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Blue Ray or HD-DVD... any bets yet?

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Anonymous
March 11, 2005 10:34:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
this point. It seems Blue Ray has more (movie) industry backing, at
lease in part because of Sony, and technology wise it is the superior
format (albeit not backwards compatible).

Oh the HD-DVD camp, oddly enough Microsoft is probably the biggest
player. They have a stake in the HD-DVD standard, and they have
commited XBOX 2 to support the HD-DVD codec (although, it's not
official yet if the XBOX will be fully HD-DVD compliant). This move
would almost certainly insure the HD-DVD standard does not die (in a
worst case, it would become exclusive to XBOX 2 media).

Of course Sony's PlayStation 3 will have native support for Blue Ray
media. Both of these systems are set for possible 2005 Holiday season
launch.

XBOX 2 and PS3 sales will be very competitive, it's possible the winner
will also help push one of the two next generation HD media standards
forward.

More about : blue ray dvd bets

Anonymous
March 12, 2005 7:23:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> this point. It seems Blue Ray has more (movie) industry backing, at
> lease in part because of Sony, and technology wise it is the superior
> format (albeit not backwards compatible).
>
> Oh the HD-DVD camp, oddly enough Microsoft is probably the biggest
> player. They have a stake in the HD-DVD standard, and they have
> commited XBOX 2 to support the HD-DVD codec (although, it's not
> official yet if the XBOX will be fully HD-DVD compliant). This move
> would almost certainly insure the HD-DVD standard does not die (in a
> worst case, it would become exclusive to XBOX 2 media).
>
> Of course Sony's PlayStation 3 will have native support for Blue Ray
> media. Both of these systems are set for possible 2005 Holiday season
> launch.
>
> XBOX 2 and PS3 sales will be very competitive, it's possible the winner
> will also help push one of the two next generation HD media standards
> forward.


FWIW, Apple Computer just announced their joining Blu-ray:

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/mar/10blu-ray.html

HTH,

Marc
Anonymous
March 12, 2005 9:23:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> this point.

While I'd like to see a single standard, I suspect that we're going to
have to put up with both of them. I'll probably buy the first player
that comes along supporting both formats. In the long run, that's
probably how it will settle - the market will eventually give us players
that can handle both (like it did with DVD-R and DVD+R, or with SACD and
DVD-Audio), and the issue will go away. The studios will put out
whichever format they choose, and the players will happily accept either
one.
Related resources
Anonymous
March 12, 2005 10:05:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Probably both will hit the market and then we will need to live with two
incompatible formats again, S.A. Beta and VHS. Seems to happen every time a
"New Technology" hits the flippin market place. Remember CD4 and
"Quadra-Phonic" Audio processing?? Eh. Then after the marketplace confirms
the viability of either format the manufacturers will then stop making the
other type leaving the poor consumer out on a limb as with the BETA and
Super BETA Formats. IHMO I think The Blue-Led will prevail basically because
of SONY's major involvement in the Movie Production, distribution, etc.
"Jim Gilliland" <usemylastname@cheerful.com> wrote in message
news:4232d132$0$95564$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
> Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
>> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
>> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
>> this point.
>
> While I'd like to see a single standard, I suspect that we're going to
> have to put up with both of them. I'll probably buy the first player that
> comes along supporting both formats. In the long run, that's probably how
> it will settle - the market will eventually give us players that can
> handle both (like it did with DVD-R and DVD+R, or with SACD and
> DVD-Audio), and the issue will go away. The studios will put out
> whichever format they choose, and the players will happily accept either
> one.
Anonymous
March 12, 2005 4:52:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

In the new Home Theater Magazine there is an article on the
development of multilayer discs that can have both BlueRay and
HD-DVD formats on one disc.

But I'd bet on dual format players before dual format discs.

Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:

>I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
>soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
>this point. It seems Blue Ray has more (movie) industry backing, at
>lease in part because of Sony, and technology wise it is the superior
>format (albeit not backwards compatible).
>
>
>

--
Ric Seyler
Anonymous
March 12, 2005 5:44:00 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Art wrote:
> Probably both will hit the market and then we will need to live with two
> incompatible formats again, S.A. Beta and VHS.

