which option?

[flexo786]

hi
over the last couple of days ive been researching parts and have now got 3 options. which is the best?

option 1-
core 2 duo e4300 1.86ghz-
asus P5N-E SLI 650i atx
kingston 1gig ddr2 667 cl6 1.8v
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/091121
Point Of View 7600GT 256mb DDR3 PCI-E graphics card
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/106578
total is £216 roughly

option 2
core 2 duo e4300 1.86ghz-
asrock conroe945g dvi
kingston 1gig ddr2 667 cl6 1.8v
Point Of View 7600GT 256mb DDR3 PCI-E graphics card
total is £188 roughly

option 3 is an am2 system.

im leaning towards option 1 as the motherboard is supposed to have a good range of overclocking features which is something i intend to do. i would be happy with a 2.6ghz overclock.
my question is is it worth paying £28 more for that board or should i use that to get a an e6420 and stick with option 2 and forget about overclocking

at the moment my budget is £200 and i can stretch it for option 1 but if i was to wait till june/july i should have another £100 probally more.

 

[Shadow703793]

I would go with option 1 and the extra $ is worth it.

 

[alcattle]

I will vote for none of the above. Option one is closet to what you should buy, with these changes
I would suggest a different motherboard but my choice is £30 more.
Kingston 2x512 PC5300
Same RAM but two sticks give the added dual channel speed. It is also £1 less.

 

[akhilles]

2.8? Are you pu??y? just kidding. I started out at 1333 fsb or 333fsb or 3ghz, & went up to 3.25ghz something stable on open table. Now back at 3ghz in my case.

The thing about p5n-e sli is that there's no cooling on the south bridge (i put a ZM-NB47J on it which has been awesome since the amd 2500+ era, see how long it has lasted) & the nb cooler is crap at best. Any serious o/c'er would replace it with a better one. The one i've been eyeing on is a thermalright sli one which can hold an 80mm fan. Once you get decent cooling for both of them, you can go far. Even 500fsb. I've seen the discussions & results elsewhere.

Also, p5n-e sli has a terrible vdroop. MSI P6N SLI would be a better choice, but its o/c options are not as great. For more 650i & 680i overclockabilities, see:

http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2964&p=12

For more e4300/6300 overclockabilities, etc., see & the next page:

http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2964&p=5

 

[flexo786]

hi
couple of more questions
-is it still worth buying the 512 pair if i plan on buying more 1 gig sticks later on? what is the benefit of 2 512 sticks?
-is this the cooler you are on about that you put on the southbridge
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Zalman-ZM-NB4...oryZ3673QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem
if so was it easy to mount?
-This will be the first time im overclocking and plan on doing it when i feel i need an increase in performance. is it true that higher overclocks make the chip die more quicker as i plan on keeping this system for bout 2 years minium
-will everything in the system work toghether or is something inccompatable.
-also what is vdrop
thanks for your help by the way

 

[akhilles]

vdroop

http://www.thetechrepository.com/showthread.php?t=126

If you don't wanna read through that, i'm gonna oversimplify it to this: vdroop is cpu voltage drop that is bad for overclocking which requires stable voltage. i.e. 1.3v for cpu will go down & up. I think Intel put it in place to protect the cpu from overvoltage/overheating.

P5N-E SLI is notorous for terrible vdroop. There's a mod that will void the warranty to reduce the vdroop.

MSI P6N SLI has very little vdroop, however, its o/c options aren't as good as P5N-E SLI.

Nothing is perfect. We deal with the imperfection.

I don't regret my mobo purchase. It's been rock solid since day 1.

Yes, that's the one. I'm using the blue zalman heatsink cuz I don';t have a better one yet. The one I'm gonna buy is Thermalright HR-05-SLI, which is compatible with any SLI mobo. Can have 2 installed.

http://www.thermalright.com/a_page/main_product_hr05sli.htm

I suggest you get a 2 x 1 gig sticks dual channel kit. I never suggested 2 x 512mb. The only benefit is it'll pass a memory test in a shorter time than 2+ gigs. This is the best bang for the buck:

http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/106133/rb/27398564787

Overclocking will void the warranty & shorten the lifespan of a component. It's up to you.

 

[flexo786]

thanks for that. its helping me make my decision but i have a couple of more questions
-is a gigabyte d3 better and also how do you know what revision it is.
-if i intend to overclock i only plan on doing it to minium 2.7. are there any cheap boards around £40-50 that could do this
-is it better to spend £45 on a core2duo e6420 and then buy a normal board
thanks for any answers and sorry if im asking to many questions as this is the first time im buying my own pc and would like to get it right

 

[alcattle]

Maybe you should relist what the build looks like now, and then what choices you are still thinking about. Hard to tell you if the DS3 is better when we can't tell better than what.

 

[flexo786]

-i mean is the ds3 better then the asus p5n-e if i wont be using sli as im not really into games on pc yet
-also would i be able to overclock on option 2 at all
-are there any shops in the u.k that sell boards based on the P35 CHIPSET
and finaly will the ds3 or asus support intel 45mm processors

 

[alcattle]

Both are good boards. I would get the cheaper one if it has the features you need.
The 945 chipset is not very good and most of the MB built with it are MicroATX. O/C will not be as good as the other choices.
Not sure what a P35 cheapset is.
They both added support for faster FSB and Quads. Not up on what all the 45mm CPU will bring

 

[flexo786]

When looking at the ds3 board how do you know what revision it is and also is there a diffrence between ds3 and ds3p

 

[akhilles]

With P5N-E SLI it may be a hassle for you to replace the northbridge heatsink & add a southbridge one.

Forgot to say that installing the Zalman cooler is not hard. Just adjust it to fit the holes. It's very flexible in that it will fit almost any chipset with 2 holes in the opposite corners. Many coolers with fixed mounting clips won't fit in some mobos.

