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4gb windows xp 32 bit problem

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February 29, 2008 12:20:59 AM

Hi, i have recently read the article about the 8gb ram upgrade for vista. But this article didn't talk much about XP. First the specs of my PC are:

AMD 6000+ , 4GB OCZ 800MHz platinum (4*1GB), MSI K9A Platinum Motherboard, 500gb HD seagate, x1950xt ati 256mb. Windows XP Pro 32bit.

anyhow, my bios says 4gb physical memory and only 3 gb usable???? Also, windows only recognizes 3gb. I have tried to find the Memory remapping feature in the bios but can't find it!

HELP!!!! I want to use my full 4GB lol

Thanks!
a b } Memory
February 29, 2008 12:45:20 AM

In 32 bit Windows operating systems, the total addressable space available is 4GB. If you installed total 4GB memory, the system will detect less than 4GB of total memory because of address space allocation for other critical functions, such as:

- System BIOS (including motherboard, add-on cards, etc..)
- Motherboards resources
- Memory mapped I/O
- Configuration for AGP/PCI-Ex/PCI
- Other memory allocations for PCI devices

Different onboard devices and different add-on cards (devices) will result of different total memory size. e.g. more PCI cards installed will require more memory resources, resulting of less memory free for other uses.

This limitation applies to most chipsets & Windows XP/Vista 32-bit version operating systems.

If you install a Windows operating system, if more than 3GB memory is required for your system, then the below conditions should be met:

1. The memory controller which supports memory swap functionality is used. The latest chipsets like Intel 975X, 955X, Nvidia NF4 SLI Intel Edition, Nvidia NF4 SLI X16, AMD K8 and newer architectures can support the memory swap function.

2. Windows XP Pro X64 Ed. (64-bit), Windows Vista 64, or other OS which can address more than 4GB memory.




Note: According to the latest Change Log published my Microsoft, Windows Vista 32bit SP1 will display the installed amount of RAM. This is a display change only.
February 29, 2008 12:58:13 AM

Good answer. I like it when a question can clearly be answered in one posting.

Good job...
Related resources
February 29, 2008 1:08:00 AM

32bit OS's have a 4gb physical memory addressing limit

physical memory includes video ram, sound card, network, and any other resourse in your machine. All these add up and slowly eat into the 4gb addressing limit.

In your case 3gb is actually fairly normal for a 256mb video card. Talk to the poor people that use 8800GTX in SLI at 768mb a piece with 32bit OS.

You will notice in that article that they are using the 64bit variant which theoretically allows 16exabytes or something crazy.

So to use your 4gb youll need at 64bit OS... also discussed in that article i believe was the difference between 32bit and 64bit in memory allocation sizes for programs, it comes out and says that the difference between 3gb on 32bit and 4gb on 64bit is negated by the increase in size of the programs loaded in the 64bit environment
February 29, 2008 1:10:10 AM

Scotteq said:
In 32 bit Windows operating systems, the total addressable space available is 4GB. If you installed total 4GB memory, the system will detect less than 4GB of total memory because of address space allocation for other critical functions, such as:

- System BIOS (including motherboard, add-on cards, etc..)
- Motherboards resources
- Memory mapped I/O
- Configuration for AGP/PCI-Ex/PCI
- Other memory allocations for PCI devices

Different onboard devices and different add-on cards (devices) will result of different total memory size. e.g. more PCI cards installed will require more memory resources, resulting of less memory free for other uses.

This limitation applies to most chipsets & Windows XP/Vista 32-bit version operating systems.

If you install a Windows operating system, if more than 3GB memory is required for your system, then the below conditions should be met:

1. The memory controller which supports memory swap functionality is used. The latest chipsets like Intel 975X, 955X, Nvidia NF4 SLI Intel Edition, Nvidia NF4 SLI X16, AMD K8 and newer architectures can support the memory swap function.

2. Windows XP Pro X64 Ed. (64-bit), Windows Vista 64, or other OS which can address more than 4GB memory.




Note: According to the latest Change Log published my Microsoft, Windows Vista 32bit SP1 will display the installed amount of RAM. This is a display change only.


Damn my slow typing fingers
February 29, 2008 1:29:19 AM

Hehe, that happened to me on another post earlier today. Thats what happens when you are long winded... ;) 
February 29, 2008 1:46:14 AM

I swear this forum needs a sticky about this topic.
February 29, 2008 1:55:14 AM

runswindows95 said:
I swear this forum needs a sticky about this topic.


