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why is everyone bashing the r600 x1800 anyone? - Page 2

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May 16, 2007 10:58:06 PM

Quote:
I doubt it, 6 months delay and they can't touch the 8800GTX. Not good. I doubt nVidia has been sitting on their thumbs in the past 6 months.



The expression is HANDS... thanks for the nasty visual :x :lol:  [/b]

Speaking of nasty visual, I see you need an avatar!







I like the first one, but you know, go for whatever.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2007 11:39:28 PM

Quote:
I doubt it, 6 months delay and they can't touch the 8800GTX. Not good. I doubt nVidia has been sitting on their thumbs in the past 6 months.


nvidia has a 6+ month lead, the 7800 sat with no competition for months, as did the new 8800.
May 17, 2007 4:28:48 AM

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Value doesn't have a time horizon... it's instantaneous. When I want to buy something I don't ask myself "What will be the better value in the future?" I ask myself "What is the best value NOW?" After all... purchases are made in the present. The people buying 8800 GTXs today are doing so because they want the best performance possible and Nvidia is providing that.


I take it you upgrade quite often. For people like me though, I'm looking for something to last at least 2-3 years. I would have upgraded my sig but unforunately my finances won't permit.

Quote:
It's your ability to tell the future that I question.


I'm not flaming you but you should have seriously thought about that above statement before you wrote it. There's no logic; of course I can't predict the future; no-one can. The best that I and everyone else on this forum can, and does do, is speculate. Will ATi rebound by Christmas? You tell me.
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a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 5:10:02 AM

Quote:
Will ATi rebound by Christmas? You tell me.


Why is it that that phrase and your Avitar made me think of a 'dead-cat bounce' kind of rebound? 8O

I sure hope it's more than that. :?
May 17, 2007 5:17:23 AM

I would pay good money to see what goes on inside that head of yours Grape :lol: 
May 17, 2007 5:18:39 AM

Quote:
anyone remember the x1800 not being able to beat the 7800gtx? I sure do then a few months later the x1900 came out and put ati back on top, the same may happen with the 2900xt


The majority of people are too stupid and too far absorbed in instant gratification to see that far ahead.

Their loss.

Fanboi???


Hmm...I wonder :twisted:
May 17, 2007 5:26:14 AM

Quote:

Fanboi???


Hmm...I wonder :twisted:


How so?

I own both AMD and Nvidia; check the sig. :roll:
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 7:24:20 AM

Well most people don't know the 'dad-cat bounce' term from the market, but for some crazy reason that just popped in my head as I was reading your post.

Speaking of a little rebound recovery, it looks like the 8.38 drivers are doing a little better than their 8.37 predecessors according to HKePC's mini review;

http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/hwdb.php?tid=790821&tp=AMD-R60...

Still not about to challenge the GTX by a long shot, but looking at least competent versus the GTS-640.

I was surprised at HIS' new dedicated graphics PSU with 2 8 pin connectors and 2 6 pin connectors. Still don't like the idea of a dedicated graphics PSU.
May 17, 2007 7:49:48 AM

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Another thread from an ATI Fanboy! :roll:
To the OP, Prozac is right.The X1800XT ate the orginal 256MB 7800GTX soooooooooo easy...!
It seems that these days the ATI FanBoys are so busy! :wink:

if i'm a ati fanboy why do I have a geforce?
May 17, 2007 8:53:57 AM

You are a confused fanboy. :lol: 
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 9:02:55 AM

I like the fact that the 2900 holds the world record in 3Dmark05. 30000!!! Its nice, but any higher number by any card is nice. And I dont care for the method of the record, more the hardware.
May 17, 2007 10:31:45 AM

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if i'm a ati fanboy why do I have a geforce?

ummm...Maybe Gh0stDrag0n is right, Maybe not! :?
Ahhhhhhhhhh...Forget it! :wink:
May 17, 2007 11:26:44 AM

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I like the fact that the 2900 holds the world record in 3Dmark05. 30000!!! Its nice, but any higher number by any card is nice. And I dont care for the method of the record, more the hardware.