I suggest you get a DS3, but you'll have to spend a bit more on fast ram. That's the thing with overclocking 965P. And I'd have to say that 965P is harder to overclock than 650i/680i cuz you must o/c cpu & ram at the same time at a ratio. And to get 1:1 ratio, you need very good quality ram. Not value ram. Not generic. That's why I switched from 965P to 6x0i. Not only do I save money on ram, but also o/c the cpu easily.

DS3 has both ok northbridge heatsink & southbridge one & is ready for overclocking. It's a proven overclocker. The capacitors are high quality & will last a long while.

45nm/65nm/90nm has nothing to do with the cpu sockets. Yep, 45nm socket 775 will fit the current s775 mobos. However, a bios update MAY be necessary for the mobo to recognize the cpu. Same for my e4300, some older mobos may not see it right.

I don't know how to see the DS3 revision. Probably it's printed on the label in a corner of the box at the last minute.

 

[alcattle]

The newer DS3 has a white box with Supports QUAD Processors and Supports 1333 FSB in a smaller blue box in the corner. If you get it from Newegg, buy the one that is not listed as rev 1.3, costs $5-10 more.

 

[senor_bob]

Not sure what a P35 cheapset is.

P35 is Intel's upcoming replacement (Bearlake chipset) for the P965. No boards using it are on the market yet. The first are expected to hit within the month.

When looking at the ds3 board how do you know what revision it is and also is there a diffrence between ds3 and ds3p

The DS3P has an extra PCIe x16 slot (that runs at x4) for some goofy crossfire setup. It's not available in US or Canada so that's about all I know about it.

I suggest you get a DS3, but you'll have to spend a bit more on fast ram. That's the thing with overclocking 965P. And I'd have to say that 965P is harder to overclock than 650i/680i cuz you must o/c cpu & ram at the same time at a ratio. And to get 1:1 ratio, you need very good quality ram. Not value ram. Not generic. That's why I switched from 965P to 6x0i. Not only do I save money on ram, but also o/c the cpu easily.

Or you can just go for a higher mutiplier CPU like the E4400 (or E6700, but I think that's out of the OP's price range). I actually hit 4 GHz on my E6700 with DDR2-667 Kingston ValueRAM on a DS3, but the temperatures were higher than I liked so I backed down, and settled at just running the RAM at rated speed. Oddly enough, my cheap RAM was perfectly happy running at 800 MHz with only a 0.1 V boost. But with my sample of one, maybe I just got lucky.

I also agree with the recommendation of the DS3, great board.

 

[flexo786]

so if i justed wanted to overclock to minium of 2.7ghz would it be better to get the ds3 with ddr2 667 ram or should i get the asus P5N-E baord with the same ram.I dont reali want to change the ram or cpu as im getting them for less then retail price. the price diffrence between the board is £3 but the ds3 is not in stock so ill have to wait a couple of weeks

 

[alcattle]

go with the cheaper setup not much difference and you will be happy either way

 

[flexo786]

if i was to get a ds3 would i be able to overclock with the ram i got or will i be better off with a 650i chipset

 

[alcattle]

akhilles said it all

I suggest you get a DS3, but you'll have to spend a bit more on fast ram. That's the thing with overclocking 965P. And I'd have to say that 965P is harder to overclock than 650i/680i cuz you must o/c cpu & ram at the same time at a ratio. And to get 1:1 ratio, you need very good quality ram. Not value ram. Not generic. That's why I switched from 965P to 6x0i. Not only do I save money on ram, but also o/c the cpu easily.

 

[flexo786]

So If I was to get a 650i board will the msi p6n be better then the asus p5n-e

 

[Shadow703793]

Check this out.http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/GUIDE-GHz-Core-Duo-Budget-System-456-Overclock-ftopict234760.html
A $456 set up if u r going for a new budget PC.

 

[akhilles]

So If I was to get a 650i board will the msi p6n be better then the asus p5n-e

MSI P6N SLI-FI (the cheap version) is good for budding overclockers as it has both ok north & south bridge coolers & ok o/c options.

http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=P6N_SLI-FI&class=mb

P5N-E SLI is good for non-overclockers & those overclockers who know what they're doing. If you do no to mild o/c, the stock chipset cooling is fine. I'm getting the best air cooling cuz I want to get the most out of it.

 

[flexo786]

got one final question will i be better off with any of the below rams instead of the kingston/corsair value ram

OCZ 512MB DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 Platinum Revision 2 CL 4-4-4-15--works out £40 for 2 sticks

OCZ 512MB DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 ATI CrossFire Certified Edition memory CL 4-4-4-15--works out £35 for 2 sticks
also will the above ram work with my baord even though its cross fire certified

 

[akhilles]

Yes, they will work with any socket 775 or AM2 mobos. Yes, they'll be faster than 667mhz. However, whether you'll be better off with those or not is up to you. In my case, I look for the cheapest available ram since I'm not overclocking the ram.

I said it in another thread that OCZ/Corsair is overrated. There's a lot of good stuff beside them. Kingston (works out of the box), G.Skill, Cruicial, etc. are underrated. If I were to o/c ram, I'd get the one that I could afford. Dorminator, etc. etc. are WAY overpriced. G.Skill HZ, for example, among many others has the same D9 chips for much less.

Finally, CF/Sli certified ram is not a big deal. It's a nice extra. Not a must. If you can get them cheap, by all means. Don't waste too much money on ram. You'll be looking at your monitor & using your keyboard/mouse the whole time.

Edit: regarding 512mb single sticks: most of the time they will run in dual channel. If they won't, performance may take a bit of beating. It's always best to buy a dual-channel kit or two as both sticks are tested to run in DC.