not a total n00b, but i need a second head...

'ello everyone,

the names root, and i need soem help. my love affair with computers is rather large, and i'm getting up the funds to build my first custom system. i'll be building a desktop mostly built for gaming, music, and recording. i've gotten a good idea for the parts i need, but i need soem more experienced opinions to make sure i havent made any errors before i drop the cash and pick up my screw driver. i'm doing all my shopping off tigerdirect.com, and i think i have a good lineup of parts. in advance, i know i dont have any fans picked out..

so heres the parts ihave picked out:

barebone tower kit- ultra uv atx mid tower case, Intel D945GCCRL Intel Socket 775 MicroATX Motherboard, Intel Celeron D 360 3.46GHz OEM Processor, Ultra X-Connect 400-Watt Titanium UV Clear Sides Power Supply

graphics card: EVGA GeForce 7600 GS 512mb

sound card: Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi Extreme Audio

RAM memory: US Modular 1024MB PC4200 DDR2 533MHz Memory x2

hard drive: Seagate / Barracuda 7200.10 / 250GB / 7200 / 8MB / NCQ / Serial ATA-300 / OEM / Hard Drive

wireless net: Linksys WMP54GS PCI Wireless Network Adapter - 54Mbps, 802.11g

so have i missed anything?
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  1. Where are you planning on buying this stuff from?

    Stay away from everything Celeron! In this day in age they're overpriced POS's. A low end AMD X2 or C2D will demolish any Celeron.

    The chipset for the motherboard you picked out is a dead. With that mobo the build has no future.

    What's your budget for this pc? I have a bunch of ideas on how to improve this build, but I need a budget first.
  2. buying it from tigerdirect.com..

    my budget is 600, and i'm already pushing it. i'm justlooking for something ot get me by, its not like i'm going ot be playing WoW till 4 in the morning. the motherboard and celeron processor come with the case. unless you can point me to a place that has really good prices and really good kits, its all i got to work with. as a side note, i'm trying ot stick with intel, i could never stand amd processors.
  3. No Newegg? They're cheaper.

    Anyway, that's plenty of cash.

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    Gigabyte DS3 - $130
    OCZ DDR2-800 2x 1gb - $90
    430w Antec NeoHE - $80
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145

    Total - $559.50

    Pick a case and you're set.

    I tried to stick will Tigerdirect, but um... Yeah...
  4. i'm staying away from things with the rebates becuause i probably wont be buying all this within the next month. i'm also a big fan of nvidia cards,and in theory, wouldnt the 512mb one i originally picked out be cheaper and a bit more powerful?and you can feel free ot use any site you like, i'm open to all suggestiosn that will save this poor musician some hard cash.
  5. I hope rootnote listens to you, that's good advice.
  6. One of the reasons I hate Tigerdirect, the things that look cheaper are really just items with rebates. Newegg is just cheap.

    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83

    No rebate, it's just cheap.

    Unless you're gaming at a high res vram doesnt matter much, the 1950pro is much faster then the 7600gs.

    Oh, and thanks Zorg. :)
  7. apt403, thank you, i am now throwing my original idea out the window.

    so with your preferred newegg, minus the case+cd drive, a list of all needed part in my budget:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50 -processor
    Gigabyte DS3 - $130 -motherboard
    Corsair 2x1gb - $70 - ram
    430w Antec NeoHE - $80 -power supply
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145 -graphics

    what about a hard drive, sound card, and wireless net?
  8. Damn, I knew I was forgetting something!

    I put that build together in hast when I read your edited post saying no AMD. My original list was an AMD box. So I will now proceed to tweak my own list.

    Instead of the DS3 get the MSI Neo-F, it'll save you about $40.

    For the psu get this instead. It has virtually the same amount of power, the quality is about the same, and it's cheaper.

    That's about it for the tweaking.

    Don't worry about the sound card, the onboard sound is fine. As for the wifi card, do you really need it? I perfer a good old ethernet cable myself...

