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Linux hosted by PocketPC?

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Last response: in Cell Phones & Smartphones
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Anonymous
May 24, 2004 11:16:27 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Hi,
I know there is www.handhelds.org working on the Familiar Linux
distribution and e.g. Xanadux whith a replacement kernel model, i.e.
you have to reflash the ROM and the developers have to adapt to each
new CPU and device driver.

What I could not yet find is a Linux kernel running as a plain
application/process on PocketPC/WinCE using its device drivers.

Of course, this would not reach 100% of the optimal speed - and
supporting some devices (frame buffer, battery manager, ...) by Linux
system calls might become very tricky. And it would consume (a lot) of
the user memory. But it would make life easier for users and
developers.

A similar approach appears to exist for Windows 2k and XP:
http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/04/29/co...

Did I miss something or is anybody interested/working on such a
project?

-- hns

More about : linux hosted pocketpc

Anonymous
May 24, 2004 9:56:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Hi!

Dr. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
> What I could not yet find is a Linux kernel running as a plain
> application/process on PocketPC/WinCE using its device drivers.

handhelds.org is working on a dualboot solution, e.g. PocketPC on Flash,
Linux on external flashcard. At the moment it's impossible to fragment the
internal RAM. Linux tries to allocate and clear all RAM while PocketPC is
storing user's data in RAM, but this is an item on their todo-list.

That's not what you're looking for, but I can't see the deeper sence in a
solution following your idea.

Greets, Michael.
May 25, 2004 1:50:36 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Hello

I'm also interested by such an idea...

It could help developpers to easily port Linux softwares on Windows
PocketPC.

An other way could be to have a PocketPC version of Cygwin
( http://www.cygwin.com )

or a minimalist GNU for Windows PocketPC ( http://www.mingw.org/ )

Sebastien Celles
Related resources
Anonymous
May 25, 2004 6:32:57 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Michael Holtermann <spamnov2003@gmx.de> wrote in message news:<fhi9o1-fp7.ln1@spinnacker.mholti.homelinux.net>...
> handhelds.org is working on a dualboot solution, e.g. PocketPC on Flash,
> Linux on external flashcard. At the moment it's impossible to fragment the
> internal RAM. Linux tries to allocate and clear all RAM while PocketPC is
> storing user's data in RAM, but this is an item on their todo-list.
>
> That's not what you're looking for, but I can't see the deeper sence in a
> solution following your idea.

It seems to go a direction I am looking for - I don't mind if Linux is
on a separate flash card - as long as I can easily switch back and
forth.

Well, there would be a financial benefit of my approach - you won't
have to purchase an additional card :-)

hns
Anonymous
May 25, 2004 8:17:35 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

> That's not what you're looking for, but I can't see the deeper sence in a
> solution following your idea.

Well, one deeper sense is to have drivers for new devices and CPUs
available eariler. Did you ever try to install a new WLAN card on
Linux? There are many cards out there that are plug and play on
PocketPC (example: SanDisk Connect Plus does not work on Linux yet).
Why not leverage that benefit by a "Linux on PocketPC" - by
sacrificing a little speed?

And think about the boot process itself. When reasoning a little more
about the "Linux on a Flash Card" approach: how many versions for
different PDA models need to be managed? Look at the www.handhelds.org
list of supported models. They always lag behind because it needs for
our Linux community some 6-12 months to find out the special functions
of a new model...

So it takes the enthusiasts a lot of time to find a PDA model for
which a stable Linux kernel is ported to and that you still can buy
(not only on e-bay :-).

-- hns
Anonymous
May 25, 2004 5:01:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

"noone@nowhere.com" <noone@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:<c8tjma$4lj$1@news-reader1.wanadoo.fr>...

> I'm also interested by such an idea...

Would you be interested in joining a project with such an aim?

It could be hosted at Source-Forge (there is already a silent project
called PocketLinux there).

Developers would need AFAIK:
* a PocketPC device
* Download MS Visual C++ tools for PocketPC
* some(one with) knowledge about how PocketPC works
* some(one with) knowledge about how the Linux kernel works

-- hns
Anonymous
May 25, 2004 8:48:21 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Hi!

Dr. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
> Well, one deeper sense is to have drivers for new devices and CPUs
> available eariler. Did you ever try to install a new WLAN card on
> Linux? There are many cards out there that are plug and play on

Yes, I've tried that. And kicked out the card and went back to wired
LAN :-). The card was a SMC2802v2.

Okay, thanks for your reply. Now your idea comes with some kind of flair :-)

I guess you'll need one of the state-of-the-art handhelds. I've got an iPAQ
3660, and opie runs more slowly than PocketPC.

Is there any software available like VirtualPC? Maybe this could be an
approach.

