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2900XT Crossfire vs 8800GTS SLI

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August 1, 2007 10:33:16 AM

Ok from what Iv seen the 2900XT is faster than the 8800GTS on most occassions, especially since the ATI driver updates, although they are pretty much neck and neck..but Iv even seen it almost get up to the GTX in certain benchmarks (lol not many though)


anyway i can get 2 2900XTs for cheaper than 2 8800GTS and cheaper than 1 GTX/ultra.

so Im thinking Im going to grab a pair of 2900XT's and stick them in Crossfire or the 8800GTS in SLI as surely a CF or SLI system with those cards must be faster than a single GTX..right?

the question is what to go for, as i cant really seem to find any CF vs SLI benchmarks, only single card benchmarks

will be paired up with a Q6600 cpu


cheers!
a c 169 U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 11:00:28 AM

What resolution do u play ?
August 1, 2007 11:01:03 AM

Get them! But be warned the drivers are still a bit dodge. Stalker especially. And the brightness jumps up if you turn your pc off in game. Get the 7.6 drivers if you can, 7.7 are not cool.

BTW i HATE you. i want crossfire....

I will get there eventually.
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August 1, 2007 11:19:58 AM

ohf... that is the same reason, the 2900xt crossfire is as good as gtx sli, crossfire scales heaps better than sli, plus, as you said someplaces, 2 lower end card are cheaper but perform better, again, get 2 2900xts
a c 169 U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 11:40:11 AM

but if he plays at low resolutions , 2x cards wont be needed
a b U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 12:20:56 PM

Here ya go:

http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_sli2007.html

These are the dual & quad VGA charts w/ SLI and Crossfire (8800 & 2900).

If you go 2x2900XT, be sure to have a huge PS, or, better yet, get a couple VGA power supplies (I got one for my single 2900, works great. Less stress on main PS.)

As for the driver complaints, have you tried the 7.8 betas? I'm using them, seem to work the best.
August 1, 2007 12:27:08 PM

rammedstein said:
ohf... that is the same reason, the 2900xt crossfire is as good as gtx sli, crossfire scales heaps better than sli, plus, as you said someplaces, 2 lower end card are cheaper but perform better, again, get 2 2900xts


better than gtx sli and scales better...., yea dude(sarcasm). and.., don't forget money grows on trees and the tooth fairy really does exist...

whatever.
August 1, 2007 12:41:38 PM

thanks for the suggestions guys, yes i have heard CF scales better than SLI aswell, although id have to say 2 x GTX would be faster, but i cant afford that!

so yer i sort of figured for the price of 1 GTX ill get more performance in most games and slightly better performance than GTS SLI..

i can get a 2nd hand 2900XT for $300 aussie dollars and a new one for $400 = $700, the GTX is around $700 here and the 640mb GTS are pushing $500 although im sure you could get them a bit cheaper if you looked around

btw i currently have a 19" widescreen 1440x900, but only because my 1950pro wouldnt handle much of higher res..If i get the CF or SLI system ill most likely get a 22" 1650x1080 or 24" 1900x1200 or whatever they are..

infact i might even just get a 20" 1650x1080 because the pixels are smaller it looks much sharper with less noticable jaggies, and i know the 2900's dont like a lot of aa so it may be the best choice for uber picture quality..

August 1, 2007 12:43:30 PM

if you can get 2x2900XT's for less than the cost of a GTX then DO IT

if anything I'd call me an nvidia fanboy, but at that sort of price point 2x2900XT's will kick arse - maybe even play Crysis on Max
a b U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 12:44:16 PM

Im not defending anything, but without AA in some games, 2900CF is faster than 8800GTX SLI. But unless youre plating on a 30" screen, whod want that?
a c 169 U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 12:47:55 PM

ok for that resolutions , if 2x2900xt is cheaper than a single GTX, then get it
August 1, 2007 1:02:47 PM

just get one 2900XT for now, should be good enough, and then buy another later when prices come down a bit.
August 1, 2007 2:08:02 PM

Something to think about cost wise... as I have no idea what the prices are like where you are.

Cost wise, does (1 GTX and lower PS) cost less than (2 2900's and a larger PS)?