Actually i have this feeling that one of the previous times this was answered someone with a correct and well written answer actually admitted to having pre-written it in a text document so they could copy and paste, instant answer!
February 29, 2008 2:03:17 AM

chookman said:
Actually i have this feeling that one of the previous times this was answered someone with a correct and well written answer actually admitted to having pre-written it in a text document so they could copy and paste, instant answer!



HAHAHA Scotteq its you....

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/247387-30-windows-read-3gig-4gig
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/247375-30-memory-sticks-home
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/247183-30-xp32-vista32
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/247156-30-anymore-gigs-waste
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/247143-30-supported
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/246640-30-installed-reading

It may as well be a sticky its everywhere LOL that so awesome cracks me up... no wonder why me fingers arent fast enough
February 29, 2008 2:05:35 AM

Way too funny!! :lol: 
February 29, 2008 2:43:10 AM

I can't blame Scotteq for saving his answer as a file. If I had to post the same answer over and over, I would keep it as a file too!
February 29, 2008 3:24:01 AM

You know when I am looking for an answer to a problem that I am having, I first do a search about the question that I want to ask.
If I find not answer then ask the question.
As this question has been answered a bunch of times, I would be inclined to just say look for the answer by searching.
a b } Memory
February 29, 2008 8:50:29 AM
February 29, 2008 9:02:48 AM

Lol :)  So that's the secret ... :D  ...

I like this forum, everybody is so helpful :)  I learn a lot of new things here B-)
February 29, 2008 9:14:44 AM

bobbknight said:
You know when I am looking for an answer to a problem that I am having, I first do a search about the question that I want to ask.
If I find not answer then ask the question.
As this question has been answered a bunch of times, I would be inclined to just say look for the answer by searching.
What... Google? Nah, I Googled "4GB 32bit" and I only got about 2,900 hits. Where would I find the answer?
February 29, 2008 9:15:33 AM

Scotteq said:
....And my Prize for Applied Intelligence is... ???? :lol: 
Saving the skin on your fingers.
a b } Memory
February 29, 2008 10:43:10 AM

Damn.... I was hoping for a half~eaten bagel on which I could use the month old cream cheese that I won last week... ;) 
February 29, 2008 11:05:04 AM

Quote:
Are you friggin kidding me????? THIS IS HOW MANY TIMES THIS QUESTION IS ASKED HERE THIS YEAR ALONE> 10,0000

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE
Ok, put the gun down. I have some nice Haldol for you, it will be alright.
February 29, 2008 11:07:35 AM

Scotteq said:
Damn.... I was hoping for a half~eaten bagel on which I could use the month old cream cheese that I won last week... ;) 
That cream cheese is still good, it lasts a long time before spoiling.
a b } Memory
February 29, 2008 11:13:35 AM

Quote:
Are you friggin kidding me????? THIS IS HOW MANY TIMES THIS QUESTION IS ASKED HERE THIS YEAR ALONE> 10,0000

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE



Zorg said:
Ok, put the gun down. I have some nice Haldol for you, it will be alright.



Perhaps it might save time if we copied these responses into a Word doc for quick cut/pasting as well... :whistle: 
February 29, 2008 11:19:44 AM

:lol:  :lol:  :lol: 
February 29, 2008 11:33:12 AM

Even Microsoft gave up on this. They just changed the displayed amount of RAM or removed it with the new Service Pack.

