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HD content goes off the screen

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Anonymous
May 19, 2005 7:10:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Hi:

I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box (made
by Magnavox).

When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
small part of the top of the "O".

I have hooked up the set-top box using both component and DVI cables
with the same results.

In addition to the picture problem, I never seem to hear 5.1 sound.
This is particularly telling during Fox's football season which brags
Dolby 5.1 sound. I have hooked up the cable box using both SPDIF and
optical cables, but I still don't get Dolby. I suspect this problem
is caused by the broadcast, but I'm not sure.

Does anyone have any ideas?

Wojo

More about : content screen

Anonymous
May 19, 2005 7:53:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Wojo wrote:
> Hi:
>
> I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box (made
> by Magnavox).
>
> When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
> in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
> content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
> logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
> HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
> small part of the top of the "O".
>
> I have hooked up the set-top box using both component and DVI cables
> with the same results.
>
> In addition to the picture problem, I never seem to hear 5.1 sound.
> This is particularly telling during Fox's football season which brags
> Dolby 5.1 sound. I have hooked up the cable box using both SPDIF and
> optical cables, but I still don't get Dolby. I suspect this problem
> is caused by the broadcast, but I'm not sure.
>
> Does anyone have any ideas?
>
> Wojo

Look for overscan settings in your picture control menus. Your
overscan percentage is likely way off.

5.1 sound broadcasting is still very much a hit and miss affair. Fox,
CBS, ABC all now broadcast 5.1 sound for many of the HD shows. However,
your local station has to be able to take the network 5.1 sound feed and
insert it into the local broadcast digital signal. Have you checked the
web page of your local stations to see if there are any statements about
5.1? If not, email the station to see if they provide 5.1 or not.

You should check to see if the cable box is set to output digital
sound. The default setting may be to not do so.

Alan F
May 20, 2005 12:30:28 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Wojo wrote:
> Hi:
>
> I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box (made
> by Magnavox).
>
> When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
> in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
> content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
> logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
> HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
> small part of the top of the "O".
>
> I have hooked up the set-top box using both component and DVI cables
> with the same results.
>
> In addition to the picture problem, I never seem to hear 5.1 sound.
> This is particularly telling during Fox's football season which brags
> Dolby 5.1 sound. I have hooked up the cable box using both SPDIF and
> optical cables, but I still don't get Dolby. I suspect this problem
> is caused by the broadcast, but I'm not sure.
>
> Does anyone have any ideas?
>
> Wojo
>
>
Have your set calibrated, including overscan.

Fox audio is xcellent...maybe the best on the air. Their 5.1, at least
locally, is great and the football games always had stadium/crowd sounds
in the rear channels. Either your cable company is stripping the 5.1
off, or their source is not sending it.
Related resources
Anonymous
May 20, 2005 6:13:40 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Alan Figgatt squeezed out a good one with:

>Wojo wrote:
>> Hi:
>>
>> I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box (made
>> by Magnavox).
>>
>> When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
>> in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
>> content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
>> logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
>> HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
>> small part of the top of the "O".
>>
>> I have hooked up the set-top box using both component and DVI cables
>> with the same results.
>>
>> In addition to the picture problem, I never seem to hear 5.1 sound.
>> This is particularly telling during Fox's football season which brags
>> Dolby 5.1 sound. I have hooked up the cable box using both SPDIF and
>> optical cables, but I still don't get Dolby. I suspect this problem
>> is caused by the broadcast, but I'm not sure.
>>
>> Does anyone have any ideas?
>>
>> Wojo
>
> Look for overscan settings in your picture control menus. Your
>overscan percentage is likely way off.

The only option I can find is "Autoscan" on or off. I haven't found a
setting that would allow me to adjust the percentages. Something else
occurred to me, however. I have a DVD recorded from an HD signal that
I have played and, again, the picture goes off the screen. This does
not occur when I play the same DVD on my computer which leads me to
believe the setting needing adjustment is somewhere within my TV as I
can see the entire picture from my PC.
>
> 5.1 sound broadcasting is still very much a hit and miss affair. Fox,
>CBS, ABC all now broadcast 5.1 sound for many of the HD shows. However,
>your local station has to be able to take the network 5.1 sound feed and
>insert it into the local broadcast digital signal. Have you checked the
>web page of your local stations to see if there are any statements about
>5.1? If not, email the station to see if they provide 5.1 or not.