You need more juice flowing... but it might be a moot point.
August 1, 2007 2:09:54 PM

Also, check what kind of PSU you have. 750W is recommended for crossfired 2900XTs
August 1, 2007 2:16:32 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Im not defending anything


Then why bring up this lame argument yet again?


JAYDEEJOHN said:

without AA in some games, 2900CF is faster than 8800GTX SLI.


If I had a nickel for every time I have seen you bring this up I would be a millionaire :ange: 

Once again, who in their right mind purchases a high end GPU to play games with no AA or AF? Much less SLI'd 8800GTX's or Crossfired 2900XT's :pfff: 


August 1, 2007 2:51:49 PM

demowhc said:
Ok from what Iv seen the 2900XT is faster than the 8800GTS on most occassions, especially since the ATI driver updates, although they are pretty much neck and neck..but Iv even seen it almost get up to the GTX in certain benchmarks (lol not many though)


anyway i can get 2 2900XTs for cheaper than 2 8800GTS and cheaper than 1 GTX/ultra.

so Im thinking Im going to grab a pair of 2900XT's and stick them in Crossfire or the 8800GTS in SLI as surely a CF or SLI system with those cards must be faster than a single GTX..right?

the question is what to go for, as i cant really seem to find any CF vs SLI benchmarks, only single card benchmarks

will be paired up with a Q6600 cpu


cheers!


staticice.com.au is your friend....

And at the moment, a pair of xfired 2900xt's will compare favorably to any single nvidia card, and will beat most sli'd nvidia cards.

All that said, there's a refresh coming from both mfg's in the near future. If what you have now is live-able, I'd be patient. (I have a pair of 6 series nvidiaa's in sli...)
August 1, 2007 3:16:59 PM

Without AA on the 2900xt usually beats the 8800GTX, unfortunatly, who plays without AA lol.

With AA on it trades blows with 8800GTS, although I must say the resent driver release made AA on the ATI card a lot more effective, it could stil get better.


I think CFAA is intended for use on the 2900xt though rather than standard AA. Using CFAA performance is a lot better and things look just as good.

2900XT CF betas GTX SLI GTS SLI, both of them. Crossfire just works better then SLI does. As someone else said it can send data both ways while SLI can only send 1 way at a time.
August 1, 2007 3:18:34 PM

It would help if you had an article showing a single 2900XT (512MB DDR3) w/o AA beating the 8800GTX. This would be news to me and everyone on this forum
August 1, 2007 4:21:16 PM

ok as far as psu goes i already have an 850w thermaltake toughpower which has 4 x 12v rails at 30amps each, i bought it when i got a 1950pro as i needed a new psu anyway. i figured it would come in handy in the future (lol slight overkill for a 1950pro but i guess im laughing now!)

and yer whats with all the different types of AA, because if i buy 2 cards in crossfire of course i want to use AA!

this CFAA, can i just use that in any game as opposed to regular AA?? for a slight performance increase over normal AA?

I also noticed the 2900's have a thing called edge detect which is meant to help smoothen the edges, as far as i know in games where AA isnt possible this edge detect still works, such as stalker and graw2..

so really i could use edge detect and say 2 x AA plus set it temporal AA to give the effect of say 6xAA with only the performance hit of 2xAA

for those of you that dont know what temporal AA is it just alternates the AA samples every second frame giving the appearance of double the quality ie- 4xaa would look like 8xaa, and it works i use it on my 1950pro all the time(if you use atitool you can set it upto 4x, so 6xaa with temporal could look like 24xAA for the same performance hit as 6xaa!) the only drawback is it forces vsync on (but i use vsync anyway) and if ur fps drops below ur refresh rate it gives a really nasty flicker on edges..



a b U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 4:28:27 PM

Well it's a pretty simple choice.

2 XTs in Xfire will generally beat 2 GTSs in SLI, and almost always beat a single GTX (with a few exceptions like Stalker).
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/diamond_radeon_2900_xt_1gb/default.asp

So while I usually think Xfire and SLi are a waste of money for most people, if the price is right then it's a viable solution. And in this case if 2 XTs are cheaper than a single GTX, it may be the way to go because the performance difference will usually favour the 2 XTs. Resale would likely favour them too, and also future performance would favour them IMO, with min fps being a big focus for what becomes 'acceptable gameplay'.

