Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question
Solved

Wine for gaming

Last response: in Linux/Free BSD
Share
August 2, 2009 3:01:14 AM

I have an old pc that I'm about to install Ubuntu on so that I can begin to really learn the system. I have another pc for gaming but had heard and read some on it while in the book store (didn't want to buy the book for a free os and figured the info is out there somewhere) that I can use wine to run major game titles that usually only work for or are best suited to Microsoft os systems. Any way my questions are this first is it worth it? And second will the game preform at an optimum level?

More about : wine gaming

Best solution

August 2, 2009 3:26:01 AM
Share

The best option is always to run a Linux version of the game if one exists.

If a Linux version doesn't exist then WINE and it's derivatives are probably your 2nd best option.

Some games run almost perfectly on WINE, others have minor problems, some have moderate problems, others severe problems and some don't run at all.

Take a look at the appDB for supported games and apps http://appdb.winehq.org/index.php

Also check out the FAQ http://wiki.winehq.org/FAQ

WINE is free and open source ( $0 - completely free to download ).

There are also commercial derivatives of WINE that you can pay for if you think they are worth it.

http://www.codeweavers.com/products/ crossover games $39.95

http://www.cedega.com/ $5 a month or $55 a year


Linux also has free open source games http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_games and commercial games http://www.tuxgames.com/browse.cgi?&category=all

Some of the commercial Linux games have free demos you can try.

Good luck :) 
August 2, 2009 3:31:42 AM

If you have a really nice computer with lots of RAM you could use Virtualbox which has 3D acceleration and run a windows vm on top of your linux OS ( that way you could run windows XP inside Linux ).

A real windows vm would require a license.

You can also run free operating systems inside virtualbox too like *BSD, Solaris, any Linux distribution, freeDOS, reactOS and so on and commercial operating systems as well.

Good luck :) 
Related resources
August 2, 2009 4:12:07 AM

linux_0 said:
If you have a really nice computer with lots of RAM you could use Virtualbox which has 3D acceleration and run a windows vm on top of your linux OS ( that way you could run windows XP inside Linux ).

A real windows vm would require a license.

You can also run free operating systems inside virtualbox too like *BSD, Solaris, any Linux distribution, freeDOS, reactOS and so on and commercial operating systems as well.

Good luck :) 



Thanks for the help i'll keep the windows vm in mind for down the road :) 
August 2, 2009 6:55:33 AM

VMs can be slow and they usually require an expensive PC with a lot of power and virtualization extensions.

WINE is less demanding but you still need a good PC with good graphics for some of the latest games, not so much for older games.

Your mileage will vary.

The appDB and the codeweavers and cedega game DBs can give you an idea of what to expect to get out of each program compatibility wise.

Neither solution is perfect.

VMs have better compatibility than WINE, since you are actually running the real OS under a VM but your virtual sound and graphics hardware can sometimes cause major problems.

Don't forget about all the free games which run on Linux natively like..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_open_source_games

http://glest.org/en/index.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vega_strike

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nexuiz

and many more :) 
August 2, 2009 7:12:16 AM

I doubt you'll be able all major game titles well in WINE.

There is a Wine compatibility list on their website.

VMs are not designed for gaming.

If you just use Linux as a host OS to run Windows, I don't see a point.
August 2, 2009 7:42:47 AM

Virtualbox lets you assign up to 128MB of video ram to your Innotek virtual VGA with 3D acceleration.

It's no ATI HD4870 1GB but at least it's 3D.

Most other VMs don't even offer 3D.
August 2, 2009 12:10:01 PM

Still if you wanna play old games like Jedi Academy, it just can't cope.

Virtual Box at the moment is OpenGL only.
August 2, 2009 12:35:07 PM

The appDB isn't always kept up to date either, especially with less popular programs. Also, note that the latest version of Wine is not always the best. Look for the version that works best with the majority of your programs. Sometimes it can go from really functional to no even working with a single version change.
August 2, 2009 8:00:52 PM

Virtualbox's performance is sometimes impressive and sometimes not, I have to admit I haven't tested it with games.

It's true sometimes you have to find a suitable version of WINE for your app or use crossover or cedega to improve the chances of the app working.

:) 
August 3, 2009 9:56:29 AM

Virtual Box ain't gonna run Far Cry 2 that's for certain.

Good luck with WINE and co.
August 4, 2009 3:22:30 AM

Thanks for all the info. It actually looks as if I'm going to be running Umbuntu on my new system instead of getting another copy of vista especially since win7 is out in October and might as well get to know Umbuntu on it too while I wait (who knows might not go back to microsoft, though gaming and some graphic design is what the new system is for.)

I know that some of the games I run do have serious compatibility problems with linux and have also considered a partition of sorts.