Here is the list from futuremark. I'll let you read for yourself what kind of GPU is used on every one of those.
Personally I couldn't care about the records and the methods used to achieve them. I mainly use futuremark to confirm performance between changes.
Quote:
1. 33953 Team Group OPB *OCX &CBB 3D Team*; Mousepot rev3+ GPUpott rev.1;Asus StrikerExtreme
2. 32966 k|ngp|n EVGA 8800gtX | CORSAIR Dominator8888
3. 31341 shark octeam pctuner.net italy
4. 31275 SpeedTime.CN ABIT-IN9-32MAX /GSKILL 8500HZ/COOLERMASTER 850W
5. 30730 Gandalfone-(tecnocomputer italia)-ThuG OC Team-Qballe-#ABIT-IN9-32MAX
6. 30642 MemoryExtreme-Team-Italy
7. 30257 OPPAINTER ----> Xtremesystems 3DTeam
8. 30140 hipro5 #HOT# (Hellas Overclocking Team) X8800 SLI AIR
9. 30101 *Overklokk* Asus Striker and Asus 8800GTX SLI

LINK
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 11:33:44 AM

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I mainly use futuremark to confirm performance between changes.
And thats not even reliable. Last gen, ATI was lower than nVidia, and it won. This gen, just the opposite. Tho it does give a ballpark figure, and once the cards are assesed as how they perform in it, then you can actually "see" some of the improvements
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 2:50:40 PM

Quote:
I like the fact that the 2900 holds the world record in 3Dmark05. 30000!!! Its nice, but any higher number by any card is nice. And I dont care for the method of the record, more the hardware.


Here is the list from futuremark. I'll let you read for yourself what kind of GPU is used on every one of those.

He's talking about a SINGLE card, not SLi/Xfire.
Kinc of NordicHardware set the new single card record with the HD2900XT running near 1.2ghz.
May 17, 2007 3:17:24 PM

Quote:
I like the fact that the 2900 holds the world record in 3Dmark05. 30000!!! Its nice, but any higher number by any card is nice. And I dont care for the method of the record, more the hardware.


Here is the list from futuremark. I'll let you read for yourself what kind of GPU is used on every one of those.

He's talking about a SINGLE card, not SLi/Xfire.
Kinc of NordicHardware set the new single card record with the HD2900XT running near 1.2ghz.

You are correct though he had not worded it that way. Why is it not on Futuremark's data? Approved drivers?
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 3:39:27 PM

Quote:
You are correct though he had not worded it that way. Why is it not on Futuremark's data? Approved drivers?


I don't know I think that futuremark doesn't split the 'Hall of Fame' into SLi and Single, I think it's just the raw numbers. This of course first popped up when all the Futuremark scores were GF6800s in SLi while the X800XTPE was the fastest single card.

Drivers would also be a issue now since they're all alphas and betas right?

I'm also not sure if Kinc, Kingpin, Fugger, Maci and Oppainter, et al actually submit all their work in the early stages. They may make an official run later once they know what they have (although I guess really it's just a question of hiting 'submit' so I could be wrong.
I suspect that someone wil run 2 HD2900XTs in Xfire and then submit eventually and likely knock the GTXs off the Bungholio list, but we probably will have to wait (not that I'd bother actually waiting) for 'aproved drivers' before it reachs the HoF list.

I don't really care about the result, I just care about the insane core speeds and such. I'd love to see breakdowns of benchmarks at those king of speeds, because you gotta think finally at 1.2ghz the HD2900 is finally making good use of the 512bit bandwidth. :wink:
May 17, 2007 6:47:57 PM

:)  Shows that there is some great potential in 2900.

Just imagine what a 65nm shrink could do for it. Should get rid of the leakage of the current 80nm process and could boast some nice clock speeds.
May 17, 2007 6:49:03 PM

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Now you suggest that we wait for the next card. A 3000 generation perhaps? But AMD doesn't have the cash to develope it.