No, and that's the point. They're not incompatible, at least not in any
sense that matters to consumers. They both use the same basic disc
format, so there's no reason that a single player can't play both
formats. So why should we care which one wins? As long as we can watch
either one without any trouble, what difference does it make?
Anonymous
March 12, 2005 7:07:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Judging from past experience, whichever format has the most serious flaws
for use as computer data storage medium will be the one that becomes
the most popular :-(.
Anonymous
March 13, 2005 6:02:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> this point. It seems Blue Ray has more (movie) industry backing, at
> lease in part because of Sony, and technology wise it is the superior
> format (albeit not backwards compatible).
>
> Oh the HD-DVD camp, oddly enough Microsoft is probably the biggest
> player. They have a stake in the HD-DVD standard, and they have
> commited XBOX 2 to support the HD-DVD codec (although, it's not
> official yet if the XBOX will be fully HD-DVD compliant). This move
> would almost certainly insure the HD-DVD standard does not die (in a
> worst case, it would become exclusive to XBOX 2 media).
>
> Of course Sony's PlayStation 3 will have native support for Blue Ray
> media. Both of these systems are set for possible 2005 Holiday season
> launch.
>
> XBOX 2 and PS3 sales will be very competitive, it's possible the winner
> will also help push one of the two next generation HD media standards
> forward.

March 11, 2005

Apple Backs Sony Format for DVD's

By BLOOMBERG NEWS

By Bloomberg News

Apple Computer is backing the Sony Corporation's Blu-ray format for the
next generation of digital videodiscs, bolstering Sony's effort to
dominate the $26 billion United States market for DVD's and players.

Apple, whose computers run software to create DVD's, joined the Blu-ray
Disc Association's board, a statement by Blu-ray said yesterday. Sony is
fighting to win support for its standard over one called HD-DVD that is
backed by Toshiba and NEC.

Blu-ray said Apple would support the new high-definition DVD format in
its iMovie and Final Cut video-editing software programs.

"Apple is pleased to join the Blu-ray Disc Association board as part of
our efforts to drive consumer adoption of HD," Steven P. Jobs, Apple's
chief executive, said in a statement on the Blu-ray Web site.

The competing formats promise high-definition pictures, better sound
quality, more storage capacity and better copyright protection than
standard DVD's. The backing of film studios and computer makers like
Apple will help determine the dominant standard. Blu-ray has five times
the capacity of current discs and more than the HD-DVD standard.

Ted Schadler, an analyst at Forrester Research in Cambridge, Mass.,
said, "Capacity is everything" for personal computer makers, adding, "In
capacity, Blu-ray is much better."

Blu-Ray's backers include the two big PC makers, Dell and
Hewlett-Packard, in addition to Sony, Walt Disney and Thomson, the
largest supplier of recorded DVD's. Film studios including Warner
Brothers, New Line Cinema, Universal and Paramount have said they will
adopt HD-DVD. The studios may agree later to release movies on Blu-ray
discs.

The Blu-ray Disc Association, with more than 100 members, develops
specifications, including compatibility, for the format as well as
promoting it. Blu-ray refers to a blue laser that reads and records the
format, according to the Blu-ray Web site.

Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company

-------------------------------------------------------

Maybe this will push the market a little towards Blu-Ray.

For the record, I have no opinion on Sony's Blu-Ray vs. the other
technologies: but I do remember that Sony came up with Betamax.
Anonymous
March 13, 2005 6:04:29 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Thomas A. Horsley wrote:
> Judging from past experience, whichever format has the most serious flaws
> for use as computer data storage medium will be the one that becomes
> the most popular :-(.

LOL, we seem to be on the same wavelength here, Tom.
Anonymous
March 13, 2005 6:04:30 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

In article <r71Zd.21517$zJ3.2721@fe09.lga>,
Sparky Singer <Sparky@moon.sun.org> wrote:

> > Judging from past experience, whichever format has the most serious
> > flaws for use as computer data storage medium will be the one that
> > becomes the most popular :-(.
>
> LOL, we seem to be on the same wavelength here, Tom.

Bad pun.

