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Quik speedfan and temp question......or two.....err four.

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  • CPUs
  • Speedfan
  • Overclocking
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February 3, 2008 6:37:23 PM

New build
GA-P35-DS3L
E2160
EVGA 8800GT
etc.

I ran Prime95, pre-calibration, to determine which temp is Tcase.

Temp1: 40C
Temp2: 45C
Core0: 44C
Core1: 43C

1. If Tjunction is always higher then Tcase then, according to my numbers, Tcase is = Temp1?
2. Where is the temp two reading coming from?
3. Is my ambient temp from the GPU the temp of the air inside the case?
4. I had a Temp3 reading of -2C, is it ok to delete that Temp3 from speed fan?

Yes I read the Temp guide and I'm just trying to work through Section 8 notes. BTW that's a great guide, even if your a noob like me you can put some effort into it and learn a lot.

More about : quik speedfan temp question err

February 3, 2008 6:49:53 PM

ugh, this isn't a place to post every question you have.

1) If those are idle temps....what the hell is your ambient
2) Comp says in the guide that Tcase will be the one that increases in relation to the cores
3) GPU temps are not ambient
4) Temp 3 is nothing
February 3, 2008 7:05:19 PM

1. Those are 100% load temps while running Prime95.

3. SpeedFan is giving me a temp labeled GPUambient Temp. SpeedFan does not give me an ambient only temp.

The temp guide says to post guide questions here, so I did.

Thanks
February 3, 2008 7:16:26 PM

I hope that is at stock because thats pretty low if overclocked

Don't use speedfan to monitor ambient...measure it yourself like the guide says thats why your calibrating, to make ambient right
February 3, 2008 7:37:54 PM

Ok. I haven't gotten that far yet. I'm just trying to figure out what Tj is and what Tcase is.

Idle

Temp1: 35C
Temp2: 25C
Core0: 20C
Core1: 20C
GPUambient: 38C
GPUCore: 52C

Load (not OC'd) Prime95 Blend test. Small FFTs

Temp1: 37C
Temp2: 42C
Core0: 40C
Core1: 40C
GPUambient: 38C
GPUCore: 52C
February 3, 2008 7:40:39 PM

Nothing there is right...

Cores are cooler than Tcase = impossible
both are lower than suspected ambient = impossible

First get a real ambient reading then try again
February 3, 2008 7:53:24 PM

Ok. I just thought I would move through the guide according to section#. I am only trying to confirm which temp is Tcase before I move to Section9: Calibration.

1. So now, if I'm only looking for a Temp with a similar Idle to Load Delta, Tcase = Temp2. Right?
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 3, 2008 7:58:34 PM

Correct.
February 3, 2008 8:13:21 PM

Thank you Sir and thanks for the guide.
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 3, 2008 10:00:40 PM

You're very welcome.
February 4, 2008 12:26:27 PM

In my case, is Temp1 one a north or south bridge temp? It never seems to change much.

Or will that be my ambient temp after calibration?
February 4, 2008 3:37:24 PM

I can't figure out how to set my CPU fan to 100%.
February 4, 2008 5:47:57 PM

No, It will not be ambient....DO NOT USE SPEEDFANS AMBIENT. Measure it yourself!!!

Temp 1 for the DS3L does not record anything. At least from what I've seen with my overclocks. The NB Temp would go up during overclocking but it didnt.

PC Health at the bottom says auto fan control and disable it
February 4, 2008 7:49:08 PM

@Silverion77, thanks.

I finally made it though Section9: Calibration Part 2: Tcase Offset Correction.

I didn't expect speedfan to be off so much.

Current Idle temps while browsing.

Temp1: 36
Tcase: 24
TjCore1:34
TjCore0:34

I measured ambient temp with the side off and all fans at 100%, with a fish tank thermometer. @ 72F or ~22C

Tcase temp. (originally Temp2 in Speedfan) = Ambient Temp + 1C = 23C

Speedfan was not reading Tcase temp @ 24C, I had to offset speedfans number by adding 2 in the advanced settings.

Tjunction Temps = Tcase Temp + 10C = 34C

Speedfan was not reading Tjunction temps @ 34C, I had to offset speefans numbers by adding 17 to both cores in the advanced settings.

Let me know if anybody sees a problem with these numbers.
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 5, 2008 11:42:36 PM

Dunkel, in reviewing your posts, you have not mentioned whether your E2160 is L2 or M0 Stepping.
February 6, 2008 4:24:19 PM

CPU-Z has me at M0 Stepping

As far as I can tell, I made it through the Temp guide and SpeedFan is correctly calibrated.