I'll do that, because there is one thing that is confounding: At the
beginning ol the program "24", I actually get sound from my surround
speakers, during the opening orchestration...this tells me that the
audio channels exist and are being broadcast and that it's not a
connection issue on my end.
>
> You should check to see if the cable box is set to output digital
>sound. The default setting may be to not do so.

I have and it is. I get sound whether I use an SPDIF connection or an
optical one. It's just rarely surround sound.

Wojo
Anonymous
May 20, 2005 9:12:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Wojo wrote:
> Hi:
>
> I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box
(made
> by Magnavox).
>
> When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
> in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
> content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
> logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
> HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
> small part of the top of the "O".

I *think* proper overscan should be 5%. You probably have to go into a
service menu to have it adjusted.

Mine seems to be adjusted properly, and I don't get all the "Fox" logo
either.
Anonymous
May 20, 2005 3:01:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Norm wrote:
> I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!


I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
May 20, 2005 8:29:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
Norm
"Larry Bud" <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1116591162.375339.170830@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>
> Wojo wrote:
>> Hi:
>>
>> I have a Hitachi 65" HD-Ready monitor and Insight HD set top box
> (made
>> by Magnavox).
>>
>> When I watch HD programming the picture actually goes off the screen
>> in all four corners. I'm guessing I'm not seeing 10 - 15% of the
>> content being sent. For example, when watching 24 in HD the "Fox"
>> logo in the lower right of the screen is normal when not watching in
>> HD, but when tuning in to HD I can only seen the top of the "F" and a
>> small part of the top of the "O".
>
> I *think* proper overscan should be 5%. You probably have to go into a
> service menu to have it adjusted.
>
> Mine seems to be adjusted properly, and I don't get all the "Fox" logo
> either.
>
Anonymous
May 20, 2005 9:35:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Larry Bud (larrybud2002@yahoo.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!

With 2% overscan, the full logo is visible on my F38310.

Except for a few channels that are horribly misconfigured at the source
which allows me to see the closed caption data and other vertical blanking
codes, I don't have any problems with that little overscan.

--
Jeff Rife | "Tragedy struck today in Sector Nine as rebel
| terrorists blew up the Death Star, killing
| thousands. The Rebel Alliance, a fringe group
| of anti-Empire fanatics, has claimed
| responsibility for the terrorist act.
| Fortunately, Lord Vader escaped without harm.
| Our hearts go out to the families of the
| victims."
| -- "NewsRadio"
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 12:44:20 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Larry Bud wrote:
> Norm wrote:
>
>>I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>
>
>
> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!

If you can not see the full logo, your set needs adjustment for
overscan. The networks are not going to put up a logo that people don't
see!

There should be an adjustment buried in your settings menu somewhere,
although it might be in a hidden service menu. You can also get a
calibration DVD such as Digital Video Essentials which displays a series
of test patterns as well as test sounds to balance the speakers for a
5.1 sound system. Very handy DVD to get your contrast, color balance,
screen brightness set right short of a professional calibration.

Alan F
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 4:45:20 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Larry Bud squeezed out a good one with:

>> I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>
>
>I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
>proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!

But it's not exactly hugging the edge of the screen, is it? That's a
good 5 inches I'm losing on either side, and I'm not even sure about
the top. However I'd be thrilled to learn it was just "Fox" and
therefore not something I've screwed up. :) 

Wojo
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 4:48:43 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Alan Figgatt squeezed out a good one with:

>>>I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>>
>>
>>
>> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
>> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
>
> If you can not see the full logo, your set needs adjustment for
>overscan. The networks are not going to put up a logo that people don't
>see!
>
> There should be an adjustment buried in your settings menu somewhere,
>although it might be in a hidden service menu. You can also get a
>calibration DVD such as Digital Video Essentials which displays a series
>of test patterns as well as test sounds to balance the speakers for a
>5.1 sound system. Very handy DVD to get your contrast, color balance,

But is there a way to access these super-secret-spy settings? I've
looked at every output/video display setting I could find and have yet
to find a setting that would allow me to adjust the "overscan
percentage" or even anything that sounded remotely like it. Do I need
Network Administrator access to my own TV?