--
Stop Mad Cowboy Disease: Impeach the son of a Bush.
Anonymous
March 14, 2005 5:47:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Jim Gilliland" <usemylastname@cheerful.com> wrote in message
news:4232d132$0$95564$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
> Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
>> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
>> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
>> this point.
>
> While I'd like to see a single standard, I suspect that we're going to
> have to put up with both of them. I'll probably buy the first player that
> comes along supporting both formats. In the long run, that's probably how
> it will settle - the market will eventually give us players that can
> handle both (like it did with DVD-R and DVD+R, or with SACD and
> DVD-Audio), and the issue will go away.

I think the relative failure of SACD and DVD-Audio was due to there being
two incompatible formats. (Copy protection also). I sure hope one HD DVD
format comes out on top relatively soon.
Anonymous
March 14, 2005 9:49:45 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Steven de Mena wrote:
> "Jim Gilliland" <usemylastname@cheerful.com> wrote in message
> news:4232d132$0$95564$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
>
> I think the relative failure of SACD and DVD-Audio was due to there being
> two incompatible formats. (Copy protection also).

I don't think either of those were a significant factor. I think the
main reason people don't buy high-resolution audio is that they perceive
no need for it. To most listeners, CD is quite sufficient. Heck, to
most listeners these days, MP3 is quite sufficient. If people are
content with MP3 quality, why would they spend extra to go to SACD or
DVD-Audio?

I'm one of the few who actually have an audio system that can benefit
from this level of quality, and even I find that the most interesting
benefit to these formats is the 5.1 capability rather than the high
sampling rate and bit depth.
Anonymous
March 14, 2005 10:48:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> this point.

That's right, you won't. If I'm not mistaken most manufaturers are
already planning to include both formats in their players. That way
they don't have to worry about backing the wrong horse. It's really
only the studios that are fighting amonst themselves right now.

I am also under the impression that they miight resolve the issue
between the format war before anything ships and consolidte into one
format. There's still about a year to go.

Either way, the smart money is on the wait and see path. Hold on to your
dollars.
Anonymous
March 14, 2005 10:49:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Richard wrote:
> Don't be shocked if the two sides get together to merge their patent license
> packages, even at this late stage.

Absolutely. A friend on the inside mentioned this to me. I believe you
are right Richard.
Anonymous
March 18, 2005 11:56:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

<Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com> wrote:

> I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> this point. It seems Blue Ray has more (movie) industry backing, at
> lease in part because of Sony, and technology wise it is the superior
> format (albeit not backwards compatible).
>
> Oh the HD-DVD camp, oddly enough Microsoft is probably the biggest
> player. They have a stake in the HD-DVD standard, and they have
> commited XBOX 2 to support the HD-DVD codec (although, it's not
> official yet if the XBOX will be fully HD-DVD compliant). This move
> would almost certainly insure the HD-DVD standard does not die (in a
> worst case, it would become exclusive to XBOX 2 media).
>
> Of course Sony's PlayStation 3 will have native support for Blue Ray
> media. Both of these systems are set for possible 2005 Holiday season
> launch.
>
> XBOX 2 and PS3 sales will be very competitive, it's possible the winner
> will also help push one of the two next generation HD media standards
> forward.

Blu-Ray and HD-DVD are storage format, not CODEC.
March 18, 2005 12:15:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Jim Gilliland" <usemylastname@cheerful.com> wrote in message
news:4232d132$0$95564$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
> Jeremy.Deats@gmail.com wrote:
> > I won't be investing in a stand alone Blue Ray or HD-DVD player anytime
> > soon, but I am curious if anyone is leaning to one side or the other at
> > this point.
>
> While I'd like to see a single standard, I suspect that we're going to
> have to put up with both of them. I'll probably buy the first player
> that comes along supporting both formats. In the long run, that's
> probably how it will settle - the market will eventually give us players
> that can handle both (like it did with DVD-R and DVD+R, or with SACD and
> DVD-Audio), and the issue will go away. The studios will put out
> whichever format they choose, and the players will happily accept either
> one.

I agree. The only issue might be what if one of them dies after a short
time--i.e. no one realeases anything on it anymore. Hopefully the machines
will continue to support both. Also, might 1080p require still higher
bitrates? Maybe Blu-ray would be much better suited later on for that
reason.

BTW, what about divX HD? No one's talking about it but they claim to be
able to fit an entire 2h movie in HD *and* SD on one of today's red-laser
DVD's!
!