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AMD takes a beating in DX10 benchmark

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May 15, 2007 8:44:49 PM


i would attribute that to driver issue. however, after delaying for 6 months, and yet the drivers are not even finalized. guess ATi was doing some major slack off during the 6 months it delayed.
May 15, 2007 8:49:29 PM

EDIT: duplicated post.
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May 15, 2007 8:56:57 PM




Your posts leave a lot to be desired with my "quotes" in your sig. It's lke you want to be my girlfriend or soemthing. Maybe your'e jealous of the WOMEN I have freaked out on the dnce floor.

At any rate, from the reviews I saw only the Ultra laid a smack down on it and it is aligned to compete with GTS.

Also, I don't think any of the games are actually available and the driver situation is said to be improving perf daily almost.

I would say that by the time Phenom FX is dropped there will be a 65nm XTX. I have seen 100MHz OCs online with the 80nm chip. The XTX may hit 1GHz.

For price perf it is the best deal ut right now.
May 15, 2007 9:11:40 PM

Quote:
Maybe your'e jealous of the WOMEN I have freaked out on the dnce floor.


:lol: 
May 15, 2007 9:35:37 PM


For price perf it is the best deal ut right now.

Actually, given that it barely keeps up with the 8800GTS 640MB and costs $100 more, I'd say the 8800GTS is the best price/perf deal going right now...
May 15, 2007 9:36:02 PM

hooooray, more evidence that ati drivers need some serious tuning before the 2900xt is actually a worthy card. Although they should have tested it against the 8800gts just to be fair. Of course the 8800gts probably would have won also since we know the current ati drivers suck horribly
May 15, 2007 9:47:12 PM

"today we find out that ATI has many driver issues on Lost Planet."
"AMD's Comments on Lost Planet:

Before you begin testing, there are a few points I want to convey about “Lost Planet”. “Lost Planet” is an Nvidia-sponsored title, and one that Nvidia has had a chance to look at and optimize their drivers for. The developer has not made us aware of this new benchmark, and as such the ATI Radeon driver team has not had the opportunity explore how the benchmark uses our hardware and optimize in a similar fashion. Over the next little while AMD will be looking at this, but in the meantime, please note that whatever performance you see will not be reflective of what gamers will experience in the final build of the game." :?

I really think this is a driver issue... I don't see why the numbers would be that horrible... damn AMD get those drivers optimized!
May 15, 2007 9:47:44 PM


i would attribute that to driver issue. however, after delaying for 6 months, and yet the drivers are not even finalized. guess ATi was doing some major slack off during the 6 months it delayed.

That's what I've been saying. ATI Had way to long for them to not have better drivers!!! :!:
May 15, 2007 9:49:29 PM

Quote:
"today we find out that ATI has many driver issues on Lost Planet."
"AMD's Comments on Lost Planet:

Before you begin testing, there are a few points I want to convey about “Lost Planet”. “Lost Planet” is an Nvidia-sponsored title, and one that Nvidia has had a chance to look at and optimize their drivers for. The developer has not made us aware of this new benchmark, and as such the ATI Radeon driver team has not had the opportunity explore how the benchmark uses our hardware and optimize in a similar fashion. Over the next little while AMD will be looking at this, but in the meantime, please note that whatever performance you see will not be reflective of what gamers will experience in the final build of the game." :?

I really think this is a driver issue... I don't see why the numbers would be that horrible... damn AMD get those drivers optimized!


I read that too and am dumbfounded that given the delays and what not the drivers suck this bad...
May 15, 2007 9:56:59 PM

Quote:



For price perf it is the best deal ut right now.


Wrong! Oh so Wrong! 8800GTS 320MB at a little more than half the price.
May 15, 2007 10:00:53 PM

Until fully playable games are benched these handpicked demos by either company can be misleading. That said ATI is even having trouble with their handpicked demo...link-dailytech.

Allowing drivers to be an excuse for ATI is week considering they didn't pull punches pointing out Nvidia's driver problems. When ATI had no DX10 hardware they claimed the delay would allow them to launch with a full line and better driver support; the only truth in that was being late. The fact is everything to do with Dx10 is causing more trouble for both companies and the game developers.
May 15, 2007 10:02:53 PM

Well they aren't that terrible really, there's just some problems.. I mean if they were terrible you could buy the card and not play anything haha
May 15, 2007 10:04:56 PM

Quote:
Maybe your'e jealous of the WOMEN I have freaked out on the dnce floor.