Wondered,
Wojo
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 2:43:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Wojo wrote:
> Alan Figgatt squeezed out a good one with:
>
>
>>>>I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
>>>proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
>>
>> If you can not see the full logo, your set needs adjustment for
>>overscan. The networks are not going to put up a logo that people don't
>>see!
>>
>> There should be an adjustment buried in your settings menu somewhere,
>>although it might be in a hidden service menu. You can also get a
>>calibration DVD such as Digital Video Essentials which displays a series
>>of test patterns as well as test sounds to balance the speakers for a
>>5.1 sound system. Very handy DVD to get your contrast, color balance,
>
>
> But is there a way to access these super-secret-spy settings? I've
> looked at every output/video display setting I could find and have yet
> to find a setting that would allow me to adjust the "overscan
> percentage" or even anything that sounded remotely like it. Do I need
> Network Administrator access to my own TV?
>
> Wondered,
> Wojo

Have you tried vertical and horizontal image sizing? The overscan is
likely buried in a service access menu as someone can really mess up
their TV if they don't know what they are doing. Option 1: do a google
search for service manual access for your model TV. Option 2: if the set
is still under warranty, request a warranty repair service call.

Alan F
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 3:21:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Larry Bud" <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1116609289.098528.19750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> Norm wrote:
> > I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>
>
> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!

I get the full logo on every network, even on an old 27" Zenith which has
lots of overscan. The Hitachi CRT RPTVs often come with excessive overscan,
but as others have noted, reducing it involves geometry and convergence
alignment and can be a tricky matter for someone who is not experienced with
the sets. Reducing overscan too much can cause the auto-convergence system
to malfunction because the sensors are outside of the screen area.

One should not attempt to adjust the size, convergence, nor geometry on a
Hitachi without reading the training and service manuals carefully and
understanding all of the steps. Frankly, one would likely not get very far
without that documentation anyway. All of the Hitachi literature is
available free to any shop that signs up on their web site.

Leonard
May 21, 2005 3:59:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Sat, 21 May 2005 11:21:26 -0400, "Leonard Caillouet" <no@no.com>
wrote:

>
>"Larry Bud" <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:1116609289.098528.19750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Norm wrote:
>> > I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>>
>>
>> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
>> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
>
>I get the full logo on every network, even on an old 27" Zenith which has
>lots of overscan. The Hitachi CRT RPTVs often come with excessive overscan,
>but as others have noted, reducing it involves geometry and convergence
>alignment and can be a tricky matter for someone who is not experienced with
>the sets. Reducing overscan too much can cause the auto-convergence system
>to malfunction because the sensors are outside of the screen area.
>
>One should not attempt to adjust the size, convergence, nor geometry on a
>Hitachi without reading the training and service manuals carefully and
>understanding all of the steps. Frankly, one would likely not get very far
>without that documentation anyway. All of the Hitachi literature is
>available free to any shop that signs up on their web site.
>
>Leonard
>
Leonard, Don't you think he should eliminate all other possibilities
before messing with the overscan? Does he get any othe HDTV content?
The trouble he describes seems like he is really looking at 16:9 Zoom
or some other aspect setting is wrong.
Thumper
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 4:06:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Thumper" <jaylsmith@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:2imu819aqbdm6gjevifen304dlv89pm96e@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 21 May 2005 11:21:26 -0400, "Leonard Caillouet" <no@no.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Larry Bud" <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:1116609289.098528.19750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> >>
> >> Norm wrote:
> >> > I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
> >>
> >>
> >> I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
> >> proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
> >
> >I get the full logo on every network, even on an old 27" Zenith which has
> >lots of overscan. The Hitachi CRT RPTVs often come with excessive
overscan,
> >but as others have noted, reducing it involves geometry and convergence
> >alignment and can be a tricky matter for someone who is not experienced
with
> >the sets. Reducing overscan too much can cause the auto-convergence
system
> >to malfunction because the sensors are outside of the screen area.
> >
> >One should not attempt to adjust the size, convergence, nor geometry on a
> >Hitachi without reading the training and service manuals carefully and
> >understanding all of the steps. Frankly, one would likely not get very
far
> >without that documentation anyway. All of the Hitachi literature is
> >available free to any shop that signs up on their web site.
> >
> >Leonard
> >
> Leonard, Don't you think he should eliminate all other possibilities
> before messing with the overscan? Does he get any othe HDTV content?
> The trouble he describes seems like he is really looking at 16:9 Zoom
> or some other aspect setting is wrong.
> Thumper

