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August 19, 2007 3:12:27 AM

Someone please recommend me a good AGP graphics card for under $100 (bang for the buck), with a requirement of 300w PSU or less. I prefer the ATI Radeon or Geforce series. I have looked at Tom's Hardware site already but both the Radeon X1650 PRO (GDDR3) and the GeForce 7600 GS require at least 350w PSU (I'm pretty sure). Thank you for your help . I am not planning on buying a new psu.

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a c 130 U Graphics card
August 19, 2007 9:34:46 AM

Ok so coulpe of questions.
Im assuming this is a replace/upgrade so what was in it before?
Do you know what the amps on the 12v rail of the psu are? its not that important as the 7600gs should run on a 300watt psu any way but its good to check either google the make and model or take the side of the case off and have a look ther will be a sticker on the side of the psu.
Micromac
August 19, 2007 10:24:19 AM

You want a good video card but you have a low wattage psu, that's not very compatible a believe.
You could get a 7600gs i know those are pretty friendly at power requirements.
Related resources
August 19, 2007 12:33:05 PM

Depends on what else is in your system amte.

Please list some specifics, thanks.
August 19, 2007 2:45:42 PM

For safety, try upgrading your PSU first.At least 350 Watt or above.

For graphic card, choose ATI X1650Pro since it used GDDR3.The Nvidia 7600 GS used DDR2 only (depends on brand, such as Asus EN7600 GS TOP uses GDDR3).Also, it depend on what resolution you want to play.
a c 130 U Graphics card
August 19, 2007 4:04:49 PM

I think you will find that the whole idea of the post is to find a way to not have to upgrade the psu and save money :) 
Mactronix
August 19, 2007 7:31:40 PM

well I'd say there aren't any decent AGP cards worth upgrading for less than $160 (X1950Pro/7900GS) and on top of that, for a decent machine you need to have a decent PSU, that's just common sense.
August 19, 2007 7:54:14 PM

nVidia GeForce 5200FX, nuff said. LOL. Oh wait, could use a Vanta LT...
a c 130 U Graphics card
August 19, 2007 7:57:25 PM

I would say your being a bit premature there emp it kinda depends what the op is upgrading from as to if there is anything out there that is worth upgrading to.
There must be loads of people out there with 2+year old AGP systems that just want one more roll of the dice and a bit more performance before they make what could be a very big purchace for some people in upgrading to a whole new system.
Mactronix
August 19, 2007 8:02:38 PM

There's nothing "premature" or "immature" about it, Im calling it like it is, if you want to game those 2 year old midrange cards are barely cutting it as it is, Im not saying they are not good cards, Im saying that they are not worth paying for them anymore.

And if you want an HTPC then you're looking probably for a HD 2400Pro, 8400GS, or 8500GT build.

There is life left in AGP systems, but it comes with a cost and requirements, a cost that the OP is not willing to pay. Having a DECENT PSU has nothing to do with being selfish/whiney/immature or whatever you want to call it, it's only the very basic need of a computer.
a c 130 U Graphics card
August 19, 2007 8:21:35 PM

Where on earth did you get "immature" from im only pointing out that as we dont know what base Crisp is starting from then its a bit early(premature)to say that there are no agp cards worth getting for less than $160.
Suppose Crisp has only onboard graphics that would mean that just about any dedicated card would be a worthwhile improvement.
Mactronix

PS
Dont know what your problem is but this.

"Having a DECENT PSU has nothing to do with being selfish/whiney/immature or whatever you want to call it, it's only the very basic need of a computer."

Is bang out of order i never said anything about. "selfish/whiney/immature or whatever you want to call it,". Dont know wher you got it from as i said and Do Not appreciate the implication of your post that i did. :pfff: 
August 19, 2007 8:29:10 PM

I misread your post Im sorry, thought you implied something else. My mistake.

Anyway, my point still stands, regardless of what he already has, using a PSU of less than 300W (Or even slightly above 300W) in this day and age is not a very good sign of anything. PSUs are the most basic thing on a computer and should never be overlooked.

He should provide more information about his uses then (Im assuming gaming, since he said the best card), but we're not miracle workers here, we have to call it like it is, right now no AGP card except 7900/X1950 is worth buying to inject some life to an AGP system, since the only somewhat acceptable AGPs systems left are probably S939 systems.
a c 130 U Graphics card
August 19, 2007 8:43:54 PM

Appology accepted :) 
The point you make is valid from a gaming point of view and even if not gaming then it would make sence to do the psu upgrade and get the most performance you can out of an old system ,but crisp did say he didnt want to go that route so i guess we have to work with what we got.
Just have to wait and see if Crisp comes back with some more info.
Mactronix
August 19, 2007 11:13:23 PM

