving for a long time for that card, i was tired to wait for ati to be reported again and again, im not gonna buy a gtx or gts 8800 because i don't know how they perform actually in DX10 and it would be a BIG waste of money because ati will make drop the price. I was tired of not playing game with my 7300GS on that rig,so i just buyed a card that actually perform pretty good in all games. When crysis will come out, im just gonna throw it away and buy the best for that game.
The difference being that the 8800GTX and GTS don't suck. :lol: 
May 1, 2007 3:52:22 AM

Quote:

And that's the problem, it's not a carefully considered purchase your GF8600 was essentially an impulse buy. You didn't NEED it for a new build that needed something ASAP. So you bought a new GF8600 at the height of their price, and squeezing in before the AMD info to ensure that should they in fact launch a competant card (hey the second card to market last generation was the best and worth waiting for), then you can be oh so happy you rushed your decision in getting the #2 card.

Oh man do I know about a new build needing a new card ASAP - I put this one together initially with an old PCI card that couldn't go past 1024x768 @ 16 bit color because I only had AGP cards (GF7800GS and the trusty old ATI 9800Pro) other than the old PCI card (lifted from a K6-2 to date it).

So my solution was this: to buy the EVGA 8800GTS-320 from CC. That leaves me three options:
1) keep it and eat the extra 10 bucks it cost over Newegg (which is really lost in the grand scale of the new build).
2) take it back if DAAMIT shows me something of X2900XT to convince me to go without a desktop for a few weeks while I wait for the release(Pentium M with Radeon Mobility 9800 rox!). By buying it in a brick&mortar store I don't have to deal with restocking fees like buying online.
3) step up to GTX/8900/whatever where the extra 10 bucks I spent versus Newegg will get absorbed from increased tradein value since they base it on price paid.

I thought (briefly) about the 8600GT on sale but then thought no way, at least the 8800GTS has a shot at being a long term solution.
May 1, 2007 10:50:56 AM

Quote:

Seriously man, I know the HABs got knocked out of the playoffs by the Leafs, but if that's gonna make you grumpy all summer you really need to start thinking about watching mini-putt or ski-doo on RDS. GO Sens GO !! :twisted:



What the point of bringing that into this topic ? What tell you i am a hockey fan ? Well i am not, is that what you do, try to insult people randomly ? I guess you did in rl and you got rocket and you came here, because to have 18 000 post and with your attitude you must have no life.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 1, 2007 3:37:12 PM

Quote:

What the point of bringing that into this topic ?


Humour, et c'est la même en Français. :roll:

Quote:
What tell you i am a hockey fan ?


Hey I didn't say you were a hockey fan I said you were a Habs fan, not the same thing really. :wink:

Quote:
Well i am not, is that what you do, try to insult people randomly ?


Oh would that be like your Fanboi comment above? Seriously give your head a shake man. I can understand why you'd take being a Habs fan as an insult, but you're far from innocent here, but you may be 'un pauvre innocent' which would explain your naivete.

Quote:
I guess you did in rl and you got rocket and you came here,


Sure whatever that means, I need to find my hanglish dictionary.

Quote:
because to have 18 000 post and with your attitude you must have no life.


First of all that would be 14,000 posts, but based on your posts in this thread I'm already aware you're not good with numbers.

As for my post count, hey, I can multi-task, ie post while at work or while watching Heros last night; while you on the other hand really have difficulty with just the one task.
As for my life, yeah it's hard deciding to go skiing or golfing on the weekends and going out to watch the games at the pubs or here on the big screen at work.

Yep, life's tough. :twisted:
May 1, 2007 3:45:51 PM

It's the internet people, try not to get your panties in a bunch.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 1, 2007 3:58:01 PM

I don't wear panties !!

I use a thong; and really, there's nothing to bunch, just the occasional flossing.... errr.... too much information ?

Sorry !! :twisted:
!