Upgrade from P4 3.4 GHz, advice needed

[naturally]

Hi,

I would appreciate all help.

My current system is the following:

CPU: Intel Pentium 4 3.4 GHz
Mobo: MSI MS-6758 ATX - Intel 875P Neo P Series
Optical #1: LG DVD DL Writer
Optical #2: LG CD Writer
Graphics: MSI Nvidia GeForce 6600 AGP 256MB RAM
RAM: 2X1GB DDR + 2X512MB DDR
Hard Disk 0: WD 500 GB SATA - WDC WD5000KS
Hard Disk 1: Maxtor 160 GB SATA - Maxtor 6Y160M0
Hard Disk 2: Maxtor 160 GB PATA - Maxtor 6Y160P0
Monitor: Sony LCD 19" monitor
Case: Unbranded - 500w supply
Fans: 3 8" fans in the case (the middle east gets REALLY hot)


I mainly use it for internet browsing, office documents, media encoding (recoding dvd's and movies ... etc). I play some games, but that is not the main purpose of the system.

The main reason for the upgrade is to enable me to upgrade the OS from windows XP SP2 to Vista Home Premium with Office 2007.

I would appreciate some recommendation for the new motherboard and CPU. I have my heart set on a 8800 GTS graphics card, and 4 GB RAM (I am not sure whether I will go for DDR3 or DDR2 advise is needed there too).

I am considering a quadcore CPU.

 

[rockyjohn]

Is the PSU unbranded as well as the case? Please provide whatever info you can on the PSU - make, model, or power by rail if there is a label on the outside providing information on the latter. Since you have an AGP card now - I am wondering if the PS has the connectors needed for a PCIe card - and also the quality of the card and power to the 12C rail. This could have a signficant impact on upgrade options - or if it needs to be replaced perhaps affect buget and plans.

 

[naturally]

I did not realise that the 8800 requires its own power. I will check the PSU and post the specs later today when I return from office.

Regardless, if there is a need, then I will replace the PSU.

 

[Nitro350Z]

You do know you will need to get a new mobo right? The one you have right now is Skt 478, all new C2Ds and C2Q are LGA775, and the 8800 series is PCI-e, while your board only has AGP.

Basically, its not worth it to upgrade only one or two things in this outdated system, Best option is to either wait, or build a new system while reusing some of the old hardware like harddrives, monitor, optical drives, etc.

HTH

 

[naturally]

Thanks for the responses.

It seems that I will need to upgrade the following:

■Motherboard
■CPU
■RAM
■PSU
■Graphics Card

The best locally supported Motherboards are Gigabyte, I reviewed their website and I like the following motherboard:

GA-N680SLI-DQ6 NVIDIA® nForce® 680i SLI MCP Chipset
Product Page at Gigbyte Website

For the CPU, I am considering an Intel Quad Core, probably the Q6600, seems like the bargain Quad core CPU.

For the RAM, I am considering 4 GB DDR2 RAM. I will try for the best brand available, but good RAM is in short supply over here and I do not want to buy RAM from the US or UK for warranty issues.


Any comments on the proposed setup above will be appreciated.

 

[aevm]

The GA-N680SLI-DQ6 was very likely the best motherboard in the world last year. I was very tempted, but then I decided I didn't want SLI after all and it didn't make sense any more. There's a new chipset called P35 out there that would serve you better. Get a GA-P35-DS3R instead.
Get 2 sticks of 2 GB DDR2-800.
Q6600 is the smartest choice in CPUs today.
Reuse the DVD writer and the hard disks from the old build. Forget the CD writer, your DVD writer can write CDs.
The 8800 GTS 320 MB is perfect for a 19" monitor.
PSU - I'd recommend Corsair 620HX or a Seasonic 600W (or Thermaltake, PC Power & Cooling, OCZ).
Get a CPU cooler, it will help if ambient temps are high.
If your current case does not cool well enough consider an Antec 900 or Thermaltake Armor.