Do you have proof that they don't have the "capital" or resources to not develop a new card? Following your logic AMD/ATI should just close their doors and go out of business then huh. I wonder how AMD got a B rating since they are so bad off financially. :roll: :roll:

My basis for this statement is their net income of a -166 million dollars in Q4/06, -611 million in Q1/07, and continued negative income predictions in Q2/07 and Q3/07. Their cash on hand will dry up as the creditors are paid and their operating capital will diminish towards $0. Hopefully, they will sell enough of the new video cards, along with fixing whatever is wrong with them, and that will give them some cash coming in, rather than just cash going out. Only when they get into positive cash flow numbers will they be able to give the R&D departments money for developing a 3000 card.

I'm not meaning to say that AMD should close its doors and go out of business, but rather that they can't afford any more mistakes. If they can't compete for the fastest title, I think they should at concentrate on making middle ground products that work.

*Sigh* I am glad that you aren't my financial advisor. AMD isn't even close to the point you are touting. Basically you said the same thing in a long written out paragraph that you said before. Only you showed your lack of financial knowledge and prowess this time more profoundly.

In any case assuming your situation and numbers are correct (which they aren't but just for the sake of this argument); Do you really think AMD is going to cut off funding to its R&D department, instead of cutting costs in other areas? Yeah right, AMD might as well close their doors as I said before.

But in reality I don't think the ATI acquisition was a mistake. It was an investment. When you say AMD doesn't have room for more mistakes...maybe this was all part of the plan. IMO ATI is not a handicap it is a huge plus for AMD. But most people yell and scream...look at the debt it created. Duh, look at what ATI may bring to the table. This chapter is only beginning to be written. So lets just wait and see what the future will bring.
May 17, 2007 7:15:44 PM

Not like they can't just borrow more money till they are back in the black either :) 
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2007 10:47:26 PM

Quote:
:)  Shows that there is some great potential in 2900.

Just imagine what a 65nm shrink could do for it. Should get rid of the leakage of the current 80nm process and could boast some nice clock speeds.


I agree, but clocks won't help some situatiuons alone, the interesting thing is the potential added die space available from a redesign (since it's not an optical shrink) might allow them to improve the back end a bit by changing the TU or ROP design/allotment. There's alot of discussion about that potential, but I'm not about to hold my breath.

Either way I think the 65nm would be beneficial, if just from a power/heat perspective alone. Not sure if it'll make it competative (heck I don't think anyone knows what that takes until solid drivers are out), but it'd still be better than it is now.... baring any unforseen flaws.
May 18, 2007 8:38:48 PM

Quote:
:)  Shows that there is some great potential in 2900.

Just imagine what a 65nm shrink could do for it. Should get rid of the leakage of the current 80nm process and could boast some nice clock speeds.


I agree, but clocks won't help some situatiuons alone, the interesting thing is the potential added die space available from a redesign (since it's not an optical shrink) might allow them to improve the back end a bit by changing the TU or ROP design/allotment. There's alot of discussion about that potential, but I'm not about to hold my breath.

Either way I think the 65nm would be beneficial, if just from a power/heat perspective alone. Not sure if it'll make it competative (heck I don't think anyone knows what that takes until solid drivers are out), but it'd still be better than it is now.... baring any unforseen flaws.

Hopefully Kinc will run some tests other than 3dmark at a high OC, so we could tell if ATi could take the crown back with a shrink and clock boost alone.

It may not be nearly as efficient as balancing the architecture, but it may be enough. I guess we'll see :) 
May 18, 2007 9:11:44 PM

Quote:
I doubt it, 6 months delay and they can't touch the 8800GTX. Not good. I doubt nVidia has been sitting on their thumbs in the past 6 months.



The expression is HANDS... thanks for the nasty visual :x :lol:  [/b]

Speaking of nasty visual, I see you need an avatar!







