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Will two raptors on a Maximus Formula work in RAID 0?

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January 11, 2008 7:41:01 PM

I want to order two raptor hard drives and get the Asus Maximus Formula motherboard. Do i need to buy anything extra for RAID 0 to work like a raid controller or any extra cables? Or do i just simply put the hard drives in as normal and then enable something in bios?
January 11, 2008 8:29:43 PM

I dont have a floppy drive, I thought Vista had the raid drivers allready installed?
January 11, 2008 8:34:33 PM

There is a simple answer to that very question! I believe that mobo does have a set of RAID controllers,...so yes with that you should be set! Make sure you do the whole loading the sata drivers by floppy on windows setup start-up (f6 prompt)! In the manual there should be a complete step-by-step instruction on how to set up a RAID0,..that should be done of course before you install windows. If you bought yr motherboard by (open box) AND there is no manual,...asus.com will always have it! Any questions....please ask!(btw,...why are u buying,...the Maximus Formula?) (get a m3n332-mvp with a phenom black edition,...OCed to 3.02) (it'll save you 300 bucks and,...get you 1 whore of a good pc)
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January 11, 2008 8:43:02 PM

I do not have a floppy drive so is it impossible for me to set up raid?
January 12, 2008 12:03:33 PM

no,..if your planing on running vista,...a pen drive will work fine!
January 12, 2008 7:53:42 PM

So i will have to download the drivers and put the install file on a pen drive? How will i open the drivers when booting the PC up?
January 16, 2008 7:29:34 AM

Does anybody know?
January 16, 2008 9:08:57 AM

What are you trying to do:

What are you hoping to achieve by going for RAID 0?
What operating system?
Are you performing a new clean install?
Do you want to have the RAID array as your boot disk?
Have you read other people's experience with RAID 0 on this forum?

January 16, 2008 10:12:46 AM

k,..this is what i suggest! I believe yr raiding for a speed increase,..not a large back up of your hard drive,..thus raid0....is ideal. In the vista setup i believe it will ask whether or not u want to install raid, scsi or (sata) drivers,....thus the pen driver should work fine as its source to load from. The raid drivers I believe should be integrated,...via bios,..check if there's a upgrade available. (this should be done before vista setup of course) To setup your raid there should be direct instructions in your manual,...there's a hotkey you hit before loading from the cd (DVD),....which launches the raid utility,...from there on it should be smooth sailing.
January 16, 2008 11:17:47 AM

UncleDave said:
What are you trying to do:

What are you hoping to achieve by going for RAID 0?
What operating system?
Are you performing a new clean install?
Do you want to have the RAID array as your boot disk?
Have you read other people's experience with RAID 0 on this forum?


1. Reason i want to set it up is for faster speeds in gaming.
2. Vista 64bit
3. Yes its a clean install.
4. What do you mean by this? My 2 raptors will be where the operating system is installed and i will boot up the computer on the raptors.
5. Have read some posts on peoples experience and some people say that vista comes with drivers, some people say you need to use a floppy disk so i was unsure.



adlertheman - Thanks for help, when my motherboard arrives i will have a look.
January 16, 2008 11:40:07 AM

I feel that most people suggest, which I support, that RAID 0 isn't worth the performance improvement. You've got the best drives around at the moment. I'd put them in as two separate drives and have the OS on one and swap files, games, etc. on the other*.

point 3 - I was wondering if you were upgrading your motherboard and wanted to move all your kit across. In that case I would have begged you to re-install the OS.
point 5 - Some drivers are included with Vista - you'd need to double check.

http://www.asus.com/products.aspx?modelmenu=2&model=188...
Intel Matrix Storage Technology Support RAID 0,1,5,10,

http://www.intel.com/support/chipsets/imsm/sb/CS-023632...
Q2: Will Intel provide RAID drivers in the final version of the Microsoft Windows Vista operating system?
A: Yes. Intel will provide an Intel® Matrix Storage Manager RAID driver as part of the final Microsoft Windows Vista release. This RAID driver will support Intel® chipsets with the following I/O controller hubs when RAID is enabled:

Intel® 82801HR/HH/HO I/O controller hub (ICH8R)
Intel® 631xESB/632xESB I/O controller hub
Intel® 82801GHM I/O controller hub (ICH7MDH)
Intel® 82801GR I/O controller hub (ICH7R)
Intel® 82801GH I/O controller hub (ICH7DH)
Intel® 82801FR I/O controller hub (ICH6R

Please read http://faq.storagereview.com/tiki-index.php?page=Single..., as quoted by geofelt in another thread.


