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I have 2x 300gb 15k SCSI Hard drives... and a P35 MoBo... How?!?

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November 21, 2007 11:25:16 PM

I have 2x 300gb 15k U320 SCSI Hard drives (http://www.stuff-uk.net/?s=ST-HUS153030VL3800)

Can someone please tell me all of the other components I will need to use these hard drives with my P35 mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N...) in RAID 0?

Also should I also get some 10k Raptor to install my OS on?

How about an RAID 5? What else will I need? Can the above MoBo handle it?

Oh and my computer case is: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Will these hard drives fit in the bays or do I need some external enclosure for the hard drives?

Thanks for the help!
November 22, 2007 12:09:47 AM

id imagine you'd ned a scsi raid card

P35 only handle raid with sata
November 22, 2007 12:29:52 AM

thanks for hte reply

so does that mean I can't do an RAID with these harddrives/mobo? or can I still do it WITH an SCSI RAID card?

And what else do i need?
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November 22, 2007 12:53:34 AM

You can with a SCSI RAID card, and you can get them very cheaply on eBay.
November 22, 2007 1:06:54 AM

the raid card. the drivers and/or the software and see if it's compatible with that motherboard which i think it is... stranger
November 22, 2007 2:03:05 AM

I wanna hear your results with these babies in RAID
November 22, 2007 2:58:34 AM

LoL - I went to check for a price on a PCI SCSI controller, but no longer listed. Heheh, I bet they're bloody expensive...
I can get new WD 250GB/16MB SATA2 for only $69 bucks each. HDs are very affordable these days!
It's too bad, but you could purchase 2 of them for less than the price of a SCSI controller (probably way less)
Regards
November 22, 2007 2:59:50 AM

jt001 said:
You can with a SCSI RAID card, and you can get them very cheaply on eBay.

Really? That would work,
L8R
November 22, 2007 3:14:39 AM

so all i need is an SCSI RAID card?!?!? are you sure there's not something else? will i also need some 80pin to 68pin adapter?

will i only need one scsi raid card for all of my hard drives?

do these hard drives fit in my case?


and a random question: is it possible to do RAID without identical model hard drives?

thanks for the replies
November 22, 2007 4:15:38 AM

If you're using 80-pin drives you can use an adapter OR a drive cage assembly with built-in adapter. You'll need a 68-pin cable rated for at least the same speed, and a terminator.

80-pin is simply the 68-pin interface with device ID pins, power pins, etc added.
November 22, 2007 4:23:32 AM

Quote:
so all i need is an SCSI RAID card?!?!? are you sure there's not something else? will i also need some 80pin to 68pin adapter? will i only need one scsi raid card for all of my hard drives?

If you already have SCSI drives, you will need just the PCI SCSI controller and cables. Possibly the SCSI drives have weird power hookup (but probably regular molex 4-pin).
Some control more drives, but most SCSI cards will control at least 2.
Quote:
do these hard drives fit in my case?

I think they are ordinary 3.5" HD size, aren't they? Note you can buy inexpensive HD rails to mount HDs in larger 5.25" (burner size) openings. I do this a lot.
Quote:
a random question: is it possible to do RAID without identical model hard drives?

Yes. The newest Intel Matrix controller technology is highly flexible in configuration. You can mirror and stripe, both on the same HDs, using matching partitions on dissimilar drives. It's pretty amazing actually...
But it worries me (I am old :sleep:  and suspicious) so, I'm not into it myself. I guess as long as you have your parity (your mirror) you are safe - it's actually safer, right? so it's free speed! I should check it out again...
Your SCSI RAID controller will probably be more basic. Probably RAID 0 (mirror) or RAID 1 (stripe) for speed. Note that RAID 0 also offers a performance improvement.
L8R
November 22, 2007 4:37:04 AM

Crashman said:
If you're using 80-pin drives you can use an adapter OR a drive cage assembly with built-in adapter. You'll need a 68-pin cable rated for at least the same speed, and a terminator.

80-pin is simply the 68-pin interface with device ID pins, power pins, etc added.


How does that work crashman - if he has 80-pin HDs would a regular controller detect them? I have had HDs that came up 'SCSI' unexpectedly sometimes, on a regular IDE controller... but they worked fine.
So a SCSI controller mounts 68-pin cable then?
It says his HDs are 'U320 SCSI' and y'know, I'm not sure what that is.
November 22, 2007 5:08:09 AM

The_OGS said:
How does that work crashman - if he has 80-pin HDs would a regular controller detect them? I have had HDs that came up 'SCSI' unexpectedly sometimes, on a regular IDE controller... but they worked fine.
So a SCSI controller mounts 68-pin cable then?
It says his HDs are 'U320 SCSI' and y'know, I'm not sure what that is.


