"Don't Skimp on the PSU!" But why not?

KrisRhodes

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I've seen a lot of comments to the effect that it is a terrible thing to get a cheap PSU. But I haven't seen any explanations as to why this is.

What's bad about a cheap PSU? What problems will it cause?

-Kris
 

hassa

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Have you ever had a battery powered clock/watch with a low battery??? The hands sometimes stop clicking over and instead bounce in place. This is due to lack of power. Clock doesn't keep the time. You don't get the performance you wanted.
 

uberman

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Cheap components and/or poor design in a psu can cause poor performance and instability due to inadequate or fluctuating voltages and currents.Also life expectancy can be shorter especially in your new rig with power hungry video cards etc.I'm not saying that the more expensive brand names don't have duds once in awhile but it's a crapshoot whether a cheap PSU will cause your system not to boot,crash,or burn up taking other valuable components with it on any given day.A good system just needs clean ,stable,reliable power and it just isn,t worth the risk cheaping out on it.
 

sgtbaker420

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Absolutely, I recently upgraded my rig, and saw this first-hand. I had:
AMD 3500+, sli-6600GT's, Xion 450w psu. When it came time to upgrade, my wife reminded me of the promised "budget" that I said that I would upgrade with. $500. I purchased an 8800GTS so there went most of my budget. After finding a sweet deal on the Athlon (socket 939) X2 4400 for $120 that left little room for my new PSU. I purchased an awesome deal on an Eagletech 750w PSU for $1 after rebate. I knew better but I wanted room left in my budget for some extra cooling, sounds like a deal.
1 month later I've had to purchase a new motherboard, RAM, and a new PSU (CORSAIR 620HX). That's why you don't Skip on the PSU.
 

runswindows95

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The PSU is the device that handles ALL the power for your machine. The PSU is the first thing I spend the most money on. If it goes, I can lose everything so I rather have a PSU I can trust instead of one made by who knows what and can blow out at any time.
 

predaking

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(all from memory so probably not exactly true)

when i put together a blazing fast 9700 pro system together =) and started to play this awesome new game jedi knight 2, it would crash when i got into an intensive graphical firefight.

curious i opened up my asus probe program and looked at the record of my voltages. right before i crashed my voltages were all screwy. my 12v line was around 10 or 14, i think my 5v was around 6 and was not steady at all.

i did some research and basically if those voltages are too far off, it can burn your hdd up and fry other components.

if something is expexcting 12V and you are greater than the 10% tolerance(depending on component) that it is supposed to have, there is a good chance that circuit won't work ever again.
 

merc14

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PSU failures can range from bizarre and seemingly unrelated system instabilities, to crashes and system shutdowns for no discernible reason to the worst case where a PSU fails catastrophically taking several expensive components with it.

Solid, steady, low ripple power is the lifeblood of an expensive system. Google jonnyguru and read about some of his experiences with cheap PSUs. scary stuff.
 

lakedude

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I bought a really cheap barebones from Tiger Direct one time. That thing would not run stable to save your life. After some checking around I upgraded to an Antec case with a better PS and now the system is as stable as any.

OTOH some people go overboard and spend way more than they need to. Quality is one thing but not everybody needs a $100+ power supply.

BTW I found a fantastic deal on a 650 watt CoolerMaser! $39.99 after rebate/free shipping!!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171014
 
Yep, yep, yep.

Lot's of people pay little concern to the PSU. It's usually the last component people think about when putting together a system. In the end choosing to go cheap on the PSU can comeback and bite you in the... well, you know what.

When I purchased my last PSU, Seasonic S12 500, I probably spent 3 month just doing research.

 

cyberjock

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Your PSU takes 120V at 60Hz(at least here in the USA it does) and converts it to DC, then steps the voltage to whatever voltage you need. Most everyone here knows computers use voltages of 12v or less. Imagine putting 120V, 60Hz into your components. Do you think it would last long?
 

cyberjock

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Ok, here's alot of information about PSU's. If you don't care to know alot of internal information then you should skip the rest of this post :p.

