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Article: AMD's Large Debt Mounting Up Fast

Last response: in CPUs
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April 30, 2007 1:28:04 PM

Not to add to the doom and gloom, but the listed debt is only a part of the problem.

There are literally hundreds of millions to billions in off-balance sheet obligations. Most of these related to contractual capex spending. Read the fine print in the 10-K, it's about 1.8-$2B a year (numbers off the top of my head).
April 30, 2007 1:31:26 PM

Posted already.
April 30, 2007 1:36:45 PM

If their debt pile builds up higher, their stock price wont have enough room to drop any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111!!one

Thats as funny as it can get, sorry. :roll:
April 30, 2007 2:01:55 PM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:

one day you'll grow up and learn to write constructive posts..........Maybe :roll:
April 30, 2007 2:28:29 PM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:



GTFO you delusional c*nt.
April 30, 2007 2:46:40 PM

Nice one, captain obvious.
a b à CPUs
April 30, 2007 2:51:47 PM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:


I don't give these posts much publicity normally. Although the article makes for a good case one cannot help but notice that this seems to be a cycle AMD always goes through.

When Intel has the top product AMD almost dies. This is of course due to the fact that AMD are the smaller of the two companies by a WIDE margin.
April 30, 2007 3:29:11 PM

I think AMD is going to be ok, or at least not going out of business. All they have to do is service their interest payments, not pay off the debt outright. Kind of like you and I making the minimum payment on our credit card bills. When Barcy gets out, AMD will be in a much better competitive position and will at least stop losing money, bringing in new cash to service their interest payments. How much cash, I don't know. I'll let more knowledgeable posters make that prediction. As for the convertible senior notes that they just sold to raise $2.2B, they don't need to pay back one red cent until their stock hits $42 (according to the article linked by the OP). That's $2.2B to tide them over (for interest payments and operational cash). And if and when the stock hits $42, I am sure they will be a much stronger company and be in even better shape to handle their debt. So I don't think either AMD or (obviously) Intel is going out of business anytime soon. I say, don't feel sorry for either company, they're both in business to make money, period. Best thing you can do is buy the processor that gives you the best performance for your money, regardless of which company makes it. After all, that's how we keep them honest, and how the free market works, right? Let's play ball!
April 30, 2007 3:38:10 PM

Stating the obvious, but Barcelona better be competitive or I smell some sort of restructuring. Maybe spin ATI back off again. I don't think R600 is even a big factor for DAAMIT's big picture.

I'm sort of divided here between between being more concerned for Tony Soprano's mounting debts or AMD's. Hopefully Amd's big gamble pays off.
Sorry, Sopranos always sticks in my head the next day. :roll:
April 30, 2007 3:41:15 PM

Quote:
Stating the obvious, but Barcelona better be competitive or I smell some sort of restructuring. Maybe spin ATI back off again. I don't think R600 is even a big factor for DAAMIT's big picture.

I'm sort of divided here between between being more concerned for Tony Soprano's mounting debts or AMD's. Hopefully Amd's big gamble pays off.
Sorry, Sopranos always sticks in my head the next day. :roll:
There both soap operas now. :wink:
April 30, 2007 4:59:17 PM

Quote:
I think AMD is going to be ok, or at least not going out of business. All they have to do is service their interest payments, not pay off the debt outright. Kind of like you and I making the minimum payment on our credit card bills. When Barcy gets out, AMD will be in a much better competitive position and will at least stop losing money, bringing in new cash to service their interest payments. How much cash, I don't know. I'll let more knowledgeable posters make that prediction. As for the convertible senior notes that they just sold to raise $2.2B, they don't need to pay back one red cent until their stock hits $42 (according to the article linked by the OP). That's $2.2B to tide them over (for interest payments and operational cash). And if and when the stock hits $42, I am sure they will be a much stronger company and be in even better shape to handle their debt. So I don't think either AMD or (obviously) Intel is going out of business anytime soon. I say, don't feel sorry for either company, they're both in business to make money, period. Best thing you can do is buy the processor that gives you the best performance for your money, regardless of which company makes it. After all, that's how we keep them honest, and how the free market works, right? Let's play ball!