:lol: 
please post some pictures and ...benchmarks! :tongue:
May 15, 2007 10:12:44 PM

I agree the GTS is a better buy right now, but new drivers and more benchmarks should help us determine the cards real worth. Regardless the card needs to be sub $400 imo. Only time will tell at this point...AMD has wasted so much of it already why not just alil more I suppose!

Best,

3Ball
May 15, 2007 10:28:53 PM

Let's hope that the driver will improve 2900XT's performance for more than 100% or ATi is out of the game.
May 15, 2007 10:43:00 PM

AMD is in a very sad state. Complaining about the unfair advantages the competition has annoys me. How dare they to claim nvidia had an advantage? Is this the GPU Kindergarten or something? Nvidia laid open what they had six months ago while the AMD Gestapo forced NDAs down everyones throat and kept claiming to get the GTX killer going, boasting how fast and good it will be. Now the bad drivers are guilty of every shortcoming AMD made over the last decade. Everywhere everyone says "the drivers suck". Yes, right, probably they do suck, but that is no excuse.
I´m not trying to protect or Nvidia or any other corporation here - nv had a quite disastrous affair with their Vista drivers and they deserved every bit of trouble they got.
The 2900XT is, technologically speaking, a revolutionary piece of hardware. The tesselation feature alone makes it something very special and i really like what i can see AMD trying to accomplish.
Sadly, they failed.
6 months late, that´s, if someone believes the nvidia pr-propaganda, almost a whole generation in the video card industry, yet the cards performance isn´t one generation ahead of its competition but a whole generation behind (comparing GTX vs XT). And no, while the XT might be in the price range of the GTS, it is currently the fastest card AMD has to offer wich makes it the direct competitor of the GTX. At a price range of 350-450$ a lot of people will go the last step to and just buy the fastest they can get if it is only 50-100$ more.
AMD had a lot of time to prepare a good launch, but what they managed to achieve is a delayed XTX, underperforming drivers and some moaning about how nobody told them to optimize their drivers for some of the upcoming games.
The card itself might be a decent, maybe even a good piece of hardware. AMD just failed to understand that hardware alone is nothing. While i really hoped they could succeed, i´m not too surprised to see what i´m seeing.
May 15, 2007 10:52:35 PM

... and this is really the only new product that they are coming out with in 2007...

Ouch!
May 15, 2007 11:09:54 PM

I don't know...there is something fishy about these benchmarks. I think lost Planet being a Nvidia sponsored title is part of it. I think all these disclaimers like this are another part:

Quote:
One of the first games that will be patched to support DX10 graphics is Call of Juarez. Reviewers were given the opportunity to test a very early beta build of the game, the results of which you see above.


I'm going to withhold bashing ATI until we get a full batch of true DX10 benchmark tests without the *.
May 15, 2007 11:13:28 PM

Yea it looks like im probably goin to lean towards an 8800 series card now when I get the money. Since the BFG has a slight OC on their 8800GTS 640mb I will probably opt for that (the last card I got that was insanely OC'd was a 7800GT and had to many problems, so I go for the mild OC's now) since that card is $60 - $80 cheaper than the XT, it runs quieter, cooler, and uses less power not to mention it is slightly longer and I am going to have to take that $60 - $80 to replace my current optical drives with SATA optical drives in order for the 8800 to fit, since ABIT decided to play a joke on everyone who bought the AB9 Pro with the most terrible IDE placement in the history of motherboards. lol

Best,

3Ball
May 15, 2007 11:17:12 PM

There has to be a driver issue of some sort; even if the 8800GTX was faster, it should still be much higher than the results they received.
May 15, 2007 11:17:55 PM

Quote:
1st- people here laughing at ati are stupid
2nd- for those stupid people... ITS A DRIVER ISSUE YOU MORONS. see farther than your nose
3rd- how the hell could they improve the drivers if it was not tested before by tons of people ? how you retard you know that nvidia took months and months to improve their driver.
4th- nvidia cards are optimized for benchmarks as the Intel cpus are so stfu. Proof nvidia had their hands on the demo for weeks already...
5th- again you stupid