* Well not really I'd rather go for RAID 1 but I think you'd get closer to what you want with less pain.
January 16, 2008 12:32:43 PM

The only reason i bought two of them was to run them in RAID for better performance. I read that RAID 0 was the best performance.

This is a whole new PC so i am upgrading everything. I went to the link you sent for my motherboard and i see it says:

"Intel Matrix Storage Technology Support RAID 0,1,5,10,
JMicron® JMB368 PATA controller "

Does this mean its built in or do i have to download it?

January 16, 2008 12:52:38 PM

These days mobo's have two raid controllers,...i guess for the reason of having a raid on one and single sata hard drives on the other! What i would do is,..find out witch one is located on the south bridge of your mobo,...probably the Intel Matrix Storage. Anyways, i would put my raid on that,....being that its probably easer to set up and likely to perform better. Anything else you plan to hook-up,..throw that on the JMicron. I wouldn't be surprised if its something to like ctrl+I to enter the raid utility (Intel controller) .
January 16, 2008 1:01:58 PM

I currently have an ASUS Commando board which I used to setup Raid 0 on two Raptor drives and install Vista 64 onto.

It required using the supplied raid utility to set the drives up and enabling the operation of the SATA drives as 'RAID' in the bios.

Once this was completed, I was able to install Vista 64 without any disks, key drives, or drivers of any kind. Vista did it all. I believe your board has a similiar RAID controller and BIOS setup to mine, but you should verify that.
January 16, 2008 1:10:56 PM

Bidybag said:
The only reason i bought two of them was to run them in RAID for better performance. I read that RAID 0 was the best performance.


RAID 0 does offer better performance. Did you read the link that geofelt provided? If not please do so as I think it's a very balanced article.

Bear in mind however, that data striped across multiple drives is much more vulnerable to loss as a physical failure of even one drive results in the loss of all data on the entire array. If capacity is the goal, it is almost always better to run the two drives as separate units.

What about performance? This, we suspect, is the primary reason why so many users doggedly pursue the RAID 0 "holy grail." This inevitably leads to disappointment by those that notice little or no performance gain.


Bidybag said:

"Intel Matrix Storage Technology Support RAID 0,1,5,10,
JMicron® JMB368 PATA controller "

Does this mean its built in or do i have to download it?


This refers to the hardware (chips) on the motherboard that provide the functionality. The Intel chips provide the RAID functionality on the SATA connectors. The PATA chips control the IDE devices. Drivers to allow Vista to communicate with the hardware will be provided by Asus with the motherboard.
January 16, 2008 1:26:40 PM

Yea i read that but i will be having a backup harddrive which i can put important files on. I will only be using my computer for gaming so even a little bit of a performance increase is good. I have already bought the hard drives too. So i might as well set it up and get a little bit of a performance increase.

Its just now im worried about it being too hard or something. I am glad to hear Suaph set it up with no problems and he didnt even need to use a pen drive or floppy drive. I hope it will be this easy for me.

Suaph - I see that you said "It required using the supplied raid utility to set the drives up and enabling the operation of the SATA drives as 'RAID' in the bios. "

After you booted up for the first time did you run this utility straight away? How did you get to this utility?

January 16, 2008 1:29:25 PM

As someone mentioned prior, during the first boot after the system POSTed, it takes you to another screen with an option to enter the RAID utility. CTRL-I sounds right, but it could be some other combination.