Under the loan covenants with MS (Morgan Stanley not the other MS) for the ATI purchase AMD would have to pay back $1.1B of the debt from the ATI purchase (This may have been negotiated downward to some other figure since MS is doing the bond offer but we have not heard yet). So after paying off MS the net increase in their debt is only $1.1B plus expenses of a couple million for the bond offering (probably a total of $1.4B). The net cash to AMD from the bond sale is likely to be around $800M which should last until Mid 2008 if AMD reduces their CAPEX and overhead as planned. The latest $611M quarterly loss is unlikely to be repeated even though sales are expected to drop next quarter because of planned inventory reductions.
April 30, 2007 5:52:13 PM

Quote:
Stating the obvious, but Barcelona better be competitive or I smell some sort of restructuring. Maybe spin ATI back off again. I don't think R600 is even a big factor for DAAMIT's big picture.

I'm sort of divided here between between being more concerned for Tony Soprano's mounting debts or AMD's. Hopefully Amd's big gamble pays off.
Sorry, Sopranos always sticks in my head the next day. :roll:


:)  It's easy to feel compassion for T, but then I remember he IS a stone-cold killer. He deserves whatever death he gets in the coming months.
April 30, 2007 9:52:49 PM



Any one want to bother logining in and replying to Xavian that AMD is not floating the 2.2 billion in senior bonds to "....build more fabs"

AMD is floating the bonds to survive 2007 without declaring BK. 8O Build more Fabs Ha, Ha, Ha, thats a good one. :lol:  :lol: 
May 1, 2007 12:10:09 AM

Quote:
I think AMD is going to be ok, or at least not going out of business. All they have to do is service their interest payments, not pay off the debt outright. Kind of like you and I making the minimum payment on our credit card bills. When Barcy gets out, AMD will be in a much better competitive position and will at least stop losing money, bringing in new cash to service their interest payments. How much cash, I don't know. I'll let more knowledgeable posters make that prediction. As for the convertible senior notes that they just sold to raise $2.2B, they don't need to pay back one red cent until their stock hits $42 (according to the article linked by the OP). That's $2.2B to tide them over (for interest payments and operational cash). And if and when the stock hits $42, I am sure they will be a much stronger company and be in even better shape to handle their debt. So I don't think either AMD or (obviously) Intel is going out of business anytime soon. I say, don't feel sorry for either company, they're both in business to make money, period. Best thing you can do is buy the processor that gives you the best performance for your money, regardless of which company makes it. After all, that's how we keep them honest, and how the free market works, right? Let's play ball!


I think AMD is far from OK, if they don't blow Intel's 45 nm offerings out of the water, they will not make good profits on their 65 nm investment which means AMD will not have money to invest in 45 nm and and pay off debt. Simply put, Hector bet the company on 1) buying ATI and 2) Barcelona both benefits are yet to show yet. The next 6 months will tell for sure though as Intel is not standing still and neither Nvidia. AMD is in a way much tougher spot than anytime in the past in contrary to what some people want to believe in terms of a major pinch point in their history. Their business model is crrently flawed, and that's why they have an executive task force trying to fix it, headed by your truely Hector :?
May 1, 2007 12:27:16 AM

Quote:
done.



Quote:
And to keep their booties afloat while they tinker with designs and accidentally find an architecture that works.




:lol:  :lol:  :lol: 

That is just sooooooo mean! :lol: 
May 1, 2007 12:42:56 AM

I found this incredibly stupid statement in the comments section:
Quote:

A fair point...but AMD finished converting all new manufacturing to 65nm/300mm (all wafers at Fab 36, more than 50% of production now, are 65nm) last month...and many of those new lines are already spitting out K10s. AMD expects to be 100% K10 by this time next year.
This is EXTREMELY fast (Intel is only 40% C2D at the moment).

Que?
May 1, 2007 1:18:00 AM

Quote:
I found this incredibly stupid statement in the comments section:

A fair point...but AMD finished converting all new manufacturing to 65nm/300mm (all wafers at Fab 36, more than 50% of production now, are 65nm) last month...and many of those new lines are already spitting out K10s. AMD expects to be 100% K10 by this time next year.
This is EXTREMELY fast (Intel is only 40% C2D at the moment).

Que?
that comment is exactly the same as claiming "following Vista's launch, 64bit transition will be completed in several months".

Wishful thinking...
May 1, 2007 1:21:39 AM

AMD isn't even fully on 65nm. Methinks that poster read too much Shakirou.
May 1, 2007 1:23:27 AM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:
WORD!
May 1, 2007 1:27:40 AM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:



GTFO you delusional c*nt.Dude, come on, show a little respect to the ladies, she deserves an apology.
May 1, 2007 4:02:45 AM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:



GTFO you delusional c*nt.Dude, come on, show a little respect to the ladies, she deserves an apology.