Here is some more info:
I am upgrading from a Geforce2 MX/MX 400; I bought this computer more than 5 years ago, and I wish to keep it for a few more years :p 
Mainboard: Intel D845EBG2
Processor: Intel Pentium 4 2000 MHz
768MB Ram
And here is my PSU:
MODEL NO: ATX-300TA
AC input: 115/220-240v~,7/3.5A, 60/50Hz
DC output: 300w (+3.3v & +5v=120w max)
+3.3v.....20.0A (ORG) ,+5v....20.0A(RED),+12v1...8.0A(Yel)
+12v2....14.0A(Yel/black),+5Vsb...2.0A(PUR P),-12V...0.8A(BLUE)

Are there any more specifications I should mention?
August 19, 2007 11:39:06 PM

dear god thats old but "a few more years" is probably not left in any agp system, about 2 or maybe at a stretch 3 years (at least if you keep playing games, I doubt word will get too much more taxing)
August 19, 2007 11:54:06 PM

I don't get why you would want to upgrade your graphics card then, you already have dedicated graphics card so you don't have to submit to onboard graphics. Also your PC has zero chance at doing any gaming at this stage. If what you want is to turn it into an HTPC, I'd suggest waiting until (and if) Ati or any of its partners release an HD2400/2600 in AGP flavor, probably add 512mb more of ram for now... best thing you can do. AND GET a DECENT PSU IN THE MEAN TIME!
August 20, 2007 1:14:51 AM

Would the nvidia 7600gs work with the PSU I have currently?
August 20, 2007 6:21:50 AM

emp said:
I don't get why you would want to upgrade your graphics card then, you already have dedicated graphics card so you don't have to submit to onboard graphics. Also your PC has zero chance at doing any gaming at this stage. If what you want is to turn it into an HTPC, I'd suggest waiting until (and if) Ati or any of its partners release an HD2400/2600 in AGP flavor, probably add 512mb more of ram for now... best thing you can do. AND GET a DECENT PSU IN THE MEAN TIME!

http://www.diamondmm.com/2400PRO512A.php
http://www.diamondmm .com/2400PRO256A.php
August 20, 2007 7:41:30 AM

emp said:
I misread your post Im sorry, thought you implied something else. My mistake.

Anyway, my point still stands, regardless of what he already has, using a PSU of less than 300W (Or even slightly above 300W) in this day and age is not a very good sign of anything. PSUs are the most basic thing on a computer and should never be overlooked.

He should provide more information about his uses then (Im assuming gaming, since he said the best card), but we're not miracle workers here, we have to call it like it is, right now no AGP card except 7900/X1950 is worth buying to inject some life to an AGP system, since the only somewhat acceptable AGPs systems left are probably S939 systems.


I use a 250 watt PSU for my Penitum D 805/Ti 200 rig. You're over-reacting.

Crisp said:
Here is some more info:
I am upgrading from a Geforce2 MX/MX 400; I bought this computer more than 5 years ago, and I wish to keep it for a few more years :p 
Mainboard: Intel D845EBG2
Processor: Intel Pentium 4 2000 MHz
768MB Ram
And here is my PSU:
MODEL NO: ATX-300TA
AC input: 115/220-240v~,7/3.5A, 60/50Hz
DC output: 300w (+3.3v & +5v=120w max)
+3.3v.....20.0A (ORG) ,+5v....20.0A(RED),+12v1...8.0A(Yel)
+12v2....14.0A(Yel/black),+5Vsb...2.0A(PUR P),-12V...0.8A(BLUE)

Are there any more specifications I should mention?


A great upgrade for you would be an FX 5200. No, it's not near as powerful or new as the x1650 pro or 7600 GS, but you should be able to snag one off ebay for as little as $15, and it probably won't consume any more power than that old Geforce 2 MX. You'll also be able to play a lot of games you currently cannot due to lack of DirectX 8 and 9. As an added bonus, your computer would then be capable of running Windows Vista with full Aero Glass effects, if in the next few years you decide to upgrade to vista.

emp said:
I don't get why you would want to upgrade your graphics card then, you already have dedicated graphics card so you don't have to submit to onboard graphics. Also your PC has zero chance at doing any gaming at this stage. If what you want is to turn it into an HTPC, I'd suggest waiting until (and if) Ati or any of its partners release an HD2400/2600 in AGP flavor, probably add 512mb more of ram for now... best thing you can do. AND GET a DECENT PSU IN THE MEAN TIME!

An extreme gamer like yourself can't understand the casual gamer. An upgrade to a video card with even Directx8 support would open up a ton more games for him to choose from. Sure, it won't run Crysis, but his rig with a modest video upgrade will allow him to play the entire GTA series, Call of Duty 1 and 2, a lot of the Battlefield titles, Counter Strike, and last but not least, Lego Star Wars. I mean, who doesn't want to play Lego Star Wars? There's a ton of games out there that just won't play on a Geforce 2.



Honestly, I think he could even get away with running a 6600GT on that 300 watt PSU without having to worry, but at that point his old 2GHz P4 would be a major bottleneck.
a c 130 U Graphics card
August 20, 2007 1:30:36 PM

Well joefriday i was begining to think it was just me :lol: 
August 20, 2007 2:19:45 PM

joefriday said:
I
A great upgrade for you would be an FX 5200. No, it's not near as powerful or new as the x1650 pro or 7600 GS, but you should be able to snag one off ebay for as little as $15, and it probably won't consume any more power than that old Geforce 2 MX.

