vista extremely slow to copy files-- microsoft -please fix

[dsharp9000]

http://techxpress.wordpress.com/2007/04/29/vista-slow-file-copydeletemove-vista-the-woe-starts-now/

http://forums.microsoft.com/technet/showpost.aspx?postid=1358057&siteid=17&sb=0&d=1&at=7&ft=11&tf=0&pageid=0

edit---- add the following:

Microsofts official position as of may 15th in an email to a tech article stated:

"Finding the root cause of issues like this and identifying a solution is of the utmost priority for Microsoft. That said, crafting a fix and fully testing it - to be sure we are not introducing other problems - takes time. This is why Microsoft makes hot fixes available, and while we understand that hot fixes are not a perfect solution, they can help people get by while we perfect the long term solution"-- end quote

here is link to article:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/05/15/vistas_long_goodbye_continues/

one user quoted in above article stated:

"I just wanted to say...that I have tried everything ...in this section..till yesterday (May 13 2007) and none of it worked," a user who goes by the name SR_1976 posted today in a Microsoft TechNet forum discussing the glitch. "I have tried my best to work with Vista ....did not work...so, gone back to XP...and all my problems are gone. Vista was more stable than XP (for me...)and does have some good features...but enough is enough.." (The discussion, by the way, is the longest TechNet thread we've ever seen.)"- end quote

the article also states:

"Microsoft issued a hotfix, but it appears it was designed to repair a problem other than the one at hand"

 

[dblD]

Hi dsharp9000,

I just posted this same message in that other thread that you said the same things in... I just didn't want you to be really embarrassed everywhere at the same time since Zoron says you probably do not really know about the things in those links.

bye
--DD

all i want is for microsoft to fix this

Oh, with that comment, I thought he was a Vista user and was trying to find a real solution to a problem. I don't really think I have any problems, my puter seems to run purty good, I just wanted to know what things to look for. Thanks.

I am sorry dsharp9000, I didn't mean to embarrass you.

 

[dsharp9000]

It is true that have not moved to vista yet --- but some of my clients have and it takes forever to move/copy files with vista --- trying to resolve problem for them--- have found a work around for now --- but is work around --- would like microsoft to fix. The following comments --- taken from the microsoft tech forum summarize the issue:

tech forum comment:

"total time to copy files was about 4 hours.I have disabled differential file transfer. I am running all the latest drivers,I never got under 23 min 20 sec to go (with about 100mb of files)The copy speed is a joke- end quote"

Another tech forum comment:

"I just wanted to say...that I have tried everything...in this section..till yesterday (May 13 2007) and none of it worked. On top of all this (as if this is not enough), there is another issue that prevents USB drives from being removed safely... end quote"

Another tech forum comment:

"Now when I copy about 3GB of photos the vast majority 2-3MB a piece, file xfres go to pieces

PATA to RAID 0 5MB/s

PATA to RAID 5 5MB/s

RAID 0 to RAID 5 15MB/s

RAID 5 to RAID 0 11MB/s

My conclusion is Vista is doing SOMETHING for each and every file... that something cost about 85MB/s when moving 3MB files around.......... something here is VERY wrong. FYI I have hot patched and disabled indexing, and everything else recommended - end quote"

Another comment from tech forum:

"What I did notice however is copying the file from within command prompt results in 38 events being generated in ProcessMonitor, while copying the file within Explorer resulted in 2053 events....The problem however does seem to exist and seems to be readily reproduceable... also in the future if someone claims the problem to be solved, do a little testing for us and get some numbers to us so we can compare ourselves and see if you're in fact experiencing the same problem we are....I'm hoping I'm wrong since it doesn't seem a hotfix could fix that without changing the design of the operation?"- end quote

Another comment from tech forum (In response to above previous quoted commment):

"I think you're onto the real issue here. I have noticed that when I copy files with Vista, it waits until the very end of the copy to present me with questions (such as Do you want to overwrite these 10 files?) So it does seem to spend an inordinate amount of time gaining access to and examining every single file" - end quote.