We're gonna assume wall voltage is 60Hz and 120V. Other countries do 240v and 50Hz, but the actual voltage and frequency are irrelevant for this post.

Here's some basic information:

Voltage - Quantity of potential between 2 points. Think of this as how high a cliff is you are standing on if you are gonna drop a basketball below. The higher the voltage, the higher the cliff.

Hz - # of full sine waves past a point per second.

Current - Quantity of electrons past the same point per unit of time.(usually seconds).



Ok, so now that we're all educated on some basic electrical theory let's go in depth.

120V 60Hz goes into your plug, and you need 12V DC for your computer.

First, your PSU has to take AC(Alternating Current) and rectify it. That uses a FWBR(full wave bridge rectifier). This creates a 60 hz ripple that's always the same polarity. Basically now instead of a wave that goes to a + voltage, then to 0, then to a - voltage you are always on the same side. In our case I'll say +. Now you have a rippled DC signal. The quantity of current you can rectify is based on how 'sturdy' your diodes are. Better diodes cost more, but can handle more current.

Next, you have to remove that ripple. Inductors and Capacitors are used to store a charge and then release the charge when the AC voltage is dropping to try to level out the voltage. Bigger beefier inductors and capacitors give you a more smooth voltage and less rippled voltage, but cost is a factor here. Hopefully you will have a smooth DC voltage here.

Now you have to convert that voltage to a voltage you can use. So you have to step down the voltage using a voltage regulator to control the voltage in the band you need. Again, the better the quality the components the better the chance it will operate at designed specs for the designed life of the computer, but the more expensive the PSU will cost to manufacture.
And hopefully now you have 12V of CLEAN DC power. Clean is the important part because that DC ripple can really ruin your computer. AC isn't good for DC components.

Now, there's more to this story still. Ever had feedback on your TV when you turn on your vacuum cleaner or microwave? Your PSU has to deal with that crap. Your PSU has to deal with serious peaks and valleys in voltage and current(think of your lights randomly dimming for a second or two). Basically it's like throwing rocks at a window and hoping it wont break. What is the solution? Make a window with thicker glass hoping they won't throw a rock hard enough to break it. Same scenario with your PSU. Also, your computer's loading is constantly changing. From millisecond to millisecond it's changing and your PSU has to react to the change in load fast enough to keep your voltage in specification. We might be talking nanoseconds to react, but when that's several clock cycles to computer running in the Ghz range, that makes a big difference. If your voltage regulator doesn't react fast enough then the computer operates for many clock cycles at a voltage that might be too low to accurately keep data in RAM. End result? Unstable computer. On the flip side it could operate with too high of a voltage. End result? Burn up your computer components.

Your PSU needs to be made well enough to rectify and regulate the voltage needed to maintain your computer. So as you can see, there is alot of work for a PSU to do, and there's not alot of room for error. If any part of the chain fails, it potentially destroys all the components going down the rest of the PSU, including potentially all of the components in your computer.

It's a gamble when you use a $5 power supply. Do you gamble alot? If you do, do you win regularly?

 

turboflame

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underpowered components overheating / not working

higher chance of it dying / taking the whole system with it

blue smoke

in short:

S*** blows up
 
Find a place that is selling a wide range of PSU's. Pick up a cheapie and what we would call a "good" one of similar power rating - say around 500 watts. The good one will be substantially heavier. It will have larger and heavier heat sinks to help get rid of heat, larger capacitors to improve filtering, larger coils made with heavier wire to increase current capacity, and better semiconductors - diodes, transistors and IC's - that improve voltage regulation, reliability, and safety. All of this is more expensive to manufacture.

Safety is particularly important. You want the PSU to electronically shut itself down if it detects a fault within itself or some kind of overload condition caused by the rest of the computer. PSU input circuits have fuses, but fuses are slow. They work in milliseconds. Solid state electronics can fry in microseconds.