Honestly, I think he could even get away with running a 6600GT on that 300 watt PSU without having to worry, but at that point his old 2GHz P4 would be a major bottleneck.


:na:  Exactly the card I said!! nVidia GeForce FX 5200. Maybe I got the FX and 5200 turned around, but meant the same card! I actually used it on an old HP/AMD 866Mhz machine and now have it on my multipurpose P4 2.0Ghz PC!! 6600GT wouldn't be bad card and he should be able to run it off 300 Watts easy.
August 20, 2007 8:34:23 PM

Get a used Radeon 9800 from ebay.

HUGE performance increase over your Geforce MX, super cheap, and a little better than an X1300 or Geforce 6600
August 21, 2007 5:45:03 AM

I'm gonna have to disagree with you Cleeve. 6600GT is better than 9800, even besting the 9800 Pro. Also, the prices for the two are almost the same, due to a combination of Ebay being flooded with AGP 6600GTs, forcing their prices down, while the 9800 Pros, for no other reason I can think of other than nostalgia, maintained the prices they had since last year, bringing them both to the $50 mark. I had to decide between the two recently, and ended up going with the 6600GT. I purchased a nice used Leadtek A6600 GT TDH off ebay two weeks ago, still with all its CDs, games, and cables inside the original box, for the paltry sum of $56 shipped (pretty much the going rate for a pristine AGP 6600GT, bare cards can be had $10 less). The 9800 Pros were going anywhere from $45 to $65 dollars, bare cards.
August 21, 2007 5:39:35 PM

The 7600GS is more power efficient than either a 9800 or 6600GT. It may cost more than the either, but it will also outperform both.

However that being said I would agree with Cleeve. A used 9800 Pro off eBay would be the best compromise. The cost would be minimal, which is what you want for a system this old and it's light years ahead of the OP's current graphics setup so their experience will still be enjoyable.

If the OP wants new, the the 7600GS is the way to go but if they want best bang for buck, a used 9800 Pro is the ticket.
a b U Graphics card
August 21, 2007 5:44:35 PM

My only reservation about a used R9800, is that while it's good price/performance, those new SM3.0 only games are potentially going to be a sticking point at some time (like Bioshock, RainbowSix Vegas, etc).

For that reason alone a cheap X1600 or GF7600 on AGP would be the way to go IMO.
August 22, 2007 5:28:50 AM

The Radeon X1600 and Geforce 7600 GS is good too.Has advantage of pixelshader 3.0.

I uses Winfast 7600GS AGP on Pentium 4 2.4 Ghz with 1GB RAM.Even with 1GB RAM, I don,t see any drastically perfomance than my previous Powercolor Radeon 9600 Pro.
August 22, 2007 7:01:36 AM

Anoobis said:
The 7600GS is more power efficient than either a 9800 or 6600GT. It may cost more than the either, but it will also outperform both.

However that being said I would agree with Cleeve. A used 9800 Pro off eBay would be the best compromise. The cost would be minimal, which is what you want for a system this old and it's light years ahead of the OP's current graphics setup so their experience will still be enjoyable.

If the OP wants new, the the 7600GS is the way to go but if they want best bang for buck, a used 9800 Pro is the ticket.


The 6600GT is also SM3.0, and is way cheaper than the 7600 GS, which hovers around the $100 mark. True, the 7600 GS does have better performance and consumes less power, but is it enough to justify paying double the price you'd pay for a 6600GT? A 9800 pro is a friggin joke for the price.

Still, it think bang/buck champion goes to the 128bit FX 5200. Go to Ebay and look at the prices.
a b U Graphics card
August 22, 2007 5:21:11 PM

The only problem with that bang/buck theory is the FX's 0 bang / any amount still gives zero. :lol: 
August 22, 2007 6:13:37 PM

joefriday said:
6600GT is better than 9800, even besting the 9800 Pro.


I didn't say GT, I said 6600... ;) 

But yeah, if 6600 GT AGPs are that cheap on ebay, they're the better bet...
August 22, 2007 6:33:14 PM

TheGreatGrapeApe said:
The only problem with that bang/buck theory is the FX's 0 bang / any amount still gives zero. :lol: 

Actually, that's not ENTIRELY true... should the FX be free, you'd have 0 divided by 0... and that's... well, that's not zero.
August 22, 2007 6:45:54 PM

Would that make the FX5200 the best graphics card ever then? I mean Infinite Price/Perf ratio is quite something...
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2007 12:52:30 AM

rodney_ws said:
Actually, that's not ENTIRELY true... should the FX be free, you'd have 0 divided by 0... and that's... well, that's not zero.


You know I had that argument with my Univ Algebra teacher in Montreal and I still could never convince him that zero goes into 0 an infinite number of times.

But just to make it easier, factoring in the cost of operating it even at a penny a year, there now we are once again at 0/1c :sol: 
!