Another comment from tech forum:

There something with file copying (apart from the speed which is addressed elsewhere) which is really strange (and scary) - --it's looking and reinterpreting the target for each file within the one copy command, and continuing in the background with no indication of what it's actually doing. It seems like it's a case of letting GUI designers play with real functionality - very scary. I wonder what else is hidden away in there?"-end quote

Another comment tech forum:

"I have the same problem.Also workin with remote desktop from my laptop (with xp) to my vista pc in the same network is slow, realy slow.Ive tried different routers, now i'm using gigabit router and can't play a 2mb video file without it going out f sync.Copying a file to another directory on the same hard drive is a pain.I read almost everything i coul find on the net to solve this problem, but nothing works"- end quote.


P. S. Microsoft should be embarrassed that this problem even exists

 

[dsharp9000]

i am unsure what you mean by your posts as they only attack me--- all what i can say is that the slow file copy is real ---- would like your input on it if you have anything meaningful to say --- a lot of others who have much more expertise than me having problem--- just want microsoft to fix this --- if microsoft fixes --- the issue ends --- main thing is microsoft does need to fix this--- your input would be helpful.

 

[dblD]

I do not know what may have led you to think I am attacking you, that is a somewhat arrogant thought IMO. I am sorry if I may have hurt your overly sensitive feelings, I usually try to totally avoid those kinds of issues. Personally, I do not care about you and I cannot stand your stupid, grinning moron icon.

Just because of the icon issue alone, this will be my last reply to any of your posts. I am sure you do completely understand, as taken by itself, the icon means that you are only trying to come off as an irritating dunce (and IMO you are totally succeeding!).

--DD

 

[dsharp9000]

What about the issue of slow file copy? --- guess no comment from you on this?

 

[dsharp9000]

consider the following:

Test run on about 5000 files (350 Mb).

The data was copied to 2 different directories by 2 different methods:

Explorer cut & paste: 3 minutes 50 seconds.

DOS COPY : 1 minute 5 seconds.

So it would seem that it is linked to the explorer shell and not the copy kernel API

anyone care to expand on this

 

[dsharp9000]

Still wondering what is going on with this as there is no fix from microsoft. Some posters have suggested it hardware/driver problem while others claim it is vista. But if it is hardware/driver problem; then why would the dos copy command be faster than windows explorer interface? Seems to indicate that the problem is in vista itself and not necessarily related to hardware/drivers. Whats up with this as it is taking forever to backup company files and such. The copy speed is a joke. Anyone else experience this or am i only one in forum who has this problem?

 

[pkellmey]

It has to do with how Explorer reads sectors - DOS does no error checking on copy function (faster) but Explorer uses full NTFS checking (helps determine if the media is at issue or if the file is). I only experienced this issue with Maxtor drives. Maxtor refused to put out a patch for their drivers. ASUS has flat out stated not to use Maxtor with some of their mb. (Some of the Maxtor forums are good reads just to see the venom that ASUS users have for them.) NVidia has also stated that Maxtor causes issues with their NForce tech. Users are trying to place the blame on Vista, but all of the other vendors are putting the blame on the hard disk man. I turned off NForce and saw a noticable improvement, but I still wasn't happy. I moved from the same speed Maxtor to WD and the problem was totally resolved. Bad Maxtor!

 

[pkellmey]

Oh, I just thought of another PC that I had this issue with had a new SATA drive. Vista has a known bug with some firmware versions of some SATA drives and mb BIOS settings. PATA has to be turned off on some mb otherwise SATA will not be recognized correctly. Vista will see it and copy to it, but the speed is really slow. For that PC, a BIOS update fixed it so it didn't matter if it was on or off.

 

[adam-mt]

I wonder if the Intel SATA/RAID/AHCI drivers are a possible culprit?

When I updated to the latest Intel Matrix Storage Manager (7.5.0.1017) I noticed the release notes stated the following:

Possible Issues with Intel® RAID and Window Vista when using devices not compliant with Serial ATA LPM device specification: A change was made by Microsoft in the Microsoft Windows Vista setup process. The result of this change is that the Intel® Matrix Storage Manager Link Power Management (LPM) registry settings that were intended for mobile installations are added for desktop installations as well. These LPM registry settings are added for both the Intel® Matrix Storage Manager RAID driver on the Microsoft Windows Vista installation disk, as well as for any drivers added during the installation process.