February 6, 2008 8:50:11 PM

errr...maybe not.

I will probably recalibrate from the beginning.

The first time I ran Crystal CPUID I selected the wrong core in Section 9:, Part 3: (A). I ended up with 44 as my two characters for Section 9:, Part 3: (D). M0 Stepping 100C - 68 (from the 44) = Tjunction 32C. This ultimately gave me a 17C offset for the Cores (Tjunction) in SpeedFan.

I then went back into Crystal CPUID today (a few days later, and a newer version), I changed the selected core because now I know that SpeedFans Core0 (my hottest core) is = Core 1/2 in Crystal CPUID. Back to Part 3: (D) and this time I got 3C as my characters which converted to 60. 100-60= Tjunction 40C. At this point I would need to go back into SpeedFan and change the Core offset to 25C.

But I'm going to start at the begging because under Section 9:, Part 4: Note: "CPU's with Steppings which are Tjunction Max 100C typically require +15C Core Offsets."

I have not started the Temp guide over yet but I did go back into CrystalCPUID to recheck my characters and this time I got 3D which converted to 61. I entered 0x19c in the MSR Number field over and over again, some times I would get 3C and sometimes I get 3D.

So that's where I'm at.

Why did I do all that when I could just take the Core temps from the CoreTemp program and use those to calibrate SpeedFan?
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 7, 2008 5:08:26 AM

Because Core Temp can also be incorrect, and because Core Temp can not be configured with Offset corrections.
February 7, 2008 11:16:05 AM

:heink:  Have you ever heard of the Core offsets for speedfan being +25C? That seems a little extreme to me considering the usually 15 statement.

I'm not going to recalibrate until I buy some better fans and a better way to measure ambient. Do you guys use digital thermometers or something?

Thanks a lot.
February 7, 2008 11:18:18 AM

What is your ambient and what is your Tjunction (once calibrated)?

sorry just forgot
February 7, 2008 11:39:29 AM

ambient was ~22C

Tj was 34C with the side off.

But if you remember, I used the wrong hot core in CrystalCPUID. My Tj offsets are 25C! :fou: 

February 7, 2008 11:43:01 AM

If ambient is 22 and Tj atm is 34 calibrated (stock speeds??) then that is right. If you recall, ambient + 10+-5 = Tj

Under any conditions....before calibration Tj was 9C (impossible without chilled water/phase change) and adding 10 would give 19 (still sub-ambient) so 25 is right in the ball park
February 7, 2008 11:54:09 AM

I know I did most of it right. I just need to re-do it based on the CrystalCPUID issue.

1. What do you use to check ambient temp?
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 7, 2008 4:39:49 PM

For accuracy, I use two devices; one analog and one digital, positioned as described in Part 2 (A), "preferably near computer case air intake, clear of warm exhaust".

If you don't have an analog or digital IR thermometer, then use the thermometer on the wall thermostat control. Just remember to take into consideration that computers which are in a different room than a wall thermostat, and are at floor level, may have somewhat cooler intake air than those which are a few feet higher at desk level.

It is not my intention in the Guide to make this Ambient measurement difficult, nor is it necessary for anyone to purchase scientific grade thermal measuring devices; just use whatever means available to read, or simply "guesstimate" room temperature near your computer air intake.

Comp :sol: 
February 7, 2008 5:38:45 PM

My extreme attention to detail will bring me down some day.
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 7, 2008 6:05:43 PM

On the contrary, attention to detail is a required discipline in career fields such as aviation. :heink:  As an engineer, it helps to stimulate my Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, :pt1cable:  and perhaps "anal retentive perfectionist" :kaola:  may best describe the desired mindset. :wahoo:  I would hope that the flight crew, as well as the ground crew, are all OCD whacko's. :lol: 
February 7, 2008 6:08:05 PM

wait comp...what do you do.

I figured you were in engineering, but aviation also.

Just wondering because it must be cool **thinks of future job**
February 7, 2008 6:25:17 PM

@Silverion77

Just remember, when your flying, don't flip anybody the bird unless your inverted. :non: 
February 7, 2008 6:33:20 PM

like in Top Gun (I think that was it) :D 
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 7, 2008 8:16:13 PM

Silverion77, you seem to be a sharp young man, so since you asked, here's the abridged version:

My background is in electronics engineering technologies. I formally began my career in the US Navy in aviation, which gave me the education, training and experience to work for top companies like General Electric and Philips. My resume includes Avionics, marine electrical power distribution systems, and I'm currently a medical imaging engineer specializing in MRI & CT systems, which are driven by high-end SCSI/Unix computer systems such as Silicon Graphics and Sun Microsystems.