New System
PCU: AMD phenom II black
mobo: Asus crosshair III formula
ram: Mushkin xp series 4GB ddr3 more later
video: Vapor-X Radeon HD 4870 1GB with possibility of crossfire later
PSU: CORSAIR|CMPSU-850TX 850W RT
HD: WD 640GB black caviar with a second of the same later
August 4, 2009 5:36:15 AM

Nice setup :)  Sweet components. Two thumbs up.

Give fedora a try too it's really cool :) 
August 4, 2009 8:01:18 AM

I like how Adam Overa put it in the Tom's Hardware Ubuntu article a few months ago:

Quote:
The question is not “can Linux run it?” That has never been the question with regard to Linux. Instead, you can make it do just about anything that you want it to do. The more pointed question is: “just how much of a hassle is this going to be?”
August 4, 2009 12:27:32 PM

I'm a heavy Wine-gamer, virtually all big titles can be played with wine after setting up/tweaking it should work perfectly. The only real thing that doesn't work is animated cursors, i get about 80% of the FPS i get in Windows.

If you are using an ATi card, you are in bad luck however. Since the drivers for Linux are of very low quality, certainly not as reasonable as the nVidia linux drivers, which work pretty well. Maybe if Gallium3D would work out, you can have opensource 3D drivers and all problems could be fixed by open source devs instead of proprietary coders.
August 4, 2009 1:07:05 PM

I tried L4D (Source engine) in Wine and where I was getting 40-120FPS in Windows on max I was getting 2-10FPS in Wine on min graphics. Must have had the "wrong" version of Wine :lol:  I was using a 9600GT too, no ATI stuff. I wonder if my GTX275 can manage 20FPS or if it's too new to break 5FPS.
August 5, 2009 5:33:22 AM

sub mesa said:
I'm a heavy Wine-gamer, virtually all big titles can be played with wine after setting up/tweaking it should work perfectly. The only real thing that doesn't work is animated cursors, i get about 80% of the FPS i get in Windows.

If you are using an ATi card, you are in bad luck however. Since the drivers for Linux are of very low quality, certainly not as reasonable as the nVidia linux drivers, which work pretty well. Maybe if Gallium3D would work out, you can have opensource 3D drivers and all problems could be fixed by open source devs instead of proprietary coders.


They are getting a tad better after the AMD takeover.
August 29, 2009 5:27:15 AM

GTA san andreas runs pretty good in Wine under ubuntu 9.04. The only problem I get about 10fps due to my old crappy rig.
August 30, 2009 5:58:30 PM

Does anyone know when Postal 3 is coming out? It is a source engine based game and it is supposed to have a Linux port. I am hoping that all their legwork getting source to run natively on Linux would be used to port games like Half-Life 2/Portal/Team Fortress 2. I think having those games working under Linux would help attract more gamers to our platform and improve support for Linux. Lets face it, WINE is a great project and is very useful, but native games are almost always a better option.

--Zorak
September 6, 2009 1:52:47 PM

Native everything is always better.
September 6, 2009 4:49:00 PM

I'm sure the Aboriginals feel the same way... ;) 
September 7, 2009 12:46:07 PM

Hehe, probably pissed I like on their land.
September 23, 2009 6:23:40 AM

I have just took the dive into Ubuntu 9.04 64 bit and have to say that I have found myself trying to get everything right. It really is a totally different OS, regarding the way you as a user must work with it compared to MS. I really like some of the things you can do with Ubuntu, love the cube desktop, effects that can be done with it. I must say that my wine experience so far is not going well. I have tried several MS games, shadowrun, DOW soulstorm, DOW II, and a few others that I have not been able to get to install with wine. I got Soulstorm to install but it will not load up to the game. I can configure the grafix but thats it.

It really is too bad about the lack of support for gamers with this Ubuntu, but for the time being, I believe I am going to take the time to learn Ubuntu and how it works. I even broke down my raid setup, I got the alt. CD to install with only Vista in raid, but could not get Ubuntu to install right with Vista and Window 7 in a tripple boot. Grub was just installed in the wrong area, or atleast now that is what I think happened. I am installing vista and 7 on there own 640gb wd black and put Ubuntu on its on 640 GB drive. I have been on the Ubuntu forums doing a lot of reading, but what has really helped me out is YouTube. There is a chick on there named NixiePixel that post's all kinds of really helpful things about Ubuntu. I think this is the first I have been on tom's in days, LOL> still trying to figure Ubuntu out.
September 23, 2009 4:14:03 PM

medjohnson77 said:
It really is too bad about the lack of support for gamers with this Ubuntu, but for the time being, I believe I am going to take the time to learn Ubuntu and how it works. I even broke down my raid setup, I got the alt. CD to install with only Vista in raid, but could not get Ubuntu to install right with Vista and Window 7 in a tripple boot. Grub was just installed in the wrong area, or atleast now that is what I think happened. I am installing vista and 7 on there own 640gb wd black and put Ubuntu on its on 640 GB drive. I have been on the Ubuntu forums doing a lot of reading, but what has really helped me out is YouTube. There is a chick on there named NixiePixel that post's all kinds of really helpful things about Ubuntu. I think this is the first I have been on tom's in days, LOL> still trying to figure Ubuntu out.