In other news the price of human brain per gram (Hbpg) went up from 15.20$ to a soaring 1022$ on friday. Gartners analysts predict no end to rising Hbpg cost, pointing at an increase of inbreeding and cultural induced idiocy as one of the reasons for the steep price.
Furthermore the grey cell market was badly shaken earlier this week by rumors about an increasing number of humans born without brainmatter. Even though the rumor was quickly refuted as a marketing ploy of Canlux International Co Ltd (NYSE: CanluxT) to promote their brain substitute the damage was already done.
Obviously analysts base their predictions regarding cultural induced idiocy on research done by austrian neurologist Dr. Glatz von Starkstrom, whose leading research on cranial diseases and the effect of elecronic devices on the human brain were published in the january edition of Science Magazine. In his article Dr. von Starkstrom describes a dangerous relation between the amount of computer memory available in a household and the decline of basic brain functions.
"Our test group consisted of 150 individuals of both sexes, mostly people between 20-35 years of age. We gradually increased the amount of computer memory in their surrounding and monitored their behavior over a period of four weeks", Dr. von Starkstrom explains. The results of the study are nothing less than shocking.
"After we increased the avalable memory to about 3 GB of typical RAM (Ed: legally available at almost all electronic stores!) a small number of subjects showed atypical behaviour, mostly forgetfulness and to some degree a decline in motoric abilities. Once we approached 3.5 GB things turned pretty bad. There was a 32 year old teacher that, after a week of exposure, couldn't recognize his daughter no longer. After two weeks we had to take the teacher out of our testing group since he became unable to move and started to uncontrolably defecate on his computer chair. Another participant was severly injured after he seemingly lost the ability to speak coherently and tried to insert his genitalia into a floppy drive. A lot of people also showed a certain unwillingness to solve even minor problems on their own." Most of the participants had to abort the experiment within the first two weeks, Dr. Starkstrom says. "At 4GB we had to abort the experiment. Most subjects became catatonic and in some cases even basic respitory functions stopped." As Dr. Starkstrom concludes, there is a definite psychological connection between computer memory and brain function. The research conducted also shows an increased aggressive behavior of male participants coupled with an agitated self-confidence and a nearly uncontrolable sexual urge.
This begs an important question: How much RAM can the human brain take before it snaps?
"Luckily," Dr. Starkstrom says," two of the test subjects were unaffected and agreed to continue the test even beyond it's original boundaries. Thanks to these two, a young female student from MIT and a 39 year old computer technician, we could successfully increase the average RAM to 8GB. We didn't dare to go any further, even though both subjects remained unaffected." That's 8192MB or 68.719.476.736 Bits - an astonishing number.
As to why those two remained unaffected is still unclear, but Dr. Starkstrom and his team will continue their research.
February 29, 2008 12:22:22 PM

Guys, to get back on topic a bit, I am currently running Vista 32-bit OEM with 2Gb of DDR2 RAM. Looking at the price of RAM, getting another 2Gb's seems very easy at the moment. The only problem is that I've just bought my OEM version of Vista, which does not allow me to upgrade to 64-bit. Obviously I don't really want to buy another copy of Vista so what do you guys think; should I just sit tight. Should I buy the extra 2Gb's and just put up with the fact that I'll loose 0.5Gb's until I upgrade to 64-bit?

Thanks.
February 29, 2008 12:47:43 PM

you can do, if u want, RAM is cheap rite now, do u really need to xtra gigs? hows ur sys running as it is?

you could always buy two 512mb sticks and go to 3gb (keeping dual channel) aswell as not losing half a gig. depends how soon u wanna go 64bit, if ur not going to for quite sometime 2x512's will set u back £20
February 29, 2008 12:50:11 PM

ghostwalker said:
Guys, to get back on topic a bit, I am currently running Vista 32-bit OEM with 2Gb of DDR2 RAM. Looking at the price of RAM, getting another 2Gb's seems very easy at the moment. The only problem is that I've just bought my OEM version of Vista, which does not allow me to upgrade to 64-bit. Obviously I don't really want to buy another copy of Vista so what do you guys think; should I just sit tight. Should I buy the extra 2Gb's and just put up with the fact that I'll loose 0.5Gb's until I upgrade to 64-bit?

Thanks.


Having 3.5 GB with 32 bit is almost as good as having 4GB with 64 bit from a memory point of view. While on 32 bit some memory will be unusuable by the OS thanks to the mapping, 64 bit consumes more memory due to the fact that the programms running on it are larger and use longer values. While it doesn't look like it, you will loose memory either way. Either to the different applications or to the memory mapping of 32 bit. Having exactly 4GB isn't what i would call a sweet spot, more like the opposite.
If you intend to move beyond 4 GB then get a 64bit OS. If not, 32 bit will serve you fine for some time (yes, even with 4GB installed).
February 29, 2008 12:54:29 PM

Slobogob said:
Having 3.5 GB with 32 bit is almost as good as having 4GB with 64 bit from a memory point of view. While on 32 bit some memory will be unusuable by the OS thanks to the mapping, 64 bit consumes more memory due to the fact that the programms running on it are larger and use longer values. While it doesn't look like it, you will loose memory either way. Either to the different applications or to the memory mapping of 32 bit. Having exactly 4GB isn't what i would call a sweet spot, more like the opposite.
If you intend to move beyond 4 GB then get a 64bit OS. If not, 32 bit will serve you fine for some time (yes, even with 4GB installed).