My first and best talent has always been troubleshooting, so I became a field engineer, since I had no desire to work as a research and developement (R&D) engineer. I hold a pilot's license as well as a captain's license, and my computer and I live aboard my sailboat in Fort Lauderdale. As a hobby, I also work with a local build-to-order PC shop to acquire data for my Temperature Guide.

Comp :sol: 
February 7, 2008 8:19:00 PM

Thats awesome...atm I'm in envy and jealous
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 7, 2008 8:39:16 PM

Please... it's never been anything as glamorous as you might think... I can tell you with absolute certainty that as a young man, my decision to get into electronics and Naval aviation was the single best choice I've ever made in my life. Launching from an Aircraft Carrier is absolutely awsome, so if you're interested in launching a technical career, then the military is an excellent place to start. I'm no recruiting poster boy, but it worked out extremely well for me.
February 7, 2008 8:42:17 PM

Well luckily there is a Independent Science Research at my school where you choose a field and get a mentor to learn about it and do projects and such.

A friend of my parents is a electrical engineer in NY. He makes power grids and does regulation across the state. It will be fun doing work with him
February 7, 2008 9:43:45 PM

BTW, what version of CoreTemp gives my correct Tj. Max. of 100C?

I'm running 0.96.1 and it's giving me 85C.
February 7, 2008 9:52:09 PM

Dunkel said:
BTW, what version of CoreTemp gives my correct Tj. Max. of 100C?

I'm running 0.96.1 and it's giving me 85C.

That's the correct TJ, I'm pretty sure.
February 7, 2008 10:05:01 PM

Scale 1: Duo
E4x00: Tcase Max 73c, M0 Stepping, Tjunction Max 100c, Vcore Default 1.325, TDP 65w, Delta 10c
E2xx0: Tcase Max 73c, M0 Stepping, Tjunction Max 100c, Vcore Default 1.312, TDP 65w, Delta 10c
E6x50: Tcase Max 72c, G0 Stepping, Tjunction Max 100c, Vcore Default 1.350, TDP 65w, Delta 10c
E6540: Tcase Max 72c, G0 Stepping, Tjunction Max 100c, Vcore Default 1.350, TDP 65w, Delta 10c

This is from the temp guide.

I have the E2160. My CoreTemp reads Revision: M0 but the Tjunction Max is set to 85C.
February 7, 2008 10:05:35 PM

O Comp. has a solutions for that.

It is 100 but some are coming up as 85.
I had the same problem....sort of. I was on as 100 but CPUID thought it was 85 so it gave me a low temp. Came up as 40C idle...but once fixed it was 30ish
February 7, 2008 10:10:46 PM

Some how I was thinking of the E6600. Meh.
February 7, 2008 10:27:34 PM

Where does CrystalCPUID show Tj.Max?
a b à CPUs
a b K Overclocking
February 8, 2008 6:45:14 AM

Crystal CPUID does not show Tjunction Max. Only Core Temp shows Tj Max. Also, in conjunction with the release of Core Temp 0.96.1, Scale 1 has been updated especially for M0 Stepping processors. Sorry this particular update to the Guide has been delayed, but a great deal time was required to verify and document DTS calibration exceptions found with "some" M0 processors.

Getting clear and specific information from Intel is usually like trying to get the Secret Service, the CIA and the FBI to agree to release the first Lady's recipe for chocolate chip cookies. A certain amount of research and resourceful evaluation was be required to sort out these M0 thermal inconsistencies.

The most notable characteristic of the M0 is a relatively small Tcase to Tjunction Delta of ~5c as well as low Tjunction Idle temperatures compared to other Core 2 variants. Additionally, the M0 is typically somewhat less tolerant of high Vcore, which causes temperatures to scale higher than other variants at the same Vcore. Tj max 85c is correct for the majority of M0 processors, and will become less of an issue as shelf stock is replaced.

Comp :sol: 
February 8, 2008 11:14:31 AM

I just bought my E2160 with M0 stepping a wee ago.

1. Are you saying that CoreTemp is giving me the correct Tj.Max.?

2. If CoreTemp is giving me the wrong reading, and my chip is an older one with Tj.Max of 100, won't that throw CoreTemps reading of my core temps off by that Delta of ~15? 100-85=15

I'm not sure if there is a relationship there but I do remember reading something about it.

Thanks for the info.
!