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6400+ or Phenom?

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December 21, 2007 10:43:58 AM

Hey i'm a regular gamer and i want to know which processor i should get. I don't know which phenom would be best, should i just stick with a 6400+?

More about : 6400 phenom

December 21, 2007 11:09:07 AM

Yes, I would at this point in time.
In 3months when the B3 stepping comes out, it may be different.
December 21, 2007 11:19:07 AM

Agree with the above.
I bought my 6000+ two months ago for an interim until a suitably rapid Phenom was available.
I'm going to sit tight and see what happens :) 
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December 21, 2007 12:28:19 PM

Go with the 6400+. It's only $155 @ the 'egg right now, which is incredible. It overclocks pretty well too...into the 3.4Ghz range easily. Phenom is too buggy right now, and $/performance for Phenom is slightly worse than C2D on average, which just isn't good enough. Plus Phenom only just got a price drop, so there's no telling how long we'll have to wait for it to surpass C2D in terms of value.

If you're a mad, mad overclocker, get a 5000+ Brisbane Black Edition. They can OC past the stock 6400+. Again, only if you've got the mobo/RAM/experience to do the job right.
December 21, 2007 12:38:30 PM

guruboy said:
Go with the 6400+. It's only $155 @ the 'egg right now, which is incredible. It overclocks pretty well too...into the 3.4Ghz range easily.


Rofl, thats a 200mhz OC.

Buy a 5000+ and OC it.
December 21, 2007 12:56:44 PM

I would suggest getting a AM2+ board and putting a 5000+ black edition and turn it up to 6400+. You shouldn't even need to adjust anything but the multiplier. (I am currently running that system with an am2 board) if you want to turn the black edition up past 3.2ghz you will need to do some additional tweaking like vcore and such.
December 21, 2007 1:03:01 PM

zenmaster said:
Or Don't "UNDERCLOCK" your X2 :pt1cable:  :lol:  :pt1cable: 


...that was a core vs. core comparison...one that shows that the Phenom core is actually a little better. So because you obviosly didn't read the article, they were comparing one core of the X2s to one core of the Phenom at the exact same clock speed.
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December 21, 2007 1:05:30 PM

Just remember that the BE versions DON'T come with a cooler, so you have to add that into the cost of the purchase. You can use the Arctic Cooler Freezer 64 to cool that bad boy down, but will cost about $20-$25 more, so figure that into your costs. I'd get the 5000+ and OC it to 6400 speeds w/AC 64 cooler and wait for the "fixed" Phenoms to come out, if your going to stick with AMD. Intel has some good options too, but you seem to want to stick with AMD, which isn't a bad thing.
December 21, 2007 1:09:20 PM

If you already have the 6400 then you can wait,if not the I would say Phenom B.E. depending on budget
December 21, 2007 1:12:43 PM

No, I read the article.

But if the X2 can run @ 3.4 Ghz and the Phenom only 2.6Ghz, the X2 is clearly better for tasks that only support 2 cores, which is most.

Add to that, the Core vs Core of the Phenom will drop some with the use of more cores since the L3 cache will become divided among multiple cores and drop each cores relative performance.

If you want to talk about OCing the Phenom then you get into a real sticky wicket. It seems some of the BE Phenoms can do 2.7, some 2.8, and a lucky few hit 3.0. However, the few that get beyond 2.8 seem to need the 790 board which supports very high motherboard voltage adjustments. So you need a $200+ board to even get to 3.0Ghz.

What did THG run the NB at? AMD sets it back to 1.8 for stability in shipped chips but sets it at 2.0ghz for LAB tests. Reportedly this really effects performance. What the TLB Bios fix in place? Likely not.

The numbers THG is showing are similar to what was seen from the original Phenom ES tests that had the 2.0NB and unfixed TLB errata.

The article leaned over backwards to try and make the phenom look good.

Even so, the Phenom is going to loose to X2 in real world tests when both chips are optimized. And it's going to cost you lots more money to get that slower chip.

WoW! Analysis!! Something both the article and yourself lacked in this question.
December 21, 2007 5:17:00 PM

Well i have a 6400+ already but i wasnt sure it it was worth getting a phenom yet, tbh i kinda thought that the phenoms arent that great yet. Cheers for your input guys. Oh and mines overclocked to 3.5GHZ, don't know how cos my brother does all that stuff.
December 21, 2007 5:33:54 PM

zenmaster said:
No, I read the article.

But if the X2 can run @ 3.4 Ghz and the Phenom only 2.6Ghz, the X2 is clearly better for tasks that only support 2 cores, which is most.

Add to that, the Core vs Core of the Phenom will drop some with the use of more cores since the L3 cache will become divided among multiple cores and drop each cores relative performance.

If you want to talk about OCing the Phenom then you get into a real sticky wicket. It seems some of the BE Phenoms can do 2.7, some 2.8, and a lucky few hit 3.0. However, the few that get beyond 2.8 seem to need the 790 board which supports very high motherboard voltage adjustments. So you need a $200+ board to even get to 3.0Ghz.

What did THG run the NB at? AMD sets it back to 1.8 for stability in shipped chips but sets it at 2.0ghz for LAB tests. Reportedly this really effects performance. What the TLB Bios fix in place? Likely not.

The numbers THG is showing are similar to what was seen from the original Phenom ES tests that had the 2.0NB and unfixed TLB errata.

The article leaned over backwards to try and make the phenom look good.

Even so, the Phenom is going to loose to X2 in real world tests when both chips are optimized. And it's going to cost you lots more money to get that slower chip.