    For the optical drive get a NEC 7170A, the HDD you picked out is fine.

    So, here's the new build.

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    MSI Neo-F - $85
    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145
    450w FSP Group PSU - $58
    NEC 7170A - $31
    250gb Seagate HDD - $66

    Total - 582.50
  9. Do you have an operating system and if not did you figure that into your budget? The bare bones system you mentioned at first puts most of your money in the hard drive, sound card and under powered video card and leaves little else for the things that really make your system.

    Take the system apt403 pieced together and add a hard drive to it. The drive you specified was $69.99 at Tiger Direct and is $66.99 at Newegg just to give an example. As for the sound card your motherboard has onboard sound which you can use until you can save for a dedicated sound card. As for the wireless card, what router do you have, do you need a wireless card to access the internet or can you use a wired connection.

    Bottom line is absolutely do not get the system you thought of first. If the system apt403 spec'd out for you is a little too much or if you have different needs we can help but with that other one your paying for old obsolete and discontinued technology.

    Edit: Post above me was made while I was typing. I just thought that if he wasn't using Vista he really doesn't need 2gb of RAM, a 1gb stick would be sufficiant.
  10. ok, everyone, lets take this monment to breathe.

    ok.

    as of now, i do have a OS, and for now, i'll be putting XP on it, but i plan to upgrade to vista in a year(when 3/4 of the bugs are fixed), so i'm hugging that 2gb of RAM.

    as for a wireless card, yes i do need one, badly. my entire house, all 4 computers, are networked off a linksys wireless b router becuase i live in a 157 year old house, and all that cable would drive the historical people nuts.

    so the new build is:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    MSI Neo-F - $85
    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145
    450w FSP Group PSU - $58
    NEC 7170A - $31
    250gb Seagate HDD - $66

    now i was shopping for cases, and found one i happened to like, and it coems with a 450w psu, would this do: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811156177
  11. The case will work fine, but the PSU won't. Raidmax power supplies pretty low quality to begin with, and bundled power supplies are usually old, lowend stock a company just wants to get rid of.

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811117086&CMP=EMC-IGNEFL051707&ATT=N82E16811117086

    It's a decent case, and it's FREE after the MIR.
  12. I looked at their site and I would tend to shy away from a included PSU when they don't mention the brand or specs on it.
  13. No specs on the site? Wow...

    Newegg has a picture of the label, it has a single +12v rail @ 14a. So it doesnt have enough power for the system anyway.
  14. ok no nix on the included power supply cases. and i wont need a cd/dvd drive as i have one salvaged from a old pc, so the new, new list is:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    MSI Neo-F - $85
    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145
    450w FSP Group PSU - $58
    250gb Seagate HDD - $66
    linksys wireless g - $55

    Total - 606.50

    so i can probably scower the 2-50 range for a case, becuase i have ot buy a monitor too(already have one picked out, $150 17" widescreen lcd)

    a new idea, i could salvage the case the cd/dvd drive came in and save $50 as long as the motherboard fits right?
  15. That list looks really good I think you'll be very impressed at what $600 can buy you. Good luck.
  16. Hey Andy,

    Nice to see your moving on to building your own computer. It's a fun hobby, glad to see someone new pursuing it! Anyways, on to your build. I've been building computers for a year, and I've found some sites that are much better than www.tigerdirect.com. Tigerdirect is good sometimes when you get deals from them, but for the most part, I tend to stay away from them due to inflated prices on shipping, and products in general. A lot of users here will point you in the direction of a very good site called www.newegg.com. It's a very good site with low prices, and amazing customer service unless something goes wrong. Another good site is www.zipzoomfly.com, although not on par with the service from Newegg, but their prices are definately cheap, sometimes cheaper than Newegg!

    Another thing I tend to stay away from, are the barebone deals from them. I understand they may be cheaper, but they are always cheaper for a reason. Most of the motherboards and CPUs are generations behind, even for people with lower budgets. Anyways, off from the boring stuff.

    Anyways, here's a list I've compiled for 600$. I've done this a couple time for some friends.

