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Great, ANOTHER one - System building

Forum Homebuilt Systems : General Homebuilt - Great, ANOTHER one - System building

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Well, hello everyone! First post time. Exciting, isn't it? I'll be honest.. I love this site and I love how helpful everyone on here seems to be. So, I'm hoping you can extend that to me as well. So here's the run down. Already have a monitor, keyboard, CD/DVD drive, a gig of RAM, and what, as far as I know, is an acceptable case. So I'm just looking at, essentially, an entire overhaul of the insides. I'd prefer to keep the budget in the range it is in already $1200-1300, and even that might be pushing it a bit. We shall see.

It will, of course, primarily be used for gaming. I'd like it to be a general multi-purpose system as much as possible however. In addition, I would prefer upgradability if I want to in the future. I'm also relatively new to this thing, but I really want to try and build this system by myself/with a buddy. So, any advice you have will also be greatly appreciated. I'm not an idiot to turn down sound advice. :wink: So, thank you so much beforehand! Lemme know if I'm forgetting anything important!

1. Processor: Intel core 2 duo e6700
2. Graphics Card: 8800 GTS (640) (EVG)
3. Motherboard: Asus P5N32-E SLI Plus Motherboard ??? (Will this be a good motherboard?)
5. Hard drive: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3500630AS 500GB Hard Drive
7. Power: Antec True Power Trio TP3-550 ATX12V 550W
8. RAM: Kingston 1GB PC4200 DDR2 SODIMM Memory

Alright, I'm not entirely sure if I have everything I'll need.. Probably not. Do I need a new cooling system as well? A fan? I don't know, anything at all I've forgotten.

Thank you!

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Can I be the first to say, OH boy :? What RAM do you have now? That one you picked is for a notebook or MAC sodimm? The CPU is killer overpriced even for a $3500 system.

2,3,5,and 7 are fine, even good picks.

Are you thinking about overclocking? What Monitor are you using? New cooling system might be good, what is the old cooling system?

Good CPU to start with might be e6420, or e6600 depending on the o/c ?
8800 is good for most games and monitors
Need to know more about the case before we can advise you on cooling and such.

Reply to alcattle

Booj,

Seems like you're merely a week or so behind me, as I also just joined and started posting. In fact, your build is very similar to mine:

Quote :

MB - ASUS P5N32-E SLI Plus LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 650i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
CPU - Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz LGA 775 Processor Model
RAM - Patriot eXtreme Performance 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit
GPU - EVGA 640-P2-N821-AR GeForce 8800GTS 640MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Video Card
HDD - SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD321KJ 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
PSU - CORSAIR CMPSU-620HX ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 620W Power Supply
CPU HSF - ZALMAN CNPS7700-CU 120mm 2 Ball Cooling Fan
OS - Microsoft Windows XP Professional 32-bit With SP2B 1 Pack


With all of this fresh in my mind, let me throw a few thoughts your way. First, that list of parts above (plus a few small odds-and-ends like case fans, DVD/CD lightscribe) ran me about $1500, just for your $$ planning.
[*:f81f343c80]The motherboard is great as far as I'm concerned. I did quite a bit of research online for all of the components in my build, and settled on the ASUS MB.
[*:f81f343c80]The E6700 is a good choice, but you can trim some fat from the budget by going with the newly released E6420 -- it has the same size L2 Cache, and you can overclock it for more speed. Overclocking is so dreadfully easy with the ASUS MB, that you won't be able to resist.
[*:f81f343c80]The graphics card sounds like a Hoover in your case. Small rodents struggle to escape the intake vents of your computer with this thing in here. But it's fast, fast, fast. :D
[*:f81f343c80]The HD is good -- it's SATA, right? Might as well make use of the 6 SATA ports on that MB. Be warned -- there is only ONE IDE connection on the board, and one floppy connection. If your CD/DVD is IDE and you have any other components in there that are IDE as well, you'll want them close together as you can only use one cable.
[*:f81f343c80]The power supply is the minimum spec for that MB. They recommend at least 550W. Somewhere in these forums is a great review of PSUs -- search, find, read. If you plan on going SLI later, you may want a bit more juice.
[*:f81f343c80]Kingston RAM. Kinda like the Harley-Davidson of memory. You pay a lot just for the name. Have you considered the Patriot mem? There is currently a mail-in rebate for it on Newegg that brings the price down to $105 for TWO gig. How's that compare to the Kingston?
Some final considerations for you -- if you're leaving in an old hard drive that is IDE, don't connect it until after you have put the whole thing together and installed your OS on your new drive. Make sure you change the jumper on it to Slave (don't leave it to Cable Select). I had some weirdness with mine that wasted a few hours; I probably could have avoided it by not connecting the IDE until after the build was complete. What case fans do you already have? What cooler do you plan to use for the CPU? That should be enough for now to get the brain working. :D