WoW! Analysis!! Something both the article and yourself lacked in this question.


Yes, I understand that Phenom gets beat by the old X2, but we have proof now that core for core, Phenom is better. Before I knew that pretty much the entire chip release was a flop in my eyes. But, I am glad they actually made a better performing core (unless we talk about max overclocks) than that of their old one. Phenom is a great option if you do a ton of CPU intensive, multithreading tasks. But other than that it lags behind the good ole' X2.
December 21, 2007 5:35:05 PM

Phenom without a doubt. It's currently $20 more than 6400+ and ANY app that uses more than two threads - such as Windows Vista will be much faster.

Sure there are occasions where the 800MHz higher clock speed will give the 6400+ an advantage, but overall, Phenom will be the longer lasting arch.

If you wait for the BE, you can more than likely get 3GHz with a good cooler and OverDrive. It may not be faster than the fastest chip out but I refuse to say it was OK for Netburst to not destroy Intel's value while Barcelona is being called AMD's death knell.
December 21, 2007 5:36:21 PM

monsterrocks said:
Yes, I understand that Phenom gets beat by the old X2, but we have proof now that core for core, Phenom is better. Before I knew that pretty much the entire chip release was a flop in my eyes. But, I am glad they actually made a better performing core (unless we talk about max overclocks) than that of their old one. Phenom is a great option if you do a ton of CPU intensive, multithreading tasks. But other than that it lags behind the good ole' X2.



It doesn't lag clock for clock. X2 is just clocked much higher right now.
December 21, 2007 5:50:51 PM

BaronMatrix said:
It doesn't lag clock for clock. X2 is just clocked much higher right now.


I never said it did...In fact, the article by toms proves that it is better clock for clock.
December 21, 2007 6:25:17 PM

relisys said:
Well i have a 6400+ already but i wasnt sure it it was worth getting a phenom yet, tbh i kinda thought that the phenoms arent that great yet. Cheers for your input guys. Oh and mines overclocked to 3.5GHZ, don't know how cos my brother does all that stuff.


OK. It wasn't clear at first that you already had the 6400+. I'd say keep your 6400+ for the time being, and 3.5 ghz is a good overclock for it. Maybe when the Phenom B3 stepping comes out, the B3 would make a decent upgrade, but maybe not, considering the outlay of money. If you have a 790FX board, then the Phenom B3 may be a good step up. If you have a AM2 board, then you won't get all the advantages of the Phenom design and I don't think it would be worthwhile to upgrade to put a Phenom into that board.
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December 21, 2007 7:07:27 PM

Already have a 6400 at 3.5??? I doubt you'd get anywhere close to that with the first gen Phenoms. So my advice is to save your money for a few months and see how AMD sorts Phenom out. There's little reason to change right now given your current setup. If you just want the project, look at stuff like a new GPU or more RAM or something else for now.
December 21, 2007 8:39:49 PM

The best deal for AMD is probably the 5000+ BE. Phenom is currently not a good deal, after all, the B3 stepping will come out soon, assuming AMD doesn't delay it.

That being said, what is your current system? If you have a decent pc atm, you should wait it out to get the B3.

Or you can go with an Intel Q6600. If you overclock and want the best bang for your buck, the E21xx series is it.
December 21, 2007 10:09:45 PM

I have:

AMD 6400+ ~3.5Ghz
4GB 800mhz corsair ram
Zotac 8800GT AMP Edition
1000w Powersupply
Abit Fatality AN9
2x 600gb Harddrives
December 21, 2007 10:38:18 PM

Definately keep the 6400+ for now and see what AMD comes up with for B3's and Black Editions. I'd only consider getting a phenom before the B3's are available if the Black Editions coming out now-ish can fairly easily hit 3.0Ghz. At those speeds you're going to be GPU limited way before CPU limited.

IMO your best bet though is to wait to see what happens within the next year with Phenoms and price drops on the 790FX motherboards.
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December 22, 2007 12:05:08 AM

relisys said:
I have:

AMD 6400+ ~3.5Ghz
4GB 800mhz corsair ram
Zotac 8800GT AMP Edition
1000w Powersupply
Abit Fatality AN9
2x 600gb Harddrives

Nice solid PC, would love to have it myself. I'd definately wait for the Phenom B3 stepping to come out and then see what the newer 790 mobo's are going for before buying anything.
December 22, 2007 1:20:57 PM

lunyone said:
Nice solid PC, would love to have it myself. I'd definately wait for the Phenom B3 stepping to come out and then see what the newer 790 mobo's are going for before buying anything.


Cheers m8, cost me about 500 odd pounds (GBP sterling) for all that so wasn't much really. Any one got an idea of what sort cost the new phenoms would be btw?
December 22, 2007 2:43:50 PM

Stick with the 6400+ till B3 stepping phenoms come out, hopefully the black edition Phenoms should also be at B3 as well. That may give them a bit more overlclock and no TLB error stuff. You don't need to spend 200+ for a 790FX board.

Picked up my k9a2 platinum on newegg for the short time they had it for only $179 US. The thing even gave my venerable old x2 4200+ a bit of a speed boost. Not to mention the bios has plenty of options for changing the divider for the memory controller to get better ram clocks.

Now all I need to do is sit and wait for b3. And a price drop on the 3870.
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December 22, 2007 3:26:24 PM

Wait for the B3 stepping, until then just put in a cheap X2 and OC it.
December 22, 2007 4:29:27 PM

Stay away from the Phenom for now, until the errata issue has been resolved, and get a 790 chipset. You have great rig now, no need to upgrade.
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