 

[Zorg]

Definitely get a P35 mobo and only 2G of ram as per aevm. A really good PS and relatively cheap.

SILENCER® 610 EPS12V

 

[naturally]

Thanks for the solid advice aevm.

I did not know about the P35 chipset. Looks like an outstanding choice.

Thank You.

 

[Kamrooz]

Well...Although I have no advice since it's already been stated...lol..Seems like you've got some good advice. What is your budget btw?

If you follow Aevm's choices you got a pretty solid rig. He's also chosen the upper tier PSU's for you as well. Can't stress enough how important PSU's are...but considering what's been said you'll be completely stoked about the performance...But what is your budget?..

 

[naturally]

No budget as such. Very flexible.

 

[naturally]

Any guidelines to decent specifications of a good PSU?

I think that I will have difficulty finding good branded PSU units locally. Warranty issues prevent me from getting one shipped half way accross the world.

I would appreciate any pointers to articles I can read on the subject.

 

[lunyone]

Here is one link for ya.
http://www.jonnyguru.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1460
Corsair/Thermaltake/PPC&C/OCZ/Antec are usually some of the best to get.
Still trying to find Milpichfamily's PSU stickies, since the Forums changed there look

 

[Zorg]

I believe those were removed when he left the forums.

 

[Kamrooz]

here's another list for you...try to stay above teir 2 since your budget is flexible..

http://forums.overclockersclub.com/index.php?showtopic=69770

BTW...why a 19 inch lcd?...why not larger?...How often do you game?..cause you didn't state really. Also do you plan to do high definiton watchin?..if so you might want a bigger monitor. If you could list all your usages I can recommend something else for yeh...19 inch is too small imo...you really should get something bigger..good to have atleast a 20 incher to last you a good while..they don't cost that much either..although I would recommend a 24+ ^_^.

 

[DXRick]

Go here to figure out what power you will need:

http://www.extreme.outervision.com/PSUEngine

 

[naturally]

Thanks to all for the information. I have enough information about the PSU purchase.

According to the PSUEngine at outervision from the link above, I need a minimum of 600w. I will probably go for 650w+, because of the hot ambient environment it will run in.

 

[naturally]

here's another list for you...try to stay above teir 2 since your budget is flexible..

http://forums.overclockersclub.com/index.php?showtopic=69770

BTW...why a 19 inch lcd?...why not larger?...How often do you game?..cause you didn't state really. Also do you plan to do high definiton watchin?..if so you might want a bigger monitor. If you could list all your usages I can recommend something else for yeh...19 inch is too small imo...you really should get something bigger..good to have atleast a 20 incher to last you a good while..they don't cost that much either..although I would recommend a 24+ ^_^.

Thanks for the link. I will aim for Teir 1 and optionally Tier 2, if I cannot locate anything better.


19 inch LCD, the only reason is because I already have it. It has been there for 3 years with no issues. I may upgrade it if I can get some advantages with a new one. The current model that I have is the Sony HX93.

I mainly use the PC for internet browsing, office documents, media encoding (recoding dvd's and movies ... etc), ripping CD's, mixing using software such as audacity, using photoshop for manipulation of digital photography pictures... etc. I do not use the PC to watch movies, only encode them. I play some old games, such as civilization and simcity 4 ... etc.

I have a PS3 and will probably buy an Xbox 360 sometime in the future. I have a Sony Bravia 46" and a Denon reciever connected to an Axiom full speaker 5.1 setup. I use that for movies and games.

For my uses, do you think that I will benefit from a bigger monitor?

 

[Kamrooz]

Well bigger monitors benefit a lot. I do MANY things, Web design, video editing, video encoding, video special effects, photoshop for graphic creation, photoshop for cg'ing my drawings, gaming, movies, 3d modeling....a lot of **** basically...lol..

