AGP 2x/4x and 4x/8x designation. What is it?

[Morganza]

After searching this board, I still have two questions:

Question #1 - I have a Tyan Trinity S2266 MB with an AGP slot containing a NVIDEA GeForce2 MX 100/200 32 MB video card. Since I hooked this computer up to my HDTV, the video card seems to not be holding its own. I'd like to replace it. The MB manufacturer says the AGP slot "will support 2x and 4x graphics mode." Can I use a 4x/8x AGP video card on this MB? I don't really know what the "x" designation refers to. Newegg shows only one card under the 2x/4x heading and 97 cards under the 4x/8x heading.

Question #2 - Are there any other criteria that I need to consider other than the AGP 2x/4x or 4x/8x issue?

Thanks

 

[mactronix]

Your board says it can suport 2x and 4x so a card with 4x/8x meets the x4 criteria.
Here is a link to AGP bus descriptions.
http://www.interfacebus.com/Design_Connector_AGP.html
Its fairly easy to follow but if you find you have any questions just ask
Mactronix.

 

[KyleSTL]

AGP 2x, 4x, and 8x all refer to bandwidths at which devices run on an AGP interface (same physical connector). The original AGP interface had a certain bandwidth (266MB/s) and was updated to increase the throughput twice, four and eight times at much data in a given amount of time (i.e. 533MB/s -> 1066MB/s -> 2133MB/s) you can use either kind of card (2/4 or 4/8) but it will only run at AGP4x maximum.

Yes. Power supply. Please list the power supply brand, capacity and rail amperage ratings (usually found on a sticker on the side of the PSU). It would also be helpful for your whole system specs (CPU, memory, HDDs, optical drives, etc) to give you the best informed decision.

 

[razvanz]

It's a little more complicated than that, besides the difference in bandwidth there's also a difference in voltage agp 8x has 1,5V and agp 2x/4x has 3,3V, so be carefull not to burn ur video card o ur motherboard

 

[Morganza]

Yes. Power supply. Please list the power supply brand, capacity and rail amperage ratings (usually found on a sticker on the side of the PSU). It would also be helpful for your whole system specs (CPU, memory, HDDs, optical drives, etc) to give you the best informed decision.

Thanks to both for the comments. That'sexactly what I was looking for AND hoping to hear.

Here's what I have.

TurboLink 320W PS ! with
+3.3 - 20A
+5 - 30A
+12 - 10A
-12 - .5A
-5 - .5A
+5SB - 2.0A

Pentium 4 - 1.7 Ghz with 1Gb RAM; 1 WD 40GB HD; 1 cheap CD burner/player; 1 FDD; 1 Montego DDL PCI sound card; PCI network card: PCI dual 2.0 USB with 320GB WD HD and a USB remote keyboard attached. The TV that it is hooked to the computer seems to work best at 1280x720 resolution.

I think that's about it.

It appears that some cards require a certain size power supply, usually 350W or more, and some don't mention power supplies. I'm assuming that these do not require any certain amount of power and perhaps get there power from the AGP connection?

I was looking at a CHAINTECH SA5200-256 GeForce FX 5200 at
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814145083

They don't mention power supply requirements, but they do list on the manufacturers website the various resolutions. They range from 640x480 up to 1900x1440. The closest to my TV preferred resolution would be the 1280x1024. I don't really know how this works, though. Should I be looking for a card that supports the 1280x720 resolution?

Thanks again.

 

[skittle]

they all support that resolution, theyre just not listed.

 

[cleeve]

I've never heard of an AGP 8x card that couldn't work in a 4x slot. All 8x cards are 4x compatible.

Of course it'll be limited to 4x bandwidth, but that makes so little real-world difference it's not even worth mentioning.

 

[Morganza]

Thanks,

I've gotten nothing but good news from y'all so far. Thanks and keep it up !!!

 

[KyleSTL]

I would suggest a new build. That system is quite old. Unless you're sure the system is powerful enough to do everything you want to with it, I would start with a new MB/CPU/MEM/GPU/PSU and reuse some of your old equipment. If you're interested in persuing this, please let us know. Otherwise, that card should work just fine.

 

[Morganza]

I would suggest a new build. That system is quite old. Unless you're sure the system is powerful enough to do everything you want to with it, I would start with a new MB/CPU/MEM/GPU/PSU and reuse some of your old equipment. If you're interested in persuing this, please let us know. Otherwise, that card should work just fine.