Viper

MrsBytch isnt a lady. IT is MMM...MadModMike, a semi-reformed former horde acolyte who was banned from THG forums, and now logs in under the puppets MrsD, MrdBytch, and one or 2 others I cant even remember anymore.
May 1, 2007 6:52:44 AM

Quote:
I found this incredibly stupid statement in the comments section:

A fair point...but AMD finished converting all new manufacturing to 65nm/300mm (all wafers at Fab 36, more than 50% of production now, are 65nm) last month...and many of those new lines are already spitting out K10s. AMD expects to be 100% K10 by this time next year.
This is EXTREMELY fast (Intel is only 40% C2D at the moment).

Que?

The aforementioned idiot (NOT DaSickNinja) must be (wrongly) assuming that all or most of AMD's 65nm Fabs are dedicated to "spitting out K-10s". Except for two things..

1). This would completely contradict AMDs track-record of not putting anything into full-production until immediately before (like 3-4 WEEKS) the first OEM releases. Personally, I'd be surprised if AMD has even reached "final-wafer" state, where the last details of production are 'locked-in'. Usually, engineering samples (ES's) are drawn from this process, since they are the closest to actual production dies.

2). Why would ANY business be spending most of it's time and resources 'warehousing' chip-sets, when it could be manufacturing chips that it can sell right now? You can bet you're bibby probably ALL of the 65nm production is Brisbane's, especially considering all the OEM contracts they still have outstanding..

Quote:
Speaking of our good doctor, did you happen by his blog today.... he sites a Newegg user review as proof of "K8 fraggin' a C2D"


What's next? Wikipedia is ALWAYS 100% true? And the Inquirer and Fudzilla always report the COMPLETE UNBIASED truth?
Pfffffffth.. :roll:
May 1, 2007 7:20:23 AM

Quote:
I found this incredibly stupid statement in the comments section:

A fair point...but AMD finished converting all new manufacturing to 65nm/300mm (all wafers at Fab 36, more than 50% of production now, are 65nm) last month...and many of those new lines are already spitting out K10s. AMD expects to be 100% K10 by this time next year.
This is EXTREMELY fast (Intel is only 40% C2D at the moment).

Que?

The aforementioned idiot (NOT DaSickNinja) must be (wrongly) assuming that all or most of AMD's 65nm Fabs are dedicated to "spitting out K-10s". Except for two things..

1). This would completely contradict AMDs track-record of not putting anything into full-production until immediately before (like 3-4 WEEKS) the first OEM releases. Personally, I'd be surprised if AMD has even reached "final-wafer" state, where the last details of production are 'locked-in'. Usually, engineering samples (ES's) are drawn from this process, since they are the closest to actual production dies.

2). Why would ANY business be spending most of it's time and resources 'warehousing' chip-sets, when it could be manufacturing chips that it can sell right now? You can bet you're bibby probably ALL of the 65nm production is Brisbane's, especially considering all the OEM contracts they still have outstanding..

Quote:
Speaking of our good doctor, did you happen by his blog today.... he sites a Newegg user review as proof of "K8 fraggin' a C2D"


What's next? Wikipedia is ALWAYS 100% true? And the Inquirer and Fudzilla always report the COMPLETE UNBIASED truth?
Pfffffffth.. :roll:So cynical!!..............J/K :wink:
May 1, 2007 2:00:04 PM

Quote:
AMD isn't even fully on 65nm. Methinks that poster read too much Shakirou.


Speaking of our good doctor, did you happen by his blog today.... he sites a Newegg user review as proof of "K8 fraggin' a C2D" ;) 

I thought quoting casewhite as hilarious, but this goes beyond the brink of despair...
I read it, reread it, though it was a mistake, and just left muttering in disbelief.
May 1, 2007 2:01:01 PM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:



GTFO you delusional c*nt.Dude, come on, show a little respect to the ladies, she deserves an apology.

If you think I'm going to apologize, then you're a delusional c*nt too.
May 1, 2007 4:45:29 PM

Quote:
And nothing to show for it yet :lol:  :lol:  Not even a low end gfx card. :lol:  :lol:  I think they all went to vegas and got some hookers. :lol: 


Nahhh, they didn't do that....

One of two things will happen --- this gets them through the 'perfect storm' and recovery will be over the course of a couple of years (this is a huge amount to pay back with the profits AMD has shown historically).

Or

They go bankrupt, and MS takes ownership of the company...

