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Has lightning struck twice (figuratively speaking!?)

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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August 5, 2007 4:20:52 AM

Ok, I don't know how to say it so here goes.

A month or two back I bought a X195pro(AGP) off of ebay (open box is always a gamble I know) I didn't work so I chucked it.
I just bought another one off ebay about a week ago, brand new and sealed. I've installed it and I'm having the same probs I did with my last one. Either it freezes shortly after starting a game (STALKER, Oblivion) or it simply goes to a blank screen saying "no signal" about a minute into playing say World of Warcraft.
I'm at a bit of a loss to know whats happening, the extra PCI-E power cable is plugged in so power should be OK.

Could it be faulty (again) or is my PSU not up to par.

My set-up:
A64 3200+ @ 2.2gHz
2 x 512 Kingmax ram (1GB)
Gigabyte mobo K8NS Pro (Nforce 250)
120Gig Seagate HDD

Any thoughts/advice thoroughly appreciated
Cheers!
Powercolor X1950pro 512mb vid card (formerly Xpertvision 256mb X800XL AGP)
Zalman ZM460B PSU (34 amps on +12V rails)
August 5, 2007 4:54:43 AM

Hmmm..Since the problems happened with both..Seems to be a power supply issue. It may have enough amps but maybe not enough watts to support the graphics card. That would be my only guess. Also..What did you have in your rig before?..graphics card wise. Always try to use driver cleaner after you uninstall just incase the drivers are still there and a hardware conflict occurs. I always do it just to be safe.

But from the sound of it. Sounds like a power supply issue. Especially since you state it happens when trying to play a game. Probably doesn't have enough juice and fails. It has a 4 pin molex connector to power it correct?
a c 164 U Graphics card
August 5, 2007 5:15:15 AM

Might also need some changes for the AGP bus in the bios. Sideband or fastwrites might need to be enabled/disabled. But I agree, double check your PSU.
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August 5, 2007 7:24:56 AM

yes those are pretty common symptoms for not enough power or possibly over heating

download atitool 2.7 and click on the "show 3d view" button, it will display a spinning furry cube on your screen that will heat your card right up, the temp is displayed to the right "show 3d view" button, see if it goes over say 70c, although it should be ok all the way upto 80 or even 90...but you really want to keep it under 70c.

next if it is overheating click on settings down the bottom then up the top click on fan control (in the box that says overclocking, click the arrow till you get to fan control) change the fan speed to 95% or 100% all the time, it will be louder of course but it stops your vid card overheating, also you can mess with the fan speeds to go at different percentages depending on the temps, ie-50c fan will go 65%, 60c fan will go 75% and so on.

I own a x1950pro and thats the first thing i did as i noticed it was running hot.

if its not temps causing the problems then id say its a psu issue, make sure all extra power connectors are in, i have an AGP version and i have to plug 2 molex connections into it, and make sur ethey are not loose or anything. apart from that you may need a new psu, although i would have thought that psu you have should be plenty

and maybe you just have 2 dud cards..lol

good luck!
August 5, 2007 9:18:50 AM

I have seen a post like this on another forum recently. It was a mobo incompatibility.
Try to play with bios options. Turn OFF sideband addressing, fast writes. Try to reset your bios with the jumper.
August 5, 2007 10:16:08 AM

Kamrooz - I had an Xpertvision X800XL 256mb card in prior to this upgrade, the difference in power requirements for the X1950 isn t that much more I think (prolly 20 watts or so). I've run driver cleaner pro to clean out the old drivers and installed the latest 7.7 drivers from ATI.

I've got the extra 6 pin PCI-E power cable plugged in.

I've just checked and the following settings are on in the Catalyst control Centre according to Smartgart:

AGP Settings:
Fast Writes: On!
AGP Write: On!
AGP Read: On!
AGP Speed is set to 8X

PCI Settings:
PCI write: On
PCI read: On

Demowhc - I'll download Atitool and give it a run to see what happens! Cheers
August 5, 2007 11:06:54 AM

Your PSU rail may be a bit dodgy, just double check it!
August 5, 2007 11:13:47 AM

Downloaded ATITool and ran it, everything was fine till I started fiddling with the fan speeds. Now everytime I click on the "show 3d" button for the fuzzy cube, my screen goes blank with the message "no signal" and I have to reset my comp for it to work again. BTW the cards temp was hovering around 50-60 degrees before the doo-doo hit the fan. :lol: 

Should I try using a molex to PCI-E adapter and use one of the molex connectors to power my card! Would that help or do the molex and PCI-E connectors output the same amount of power?
a b U Graphics card
August 5, 2007 3:01:49 PM

Supernoob - Ref 6 pin pcie vs using pcie molex to 6 pin adaptor.

You need to look at the +12v rail breakout. Example
E6400 @ 3.2 w/X1950xt graphics card.

PSU igreen 600W (36Amps) ; +12V1 = 16A, +12V2 = 14A, +12V3 = 6A

It has 2 6pin pcie connectors, P4 (uses +12V1) and P5 (uses +12V3).
I used P5 since 6Amps and only connector using +12V3 and V1 was used to supply MB and SATA/Molex power.