This is a very, VERY common misconception. Linux isn't incompatible with games; the games are incompatible with Linux. If you run a game with a Linux-native installer (Quake, and anything using the same engine I believe, to name a few), you'll notice it performs wonderfully. Unfortunately, not many people run Linux in comparison to Windoze, so the gaming companies don't 'waste' their time making a Linux-native installer for the game.

Hopefully your experience goes better, as Linux is truly wonderful. :) 
September 23, 2009 4:23:54 PM

Hehe, they made a reverse wine for Windows to let us run linux-ware on Windows.
September 23, 2009 4:25:55 PM

amdfangirl said:
Hehe, they made a reverse wine for Windows to let us run linux-ware on Windows.


No wai! :D 
September 24, 2009 3:15:58 AM

Pyroflea said:
This is a very, VERY common misconception. Linux isn't incompatible with games; the games are incompatible with Linux. If you run a game with a Linux-native installer (Quake, and anything using the same engine I believe, to name a few), you'll notice it performs wonderfully. Unfortunately, not many people run Linux in comparison to Windoze, so the gaming companies don't 'waste' their time making a Linux-native installer for the game.

Hopefully your experience goes better, as Linux is truly wonderful. :) 


Thanks for pointing that out, however if I made it sound that way I'm sorry, I know that it is the games that are incompatible with Linux. All was well with my Linux install untill late last night. After trying to install my Razor mouse drivers with wine, so I could config. my buttons the way I like seemed that it started locking up my rig. I also installed the DOW soulstorm so Maybe that had something to do with it? I have no fan control for my ACC on the 4870's so I am not sure if the 80c I see is causing the problems. I tried playing a DVD and it also caused it to freeze up. Looks like I have some more learning to do on Ubuntu.
September 24, 2009 5:34:11 AM

You can't use WINE for everything, particularly drivers. Too hard to communicate with the OS.
September 24, 2009 7:18:30 AM

amdfangirl said:
You can't use WINE for everything, particularly drivers. Too hard to communicate with the OS.



So Installing some games work, but installing drivers for hardware doesn't?
September 24, 2009 7:32:54 AM

The drivers can't communicate with a Windows kernel that isn't there.
September 24, 2009 9:19:18 AM

It's too hard to communicate to the Linux kernel.
September 24, 2009 8:07:04 PM

Thanks for the info. So drivers It really isn't going to work for, but installing games is ok to use wine?
September 24, 2009 10:15:30 PM

medjohnson77 said:
Thanks for the info. So drivers It really isn't going to work for, but installing games is ok to use wine?


Yes, games are fine. There's a compatibility list on their website, which will give you a rating of how well the specific game will work :)  Drivers on the other hand do not work, and should not be used. :) 
September 25, 2009 12:03:14 AM

thanks for the info guys, maybe that is why my Ubuntu froze up and black screened. I have deleted my install's and have now started getting Vista back in and am debating on loading Windows 7 RC back in and trying to tripple boot with all three. I had nothing but problems doing this in a raid 0 setup. We will see how it works this time.
September 25, 2009 12:03:58 AM

medjohnson77 said:
thanks for the info guys, maybe that is why my Ubuntu froze up and black screened. I have deleted my install's and have now started getting Vista back in and am debating on loading Windows 7 RC back in and trying to tripple boot with all three. I had nothing but problems doing this in a raid 0 setup. We will see how it works this time.


Good luck :) 
September 25, 2009 12:37:29 AM

There are a few exceptions for drivers, such as NDISwrapper, which has it's own Windows kernel implementation and allows Windows XP wireless hardware drivers to work on Linux.
September 25, 2009 1:26:27 AM

Thanks for the info Randomizer, I have seen that info in some of the reading I've been doing
September 25, 2009 6:24:13 AM

Still, try to stick to native Linux software if possible.
September 25, 2009 6:48:22 AM

Ok, thanks I will try to do that. So looks like I will be running Vista, Windows 7 and Linux Ubuntu 9.04 64 bit. I haven't got it installed in my main rig yet, I have several other very old computers( a amd duron 650) on a Via KT133 mother board a friend gave me. The Winteck psu blew in it and he just gave it to me. Tried to install Ubuntu 9.04 32 bit desktop on it, and got a bug 14 code in the first install area. I tried to install the same on a Dell cpi d233st I think and it really looked like it was going to take it, but two hours into it I gave up, LOL.