Greets, Michael.
May 26, 2004 2:12:28 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

Dr. Nikolaus Schaller a écrit :

> "noone@nowhere.com" <noone@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:<c8tjma$4lj$1@news-reader1.wanadoo.fr>...
>
>
>>I'm also interested by such an idea...
>
>
> Would you be interested in joining a project with such an aim?
>
> It could be hosted at Source-Forge (there is already a silent project
> called PocketLinux there).
>
> Developers would need AFAIK:
> * a PocketPC device
> * Download MS Visual C++ tools for PocketPC
> * some(one with) knowledge about how PocketPC works
> * some(one with) knowledge about how the Linux kernel works
>
> -- hns

Hello

I'm interessted but I'm not a programmer...
in fact I need it to run a Computer Algebra System called
xcas http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~parisse/giac.html
(I 'm just a tester)

you can send me private mail at

s _dot_ cls _at_ laposte _dot_ net

moreover providing such an environment is good for the GNU project
because it will hurge people to use GNU developement tools...

I think you forget that developers should have ever experiment
cross-compiling with gcc (have a look at gnuwince...
http://win-ce.voxware.com:28575/Development%20Tools/gnu... )

Maybe the first work could be to have a shell... like PocketConsole
for DOS
http://www.symbolictools.de/public/pocketconsole/index....
http://www.symbolictools.de/public/pocketconsole/applic...


That 's just an idea...

Sebastien CELLES
Anonymous
May 28, 2004 12:21:02 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

hns@computer.org (Dr. Nikolaus Schaller) wrote in message news:<e5f20ec4.0405251201.6a2cbf81@posting.google.com>...
> "noone@nowhere.com" <noone@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:<c8tjma$4lj$1@news-reader1.wanadoo.fr>...
>
> > I'm also interested by such an idea...
>
> Would you be interested in joining a project with such an aim?
>
> It could be hosted at Source-Forge (there is already a silent project
> called PocketLinux there).
>
> Developers would need AFAIK:
> * a PocketPC device
> * Download MS Visual C++ tools for PocketPC
> * some(one with) knowledge about how PocketPC works
> * some(one with) knowledge about how the Linux kernel works
>
> -- hns
What's the point of making a an open-source Linux project using Visual
C++?
Use GCC (http://gcc.gnu.org/) or Dev C++ (http://www.bloodshed.net/)
instead.
Visual C++ has this nasty habit of inserting a whole bunch of excess
Microsoft junk such as a pop-up message that says "Made with Microsoft
Visual C++."
It's Microsoft's way of saying "It's Shake-n-bake, and I helped." This
usually is accompanied with a dependence of .dll files on a larger
Windows machine too big to store on most PDAs.

I like the handheld.org project because you can create programs ON you
PDA and they have a C++ compiler FOR the PDAs whereas Microsoft's
PocketPC compiler must be used on a big machine. In a sense, using
Visual C++ you create programs for the big computer not the PDA.
Anonymous
June 2, 2004 6:01:56 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.handhelds (More info?)

bushidohacks@gmail.com (Bushido Hacks) wrote in message news:<f27f7f97.0405280721.6c8a1e5f@posting.google.com>...

> What's the point of making a an open-source Linux project using Visual
> C++?

Pure availability of tools. I assume that 90% of the PocketPC owners
have some Windows machine nearby (sigh...).

> Use GCC (http://gcc.gnu.org/) or Dev C++ (http://www.bloodshed.net/)
> instead.

That creates an entry barrier. It does not work on a Win out of the
box...
And are the header files and libraries available to create an
application that runs natively on PocketPC?

> Visual C++ has this nasty habit of inserting a whole bunch of excess
> Microsoft junk such as a pop-up message that says "Made with Microsoft
> Visual C++."

Really? Can't be removed? Didn't know that.

> It's Microsoft's way of saying "It's Shake-n-bake, and I helped." This
> usually is accompanied with a dependence of .dll files on a larger
> Windows machine too big to store on most PDAs.

I had experimented a little with the Embedded visual tools and my
observation is that they create programs for the PocketPC PDA and have
no dependence on (large) Windows .dll - but I have to admit that I am
neither a Windows nor PocketPC expert.

>
> I like the handheld.org project because you can create programs ON you
> PDA and they have a C++ compiler FOR the PDAs whereas Microsoft's
> PocketPC compiler must be used on a big machine. In a sense, using
> Visual C++ you create programs for the big computer not the PDA.

That is not at all excluded by this approach. The approach separates
development of the Kernel (on Embedded C++) and applications (which
will be the standard like OPIE, Qt, gcc etc.) on whatever you like.

To be clear: it is only about creating a Linux Kernel on PocketPC and
Device Drivers.

-- hns
!