I like the first one, but you know, go for whatever.

Twisted Sister ROCKS man! :twisted:
May 18, 2007 10:54:56 PM

Word. Iron Maiden isn't bad either. I was actually hoping he would grab that first pic, it would make a bad@ss avatar.


edit: I guess he would have to resize it in photoshop.
May 20, 2007 11:11:16 PM

Quote:
macer1
sad to see ppl comparing a 550$ card to a 400$ card LMFAO . nvidia sucks compaired to ATI hell my x700pro kills there crappy 6200.
compare apple to apples and see what you get.



If you would actually read the post rather than reading what you want your eyes to read I am not comparing a $550 card to a $400 card.

I am comparing a 640 MB 8800GTS by EVGA which costs $359 on newegg.com as of today compared to the 2900XTs on newegg which by inlarge were priced $429 as of yesterday.

That is a fair comparison comparing apple to apple. Not apples to oranges which would be a unfair comparison between a $550 768MB 8800GTX to a $429 2900XT. The 2900XTX will contend with the 8800GTX when ever ATI chooses to release it.

Answer my question. Why would you pay $70 more for a 2900XT when you could get a 8800GTS for $70 less which runs cooler, quieter, has 128 more MB of ram and offers comparible performance?

Stop bragging about your x700pro crushing Nividia's 6200. That message board thread ended about 3 years ago.


Well often times when people cannot brag about the present they brag about the past, because its always a way to "1up" another individual because the past is set in stone.

Though such insults only really offend those that have an emotional attachment to their respective favorite company which only sees them as Dollars and Cents.

Anyone else just laughs it off.

Why brag about the past when anyone now only cares about the present and future?
May 20, 2007 11:39:32 PM

Loyalty to a company was betrayed when Intel won the cpu race, and if amd comes with a cpu than everyone says how Intel sucks, funny and strange humans and computers are. Mine is better, that is the best. Ever have a family member that brag about everything they have. What I do is say, can’t take it when you go. For now nvidia is doing quite well for themselves and ati is not doing so well and tomorrow ati might be better and everyone will swear they have the better card and for that time they won the race. 6 months nvida has the better card and they are the best, reminds me of that family member. We humans are so very strange you would think some are from a different planet. It’s the blood of god race has been taken over by the other blood line and humans can smell the different blood lines and fight about it.
May 21, 2007 1:16:27 AM

Quote:
Loyalty to a company was betrayed when Intel won the cpu race, and if amd comes with a cpu than everyone says how Intel sucks, funny and strange humans and computers are. Mine is better, that is the best. Ever have a family member that brag about everything they have. What I do is say, can’t take it when you go. For now nvidia is doing quite well for themselves and ati is not doing so well and tomorrow ati might be better and everyone will swear they have the better card and for that time they won the race. 6 months nvida has the better card and they are the best, reminds me of that family member. We humans are so very strange you would think some are from a different planet. It’s the blood of god race has been taken over by the other blood line and humans can smell the different blood lines and fight about it.


I think i speak for everyone here when i say...WTF?
are you a scientologist? ;p
May 22, 2007 3:14:44 PM

Quote:
Loyalty to a company was betrayed when Intel won the cpu race, and if amd comes with a cpu than everyone says how Intel sucks, funny and strange humans and computers are. Mine is better, that is the best. Ever have a family member that brag about everything they have. What I do is say, can’t take it when you go. For now nvidia is doing quite well for themselves and ati is not doing so well and tomorrow ati might be better and everyone will swear they have the better card and for that time they won the race. 6 months nvida has the better card and they are the best, reminds me of that family member. We humans are so very strange you would think some are from a different planet. It’s the blood of god race has been taken over by the other blood line and humans can smell the different blood lines and fight about it.


I think i speak for everyone here when i say...WTF?
are you a scientologist? ;p

WTF is right....

Water walking cheek turners vs. green blooded martians? This guy needs to write a book and sell the rights to Spielberg.
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