    CPU - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103747 - 97$

    The Athlon X2 4200+ For socket AM2. This is a good, solid dual-core processor. The socket AM2 will provide you with future upgradability for the future, in case you want to.

    Motherboard - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131024

    The Asus M2V Socket AM2 - Looks like a good solid motherboard for about 70-ish dollars. Provides up to 8 gigs of RAM [Doubtfull that you'll use it.], and a PCI-express slot, which is the standard for todays graphics cards.

    RAM - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820208283

    Transcend JETRAM. Not a well known brand, but it will have to do for your needs. Comes with a Lifetime Limited warranty, though you probably won'ot use it. Has some good reviews on Newegg too. Cheap for 2 gigs of Dual channel RAM too.

    CD/DVD Writer - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106043

    Lite-ON generic DVD burner. Just something to go on with your PC. Pretty much a must need.

    Hard Drive - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148144

    Seagate 7200.10 250 GB with Perpendicular Recording technology, SATA 3.0 GB. A really fast hard drive with the new perpendicular technology. SATA is quickly becoming the standard for hard drives.

    Video Card - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130017

    eVGA 7600 GT. 120$. Good card for the price. eVGA over the other brands because they just have EXCELLENT technical support, 24/7, on all days of the year, and their service is excellent.

    Power Supply - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817103937

    Antec Smart Power 2.0 500 watt. Enough power for your system. Antec is known to have good, solid power supplies.


    That leaves you with about 50-60$ for a case. This is assuming you of course have the operating system. If not, you can downgrade your CPU to a 3600+ for about 40$, saving you about 60$, and you can find cheaper power supplies.


    Hope these provide you with enough of a basic outlook on what to buy.

    Edit:

    Ah, I realized there were a bunch of responses. I didn't realize you didn't need a case, and some of the other parts. Apt's list looks perfect for your needs, and is more powerful than mine. The Intel build will definately be more powerful.
  17. Theres always the option of dropping 1 Gig of ram and picking up a wireless card, and adding another Gig down the road.
  18. Lets's see if we can knock it down some.
    First the $13 wi-fi cards are fine, I have 2 of them.
    There are deals to be found on gfx cards, always seeing a good one for $99. Fry's and Circuit City will have one at least once a month.
    Yes most cases will work unless it was from a PC-maker like Dell or Compac.
    There is a little, and if you take some time, you will find deals on everything.
  19. Quote:
    apt403, thank you, i am now throwing my original idea out the window.

    so with your preferred newegg, minus the case+cd drive, a list of all needed part in my budget:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50 -processor
    Gigabyte DS3 - $130 -motherboard
    Corsair 2x1gb - $70 - ram
    430w Antec NeoHE - $80 -power supply
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145 -graphics

    what about a hard drive, sound card, and wireless net?


    You don't have the HD from you old system you can use temporarily? I like the above system with a cheap WIFI card, as per alcattle. I was going to suggest the SLK3000B case with out the truepower PS, but it appears they don't sell it anymore, at least I can't find it. The truepower PSs had some problems. Maybe you can call antec and ask them where you can get it. It is sbout $50-$60and it works well for me. I also don't like the FSP 450W, everyone recommends them, but looking at Newegg reviews it appears they have their own problems.

    @all, Yes I know you can't rely on Newegg reviews but these PS failures seemed legitimate. read the reviews and post you opinion.
  20. I counted about 15 bad reviews that looked legit, that's pretty good out of 115 reviews. 87 of 'em giving the psu 5 stars.
  21. I know that is not a true percentage of the ones sold but 13% is still a little scary. I just looked at the Neo HE430 and it appears to have even more bad reviews. I thought that the only Antec PSs that were really suspect were the smartpower. I might have to get away from Antec PSs all together. I guess you need to be in the +$100-125 min. range, which I have always recommended, to get the failure rates down. I guess for a budget build you just throw the dice.
  22. do not get the Antec Smart Power Series. they suck...