Hi. I stupid retard moron. Since I so stupid retard moron I thought that the only significant release of an entire calendar year would actually have been tested before throwing it on the street and realizing that it sucks. But I don't know much. I stupid retard moron. :lol: 
May 15, 2007 11:19:44 PM

If nVidia's cards are "optimized" for benchmarks as you say, then can you please explain why the XT scores higher than the GTX in 3Dmark scores, which is a BENCHMARK. Different cards react differently in different scenarios such is the difference in one companies arch when compared to another's. If you want to see a moron then take a look in the mirror my friend. You must be having daddy issues or something because neither company in CPU's or GPU's "optimizes" their CPU's for benchmarks...they may optimize benchmarks that they release for their CPU's but software is what is manipulative not the hardware...you need to get your facts straight and get over yourself!!!

Best,

3Ball
May 15, 2007 11:31:15 PM

Intel cpu's optimised.....haha. Maybe if it was a sse4 test then i'd agree.


Anyway, nice to see AMD telling everyone else how to do things then fucking them up theirselves. Who was that guy that said all their drivers are fine? Must be the cards that suck then?
May 15, 2007 11:40:03 PM

Quote:
1st- people here laughing at ati are stupid and got no good reason to do so.
2nd- for those stupid people... ITS A DRIVER ISSUE YOU MORONS. see farther than your nose
3rd- how the hell could they improve the drivers if it was not tested before by tons of people ? are you retards you do know that nvidia took months and months to improve their driver and is still inproving it in vista cause it sucks... again months after its realease.
4th- nvidia cards are optimized for benchmarks as the Intel cpus are so stfu. Proof nvidia had their hands on the demo for weeks already...
5th- again you stupid

The only thing I'm wondering is why ATI was sold to AMD at first. They were doing great work and now AMD has them... you know... AMD is late as always


I think there are few people here that don't realize that ATi will dramatically improve their drivers. They, and I, just don't think that this was a very good starting point for them. As a result, it is very likely that R600 will be inferior to G80 in both DX9 and DX10.

This is a shocking turn of events, since ATi has produced very good GPUs for the last four generations and have had the top GPU on the market most of the time during the last three generations. During that time, ATi hasn't produced a flagship GPU that has been as much of a stinker as this one is. It is time to worry about whether ATi will be viable during this generation.

Personally, I've never owned an Nvidia card. I've found them to not be price competitive in the midrange performance arena. If they pull a GeForce 5XXX fiasco, it might not be so fun to purchase video cards during this generation.
May 15, 2007 11:43:18 PM

Quote:
And no, while the XT might be in the price range of the GTS, it is currently the fastest card AMD has to offer wich makes it the direct competitor of the GTX.


You're deranged. Price range is what determines what is a direct competitor to what. Now I must do something that will pain me at least as much as it will pain you and everyone else: a car analogy.

That's like saying that GM's top of the line spots car is meant to be a direct competitor to Bugatti's top of the line sports car. But last I checked GM doesn't sell any $1300k sports cars...

As far as I can tell from the benchmarks I've seen so far the 2900XT trades blows with the 8800 GTS all over the place. Also, we can safely assume that future firmware, drivers, tweaks, and clock bumps will improve performance for the 2900XT but the 8800GTS is at the top of it's game. The BIGGEST thing I notice when looking at these benchmarks is that the scores are all over the freaking place and this is probably due to immature dx10 benchmarks affecting all the cards in the lineup and immature drivers affecting the 2900.

At present moment buying a 2900 at launch seems to make more sense then buying an 8800 at launch did for all but the "must compensate for phallus size" segment of the market (which is a very small segment anyway) and with a lower price point I'm sure plenty of people will no matter how loudly we point out that it has problems. There was a time when ATI was *always* trailing nVidia for performance and even when they started pulling ahead they had *horrible* driver problems (they literally fried people's monitors with one particular catalyst release). They still made money, survived, and prospered though. Just because the 2900 didn't blow the 8800GTX out of the water doesn't mean it was a complete failure. We still need to wait for the prices to normalize, drivers to mature, and new games to come out to see how it stacks up for price/performance.