Unless you're gaming at 1024x768, where I'd say just buy a single XT and save money, seems like an easy decision in this case.
a b U Graphics card
August 1, 2007 6:45:43 PM

Temporal AA didn't work with my card (in Oblivion). Grainy white dots popped up everywhere, and I had to restart the computer to get them to go away. This was with an old driver though. With 4x AA (I don't remember which type) I get 20-40 FPS outside (15 minimum) and 60 FPS (vsync limit) inside with all of my graphics mods.
August 1, 2007 8:39:18 PM

EXT64 said:
Temporal AA didn't work with my card (in Oblivion). Grainy white dots popped up everywhere, and I had to restart the computer to get them to go away. This was with an old driver though. With 4x AA (I don't remember which type) I get 20-40 FPS outside (15 minimum) and 60 FPS (vsync limit) inside with all of my graphics mods.



Temporal AA is garbage. It only works if your FPS is above a certain threshold and games such as oblivion are simply to demanding and run to slow for the effects of temporal AA to be effective.
August 1, 2007 9:08:11 PM

temporal aa is great, i use it in CSS and dods atm, but yer id say in oblivion with regular fps drops it wouldnt be effective.

the threshold is there so the flickering doesnt occur when ur fps goes under ur refresh rate, it just stops working below the threshold then kicks back in when ur fps go above the threshold.btw with atitool you can set the threshold to whatever you like.
August 2, 2007 8:27:20 AM

hmm..have a question here. just curious that the tom's vga chart sli 8800gts vs CF 2900xt, most of the time sli 8800gts will get the better result? (with AA and AF, max graphic quality)
August 2, 2007 9:13:01 AM

@ Warezme: Crossfire scales MUCH ******* better than sli.

Does anyone get ANY good frame rates at all with 24x AA? i get like 20 frames...

@ Stanley: The toms charts are using the old drivers i think, not sure though.

Anyway: www.tweaktown.com
a b U Graphics card
August 2, 2007 10:00:14 AM

ihatefanboys said:
Then why bring up this lame argument yet again?




If I had a nickel for every time I have seen you bring this up I would be a millionaire :ange: 

Once again, who in their right mind purchases a high end GPU to play games with no AA or AF? Much less SLI'd 8800GTX's or Crossfired 2900XT's :pfff: 
This was in reply to this
Quote:
ohf... that is the same reason, the 2900xt crossfire is as good as gtx sli, crossfire scales heaps better than sli, plus, as you said someplaces, 2 lower end card are cheaper but perform better, again, get 2 2900xts
Not to someone who handpicks posts in a thread. Im glad you know this, others dont. Im pointing out the shortcomings of the 2900, if you dont like that, then prove me wrong
August 2, 2007 11:35:57 AM

wow..i just went to have a look on the review, so now the best value isn't 8800gts but 2900xt? it's lot more cheaper than 8800gtx, and yet got better performance than gtx @@
August 2, 2007 11:50:36 AM

bfellow said:
It would help if you had an article showing a single 2900XT (512MB DDR3) w/o AA beating the 8800GTX. This would be news to me and everyone on this forum
Sorry I didnt know you spoke for everyone on the forum. Im such an idiot, doh!

With th neewer drivers it actually does, look on tomshardware charts and youll find they actually used catalyst 7.1 to bench those. Using 7.7, the newest ones, the 2900XT outperforms the 8800gts is quite a few things, its AA is much improved, and without AA it can compete with the GTX.

Ill try to find some of the reviews but atm I am actually busy doing other things.

ON TOPIC Id definatly recommend the 2900xt CF over the 8800gts SLI because theres just so much more perofrmance and potential.

The 2900xt's CFAA works by correcting only the really bad edges and unlike AA doesn't try to smooth already quite smooth edges. So you get better performance and depending on the situation it could still look just as good.

I also read somewhere that the default setttings on the 2900xt are meant to be better due to built in hardware but most of the reviews Ive read say that it doesnt actually look as good as the GTX.



edit: http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?p=1335063179...

and there we go. The icing on the cake.
!