Tom's Hardware > Forum > Windows Vista > Vista General Discussion > XP vs. Vista speed differential begins to clear

XP vs. Vista speed differential begins to clear

Forum Windows Vista : Vista General Discussion - XP vs. Vista speed differential begins to clear

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http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=1338

Adrian Kingsly-Hughes at Zdnet has been running some interesting tests on Vista SP-1. One of these tests showed XP had a rather massive speed advantage in the file copying department. But Mark Russinovich has suggested that XP removes the file copying dialog box from the screen before the actual file has been transferred whereas Vista actually waits for the file to leave the cache and get written to disk! Ah ha. So XP is sort of cheating, as it were. Maybe. The situation is unclear to say the least but Kingsly-Hughes seems to be accepting that this may indeed be the reason XP file transfers are 'faster' and has moved on to other ways of testing.

The results of his latest tests are in the link above. The short of it is that XP seems to have a marginal speed advantage but the situation is still murky. I'd be interested in the opinions of others here as to his results. One thing I will say is that any notion of 2x speed advantage for XP seems rather fanciful at this point. XP may actually be 'faster', at least in some departments, but so what. I want my OS to do more and push the limits of current hardware. As hardware and drivers get faster and faster soon we have speed overkill on Vista and it's time to move on to a more demanding OS.


From his blog:

Quote :

Average PassMark ratings, both systems under copy load:

(my edit: results NOT under copy load:
XP SP2: 509.0
Vista SP1: 469.5)



XP SP2: 490.1
Vista SP1: 384.4
Based on these results, under copy load XP SP2 achieves a PassMark rating that’s fully 27.5% better than Vista SP1.

However, using the baseline that we gathered earlier we can see the effect that the file copy load has on the benchmark rating for OS:

Under load, XP SP2 achieves a PassMark PerformanceTest rating that’s 3.7% less than the OS under no load.
Under load, Vista SP1 achieves a PassMark PerformanceTest rating that’s 18.1% less than the OS under no load.
However, oddly enough, Vista SP1 felt more responsive to user inputs such as opening applications and saving files while the tasks were being performed (we tried this out on separate runs). Problem is that it’s darn hard to measure this end responsiveness without relying more on synthetic benchmarks.

However, let’s see what we can do to clear things up …



I also suspect that superfetch is making Vista more responsive in many real world situations, as Adrian himself seems to infer above. The 'speed' race is actually quite close, IMHO. So close it's really moot.

Message quoted 1 times
Message edited by notherdude on 02-19-2008 at 04:46:18 AM
------------------------------ tehhardpro wrote :


notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
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I installed vista and reformatted and went back to Xp, Vista just is slow, post sp1 we will see, but if not I cant see me switching over to vista until Vista Sp2 I just dont see it. Xp is nice with 2gb, Vista is just coded horribly. I want to see Vista as fast as Xp but something tells me it aint happening for another year or year and a half.

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Message edited by Eternal on 02-19-2008 at 07:26:22 AM
------------------------------ Intel 6750 Gigabyte Ga -P35-S3G ATX DDR2-800x2g
Antec NeoPower 550 TrueWatts.
Reply to Eternal

interesting... I'm curious how long folks that are switching back ran Vista. I'm curious because if I understand superfetch correctly it pulls programs you normally use into ram for quicker access. I'd think that that might take a little bit for the system to learn the user...

or I could be completely wrong

------------------------------ Why is it that the more somebody talks about what Certs they have the stupider they sound?

 

Reply to vangvace

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vangvace wrote :

interesting... I'm curious how long folks that are switching back ran Vista. I'm curious because if I understand superfetch correctly it pulls programs you normally use into ram for quicker access. I'd think that that might take a little bit for the system to learn the user...

or I could be completely wrong



You are correct - Superfetch starts off on defaults, but learns as it goes.

------------------------------ Which Chip? Well, it depends on which set of thieving b@stardz you choose to support: The ones who use insider trading to enrich themselves while running their company into the ground, or the ones who illegally pay vendors to not support the first group.
Reply to Scotteq

New twist. Ed Bott tried to recreate the results on a different test bed and Vista was equal or better.