It really sucks that my install on my main rig black screened out on me, I really had alot installed on it and had changed alot of things. I got the cube working, and the black slickness working. I think I am going to get Ubuntu 9.04 going back on my main quad rig, and use it for everything besides gaming, unless I can find some games I like made for Linux. I'll keep Vista and maybe upgrade to Windows 7 when it comes out, not sure yet, for running MS games.
September 27, 2009 1:08:37 AM

Hey guys,

I have been working on giving Ubuntu installs another try on the older computers and this is what I have come up with. I got Ubuntu 8.10 to install on the Duron 650mhz with the Kt133 chipset. I had to download the min. CD which I installed and had problems with once it completed. If you would like to hear more on this, I am starting a new thread since this one is solved. Thanks for all the info guys.
September 27, 2009 1:21:48 PM

Hehe, damn small Linux... *leaves*
September 30, 2009 10:38:07 PM

randomizer said:
I tried L4D (Source engine) in Wine and where I was getting 40-120FPS in Windows on max I was getting 2-10FPS in Wine on min graphics. Must have had the "wrong" version of Wine :lol:  I was using a 9600GT too, no ATI stuff. I wonder if my GTX275 can manage 20FPS or if it's too new to break 5FPS.

This message is way old but still like to reply to it. :p 

If a game supports both DirectX and OpenGL graphics, selecting OpenGL will make that part go virtually native so very fast. For example World of Warcraft can be launched with the -opengl parameter, such as "wine Wow.exe -opengl" in a command line. This will yield very reasonable performance. I've tested this with 9600GT and normally it reaches the 60fps cap (tied to my refresh rate as more won't matter since the monitor can't display). But in very busy places with lots of players such as Dalaran, the FPS drops sometimes below 20fps. I suspect this is mainly CPU limited, and WoW is a single threaded engine. DirectX performance is improving, and alot of bugs have been fixed which makes alot of apps now work.

Generally, if you want to try an application using Wine, you should first consult the WineHQ.org's AppDB for that application, which states how well it is supported by various ratings: Platinum is the best, meaning it works flawless out-of-the-box without any tweaks, and grades down to Garbage - not useful at all. It also contains instructions on how to properly install or tweak the application to make it run well under Wine. Note that Ubuntu gets shipped with old Wine 1.0.1 and not the latest development releases such as 1.1.30 at current time of writing. When the big boss Alexandre says its time to create a stable release again, it will be 1.2.0. This way, Wine wants to provide some form of stable releases which is a good idea. But using 1.0.1 is just old. Fortunately, after setting up a PPA as described on the WineHQ site, Ubuntu users can get regular updates from Wine just like they get from their operating system. So keeping up to date with the latest and greatest wine is easy; no compiling or installing just click update. :) 

In my experience, Wine already supports alot of really popular and complex application and games. Some need some tweaks/modifications to work but with each new release of wine less of these are necessary. To get the most out of wine, however, experienced wine users will use a separate .wine directory per application or game. So for example, i have WoW installed to /jfs/wine/WoW/, where in that directory is the drive_c containing a fake windows directory and the game itself. Its like having one brand-clean windows with just one application installed; it keeps it tidy. The advantage here is that applications can't affect each other. All those DLL files can conflict or cause problems nobody has foreseen and if you keep an environment tidy you can avoid any problems now or in the future. Wine also refuses bugreports if you haven't tested it in a clean .wine directory with just that application installed or used. Note that it's not just files, but also registry values which are separated here.

Another advantage of keeping separate .wine directories for each application is that it becomes a portable package. You can move that directory to a totally different linux machine with different hardware and perhaps even different linux version or even FreeBSD and it would still run that application the same. Try that on Windows.

Personally, i find Windows self-contaminating. Its just a mess with all those applications installed which install files everywhere; as opposed to having a separate self-contained "environment" for each application, such as which is possible with Wine. So in effect, running Windows applications like this might become the future and totally hassle-free and almost guaranteed working instantly, by making wine application packages that are portable and work instantly. Its also very secure, since when properly configured an application run using Wine cannot escape its environment.

So i see this as a huge benefit to linux and once its made more accessible to common users - who just want to get it working in two mouse clicks - linux gaming might really even start to thrive. Linux isn't for nerds anymore, Ubuntu has proved that already IMO. Still they have a long road to go but generally i like the changes they make alot better than the ones made by their biggest rival.
November 11, 2009 1:22:06 AM

nice reply comrades .
November 11, 2009 2:11:12 AM

I agree, I think I missed submesa's replay when it was originally posted.
November 11, 2009 5:33:00 AM

genuinethief said:
nice reply comrades .


Communism for everyone :) 
November 12, 2009 9:16:14 PM

amdfangirl said:
Communism for everyone :) 


That brings back some memories of the missions in COD world at war. "Good job comrades......"
!