There is obviously something seriously amiss with the comparison in the link of the OP. On the 2900 some things are simply not being rendered and the "motion blur" feature obviously doesn't work right with the 2900. If this were one of several released games that worked properly on a range of nVidia cards but wouldn't run on any ATI card this would be a serious issue. On a pre-release dx10 app it's not such a big issue. We're not talking about a slight difference in quality and lower framerate, it's seriously messed up on the 2900. Until you know *why* it's seriously messed up you don't know anything.
May 16, 2007 12:00:11 AM

First, Id like to actually talk to someone who has read this "bench". Im going to supply everyone here some words from the "bench".
Quote:
Before you begin testing, there are a few points I want to convey about “Lost Planet”. “Lost Planet” is an Nvidia-sponsored title, and one that Nvidia has had a chance to look at and optimize their drivers for. The developer has not made us aware of this new benchmark, and as such the ATI Radeon driver team has not had the opportunity explore how the benchmark uses our hardware and optimize in a similar fashion. Over the next little while AMD will be looking at this, but in the meantime, please note that whatever performance you see will not be reflective of what gamers will experience in the final build of the game.

Second, at 10x7, which is the only bench the GTX wins in, what the hell would anyone be gaming at that rez with those cards? And even when the ATI part does win, heres the quote
Quote:
With the resolution cranked up to 1600 x 1200 the tables were turned and the ATI Radeon HD 2900 XT was able to take the lead over the more expensive GeForce 8800 GTX by less than two frames per second. Keep in mind our previous comments back in the image quality section about the use of a filter though!

Its a known fact that the AA in the 2900 has had issues. The turn it off option, which at default looks good, is always there. Lets not jump too far here ok?
May 16, 2007 12:15:33 AM

OK, hows this? I think under your way of thinking, that ALL cpu benches should use FP ONLY as the true determination for buying one. This is nVidia sponsored. They said not even 2 frames, when they could let it speak for itself. This card costs two thirds of the GTX, now THATS fair as well. lets take a nVidia card costing two thirds od the 2900 and see what happens. Or a Intel cpu against a AMD cpu, and only use FP.
May 16, 2007 12:24:43 AM


For price perf it is the best deal ut right now.

Actually, given that it barely keeps up with the 8800GTS 640MB and costs $100 more, I'd say the 8800GTS is the best price/perf deal going right now...

The problem is that the steups are different because the review I saw showed it only losing to the GTX consistently, especially with AA/AF on. I think the best game to look at is STALKER and FEAR. Even Oblivion liked the XT. I think the review was at DriverHeaven. I linked to it from the Inq.
May 16, 2007 12:38:17 AM

I´ll forgive you your car analogy. But only this time.

Quote:

Until you know *why* it's seriously messed up you don't know anything.


I don´t need to know why it is messed up. It was delayed 6 months. They had 6 months more than the competition to prevent any mess ups. Still, something is messed up. They keep crying and complaining that no one does their work for them. That´s what i´m talking about. I´m sorry but i can´t make it any simplier to understand without reverting to grunting noises and cave drawings. AMD is supposed to be a corportion and not some 3rd grader who just lost his candy bar to the school bully. Just because "it´s just the driver" doesn´t make this okay. It´s a mess up.
Sure, it doesn´t mean the 2900XT is doomed - that´s not my point and that´s not what i´m talking about.

Maybe i´m deranged, maybe i should go outside and dance around some tree singing about how great it is that at least AMD didn´t pull off another paper launch and instead forgot to code drivers during the last 6 months. :lol: 
May 16, 2007 12:40:07 AM

What do you want me to tell you?
May 16, 2007 12:58:13 AM

I think what I posted says alot. If your competition sponsors and then gets a demo and then prepares for it and you havnt didnt and cant, then what can you tell me? Fair?
May 16, 2007 1:17:23 AM

Quote:
I think what I posted says alot. If your competition sponsors and then gets a demo and then prepares for it and you havnt didnt and cant, then what can you tell me? Fair?


No, of course not. It´s not about being unfair. Actually it´s supposed to be unfair.