EDIT: *shakes fist at alcattle* Darn you and your speedy fingers!

Reply to Findail

Wow, thanks a ton guys! It helps a lot. Yeah, the RAM there was a brain fart.. I just had it in the same word document as a reminder for something else. Sorry. That makes me feel dumb. :oops:

alcattle: I'm interested in overclocking, yeah. So you think I should switch my CPU to an e6600 instead? It does seem to be a lot more popular..

Findail: Thanks for all your help! Do you think it would be possible to give (or PM) a direct link to that rebate? I kinda glanced through NewEgg, and the only 2 gig thing I could find was still $250. Thanks for pointing that out about IDE, but I think I'm okay there. I wasn't going to stick in a current hard drive, but thank you for the advice! Like I said, I won't rule out SLI.. How much greater do you think I should jump up my power supply?

Alright, and about the case.. Well, I had been planning on cannabalizing one of my friends, but he decided he wants to keep it around.. So that's out of the picture. Also, as I haven't done any research on cases, what would be some possible recomendations? Anything and everything is appreciated at this point. :D

Sorry if I'm being too demanding of you guys.. But, thank you for any new advice you have!

Reply to Booj2600

1) Many 2x1GB RAM can be had in the $100-$150 range now, just look a little harder on Newegg. Gskill, Geil, there are lots of good brands (because they're all pretty much from the same factories anyway)

2) Definitely go with the E6600, save your money for something else, if you are willing to try a little overclocking (not very hard anymore these days, look up the excellent guides on this forum) you might even consider saving even more and going for an E6420.

3) The resolution of your monitor is ?? If it's 1680x1050 (ie a 20-inch widescreen lcd) or below, I would suggest the GTS 8800 320MB video card as the better buy.

4) Motherboard is good, even PSU is ok but you might bump the wattage up a notch to give you some headroom for later on. Again, check the forums for the great guide on PSUs to be found here.

5) Forget about SLI, while it tweaks the performance enthusiast in all of us, it's pretty much utterly worthless for just about everything. But don't take my word for it, have a look around and you'll see most everyone agrees with that. :)

Reply to mythos

As far as cases go, I like Sanji's guide:
http://forumz.tomshardware.com/har [...] 28067.html

It has a section with cases, with links and thumbnails. The guide is getting kind of old though. Some of the links are broken. Prices might not match up either.

Reply to Tirrock

Thanks a whole bunch guys. That guide was really helpful, not just for cases. And the PSU guide was informative as well. So, now, I'll try this again. Be gentle. :wink:

- Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo e6600
- GPU: 8800GTS 640 MB (Though I was wondering, mythos, why would you suggest the 320 MB one if I had a smaller resolution? I don't, I have a nice fat monitor, but I was just curious)
- Motherboard: Asus P5N32-E SLI Plus Motherboard
- RAM: CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory (In addition to a GB of unknown DDR2 RAM already in system, for a total of 3 GB)
- PSU: Antec True Power Trio TP3-650 ATX12V 650W (Enough power?)
- HDD: SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM (Just to verify, OEM means I'll have to buy connector cables and whatever else myself, correct? Any idea what those run, price point wise, and where?)
- Case: NZXT Apollo BLACK NP Black SECC Steel Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

Alright, tear it apart. Go crazy. Sorry for having so many questions in there! I may not be the best, but this is all interesting to me.