Various desktop Serial ATA devices such as hard drives and CD/DVD drives have been reported that do not comply with the Serial ATA LPM device specification and display erratic behavior when LPM is enabled.

Because the setup change means that LPM is enabled by default for all Microsoft Windows Vista platforms, using a device that does not completely follow the specification may result in one of the listed issues.

Inability to install Microsoft Windows Vista (i.e. system halts during installation)
Performance degradation
Timeout errors reported by iastor or iastor(v) in Microsoft* Event Viewer*
NOTE: With systems having Intel® ICH9R controller hub there might be a possibility of issue occurring on XP also as Intel® Matrix Manager 7.5 release enables LPM on desktop systems starting ICH9R

Workarounds:

If you are experiencing installation issues, the following workarounds may help resolve the issue:

If available, install updated firmware for the device.
Attach the devices to ports 3-5 on the Intel® 82801HR/HH/HO I/O controller hub (ICH8R) or port 3 on the Intel® 82801GR/GH I/O controller hub (ICH7R)
If you are experiencing performance degradation or timeout errors, the following workarounds may help resolve the issue:

If available, install updated firmware for the device.
Delete the iastor(v) Parameters registry key by using the following steps:

1. Go to Start -> Search.
2. Type in RegEdit and hit the Enter key.
3. Go to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\iaStor(v).
4. Right-click on the Parameters key under iaStor(v) and select the Delete option.

<bolds added by myself>

Oddly, if you check the Intel site now (http://downloadcenter.intel.com/filter_results.aspx?strTypes=all&ProductID=2101&OSFullName=Windows+Vista*+32&lang=eng&strOSs=164&submit=Go%21) the release date (and notes) have changed, removing this text.

The download I got had a release date of March 30th, but it now says April 6th. And this despite the version number being identical.

(Can't test it myself since fortunately I've not encountered the slow copying issue).

 

[dblD]

It is still considered to be a known problem...

Possible Issues With Windows Vista* and Intel® RAID


The above link comes from the more general Matrix Storage Manager listing shown here.

--DD

 

[dsharp9000]

I finally found my post.

 

[dsharp9000]

P. S.

The problem continues with slow file copy as dbld indicates; but it is not problem with raid or chipset but with vista itself. This can be confirmed by going to the microsoft tech site that I list above.

 

[pkellmey]

This can be confirmed by going to the microsoft tech site that I list above.

When a problem is reported to MS, they will post the problem as existing even if it's not their issue (as they should). In this case, many, many tech forums have shown that by changing the hard disk man., drivers, BIOS version, etc., this problem can be resolved. That's why not everyone is having this issue. From what I've read in the Vista SP1 preview sites, MS is placing the driver/man. updates that they have received into the release for some of those drives. Current release date for SP1 is between Thanksgiving and Christmas.

 

[dsharp9000]

The only problem is that it is a big problem. it is micorsofts issue as it is in explorer command shell problem --- if it is driver problem then why do people using opus nine not experience this problem (opus nine works outside explorer)?.

 

[pkellmey]

The only problem is that it is a big problem. it is micorsofts issue as it is in explorer command shell problem --- if it is driver problem then why do people using opus nine not experience this problem (opus nine works outside explorer)?.

I'm not saying it is a driver issue. That's exactly the point. Not everyone experiences the problem (so it is not a Vista issue for everyone who uses Vista), however those who use different drivers, different versions of drivers, different BIOS levels, different hardware, etc. have resolved the issue. When I tested hardware for Vista in a lab, I took a Maxtor drive and a WD side-by-side with Vista on a ASUS mb, the Maxtor took 10X longer with the same size, speed and cache. MS pointed to ASUS or Maxtor as the problem but said they would open a ticket to investigate, ASUS pointed at Maxtor as the problem (a few other motherboards I tested did not experience this magnitude of a problem) and Maxtor pointed to NVidia NForce as the issue. So, we went with WD and have quick, easy transfers - not a single patch, driver or OS change was needed. That is just an example of what this type of issue involves. You can't just point to the OS when there is so much other documented evidence out there that there are other work-arounds not OS related. However, if you do have issues, SP1 may also possibly provide the answer, who knows.