You will have to enable RAID operation and set up the drives in RAID before you install Vista. Otherwise Vista would just format one of the drives and install it on a that, and not the array.

One other note: Any time you update the BIOS on the motherboard, you will most likely be required to reset the operation of the SATA drives to RAID before your computer will boot up properly again. As the default settings seem to reset this option.
January 16, 2008 1:32:10 PM

Ok thanks.

1. When im setting up RAID do i have to set any other options? I read something about the stripe setting? Do i have to change this while setting up RAID or can i change it at any time?

2. Will my motherboard come with the latest bios drivers or do i have to download them and update it myself? How would i check the current bios version?
January 16, 2008 1:55:22 PM

1. When you set up RAID it will require you to enter the type of array etc, and you cannot change this at any time. You may want to do some reading on RAID setup and management before you go this route.

2. It may, or may not. Generally there will be something new out between the time the motherboard is packaged and you receive it. However, you do not need to update the BIOS unless there is a release that fixes a specific problem you are having. (IE: CPU support, etc) Recent ASUS BIOS come with an EZ Update program built into the BIOS that requires storing a BIOS image file on a key drive. ASUS also has a windows update program that will update the BIOS, for most of their boards. Like I said, it shouldn't be necessary unless you're having problems with something that a new BIOS update would fix.
January 16, 2008 2:05:27 PM

naturally,..you should just check the mobo web site for updates. OK,....i guess these are the steps u should take.

1 If possible to use another computer, check for bios updates,..if available,...update,...and set sata to raid,..there could be other configs to fiddle with.

2 Launch raid tool,...raid0 both raptors,..i don't know who the hell is saying raid0 has no performance gain.

3 Install vista,...make sure,...yr sata drivers are installed,...or you'll be working with a 40mb/s Hard drive bandwidth instead of something around 70-110
January 16, 2008 2:07:41 PM

Suaph said:
1. When you set up RAID it will require you to enter the type of array etc, and you cannot change this at any time. You may want to do some reading on RAID setup and management before you go this route.



I know i am going to use RAID 0 when setting it up but i was wondering if there are other settings i have to set up. Like the stripe setting or anything else?
January 16, 2008 2:29:11 PM

Bidybag said:
I know i am going to use RAID 0 when setting it up but i was wondering if there are other settings i have to set up. Like the stripe setting or anything else?



With all due respect I think all of the advise that you are being offered in this thread may be making something that should be simple, complicated. I suggest that you wait until your kit arrives, read the manual and then post any questions that you have on this or a new thread.

Suaph has been through what you would like to do - listen to what he says.
January 16, 2008 2:29:12 PM

You will have to set the stripe size, yes. You cannot change this without backing up the data, wiping the array out, creating a new array, and then loading from the back up.

Stripe size depends on your average use... large file versus small file. The larger the files you deal with, the larger the stripe size you can/should use. Some reading on the topic may help you decide, but 64kb or 128kb should be fine for general use.

You may even choose to leave the default stripe size the RAID utility is set at. Small striping causes decreased performance in the writing of massive files, large stripes nullify any benefit of the RAID setup in writing of files smaller than a single stripe.
January 16, 2008 3:16:07 PM

I am going to use my computer mainly for gaming and downloading big files on the Internet. Would it just be safer to leave it as default? But if i leave it as default i wont get the maximum benefit from RAID?
a c 174 G Storage
January 16, 2008 3:40:32 PM

If your use is gaming, and downloading big files from the internet, it will be safer, easier, and faster to use both raptors as separate individual hard disks.

Download speeds from the internet are limited by your internet speed, not the hard drive speed, so there is no advantage there.

As to games, there are some plusses, and some minuses from raid-0. Net is a performance wash. I suggest you put your os on one drive, and your games on the other. With two raptors, you will have the very best reasonably priced configuration available today. Add in a good defrag of the hdd with the game levels, and you are good to go.