Reply to Booj2600

Whoops! Looks like you answered your memory question before I got back to this thread. In case you still want it, here's the direct link to the Patriot RAM that I bought.

Quote :

(Just to verify, OEM means I'll have to buy connector cables and whatever else myself, correct? Any idea what those run, price point wise, and where?)


That appears to be the same HD that I got. If so, it's just the hard drive in bubble wrap, no cables. However, the MB you are ordering came with plenty of cables, so I didn't have to buy more. Shoot, it even came with regular and right-angle SATA connectors. I believe there were four total SATA cables packaged with it. Your PSU should have all the power cables you need, so you shouldn't have to buy any extra cables to make it work.

PS: 650W should be more than enough. I'm getting by on a mere 620W. :wink:

Reply to Findail

Alright then! Thanks a lot Findail! You've been a great help. Is there anything wrong with the updated system? Acceptable to everyone? Should last me a while and have some room for upgradability, right? Awesome. :D

Will the two 120mm (One in rear, one on the side) fans of the case be enough cooling so everything doesn't start over heating? Especially because there isn't a side air duct. Even if I overclock? Questions questions questions!

Reply to Booj2600

Uhhhhhhhhhhh.... Kingston? The Harley davidson of memory? You pay for the name?? HHAAHAHAHAHAH wow....

no.

Here's your memory:

Patriot eXtreme Performance 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820220144

or

OCZ Platinum Revision 2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820227139


If you want to get the 6700, get the 6700. I'm planning on getting one for my build... It's a price difference of $100, but it's a pretty big performance difference in the charts. The 6600 is really good as well though, so it's whatever you feel comfortable spending money on!

I'm going to go w/the Seagate 7200.10 sata drives myself, but the spinpoints are very good as well. Again, a personal preference.

The Antex True Power should be just fine as a PSU, but these are the two I'm personally looking at:

CORSAIR CMPSU-620HX ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 620W Power Supply 100 - 240 V
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6817139002

ZALMAN ZM600-HP ATX12V 600W Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6817379003


You'll probably want a cooler if you're going to do any OCing. I'd suggest the:
ZALMAN 9700 LED 110mm 2 Ball CPU Cooler - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6835118019


You may notice I'm suggesting a lot of zalman parts. Are there better ones out there? Sure... but after a runin I had with their customer support, I highly recommend them. They were nothing short of amazing.

Also, your question about the 320 vs the 640. A larger memory aperature means that it can push more frames to higher resolutions.

Reply to Phrozt

Quote :

Uhhhhhhhhhhh.... Kingston? The Harley davidson of memory? You pay for the name?? HHAAHAHAHAHAH wow....

no.

Here's your memory:

Patriot eXtreme Performance 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820220144


Um... Patriot is the memory that I have. In fact, I have the exact stuff that you linked. Perhaps I should have enclosed my Harley comments about Kingston in [sarcasm] [/sarcasm] just to be clear. :wink:

Reply to Findail

Quote :

Is there anything wrong with the updated system?


Well, I'm currently trouble shooting a relatively hot idle on my CPU. I think the final verdict is that because I'm jamming this all into a 4 year old case that didn't even have any fans with it in its previous incarnation that I need to add a fan or two and do some better ventilating.

So get a good case. 2 x 120mm fans is a good start -- does it also have one in the front bring fresh air into the case? Spend the extra time to do good cable management so you don't block whatever airflow you have. That's about it for advice. Feel free to shoot more questions my way if you have them.

Reply to Findail

Actually, if you read it, it does sound like you're being serious.

Reply to Phrozt

Quote :

Actually, if you read it, it does sound like you're being serious.


I have a chronically dry sense of humor. I think I was dropped on my head too often as a child.

Reply to Findail

I do as well.. but you have to work on your delivery. When you make bulleted lists in a factual response, you need to pronounce your humor slightly more, as it can easily get lost by someone skimming to pick up "facts."

In this way, one can assume that you were being serious, thus creating a need for you to explain yourself, and the person to re-read and understand what you said... leading to the root of all assumptions, that it makes an ass out of both "u" and me.