A regular 68-pin SCSI controller will detect them because it uses the same interface. A normal 68-pin drive has a data cable, a power cable, and several jumpers. The 80-pin interface contains all of those. 80-pin interfaces are designed for drive cages that have the jumpers and power connector on the cage, so that the drive can be swapped without manually configuring the jumper settings on the new drive. 80-pin is nothing more than an easy-swap connector that uses the 68-pin data interface. Some server cases have a huge drive cage built in, with all the jumpers and so forth on the rack.

This is totally unlike ATA or SATA, all the parts are different. Ultra 320 is the fast version, but Ultra 160 will function just as well in most PC's due to the bandwidth limittations of the 32-bit PCI slot. Ultra 320/160/80 are all cross-compatible.
November 22, 2007 5:37:55 AM

Will this cheap controller work:
http://cgi.ebay.com/IBM-ServeRaid-5i-U160-U320-SCSI-RAI...
http://www-304.ibm.com/jct01004c/systems/support/suppor...

If so, will it bottleneck my hard drive?

How about these 68-80 adapters:
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-SCA-80-ADAPTER-TO-68-PIN-SCSI-D...

Again i have to ask: will the adapters bottleneck?

Thanks!



edit:
and will i need this cable to connect each adapter to the actual controller? or am i looking for something else?
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-SCSI-Ultra-U320-320-LVD-CABLE-4...
November 22, 2007 2:58:25 PM

When placing a 64-bit (long interface) card into a normal (short) 32-bit slot, you need to make sure the motherboard had enough clearence to let the extra card portion hang out of the front of the slot. Most boards do. U160 is still faster than the slot, so I don't perceive any performance penalty.

The adapter should be fine.

Then you need to make sure you can get drivers for the card that work with your operating system. Windows XP might have built-in drivers for that card, or the Win2k drivers might work under XP. As for Vista, you'd need to do some research.

The cable should be fine.
November 22, 2007 10:08:01 PM

Won't the 32-bit interface bottleneck my hard drive? the hard drive has a max data transfer of 320 mb/s right? (hence the name ultra320)

And the 32-bit interface has a max transfer rate of 133 mb/s?

Considering I only have a P35 MoBo, do I have to get a PCI-express X1 scsi adapter to allow my hard drive to realize its full potential? my x16 is occupied by a graphics accelerator
November 22, 2007 10:31:50 PM

Yes, PCI-Express x1 gives you 250mb/s each way (bi-directional) and will be faster than the real performance limit of each drive (and probably close the the performance limit of two drives in "RAID" Level 0). Good luck finding one.
November 22, 2007 11:26:11 PM

Well your luck didn't help me lol... those PCI-e X1 SCSI controllers cost $150+ and are pretty dam rare

so the hypothetical maximum data transfer is 320 mb/s, but is it safe to assume these 15k ultra320's won't ever exceed a transfer rate of 100 mb/s? The hard drive tests at Storage Review seem to indicate so (http://www.storagereview.com/php/benchmark/bench_sort.p...)... or am I looking at something entirely irrelevant? If, so what is data transfer? Have any hard drives exceeded 100mb/s transfer?

I'd like to get a standard PCI 32-bit interface controller or the PCI-X with the other half not being in use, but I really don't want to bottleneck my hard drive -- the whole point of getting these hard drives was to have fast transfer rates
November 23, 2007 1:29:21 AM

I would have gone with a couple of Western Digital's latest 750GB SATA drives in Level 0 using the chipset's controller. The pair would be faster than the 133MB/s supported by a 32-bit PCI slot.
November 23, 2007 3:54:10 AM

I've decided to sell one of the 300gb 15k SCSI Hard Drives and just use one.

So this is all I will need right for my P35 MoBo? All is compatible?

PCI to SCSI adapter/controller:
http://cgi.ebay.com/LSI-Logic-1320-U320-PCI-X-133-SCSI-...

68pin to 68pin cable:
http://cgi.ebay.com/3-device-SCSI-CABLE-24-Ultra320-LVD...
I couldn't find a cable with just one 68pin male to one 68pin male. Do I need to put terminators on the unused male pins?

80pin to 68pin adapter:
http://cgi.ebay.com/SCA-80-ADAPTER-TO-68-PIN-ULTRA-SCSI...

Thanks for all the help! Almost done here :) 
November 23, 2007 4:00:33 AM

That should do it. You can actually run quite a few drives off from one SCSI cable if you like.
November 23, 2007 4:18:11 AM

Ok one LAST question: do I need terminators for the unused 68pin males for the cable?

And yea, thanks for all the help crashman. I really appreciate it
November 23, 2007 4:41:29 AM

You only need one terminator at the end of the cable.
!