The cheap power supplies are generally rated for full output at 25° C., the better ones at 50° C. These are internal PSU temperatures. I estimate - because manufacturers of cheap PSU's generally do not provide this kind of data - that you need to derate the output about 1% for each degree Centigrade over the temperature rating. This means that as the cheapie 500 watt PSU heats up under load and reaches 50° C. (a not unreasonable temperature), your 500 watt PSU becomes a 400 watt PSU.

All PC PSU's contain a circuit that monitors all the DC outputs. If all the outputs are good, it generates a signal called "PSGood". You need this signal to boot. So if one of the PSU outputs (usually the 12 volts) drops below a certain level, you lose PSGood. This forces an automatic CPU reset. PSU load drops because the computer isn't doing anything. PSGood comes back up, the PC reboots. This will look like a random reset/reboot.

If you lurk here long enough, you will see a thread similar to "I built my new computer and it randomly resets after 30 minutes to 2 hours of operation." And the replies in some form will be "What kind of PSU."

One of the forums here has an excellent article ranking different brands of PSU's. You can also find PSU "calculators" that will help you estimate what PSU capacity you will need to power your system.
 

4745454b

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Whats wrong with a cheap PSU??? Do some reading.

http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTM5NywxMiwsaGVudGh1c2lhc3Q=

Hardocp finally got around to testing some cheaper PSUs again. When they tested this MSI model, two capacitors literally exploded off of the secondary side. While in all five of these examples none of the PSUs took any other PC components, it is theoretically possible for it to happen. At the best, using a substandard PSU will cause the PSU to fail. At worst, it can take other parts of the PC with it.
 

lakedude

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cyberjock

I learned electronics long enough ago that I remember when power supplies worked as you describe, even built one in high schoool electronics class. I'm pretty sure that isn't how they work anymore.

Read all about it here:

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/power-supply.htm

Switcher Technology

Prior to 1980 or so, power supplies tended to be heavy and bulky. They used large, heavy transformers and huge capacitors (some as large as soda cans) to convert line voltage at 120 volts and 60 hertz into 5 volts and 12 volts DC.

The switching power supplies used today are much smaller and lighter. They convert the 60-Hertz (Hz, or cycles per second) current to a much higher frequency, meaning more cycles per second. This conversion enables a small, lightweight transformer in the power supply to do the actual voltage step-down from 110 volts (or 220 in certain countries) to the voltage needed by the particular computer component. The higher-frequency AC current provided by a switcher supply is also easier to rectify and filter compared to the original 60-Hz AC line voltage, reducing the variances in voltage for the sensitive electronic components in the computer.
 

cyberjock

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You are correct. However I was not going to explain switching power supplies because they are MUCH more complex, and I'm not sure I'd be very good at explaining it. Besides that if you buy the $10 power supply, I can guarantee they won't be switching power supplies.
 

Zorg

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All good posts about the dangers here, but yours really hits home. :cry:
 

soloman02

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I bought an Allied PSU for my Bro's comp when it was built, cause I was on a budget (parents said no more than $450). To stay in the budget, I had to have the PSU come with the case(bad) the case made by Allied is good (it it kind of hard to screw up a case), but the PSU is dead. I opened it up and lo and behold, several Capacitors had burst. The gunk was hardened outside the canisters. Unfortunately, I do Not have the proper adapter to test his motherboard and cpu.(I don't have a 20pin to 24pin ATX converter). So for all I know, many other system components could be fried right now, aside from the cheap PSU.

We are buying a new PSU, and it will probably be a TT since I have been running a TT purepower 420Watt for the last 3 years with no problems. Also, the TT is heavy :)
 

pidesd

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if you want a silent psu you ll often have too reach for the high end.

also an good efficient psu will save you heat and money.

i calculated once the money you d save from a 85% (high end) efficient 500 watts psu versus a 70%(low-end)
and at a rate of 6 canadian dollars per kilowatts*hour( which is cheap). i found myself saving around the price of my psu in 5 years at moderate use in terms of electricity bill. so unless you do not have the money right now i see ABSOLUTELY no reason not to spend on a good efficient psu

one more reason: psu s dont evolve as fast as the rest of your system except maybe the case so if you wanna shell out well...

and that is pretty much it.