It's always nice to have a larger monitor. If you work with very large files it helps having a bigger monitor and a graphics card to utilize its native resolution. Do you do a lot of photoshop work?...Cause there are three types of panels..TN, PVA/MVA, and IPS...Tn are the cheapest and that's what you see in almost all retail stores.

TN = Fastest response times and low input lag, lowest color accuracy and darks.

PVA/MVA = Much better colors, highest contrast ratio of all. Best blacks but they crush (you lose detail in very dark areas). They also are the slowest in terms of response time and input lag. Which means ghosting..basically an after image..If you play games think of it as a blur of objects moving. But a word about ghosting. Some people see it and some don't..It actually depends on the person. I've gamed competitively in leagues for years...I have fast reflexes and a very keen eye when it comes to quality and artifacts...I can see pixelation while friends think I'm crazy...It all depends on the persons traits and eyes.

IPS = Best color accuracy out of all panels. Blacks are good and contrast as well but not as good as PVA/MVA in terms of contrast. But you don't lose details in the darker areas (they don't crush). They also have fast response times and input lag but not as quick as TN..but faster then PVA/MVA.

Those are the 3 types. It basically is based off your usages...For me...I have a CRT...I'm planning to nab another CRT..a Sony FW900 24" widescreen CRT...the only widescreen CRT made..Retailed around 2,300 back in 2003 before they discontinued it (all companies have switched to flat panels). But yea...If I was to nab a LCD monitor, cosidering my vast uses I'd have to get a top of the line Nec 2690WUXI...it's 1700 dollars but offers professional grade quality. It's a 26 incher..but you can get away with MUCH more since your uses aren't as demanding...

They have 20 inch IPS panels which might be of interest to you. They don't have any IPS 22 inchers unfortunately..so if you decide to go IPS you'll have to get either a 20 inch or a 24+...If monitors don't really bother you you can get by with pretty much anything. But once you've used a PVA/MVA or IPS panel it's hard to get back to a TN. for Hidef video I'd recommend a 24 inch if you are planning to get one. But it's all based on what size you want and feel fits for you. For me the bigger and more workspace the better. Dealing with hidef video for editing is a pain at times. It's just too damn large.

Overall I think 19 is a bit small...is yours a widescreen?...

 

[naturally]

It is not widescreen, ordinary 4:3.

I will consider the monitor upgrade once I finish with the PC upgrade.

I was trying to understand the acronyms used above, and figured out that TN was "Twisted nematic" and that IPS was "In-plane switching".

I cannot figure out PVA/MVA , any hints?

 

[Kamrooz]

you are right on TN and IPS...MVA stands for "Multidomain Vertical Alignment"...While PVA is "Patterned Vertical Alignment"..

here's a quick difference between the panels..

TN Gamers
Considered a "gamers" panel due to it's fast pixel response times which reduces trailing images know as "ghosting". However, this advantage has been reduced by new technologies to accelerate pixel response times in other panel types. Colors and contrast tend to be weak and blacks are not truly dark. Viewing angles are significantly limited. However, monitors based on this technology tend to be inexpensive.

IPS / S-IPS Graphics Work or Web Browsing
Considered to have the best color reproduction of all panel types, these panels are well suited for graphics work or web browsing. Pixel response time is also good but slower than the TN "gamers" panel. Contast and blacks are also less dark than VA panels but viewing angles are excellent.

MVA / P-MVA / PVA / S-PVA Compromise for All-Around Use
These panels are a compromise between the fast pixel response times of the TN panel and the excellent color reproduction of the IPS panels. Contrast and blacks are best of all the panel types. Viewing angles are similar but slightly inferior to IPS.


One part which isn't very accurate though is the response/input lag on the MVA/PVA...it's not really a "compromise" PVA/MVA have the slowest response time of the 3 panels..which results in ghosting...

Here is some more info..