Reply to Phrozt

I would wait until next week for the HD2900XT to come out. Hopefully it will be significantly be better than the 8800GTS (but I doubt it) or at least be competitive (more likely the case) and bring prices down.

If you do plan on overclocking, the E4400 might be something to look at. It has the same multiplier as the E6700 (which is 10) so it's extremely easy to overclock. You don't have to raise the FSB as much as with the other "budget" C2D's. It's just missing 2 MB of cache which isn't that much of a performance hit. Now, the E6600 has a 9 multiplier but with an extra 2MB of cache which isn't that much more.

If you are not going to do extreme oc'ing (> 3.6GHz), then get the E6600, otherwise for ease of oc'ing, the E4400 would be my choice.

Here's a very good link.

That ASUS is a good motherboard but in my opinion you don't need SLI. I have the Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3. It overclocks well and is a lot cheaper.

If you do plan on going SLI one day, you will need a better PSU. This OCZ PSU should provide as a starting point. Look here for more PSU pointers.

I'm assuming you already have a copy of an OS?

Reply to purdueguy

Quote :

I would wait until next year for the HD2900XT to come out. Hopefully it will be significantly be better than the 8800GTS (but I doubt it) or at least be competitive (more likely the case) and bring prices down.



*fixed

Reply to Phrozt

It seems that way, doesn't it. But with all of the "leaks" that have been going around, I think it's safe to say next WEEK. 8)

Reply to purdueguy

Hell... there's been "leaks" ever since it was supposed to be released at the end of last year...

Leaks are only indicative of a sinking ship.


(what a great analogy :))

Reply to Phrozt

Alright, but what are the honest to god chances of it coming out next week? I'd like to try and get everything set up before my birthday (May 21st) and I am slightly impatient. ;) Would it even be in the same price range?

I'll replace the RAM I had selected with the Patriot 2GB Phrozt suggested (cheaper than what I had and seems to be more highly regarded), and the OCZ purdueguy recommended. Its the same price after rebates and more power. So.

No, Findail, the case doesn't seem to have on in the front, though the fan on the side appears to lead to the outside and blow directly on the mobo/gpu. So is that alright? Or will I need another additional cooling unit?

So, I looked at benchmarks for a single 8800GTS and a SLI set-up, right here on the site, and it appears to almost double the scores on the tests.. So what would make it not worth it? It seems like when the card drops in price, that would just make it easier to up the framerates, instead of buying a whole new card. I'm probably missing something. :wink:

Also, purdueguy said that the E4400 has the same (10) multiplier as the E6700, which is what makes it easy to OC. Wouldn't that also make the E6700 easy to overclock?

Haha, let me know when you guys get sick of me.. But I really do appreciate all the effort you guys are going to to make this system the best it can be. :D

Reply to Booj2600

Chances of it coming out next week are *honestly* very high.

I'm just poking at it's very poor PR track record. However, keep in mind that it's going to be at a high price for awhile... so chances of you seeing any market changes in time for your bday to hit (may 18th + 3 business days for shipping = may 21st) is highly unlikely.

Also, I cannot take all the credit for the patriot suggestion as it's already been suggested (but at least I gave a link ;)).

Reply to Phrozt

Would it be worth it to wait for a possible price drop? Of course, I COULD wait.. I just don't really want to. ;) Do you think it would be worth it to wait and get into the general price range of the 8800GTS respnably soon? Essentially, would I regret buying this videocard at this point in time? Also, in somewhat related news, I found a GTS that says its superclocked, would it be worth the 20 extra bucks?

Hehe, no, I know the other poster suggested that RAM as well, which helped to convince me that it was a good kind. So thanks to both of you, and everyone else who puts up with me on here. :)

Reply to Booj2600

You can overclock the standard GTS so easily you should save yourself the 20bucks.

Reply to tdank

Point of buying a factory OCed card is that the warranty covers the OC, wheras the warranty will not *always* (some do, some don't) cover person OCing.

Reply to Phrozt

So would the fact that its a factory OC'ed card place more limitations on its future OC'ing then a base card? For whatever reason, would the fastest it could get be slower than a base card?

Any input on the other questions?

Reply to Booj2600
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