Just tell me why didn´t AMD optimize their drivers for that demo? There is no good reason. No matter what demo or benchmark they would loose they would claim the same thing. What prevented them from getting the demo before releasing their drivers/cards? Do you really believe Nvidia held those Lost Planet people hostage and threatend them to kill their families if they hand over a pre-release of their demo to amd? I don´t think so. Even if Nvidia set this all up, AMD should´ve seen that one coming. They had all the time on their hands.
The launch of the first DX10 software is important for both AMD and Nvidia. How is it possible that the release of that demo took AMD by surprise? How could Nvidia sponser it and why couldn´t AMD do the same or at least get a pre-release? Maybe the demo was optimized for Nvidia because their product was available to test the demo on a lot earlier?
I guess they just saved the 20 cent for the phone call or maybe they fired the people that should´ve called and asked for the demo.
It´s all excuses. There is something wrong with AMD right now and i really, really hope they get this mess sorted out before they launch the next card or processor.
As i said, i don´t really care why they messed up. They need money and a perfect launch of a video card can´t be something impossible. I´m wasn´t even expecting a perfect launch, but only a mediocre one.
May 16, 2007 1:17:41 AM

Quote:
Maybe your'e jealous of the WOMEN I have freaked out on the dnce floor.

this forum is becoming scary 8O
May 16, 2007 1:32:45 AM

Quote:
I think what I posted says alot. If your competition sponsors and then gets a demo and then prepares for it and you havnt didnt and cant, then what can you tell me? Fair?


No, of course not. It´s not about being unfair. Actually it´s supposed to be unfair.

Just tell me why didn´t AMD optimize their drivers for that demo? There is no good reason. No matter what demo or benchmark they would loose they would claim the same thing. What prevented them from getting the demo before releasing their drivers/cards? Do you really believe Nvidia held those Lost Planet people hostage and threatend them to kill their families if they hand over a pre-release of their demo to amd? I don´t think so. Even if Nvidia set this all up, AMD should´ve seen that one coming. They had all the time on their hands.
The launch of the first DX10 software is important for both AMD and Nvidia. How is it possible that the release of that demo took AMD by surprise? How could Nvidia sponser it and why couldn´t AMD do the same or at least get a pre-release? Maybe the demo was optimized for Nvidia because their product was available to test the demo on a lot earlier?
I guess they just saved the 20 cent for the phone call or maybe they fired the people that should´ve called and asked for the demo.
It´s all excuses. There is something wrong with AMD right now and i really, really hope they get this mess sorted out before they launch the next card or processor.
As i said, i don´t really care why they messed up. They need money and a perfect launch of a video card can´t be something impossible. I´m wasn´t even expecting a perfect launch, but only a mediocre one. This sounds like a bunch of women bickering. No he didnt , yes he did, ok, now its time to be underhanded. Give me a break. I dont care what kiddy games they play. I do know that ATI has some serious driver issues that theyre working on for GAMES that are OUT. I do know that ATI has some serious AA issues, but this lil, neener neener neener crap is for kids and immature women. If at the end of the day, a 400$ card is slightly beaten by a 550$ card, who cares? The 550 SHOULD beat it, and yes I know, they shoulda, coyulda woulda regaurding the demo, which Ill remind you once again is sponsored by nVidia. How well does the RUBY demo run on nVidia? Who cares? I want real games, or at least ready on ready, not some advantage for the moment crap. This doesnt help me with a DX10 choice, does it for you? I certainly hope not. As Ive said 400 vs 550, that shouldnt even be the comarison anyways. Let the GTS640 do that job.
May 16, 2007 1:59:22 AM

Quote:
This sounds like a bunch of women bickering. No he didnt , yes he did, ok, now its time to be underhanded. Give me a break. I dont care what kiddy games they play. I do know that ATI has some serious driver issues that theyre working on for GAMES that are OUT. I do know that ATI has some serious AA issues, but this lil, neener neener neener crap is for kids and immature women.

Exactly my point. And why is AMD playing it?

Quote:

Ill remind you once again is sponsored by nVidia.

So every game that has that Nvidia logo going is supposed to run better on nvidia cards? Well, then i don´t care if nvidias hardware is crap and AMDs arch is the holy grail of technology since every other title is developed and optimized for nvidia crap. Nvidia set this up and AMD fell for it. It would´ve been better if AMd wouldn´t have commented on it at all. It´s almost ironic. All the silence in the last few months, all the NDAs and out of the sudden AMD talks. And then... it´s childish bickering.

Quote:

How well does the RUBY demo run on nVidia?

I guess nvidia didn´t sponsor that one eh? Would´ve been too obvious. Joking aside, now you´re comparing apples and oranges. The Ruby demo is hardly sponsored by AMD. It´s a pure AMD demo.

Quote:

I want real games, or at least ready on ready, not some advantage for the moment crap. This doesnt help me with a DX10 choice, does it for you?