I believe the former will happen.

where have you been?
it has always historically been walmart that buys amd not MS.
you are a bad man! :wink:


Attention associates we need a laser cutter alignment in aisle 6. :lol: 
May 1, 2007 4:57:21 PM

AMD Financing Terms: Even Stranger Than Expected (AMD)
http://www.streetinsider.com/Contributors/AMD+Financing...(AMD)/2155871.html

Can anybody provide insight into the significance of "AMD agrees to file a shelf registration statement" referenced in the article? What is a shelf registration statement? :?
May 1, 2007 5:43:46 PM

Quote:
One day you all will grow up and get lives.......Maybe. :roll:
I tend to worry only about my debt, I could care less about some companies. When you buy a 5 billion dollar company and you dont have 5 billion dollars. You go into debt. No news here. :idea:

Well, considering they (AMD) spent virtually all of their cash on a company (ATI) that has not helped them make money it does seem like a bad investment for now. I think AMDs dramatic financial decline is big news... bigger than big.
May 1, 2007 5:47:50 PM

Quote:
AMD Financing Terms: Even Stranger Than Expected (AMD)
http://www.streetinsider.com/Contributors/AMD+Financing...(AMD)/2155871.html

Can anybody provide insight into the significance of "AMD agrees to file a shelf registration statement" referenced in the article? What is a shelf registration statement? :?


A shelf registration statement is a filing with the SEC to register an offering (stock) usually when there is no present intention of selling the stock being registered. As I understand it, this means that AMD wants to create a large number of stock shares, but it is not expressing that it will put the shares up for sale. This may have a relationship to the stockholders meeting later this month in which the AMD management will be asking the stockholders to approve the issuance of new stock.

Other than that, AMD is in deep trouble and is grasping for straws in an effort to remain solvent. They need to release products fast in order to get some cash flow and pay bills. The fact that they keep delaying product releases and keep refusing to talk about such products causes fear that they may either have nothing to sell or that the products will be failures on the marketplace. Keep tuned for later this month when the NDAs come off the 2900 series cards. Then we will know more.
May 1, 2007 7:37:42 PM

Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?
May 1, 2007 7:42:34 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?
If you don't like it....there are many other active threads, that you can share your genius in. :x
May 1, 2007 8:01:44 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?


AMD makes CPUs, so why isn't this appropriate discussion? I suppose we could compare benchmarks of the K10 architecture... oh, wait... ummmm... never mind!
May 1, 2007 8:14:58 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?


Some of us own/have owned/will own AMD stock and care about more than why we have no benchmarks from AMD.
May 1, 2007 8:19:34 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?
If you don't like it....there are many other active threads, that you can share your genius in. :x

Wow. You pegged me for a genius by reading three sentences. I am impressed. This is supposed to be a CPU forum, to discuss CPU's. NOT financial and stock data. That can be had at countless other sites. This thread is a waste of bandwidth and disk space and it's only purpose is for raving Intel fanbois to get their digital rocks off. In other words, flamebait. Looks like THG is more concerned with post counts than they are with staying on topic and limiting crap posts. Don't like my posts? Then don't read them and keep your useless opinions to yourself.
May 1, 2007 8:21:35 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?


Some of us own/have owned/will own AMD stock and care about more than why we have no benchmarks from AMD.

Fine. That is a valid point. BUT. This is NOT the place for such discussions. There are countless stock and financial web sites out there for just such topics.
May 1, 2007 8:23:28 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?


AMD makes CPUs, so why isn't this appropriate discussion? I suppose we could compare benchmarks of the K10 architecture... oh, wait... ummmm... never mind!

Again, this is NOT the place. As for the rest of your reply, I have had my fill of fanboi flamebaiting. From either side.
May 1, 2007 8:47:42 PM

Quote:


Again, this is NOT the place. As for the rest of your reply, I have had my fill of fanboi flamebaiting. From either side.



The successes and failures of AMD directly affect the CPU market place. There are plenty of threads in the CPU section that don't belong here, go attack them, not this perfectly valid thread.
May 1, 2007 9:01:53 PM

Quote:


Again, this is NOT the place. As for the rest of your reply, I have had my fill of fanboi flamebaiting. From either side.



The successes and failures of AMD directly affect the CPU market place. There are plenty of threads in the CPU section that don't belong here, go attack them, not this perfectly valid thread.