Of course. If he can't figure out if that is the case he certainly has
little chance of adjusting overscan without botching it. I have seen recent
Hitachis, as well as other brands, that have really excessive overscan,
however.

Leonard
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 7:06:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Wojo" <kenw@isoc.net> wrote in message
news:05ft81lk5s8ee5k9q2g7hmg9rv527kljev@4ax.com...
> Larry Bud squeezed out a good one with:
>
>>> I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
>>
>>
>>I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and since
>>proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
>
> But it's not exactly hugging the edge of the screen, is it? That's a
> good 5 inches I'm losing on either side, and I'm not even sure about
> the top. However I'd be thrilled to learn it was just "Fox" and
> therefore not something I've screwed up. :) 
>
> Wojo

Get a test DVD (as has been suggested) so you can see what the overscan of
the set really is. It is possible that your cable box is actually cutting
off part of the image.
Overscan for a CRT projection set like yours, is not a single adjustment,
but will totally involve the picture geometry and convergence settings.
Read about ISF calibration.
Anonymous
May 21, 2005 11:48:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Thumper wrote:

> Leonard, Don't you think he should eliminate all other possibilities
> before messing with the overscan? Does he get any othe HDTV content?
> The trouble he describes seems like he is really looking at 16:9 Zoom
> or some other aspect setting is wrong.
> Thumper

True, the OP should double check the zoom settings on both his TV and
the set top box. Too easy for someone to zoom in while watching a 16:9
SD show and then forget that it is zoomed in after they change back to
and HD channel.

Alan F
Anonymous
May 23, 2005 2:40:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Alan Figgatt squeezed out a good one with:

>> Leonard, Don't you think he should eliminate all other possibilities
>> before messing with the overscan? Does he get any othe HDTV content?
>> The trouble he describes seems like he is really looking at 16:9 Zoom
>> or some other aspect setting is wrong.
>> Thumper
>
> True, the OP should double check the zoom settings on both his TV and
>the set top box. Too easy for someone to zoom in while watching a 16:9
>SD show and then forget that it is zoomed in after they change back to
>and HD channel.

Let me clarify.

Although I am most certainly not as knowledgeable as the average
poster here regarding adjusting such things as overscan settings, I am
NOT making the mistake of leaving my TV in a Zoom mode. And as far as
I know my cable box doesn't even have one, so that's not the issue
(unless there's a hidden "zoom mode" on my cable/HDTV box which
changes the setting automatically for HD content). My TV is always in
standard 16:9 format, even when I'm watching something broadcast in
4:3 (which is rare, I hardly watch standard TV, and when I do it's
very rarely in my theater).

I'm thinking my problem HAS to either be with my cable box/cable
provider or with my TV.

Here is something to ponder: I have a DVD that was recorded from an
HD broadcast. On my computer it displays perfectly...the entire
screen is visable. On my TV it is cut off as previously described.
This is not HD content, this is a standard DVD recorded FROM HD
content...meaning that it must be the TV causing the problem...right?
I don't have a futuristic DVD recorder to record content in actual HD,
and I watch DVD's on an X-Box. Therefore there has to be something
wrong with my TV, doesn't there?