No it doesn´t. You´re missing my point again. AMD let, and that´s the worst part, let Nvidia steal it´s thunder. The AMD product is good, it´s a really nice card. Yet i have to see those horrible numbers and childish bickering from AMD. Compare the two commets of the two companies and tell me which one sounds more mature, more professional? It´s the same thing that happend to them with the DT benchmark that came early with "bad" drivers. Doesn´t AMD learn anything? Throwing pearls to the pigs or how does that saying go?

Quote:
As Ive said 400 vs 550, that shouldnt even be the comarison anyways. Let the GTS640 do that job.

Again, not my point. But i´ll take the time to explain it at least.
There are low end, mid range and high end cards. I don´t know where exactly what category starts but the customers the different categories cater to are differnent.

For example:
Some one who buys a 150$ card is either only a occasional gamer or is on a tight budget.
Someone who shells out 250$ is someone that either needs some real GPU power and/or plays frequently.
At 400$ someone either has too much money to spend or is a hardcore gamer.

Someone choosing between a 155$ card and a 120$ card is not a possible customer for a 2900XT. The guy that really wants to spent 400$ on it is. Now that guys buying range is largely different.
We´re not talking about a penny pincher that has to rob old women to get 5$ more to get a 160$ 8600 GT. If the 2900XT is within range, the 8800GTX is most llikely in range too - he just has to decide whether it is really worth it.
That´s the main difference between the low or medium and the high range customers. And if someone has all the money and just wants the fastest card, the fastest models of both companies will be pitted against each other. That´s the whole point of it.
Doing that sort of comparison with a medium or low range card doesn´t make much sense - with the high end it is reasonable to do it though.
May 16, 2007 2:38:14 AM

*Sigh* Time for another line by line FUD bust.
Quote:
1st- people here laughing at ati are stupid and got no good reason to do so.

People aren't laughing at ATI, they're amused at the debacle that has been AMD for the last six months. If anything we feel sorry for the guys at ATI and hope that they can pull thru with better drivers and can use some of the new technology in the R600 architecture to pull a win.

Quote:
2nd- for those stupid people... ITS A DRIVER
ISSUE YOU MORONS. see farther than your nose

A driver is still part of the release. Therefore a flawed or faulty driver on release will reflect in a negative light on those that released the hardware.

Quote:
3rd- how the hell could they improve the drivers if it was not tested before by tons of people ? are you retards you do know that nvidia took months and months to improve their driver and is still inproving it in vista cause it sucks... again months after its realease.

There are so many 8800GTX's and GTS's floating around and so many games availible it boggles the mind to read that someone thinks that AMD, with all that money, can get a hold of either to test their drivers against, and see if there are any major flaws. Then again, I try to have a grip on reality so that may just be my issue.

Quote:
4th- nvidia cards are optimized for benchmarks as the Intel cpus are so stfu. Proof nvidia had their hands on the demo for weeks already...

See above statement.

Quote:
5th- again you stupid

*Response to above noted foolishness censored to protect the young and innocent minded*

Quote:
The only thing I'm wondering is why ATI was sold to AMD at first. They were doing great work and now AMD has them... you know... AMD is late as always

Ah so you finally took your foot out of your mouth. Half the tech world wonders the same.
May 16, 2007 2:53:24 AM

As Slobobob said, just about EVERY PC game out is a member of Nvidia's bull$h!t "TWIMTBP" program, so if ATI is going to perform consistently worse in these games, there are hardly any games out there for them to perform well in.
Anonymous
May 16, 2007 2:56:00 AM

OKay MORON we know your ATI brain wash fan boy. and tell me which vista drivers suck from nvidia. early ones yeah but not the ones 158.18 i play all the games on vista now. and they don't suck anymore. and as for ATI they had lot of time to come up with better hardware. not a power hungry monster. it's simple 2900XT didn't live to the hype AMD created.
May 16, 2007 3:04:14 AM

I have to agree with Slobogob completely here. AMD has no valid excuse for the lackluster performance of the 2900, and their reaction to their own failure has been disappointing at best. I've yet to see a valid explanation from AMD for all of the 2900's delays now that it has become obvious that the time wasn't spent improving drivers and working on dx10 compatability as they claimed. All of their secrecy and misleading comments have left me with little respect for them. I've been using ATI cards exclusively untill now, and I have to say that not only am I completely disappointed with their recent offering, but more importantly, I have now lost my trust for them and their parent company. I will not be using their products untill I see some big changes made; and I'm not just talking about hardware and drivers.
May 16, 2007 3:31:22 AM