TN film (Twisted Nematic)
- low manufacturing/retail costs
- restrictive viewing angles
- fast pixel response times
- dead pixels display white. Stuck pixels display RGB colors
- lower contrast levels means blacks are not as dark as VA based panels
- lower color reproduction

IPS (In Plane Switching)
- improved viewing angles over TN
- very good color reproduction
- slower pixel response times than TN
- dead pixels display black
- lower contrast levels means blacks are not as dark as VA based panels

MVA (Multidomain Vertical Alignment)
- compromise between TN and IPS technologies
- superior color reproduction over TN but not as good as IPS
- very good viewing angles but less than IPS
- higher contrast than TN or S-IPS means very good blacks
- dead pixels are black
- slower pixel response than TN or IPS
- details can be lost when directly viewing dark areas

PVA (Patterned VA)
- same as MVA except ...
- larger viewing angles
- higher contrast levels means darkest blacks

Hope that helps....If you have ANY questions..feel free to ask.

 

[lunyone]

I believe those were removed when he left the forums.

OUCH!!! That was a big blow to the PSU section He'll be missed. Wonder why he left?

 

[smokedyou911]

You could hock your pc up to your tv . That rig is gonna be sweet. I belive If you use your hard drive and dvd burners from your current build you can build a q660, 2 gigs for dd2, 8800gts 320mb, p35 mobo, cooler master centurion 5 and the psu of your choice you can get it for $1000-1200.

 

[rockyjohn]

According to the PSUEngine at outervision from the link above, I need a minimum of 600w. I will probably go for 650w+, because of the hot ambient environment it will run in.

Are you sure? It seemed a little high to me so I ran it using your basic specs and throwing in a few minor peripherals in case all the little items weren't mentioned. I came up with a requirement of only 382W. I did not include any overclocking though. You might want to check it again. On the first item, did you select single or quad processer? The Q6600 is a SINGLE processor with quad core. You should select "Single" - the quad cores are accounted for under the processor choice.

However, nevertheless, a 600W processor is fine and should leave room for plenty of upgrades. However, a 500W or 550W unit might save you a little money and would still leave room for upgrades. If considering SLI or overclocking, you might want to stick with the 600W.

 

[naturally]

Are you sure? It seemed a little high to me so I ran it using your basic specs and throwing in a few minor peripherals in case all the little items weren't mentioned. I came up with a requirement of only 382W. I did not include any overclocking though. You might want to check it again. On the first item, did you select single or quad processer? The Q6600 is a SINGLE processor with quad core. You should select "Single" - the quad cores are accounted for under the processor choice.

However, nevertheless, a 600W processor is fine and should leave room for plenty of upgrades. However, a 500W or 550W unit might save you a little money and would still leave room for upgrades. If considering SLI or overclocking, you might want to stick with the 600W.

I have lots of ambient heat, so I factored for more cooling. I also though about overclocking the CPU and selected that option.

I also do lots of video editing and image processing which results in big files. I currently have 3 Hard Disks in my system and am planning for 4 with the new one.

 

[naturally]

The GA-N680SLI-DQ6 was very likely the best motherboard in the world last year. I was very tempted, but then I decided I didn't want SLI after all and it didn't make sense any more. There's a new chipset called P35 out there that would serve you better. Get a GA-P35-DS3R instead.
Get 2 sticks of 2 GB DDR2-800.
Q6600 is the smartest choice in CPUs today.
Reuse the DVD writer and the hard disks from the old build. Forget the CD writer, your DVD writer can write CDs.
The 8800 GTS 320 MB is perfect for a 19" monitor.
PSU - I'd recommend Corsair 620HX or a Seasonic 600W (or Thermaltake, PC Power & Cooling, OCZ).
Get a CPU cooler, it will help if ambient temps are high.
If your current case does not cool well enough consider an Antec 900 or Thermaltake Armor.

I did some more reading and found out that the Q6600 support 1066 FSB.

Would I gain any performance advantages by going for 2 GB 1066MHz RAM as opposed to 4 GB 800MHz RAM?

(nb. 2 GB 1066 MHz costs the same as 4 GB 800 MHz RAM)