    personal experience
  23. Quote:
    ok no nix on the included power supply cases. and i wont need a cd/dvd drive as i have one salvaged from a old pc, so the new, new list is:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    MSI Neo-F - $85
    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145
    450w FSP Group PSU - $58
    250gb Seagate HDD - $66
    linksys wireless g - $55

    Total - 606.50



    Just starting reading here, but hey root that's a pretty solid system for $600. Everyone, as usual came back with some great suggestions. I see some people are suggesting the 7600gt, but for my money I would stick with the 1950 pro. This rig is easily twice the system you had originally picked out, and will be around for a good while to upgrade when have a few extra $$$'s.
  24. Quote:
    The case will work fine, but the PSU won't. Raidmax power supplies pretty low quality to begin with, and bundled power supplies are usually old, lowend stock a company just wants to get rid of.


    I disagree. My Raidmax Aurora has been healthy and strong since day one, powering 4 HDD, 1900xtx and a few other things..

    And I'm yet to have an OEM PSU in a case fail, ever. I've built 5 comps in last 2 years (all using supplied psu, cept mine which i upgraded from later cuz of the 1900xtx) and all are still running fine. Might just be that I'm getting lucky though :D Having a nice PSU is generally only critical IMO when the user plans on getting a big VGA and/or overclocking. Although there are some company's PSU's that I would definitely shy away from...>.<
  25. Quote:
    ok no nix on the included power supply cases. and i wont need a cd/dvd drive as i have one salvaged from a old pc, so the new, new list is:

    Intel E4300 - $114.50
    MSI Neo-F - $85
    G. Skill 2x 1gb - $83
    Sapphire 1950pro - $145
    450w FSP Group PSU - $58
    250gb Seagate HDD - $66
    linksys wireless g - $55

    Total - 606.50



    Just starting reading here, but hey root that's a pretty solid system for $600. Everyone, as usual came back with some great suggestions. I see some people are suggesting the 7600gt, but for my money I would stick with the 1950 pro. This rig is easily twice the system you had originally picked out, and will be around for a good while to upgrade when have a few extra $$$'s.

    Save some cash and get a cheap 7900GS, they are amazing value now

    just check out the Great deals thread in my sig.

    the XFX 7900GS XXX Edition for $135 is great value as is the BFG 7900GS for $100.

    Buy one they rock.
  26. Quote:
    The case will work fine, but the PSU won't. Raidmax power supplies pretty low quality to begin with, and bundled power supplies are usually old, lowend stock a company just wants to get rid of.


    I disagree. My Raidmax Aurora has been healthy and strong since day one, powering 4 HDD, 1900xtx and a few other things..

    And I'm yet to have an OEM PSU in a case fail, ever. I've built 5 comps in last 2 years (all using supplied psu, cept mine which i upgraded from later cuz of the 1900xtx) and all are still running fine. Might just be that I'm getting lucky though :D Having a nice PSU is generally only critical IMO when the user plans on getting a big VGA and/or overclocking. Although there are some company's PSU's that I would definitely shy away from...>.<

    lucky bastard...
  27. Quote:
    i have ot buy a monitor too(already have one picked out, $150 17" widescreen lcd)


    Don't know what your needs are, but you could save some serious cash if you get a CRT from eBay. They go for like $20. But you'll have to find one in your area to go pick it up for that price.
  28. i really do need the lcd as my desk is kinda small space wise.

    so it looks like the PSU is under debate...
  29. Classic Engrish:
    http://www.lian-li.com/product/product06.php?pr_index=20&cl_index=1&sc_index=1&ss_index=4&type=a

    "PC-A10 is Lian Li the most Powerful Model"


    why cant they get good ol american teenagers to fix these kinds of problems

    hell id do it for minimum wage
  30. I like the setup as is but if your not planning to overclock you could go with something like this for $64.99 and save yourself about $20. 533 RAM is all you need for a 1066 CPU to run at 1:1. Then use that $20 to help buy you're wireless card.
  31. to have duo core and not over clock? come on now.... though i do like the setup i have now, i think it should do me for awhile. now what about possible future upgrades.....i know a sound card, but what else?
  32. Really depends upon your needs. Better video card, faster CPU, more or larger hard drives. I think that system will be better than you could imagine, you would be suprised at what a modest amount of money can get you. Read this.
  33. for your power supply needs, go to jonnyguru.com, sign up on the forums, list your parts, and they will suggest one.