Ive posted earlier that from their release the GTX and the GTS has received a 10 to 40% increase in performance. I expect the same for the 2900. So am I to blame nVidia for having to wait til today for a 20% increase in their Vista drivers in the Call of Juarez demo benches? Do any of you know how this works? How long did it take for Intel for their new revision? Lets be reasonable here ok?
May 16, 2007 3:37:34 AM

Ok heres a quote from May13th review/bench of Call of Juarez, one thing to remember is, this is a 550$ card vs a 400$ card
Quote:
The only playable resolution was at 1024x768 with no AA enabled. The NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTX with the just released Vista 158.42 drivers was able to take the performance lead and beat out the ATI HD 2900 XT by a small margin. The differences between the NVIDIA 158.18 and 158.42 drivers was significant as they managed to pull off a 20% performance boost by the driver update. The update took NVIDIA from losing this test by ten percent to actually winning it by ten percent!


May 16, 2007 3:38:29 AM

To be fair jaydeejohn you somewhat quoted out of context. It was AMD that said nVidia sponsored that benchmark. It was a quote in the article that AMD said this yet you didn't show this. Im not saying nVidia didn't sponsor it, but I would rather here it from nVidia or a trustworthy source. Not from the competition that knows its about to not fair so well in the benchmark.

Best,

3Ball
May 16, 2007 3:52:28 AM

i think that AMD is bad luck for ATi, when they were alone ATi was doing great.
May 16, 2007 3:53:12 AM

Ive already stated that AMD/ATI has issues at the moment, as did nVidia til the 13th, after their cards had been out for 7 months. Heres a quote
Quote:
NVIDIA's Comments on Lost Planet:

This week, Capcom will be releasing two versions of its Lost Planet: Extreme Condition demo for the PC. Both versions will contain the same content (i.e., no differences in game play), but one version will be DirectX 9 and the other DX 10. The latter version will be the world’s first downloadable DX 10 game demo. The demo also contains a system performance test. The test is an in-engine run-through of two levels of the game, complete with enemies, explosions and 3D meshes. The performance test shows your current FPS, average FPS, relevant system info (CPU and speed, graphics card, resolution and DX version) and, after a complete pass through of both levels, an average FPS for both the “Snow” and “Cave” sections. We think that this tester will be a useful tool for your testing purposes, as well as for your community.

Sounds like one was quite ready for this... heres another lil tidbit from the CoJ bench
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With the resolution cranked up to 1600 x 1200 the tables were turned and the ATI Radeon HD 2900 XT was able to take the lead over the more expensive GeForce 8800 GTX by less than two frames per second. Keep in mind our previous comments back in the image quality section about the use of a filter though!

So we see that unlike cpu's the gpus are a continuing process, or a much quicker or slower (depending) on inprovements. Im not an apologist here. Im just bringing info that needs to be seen and heard. These are both 2 fine cards. I think in the end, we will see each ones weakness
May 16, 2007 4:06:28 AM

Think of it this way, imagine writing new instructions for your cpu's every month, yes youtre going to see improvements, but it also ist a hit hit situation, sometimes its a give and take. Give it time, then we will know for sure
a b à CPUs
May 16, 2007 4:10:43 AM

Man... you Intel fanboys are the ones getting on my nerves now.

What gives? Why the constant attack on AMD Wombat? Got anything else to do with your life?

Seriously dude... go out, go swimming, camping.. whatever. You really need to clear your head.
May 16, 2007 4:32:37 AM

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Ive posted earlier that from their release the GTX and the GTS has received a 40% increase in performance.


Links please.
a b à CPUs
May 16, 2007 4:37:45 AM

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Ive posted earlier that from their release the GTX and the GTS has received a 40% increase in performance.


Links please.

Links?

You haven't noticed the constant driver improvements and speed improvements? I thought it was common knowledge that upon release the 8800 series drivers were horrible and now only their VISTA drivers still suck.
May 16, 2007 4:50:29 AM

The links are from annands. The first 8800 review and the 2900 review. They used the same testbeds, and all is done at 25x16. There were three games that had been used in both reviews, others were used, but not in both. Look em up if you want. I still have the info written down for crossreferencing, but youd be better to look yourself
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