------------------------------ tehhardpro wrote :


notherdude u have an old hand. Having an old hand doesnt make sence. Cuz its old. get a new one.. seems like ur hand doesnt understand what it is writing. So placve it in ur rig instead of vista human orgnoids will amke more sense
Reply to notherdude

notherdude wrote :

http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=1338

Adrian Kingsly-Hughes at Zdnet has been running some interesting tests on Vista SP-1. One of these tests showed XP had a rather massive speed advantage in the file copying department. But Mark Russinovich has suggested that XP removes the file copying dialog box from the screen before the actual file has been transferred whereas Vista actually waits for the file to leave the cache and get written to disk! Ah ha. So XP is sort of cheating, as it were. Maybe. The situation is unclear to say the least but Kingsly-Hughes seems to be accepting that this may indeed be the reason XP file transfers are 'faster' and has moved on to other ways of testing.



Proof? from Microsoft’s tech blogging guru Mark Russinovich Inside Vista SP1 File Copy Improvements

Quote :

Perhaps the biggest drawback of the algorithm, and the one that has caused many Vista users to complain, is that for copies involving a large group of files between 256KB and tens of MB in size, the perceived performance of the copy can be significantly worse than on Windows XP. That’s because the previous algorithm’s use of cached file I/O lets Explorer finish writing destination files to memory and dismiss the copy dialog long before the Cache Manager’s write-behind thread has actually committed the data to disk; with Vista’s non-cached implementation, Explorer is forced to wait for each write operation to complete before issuing more, and ultimately for all copied data to be on disk before indicating a copy’s completion. In Vista, Explorer also waits 12 seconds before making an estimate of the copy’s duration and the estimation algorithm is sensitive to fluctuations in the copy speed, both of which exacerbate user frustration with slower copies.


Quote :

Unfortunately, the SP1 changes, while delivering consistently better performance than previous versions of Windows, can be slower than the original Vista release in a couple of specific cases. The first is when copying to or from a Server 2003 system over a slow network. The original Vista copy engine would deliver a high-speed copy, but, because of the out-of-order I/O problem I mentioned earlier, trigger pathologic behavior in the Server 2003 Cache Manager that could cause all of the server’s memory to be filled with copied file data. The SP1 copy engine changes avoid that, but because the engine issues 32KB I/Os instead of 60KB I/Os, the throughput it achieves on high-latency connections can approach half of what the original Vista release achieved.

The other case where SP1 might not perform as well as original Vista is for large file copies on the same volume. Since SP1 issues smaller I/Os, primarily to allow the rest of the system to have better access to the disk and hence better responsiveness during a copy, the number of disk head seeks between reads from the source and writes to the destination files can be higher, especially on disks that don’t avoid seeks with efficient internal queuing algorithms.



SP1 Article

Quote :

Finally, and the reason that Microsoft believes is the root of most of the Vista complaints, Explorer under XP cheated a bit with file copying operations; it considered the job done once it had finished writing a file to the write cache. Vista meanwhile doesn't consider the job done until it is done writing the file to disk, so Vista will almost never “win”.

------------------------------ Why is it that the more somebody talks about what Certs they have the stupider they sound?

 

Reply to vangvace

Eternal wrote :

I installed vista and reformatted and went back to Xp, Vista just is slow, post sp1 we will see, but if not I cant see me switching over to vista until Vista Sp2 I just dont see it. Xp is nice with 2gb, Vista is just coded horribly. I want to see Vista as fast as Xp but something tells me it aint happening for another year or year and a half.



Slow? I used XP for the past ~4 years or so and moved to Vista back in November. I really haven't noticed any difference in speed and my specs are quite equal to yours. Strange.

------------------------------ The computer allows you to make mistakes faster than any other invention, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila- Mitch Ratcliffe
Reply to bildo123
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I have not noticed and speed diffences in Vista what so ever. Programs start and execute just as fast.

Only issue I have with vista is all the extra services running..... I have disabled all I could except the aero and theme stuff which gives vista its look and appeal to me

------------------------------ Q6600@3.6(9x400)Lapped Abit IX38QuadGT,TRUE 120 Lapped,Vista Ultimate 64bit,Gigabyte HD 3870 OC'd to 860/2250 w/ Zalman Fan,4x2GB G.Skill PI-Black,CM690 w/ 5x140m 3x120m fans,Idle 28c load 42c-Corsair HX620w
Reply to xringx
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