Well, now you've done it. That's been in the back of my mind since the beginning. A few years ago I bought this machine for my wife at a local computer shop before I realized I could build my own and do a lot better for a lot less. Earlier this year I built two for me and one for her (with help from this forum of course) and ended up with this computer sitting idle, so I hooked it up to the TV. I thought I'd "try it" for awhile and see if it would work and if I really wanted a HTPC type setup. As it turns out, it does and I do. I wish I'd done it long ago. Since I've gone this far, I'd like to upgrade the video card just enought to get it working flawlessly, then I guess I'll start looking at starting from scratch. I'll certainly ask for comments when I do. I already have some questions and I'm sure there are others that haven't occurred to me yet.

Thanks once again -

 

[cleeve]

Well, the Radeon 2600 XT has excellent HD video acceleration and will take most of the load off of your CPU.

Not positive if those features work on the AGP version tho...

 

[KyleSTL]

@cleeve: It would also require a PSU upgrade (obvious to you, might not be to the OP)

 

[4745454b]

It's a little more complicated than that, besides the difference in bandwidth there's also a difference in voltage agp 8x has 1,5V and agp 2x/4x has 3,3V, so be carefull not to burn ur video card o ur motherboard

Its a little more complicated then what you wrote. (which was wrong btw...)

What you are talking about btw is called the signaling voltage. This is a voltage that is passed between the motherboard and the GPU so that they know they are compatible. Remember that we already determined that the AGP slot is the same, so each successive AGP "release" used a lower signaling voltage so that you didn't plug in the wrong card. (this is assuming you were able to use enough brute force to get it passed the difference in notches...) 2x used 3.3 volts, 4x used 1.5, and 8x used .08v. (notice that each new speed increase has the signaling voltage go down by .5.) The amount of power sent through the slot never changed that I'm aware of. What you are claiming is flat out wrong, can you imagine the amperage needed if the slot provided 50W at only 1.5V? (33.33A)

 

[cleeve]

@cleeve: It would also require a PSU upgrade (obvious to you, might not be to the OP)

Depends on his PSU I guess, Whatcha got, OP?

 

[KyleSTL]

TurboLink 320W PS ! with
+3.3 - 20A
+5 - 30A
+12 - 10A
-12 - .5A
-5 - .5A
+5SB - 2.0A

Pentium 4 - 1.7 Ghz with 1Gb RAM; 1 WD 40GB HD; 1 cheap CD burner/player; 1 FDD; 1 Montego DDL PCI sound card; PCI network card: PCI dual 2.0 USB with 320GB WD HD and a USB remote keyboard attached.

From earlier in the post.

 

[4745454b]

I suggest these for the upgrade.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161053 This is the cheapest non open box AGP x1k card newegg has. I'm also thinking that you should get a newer video card to help decode new video codecs. You might want to look at this card to.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102711

You don't need to go overboard on you PSU, but a 10 amp one isn't going to cut it. FSP is known for making solid 400W+ psu, though many people also like Thermaltake. (I personally don't.) Something like this should be fine.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104954

 

[cleeve]

10A on the 12v!

Ew.

 

[Morganza]

4745454b - Thanks, I like the Sapphire card especially.

If I ultimately decide to stick with this system for awhile, that may serve me well.

I noticed at the ATI Radeon site for this product it says," HDCP support for playback of protected content requires connection to a HDCP capable display " I wonder how I would know if my display is HDCP capable or not. The display is a Mitsubishi WD 62725 DLP set.

When all is said and done, I'm pretty sure I'll eventually ditch this system, start from scratch and do it right. If I had any sense, I'd just do it now and be done with it, saving some bucks in the long run.

 

[4745454b]

I didn't find much on my quick internet search. I did find this site, where the guys says his TV does support it.

http://hdtv.forsandiego.com/cgi-bin/show.cgi?tpc=460&post=18618

Assuming he is right, then you have an HDCP monitor. Remember however that it will only work with HDMI, no other connector. I believe your optical drive also needs to be HDCP compatible. All devices need to be HDCP compatible or it won't work.

 

[Morganza]

Wow, thanks 474..... , I guess I will check over at hometheaterspot.com and confirm this. They are very big on Mitz tvs there. If the optical drive is not HDCP, I can just get one that is, I guess. I think it is though.