 

[dsharp9000]

pk, i understand what you are saying. However, find it strange that if you operate outside the explorer command shell, that problem goes away. Just wierd that opus nine can fix for all hardware while microsoft cannot. I am hoping sp1 fixes it and am disapointed that its not already fixed as other vendor have already found a way around an issue that should not exist. It is frustrating to me sitting there for ever trying to explain why i am charging so much for my services but am getting nothing done as i am waiting for copy.

 

[dsharp9000]

I did hear rumor that sp1 may have a fix on this issue; hope it does

 

[proximus1]

I registered just to tell you, dsharp9000, to shut the **** up.

You've been bitching this entire thread, go use windows XP if vista bothers you so much (or if you could write an operating system better, do it).

God damn..

 

[dsharp9000]

Microsoft just released the following fix under a beta download (but think its going to be finalized on August 15 2007 as sp1. It appears solve my slow file copy that I was having with vista. It also fixes a lot of other problems.

938979 Vista Performance and Reliability Pack
This update resolves a number of individual issues which may be affecting some computers running Windows Vista. These issues have been reported by customers using the Error Reporting service, product support, or other means. Installing this update will improve the performance and responsiveness for some scenarios and improves reliability of Windows Vista in a variety of scenarios. Some examples of the improvements contained in this update are:

* Improves performance in resuming back to the desktop from the Photo and Windows Energy screensaver.
* Resolves an issue where some secured web pages using advanced security technologies may not get displayed in Internet Explorer on Windows Vista.
* Resolves an issue where a shared printer may not get installed if the printer is connected to a Windows XP or Windows Server 2003 system and User Access Control is disabled on the Vista client.
* Resolves an issue where creating AVI files on Vista may get corrupted.
* Improves the performance in calculating the %u2018estimated time remaining%u2019 when copying/moving large files.
* Improves performance in bringing up Login Screen after resuming from Hibernate.
* Resolves an issue where synchronization of offline files to a server can get corrupted.
* Resolves a compatibility issue with RAW images created by Canon EOS 1D/1DS Digital SLR Camera which can lead to data loss. This only affects RAW images created by these two specific camera models.
* Resolves an issue where a computer can lose its default Gateway address when resuming from sleep mode.
* Improves the performance when copying or moving entire directories containing large amounts of data or files.
* Improves the performance of Vista%u2019s Memory Manager in specific customer scenarios and prevents some issues which may lead to memory corruption.

938194 Vista Compatibility and Reliability Pack
This update resolves a number of individual issues which may be affecting some computers running Windows Vista. These issues have been reported by customers using the Error Reporting service, product support, or other means. Installing this update will improve the reliability and hardware compatibility of Windows Vista in a variety of scenarios. Some examples of the improvements contained in this update are:

* Improved reliability and compatibility of Vista when used with newer graphics cards in several specific scenarios and configurations.
* Improved reliability when working with external displays on a laptop.
* Increased compatibility with many video drivers.
* Improved visual appearance of games with high intensity graphics.
* Improved quality of playback for HD-DVD and Blue-Ray disks on large monitors.
* Improved reliability for Internet Explorer when some third party toolbars are installed on Vista.
* Improved Vista reliability in networking configuration scenarios.
* Improved the reliability of Windows Calendar in Vista.
* Improved reliability of systems that were upgraded from XP to Vista.
* Increased compatibility with many printer drivers.
* Increased reliability and performance of Vista when entering sleep and resuming from sleep

here is link

http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=41691


P. S.

Proximus, it appears i have to find something else to bitch about now; I think thats a good thing

 

[Vistanut]

I found this solution to SLOW file copy/delete/move:

Open Programs & Features
Select Turn Windows Features On or Off
De-select Remote Differential Compression
Select OK

It will take several minutes for this to be de-activated.

Reboot to be sure it takes.

Now these operations fly!

 

[bradwarduk]

well the last post improves the copy process but its still sluggish and if you cancel the copy half way through it takes an age for vista to rewind itself. i think MS has tried too hard to be too clever and need to go back to the basic of the copying a file lol maybe they will sort it in Win7. i think the last post about disabling remote thingy just removes one of the many processes that vista explorer's does when it copies a file.