Long story short, if your 6 pin pcie connector shares the same rail as your molex - then mox nics.

a c 164 U Graphics card
August 5, 2007 7:15:27 PM

Turn off fast writes and try again.
August 7, 2007 1:36:49 AM

Tried turning off fast writes and retested, but to no avail still freezing or losing signal.

The card is on a rail all by itself, so power isn't an issue as far as I can tell.

I ran a little test last night using the 3d model in ATITool (fuzzy cube), ran it 3 times, every time the temperature of the temperature chip reached 42 degrees or above, the card/system froze and had to be reset!

So I think the problem is with that particular chip overheating. I can't install a fan to cool it on the side of my case as my case doesn't have a mount to do this, so I'm going to try and RMA it failing that put an axe though it!! :fou: 

So thats it, I've had 2 tries with this type of card, I'm going for a 7800gs or 7600gt to replace my X800XL as its beginning to artifact and generally cr@p out.

Thanks to everyone for their input and advice
Supernoobie away!! :pt1cable: 
August 7, 2007 1:59:27 AM

42 isn't bad...my x700 is at 39/40 c idle right now...it gets up to around 68 on full load. Depending on the graphics card..gpu's run in most cases much hotter then processors do. The fact that you had the same problem with more then on card means it is probably not the card. But something else..Either power supply or mobo...But IMO I think powersupply. Can you nab a friends power supply and give it a test?..That would be the best idea imo before you spend money on a new gfx card...
August 7, 2007 6:17:33 AM

or try the video card in another pc, even go down to your local shop and ask them to wack it in to see if it runs.

if both cards are doing it i doubt its the cards, and you may find a 7800 works fine as it draws less power then assume it was the cards when it really wasnt!



oh btw dont worry about the temp chip reading, look at the GPU reading above it, if its sitting on 50-60 idle(no 3D cube) then i dare say it would be overheating badly once the 3D cube is displayed

ie- my card sits on 35ish when no 3d cube is displayed, then after about 5 mins of having the cube up it tops out at around 65ish, almost double..

good luck!
August 7, 2007 11:54:02 AM

I went in to my local PC shop today and had a chat with one of the guys there. He reckons that my PSU isn't powerful enough and that my requirements are outstripping my psu (its *only* being a Zalman ZM460B 460watts psu), he suggested that I buy something like a Thermaltake Toughpower 600 watt unit.

As for testing the card in another PC, the local PC shop only test using basic desktop apps, not games like Oblivion, Stalker as far as I know, and the only other person with a rig similar to mine to test it on, is away!

I don't know what to do atm, shell out more money for another PSU, buy another card? :pt1cable: 
a c 175 U Graphics card
August 7, 2007 1:04:43 PM

Well, if you buy another PSU, you could get one able to power your next rig, so it isn't like you'd be flushing money. Check out the listings at http://www.tomswiki.com/page/Tiered+PSU+Listings?t=anon and choose one from Tier-3 or better. Your current rig ought to run fine on 450W, but 600W allows for just about any future upgrade other than SLI (which, imho, is usually a waste). Newegg.com would be a good place to get it. They have decent prices, ship fast and have good customer service.
August 7, 2007 10:55:17 PM

If your system requires 450W to run, a 460W PSU may be cutting it close. I don't know Zalman PSUs very well so I don't know if that is peak output or constant. I agree that getting a better PSU won't hurt anything. I bought a PC P&C 610 silencer (I don't see myself running SLI) and it has performed flawlessly. Too bad you chucked the other card though... :( 
Edit: Are you sure that your card is compatible with your mobo's agp port? Maybe your mobo's bios needs updated? Or even the chipset drivers may need updating to support the new card?
August 7, 2007 11:39:39 PM

Have you checked the error log in your WoW folder? Whats the error message? (If there is one)

I have an X1650Pro with 512mb and have been having trouble running WoW. I'm starting to think its a driver issue, heres why:

With Driver 7.7 I was crashing almost constantly sometimes going to Windows with an error others it gives me the "No signal" screen. Using 7.6 cut the crashing by about 30%. I downloaded the ATITool and used it to Oc the card. Now I rarely crash and it only crashes in places that have heavy amounts of acitvity.

The error I have been getting says "Insufficient system resources to complete request", I have tried alot of different things and nothing has helped except Ocing that card and the older driver made a huge difference.

My specs are:

P4 3.2ghz w/HT (socket 775)
1gb PC2700 DDR (2x 512mb)
HIS X1650Pro 512mb w/Iceq cooler AGP8x (oc'd from/to= core: 600 / 641.5 memory: 400 / 454.75)
Asus P5V800 Mobo w/ onboard sound
Antech 550w psu (about 2 months old)


I know its not the greatest rig but oddly enough it runs Oblivion and Doom3 without issue. I load up WoW and it was crash city. I have read that ATI's drivers can be buggy in WoW, and 7.7 seems to be bad.


The problem you have is the same with to totally differnt cars, what are the odds. I bet its the same driver tho. Try using the 7.6 driver and maybe even do a slight OC and see if that helps.

Good Luck!
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