I am waiting for SSD's to become reasonable in price.
January 16, 2008 11:45:27 PM

I have read about people saying they have had a big performance increase when using RAID 0 so if i have two raptors then i might aswell use them in raid. It would be a waste not to.
January 17, 2008 12:22:11 AM

Bidybag said:
I have read about people saying they have had a big performance increase when using RAID 0 so if i have two raptors then i might aswell use them in raid. It would be a waste not to.


I ran 36GB Raptors in RAID 0 on my old P4 system. In my opinion, it wasn't worth the hassle and exponential increase in the probability of the RAID failing. If one drive dies, you lose it all. But to each his own.

If I were you, I'd install Vista and a few programs/games on a single drive. Take note of the performance. THEN format and reinstall everything in RAID 0 and see if it's everything you thought it would be. My guess is that it won't be.
January 18, 2008 8:30:23 AM

That will take too long. I am just going to use RAID with the raptors. Thats the reason i bought two of them.

Just need to know what a good stripe size is.
January 18, 2008 3:29:33 PM

I had a look on some pages and i found out that 64KB was an ok size for gaming. What do people think of this?
January 18, 2008 4:15:25 PM

up at falcon they are having increasing customer
complaints with the raid arrays due to controller issues.
falcon suggests that you do not raid.
January 23, 2008 5:45:06 AM

I checked the Asus website and in the downloads section for the Forumula motherboard they had:

Version 7.5.0.1017
2007/09/17 update
Description Make Intel ICH9 RAID Driver Disk for Windows XP & 64bit XP/ Vista/ 64bit Vista.
File Size 1.38 (MBytes)


I downloaded it and read the readme and it says i need to put it on a floppy disc. It also comes with Asus file image extractor so i can put the files on a floppy.

What is this for? Do i need this for RAID to work?
July 23, 2008 5:30:35 PM

That's for XP, not Vista.
a b G Storage
July 23, 2008 7:22:52 PM

Vista shouldn't need the drivers. Try it without first, and if it doesn't see the volume, then you can start trying to find the proper drivers.
July 24, 2008 2:57:38 PM

Just want to add my $.02 here. I have the Asus P5E, which is the little brother to the Maximus Formula. Initially, I have run TWO WD 74 GB Raptors in Raid 0 with NO issues. Prior to the P5E, I ran the same two drives on two other motherboards...first an Asus P4C800E and then the Asus P5B Deluxe. Over a total three and a half year period, I have NEVER experienced any issues with these drives in RAID 0. I currently have upgraded to ONE Velociraptor 300 GB and am about to purchase a second in a month or so...and will go back to RAID 0. These Raptor drives from WD are enterprise drives...even WD will tell you that they can sustain and maintain RAID 0 very well. I have never lost one file...The performance of the single drive Hits 130 on the outer and minimum 80 on the inner with an average seek rate of 108 on my machine. Reports in RAID 0 are supposed to be Outer 166 / Inner 120 with an average somewhere in the 130's. The drives are really built well...and I don't think that you will encounter any issues. I will admit that I back my system up weekly...with Acronis TI 10 and an external Firewire drive (I have done regular backups for years...based on the warnings...and have only needed to restore because I did something to corrupt my data...not the Raptors).

Follow your own path. If you want RAID 0 with two Velociraptors...you ARE gonna see a good incrrease. All in all...they are great drives...capable of RAID 0 without even breaking a sweat...

Good Luck

Bob
a b G Storage
July 29, 2008 11:55:01 AM

Raid0 should work just fine in your board/drive. All my PCs are on raid0 and never had issues with it.

March 15, 2009 1:02:26 PM

My God this thread has gotten way too complicated.
I've done RAID0 on Maximus Formula Vista x64 --- Here's the answer:

Boot to Bios / Main / SATA Configuration
---- Configure SATA As: RAID ----
Save and exit -
Setup your drives as striped in the config menu on reboot.
Save and exit -
Boot to your Vista CD and install. Vista will detect the RAID0 config and install the
OS onto the array (seeing the raptors as a single drive)

Presto!
!