You said it yourself. "marketplace". This is SUPPOSED to be a tech forum, not a financial page and either way it's flamebait, not a valid thread. After having looked around a bit, I can see the THG could care less about moderating this forum and if the hordes of Fanbois post tons of off topic threads, NO PROBLEM! It keeps the post count up! Meanwhile the ratio of crap vs actual on topic threads is retarded. Ah, to have back the THG of 1998 and 1999.
May 1, 2007 9:06:47 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?
If you don't like it....there are many other active threads, that you can share your genius in. :x

Wow. You pegged me for a genius by reading three sentences. I am impressed. This is supposed to be a CPU forum, to discuss CPU's. NOT financial and stock data. That can be had at countless other sites. This thread is a waste of bandwidth and disk space and it's only purpose is for raving Intel fanbois to get their digital rocks off. In other words, flamebait. Looks like THG is more concerned with post counts than they are with staying on topic and limiting crap posts. Don't like my posts? Then don't read them and keep your useless opinions to yourself.Just like i said to you. Obviously, you think your opinion is Gospel....as you joined just to bitch. Go away, little boy. :roll:
May 1, 2007 9:24:43 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?
If you don't like it....there are many other active threads, that you can share your genius in. :x

Wow. You pegged me for a genius by reading three sentences. I am impressed. This is supposed to be a CPU forum, to discuss CPU's. NOT financial and stock data. That can be had at countless other sites. This thread is a waste of bandwidth and disk space and it's only purpose is for raving Intel fanbois to get their digital rocks off. In other words, flamebait. Looks like THG is more concerned with post counts than they are with staying on topic and limiting crap posts. Don't like my posts? Then don't read them and keep your useless opinions to yourself.Just like i said to you. Obviously, you think your opinion is Gospel....as you joined just to bitch. Go away, little boy. :roll:


Actually, all of my other posts have been quite on topic and genial, so your assertion that I just joined to bitch has just been squashed. I took exception to this drivel and flame bait. My opinion is just that opinion, as to the FACT that this thread is off topic and out of place is just that, fact.

I am neither little nor a boy. Keep your keyboard bravery to yourself. Your "parts" are still the same size. As for me, I was building computers, fixing mainframes and writing code in 1977. If you had asked that, you wouldn't look like such an ass for calling me a little boy. 'Nuff said, thats far too much fanboi for me today. Run along now, I am sure there are other ways for you to indulge your "mine is bigger than yours" fetish.
May 1, 2007 9:32:55 PM

Quote:
Is this a CPU forum or a stock tip and accounting fan forum? Why are threads like this allowed to stay? Are there no moderators?


Some of us own/have owned/will own AMD stock and care about more than why we have no benchmarks from AMD.

Fine. That is a valid point. BUT. This is NOT the place for such discussions. There are countless stock and financial web sites out there for just such topics.

True there are but they are populated by people that only care about making money buying long or selling short not what is made or how it is made. This happens to be a thread in a forum of computer enthusiasts for those that happen to trade computer manufacturers stocks. If you don't like the topic don't stop by since the thread is plainly for those interested in financials.
May 1, 2007 9:34:22 PM

For someone who doesn't seem to like the thread, you have spent an awful lot of time in it.

Don't be part of the thread, if it upsets you so much. No one is forcing you to read something that you think has no place in the forum.

What is the problem then? The fact that this thread is about AMD's finicial troubles, or that it just seems negative to you? Again, don't add your own comments to something you deem unneeded. There are others who seemingly enjoy participating in the thread.
May 1, 2007 10:01:44 PM

Quote:
Sometimes you have to be careful when selecting a new name for yourself... For instance, let's say you have chosen the nickname "Fly Head." Normally you would think that "fly Head" would mean a person who has beautiful swept-back features, as if flying through the air. But think again. Couldn't it also mean "having a head like a fly"? I'm afraid some people might actually think that instead.


That means he is a Necrophiliac born in 1967 or it's his 1967'th name since he was originally banned as Necro? As he aggressively posts like a kid I would go for the latter.
May 2, 2007 1:07:07 AM

Judging by the alternating cApS in his name he is obviously l33t. I would avoid provoking him further, he might be a ninja.
May 2, 2007 1:46:57 AM

Just curious, how did the name of this thread change from "AMD's large debt mounting fast" to "WTF???"?

I noticed today that AMD is down to 13.50. Ok Vern, how long before it hits the 12's? And how low does it go before its safe to buy again?
May 2, 2007 1:53:17 AM

Vern didn't change the title, necro changed the subject line to "WTF???", hence the new subject line so far.
!