It seems I may have made a mistake purchasing a Hitachi unless I want
to pay somebody to come and set it up in a way no other TV requires.
I work for a company that sells both HD TV's and home theater
equipment and I've yet to come across this.

Wojo
Anonymous
May 23, 2005 10:47:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Alan Figgatt wrote:
> Larry Bud wrote:
> > Norm wrote:
> >
> >>I get the F and just part of the O in the FOX logo. Maybe it's FOX!
> >
> >
> >
> > I think they put the logo as far in the corner as they can, and
since
> > proper adjustment is with overscan, nobody gets the full logo!
>
> If you can not see the full logo, your set needs adjustment for
> overscan. The networks are not going to put up a logo that people
don't
> see!

Networks do a lot of crazy things. EVERY properly adjusted screen has
overscan.

>
> There should be an adjustment buried in your settings menu
somewhere,
> although it might be in a hidden service menu. You can also get a
> calibration DVD such as Digital Video Essentials which displays a
series
> of test patterns as well as test sounds to balance the speakers for a

> 5.1 sound system.

Got it, and my set is adjusted properly.
May 23, 2005 6:42:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Sun, 22 May 2005 22:40:42 -0400, Wojo <kenw@isoc.net> wrote:

>Alan Figgatt squeezed out a good one with:
>
>>> Leonard, Don't you think he should eliminate all other possibilities
>>> before messing with the overscan? Does he get any othe HDTV content?
>>> The trouble he describes seems like he is really looking at 16:9 Zoom
>>> or some other aspect setting is wrong.
>>> Thumper
>>
>> True, the OP should double check the zoom settings on both his TV and
>>the set top box. Too easy for someone to zoom in while watching a 16:9
>>SD show and then forget that it is zoomed in after they change back to
>>and HD channel.
>
>Let me clarify.
>
>Although I am most certainly not as knowledgeable as the average
>poster here regarding adjusting such things as overscan settings, I am
>NOT making the mistake of leaving my TV in a Zoom mode. And as far as
>I know my cable box doesn't even have one, so that's not the issue
>(unless there's a hidden "zoom mode" on my cable/HDTV box which
>changes the setting automatically for HD content). My TV is always in
>standard 16:9 format, even when I'm watching something broadcast in
>4:3 (which is rare, I hardly watch standard TV, and when I do it's
>very rarely in my theater).
>
>I'm thinking my problem HAS to either be with my cable box/cable
>provider or with my TV.
>
>Here is something to ponder: I have a DVD that was recorded from an
>HD broadcast. On my computer it displays perfectly...the entire
>screen is visable. On my TV it is cut off as previously described.
>This is not HD content, this is a standard DVD recorded FROM HD
>content...meaning that it must be the TV causing the problem...right?
>I don't have a futuristic DVD recorder to record content in actual HD,
>and I watch DVD's on an X-Box. Therefore there has to be something
>wrong with my TV, doesn't there?
>
>It seems I may have made a mistake purchasing a Hitachi unless I want
>to pay somebody to come and set it up in a way no other TV requires.
>I work for a company that sells both HD TV's and home theater
>equipment and I've yet to come across this.
>
>Wojo


Make sure you are watching the TV from the component input. Do you
have component cables hooked up?
Thumper
Anonymous
May 24, 2005 7:14:46 AM

Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Thumper squeezed out a good one with:

>>It seems I may have made a mistake purchasing a Hitachi unless I want
>>to pay somebody to come and set it up in a way no other TV requires.
>>I work for a company that sells both HD TV's and home theater
>>equipment and I've yet to come across this.
>>
>>Wojo
>
>
>Make sure you are watching the TV from the component input. Do you
>have component cables hooked up?

Yes, and I also tried DVI which, initially, gave the cable box reason
to tell me to revert back to it. Though a reboot of the cable box
eliminated that error message the end result didn't change. :( 

Wojo
!