    You actually got lucky, because that ultra-X from that original bare bones build is REALLY good, but *most* PSUs that come in cases are crap.

    Jonnyguru reviews PSUs as an avid hobby and works on them for a living, so he'll do you right.
  34. I don't know why anyone would get a 7600 or 7900 over a 1950pro for the difference in price the 1950 is the better card.Don't skimp on the PSU either as a fast vid card and future upgrades might leave some cheapo models wanting. Never had a problem with Antec.
  35. ok,so if i overclock this 1.8 duo core, how much faster will it be once overclocked?
  36. Quote:
    ok,so if i overclock this 1.8 duo core, how much faster will it be once overclocked?


    well I guess it depends on how far you overclock it

    if you oc it to 3.6ghz it will be roughly 2x faster

    if you oc it to 5.4ghz it will be roughly 3x faster

    if you oc it to 7.2ghz it will be roughly 4x faster

    if you oc it to 9.0ghz it will be roughly 5x faster

    and so on until you get to 18ghz where it is 10x faster

    all you need is imagination :D
  37. Off the top of my head you should easily get to 2.6 stable on stock cooling with a significant boost in perf. some others here should be able to give some better numbers. You won't know for sure how much until you try.
  38. hey guys, back again! i'm looking at this mother board apt403 reccommended, and its reviews are starting ot bother me (for quick reference: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130052). i can probably squeeze an extra $20-$40 for a tad bit better motherboard. any suggestions/reccomendations?
  39. Quote:

    Instead of the DS3 get the MSI Neo-F, it'll save you about $40.


    I think that link is wrong.
  40. Quote:
    Classic Engrish:
    http://www.lian-li.com/product/product06.php?pr_index=20&cl_index=1&sc_index=1&ss_index=4&type=a

    "PC-A10 is Lian Li the most Powerful Model"


    why cant they get good ol american teenagers to fix these kinds of problems

    hell id do it for minimum wage


    Grammar!!!! :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:
  41. soany reccomendations?
  42. Could save a little more on the CPU if you go with one of the new Allendales:

    Intel Dual-Core E2140 Allendale 1.6GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E2140 - Retail $83
    Intel Dual-Core E2160 Allendale 1.8GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E2160 - Retail $91

    Less cache than the E4x00's and E6xx0's, but it would free up cash for a better video card or power supply. What do y'all think?
  43. na, need that prcessor, i plan to overclock. i'm just looking to get a better motherboard.
  44. You could still overclock one of the new Allendale processors. I can't remember where I saw the review, but they have performance pretty close to the e6300 and e6320, I think. It couldn't hurt to at least consider em...
  45. What about this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128042 or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128017 ? I personally would go with the DS3 as it will last you longer, but both are good overclockers. I have an E4300 at 3 GHz on a DS3.
  46. Well, this motherboard will suit you well.

    It also has great upgrade-ability.

    I'm no expert by any means. But this is a good mobo.
  47. Quote:
    You could still overclock one of the new Allendale processors. I can't remember where I saw the review, but they have performance pretty close to the e6300 and e6320, I think. It couldn't hurt to at least consider em...

    I think this is the review you are referring to:

    http://legionhardware.com/document.php?id=653

    They went to 3.0GHz with the stock cooler, stock volts, and 3.4GHz with an aftermarket cooler.
  48. Daredevil, the psu in that case had a single 12V rail @ 14amps... That is not going to cut it for the system people are listing here.
  49. i think i'll go with the ds3 mobo, it has good reviews and i think will do good for what i need. thanks guys, again ,you all rock
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