So would you say, performance wise, 4Gb with Vista 64-bit is about the same as 4Gb (3.5Gb addressed) with Vista 32-bit?
February 29, 2008 1:03:27 PM

samal90 said:
Hi, i have recently read the article about the 8gb ram upgrade for vista. But this article didn't talk much about XP. First the specs of my PC are:

AMD 6000+ , 4GB OCZ 800MHz platinum (4*1GB), MSI K9A Platinum Motherboard, 500gb HD seagate, x1950xt ati 256mb. Windows XP Pro 32bit.

anyhow, my bios says 4gb physical memory and only 3 gb usable???? Also, windows only recognizes 3gb. I have tried to find the Memory remapping feature in the bios but can't find it!

HELP!!!! I want to use my full 4GB lol

Thanks!



I try not to be an ass but sometimes I just can't help it.

Please punch yourself in the face and learn to do a little reading before you post.
February 29, 2008 1:09:41 PM

thx for the quick responses guys...guess I'll have to switch to vista 64 sometime...probably after SP1 is released :) 

and yeah....I punched myself in the face :) 
February 29, 2008 1:27:02 PM

ghostwalker said:
So would you say, performance wise, 4Gb with Vista 64-bit is about the same as 4Gb (3.5Gb addressed) with Vista 32-bit?


From a pure theoretical perspective 64 bit is faster. Then again the Core 2 duos perform worse with 64 bit (marginally) since they can't fuse two 64 bit instructions (they can do that with some 32 bit operations!). The memory addresses are longer and most applications need more RAM which slows things down too (marginally, again). Drivers and software on 32 bit are more mature even though 64 bit caught up by quite some - 32 bit should still have an advantage though.
Calculations with long numbers of any kind are significantly faster on 64 bit IF the software uses it correctly. That's a big if though. Since almost everything a computer does are calculations, 64 should improve things. Well, at least if precision or large numbers are involved.

To come to an conclusion, i can't say whether 32 bit is faster or 64 bit. Maybe Google can provide a comparison or some bencharks. Personally i would go with 64 bit but not because of the performance. 32 bit needs to go where 16 bit has gone, that's why i would pick 64 bit. That's my opinion though. If i were you i'd stick with 32 bit until you can get a cheap 64 bit version or even until a new OS comes along. Maybe you will buy a new computer before you really need a 64bit OS.
Anonymous
February 29, 2008 1:53:41 PM

Zorg said:
What... Google? Nah, I Googled "4GB 32bit" and I only got about 2,900 hits. Where would I find the answer?



I bet you can Google 99.9999999999% of everything in this forum. SO then why even have the forum if ya keep telling people to google.
February 29, 2008 2:19:01 PM

samal90 said:
thx for the quick responses guys...guess I'll have to switch to vista 64 sometime...probably after SP1 is released :) 

and yeah....I punched myself in the face :) 



Thank you very much.
February 29, 2008 4:36:42 PM

Anonymous said:
I bet you can Google 99.9999999999% of everything in this forum. SO then why even have the forum if ya keep telling people to google.

WTF? Your kidding me right? I don't tell people to Google. I recently got slammed on not doing a Google myself, I did try though.

Here's a quick recap.

Before my post.
runswindows95 said:
I swear this forum needs a sticky about this topic.
chookman said:
Actually i have this feeling that one of the previous times this was answered someone with a correct and well written answer actually admitted to having pre-written it in a text document so they could copy and paste, instant answer!
runswindows95 said:
I can't blame Scotteq for saving his answer as a file. If I had to post the same answer over and over, I would keep it as a file too!
bobbknight said:
You know when I am looking for an answer to a problem that I am having, I first do a search about the question that I want to ask.
If I find not answer then ask the question.
As this question has been answered a bunch of times, I would be inclined to just say look for the answer by searching.
Zorg said:
What... Google? Nah, I Googled "4GB 32bit" and I only got about 2,900 hits. Where would I find the answer?
After my post.

Quote:
Are you friggin kidding me????? THIS IS HOW MANY TIMES THIS QUESTION IS ASKED HERE THIS YEAR ALONE> 10,0000

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE
Zorg said:
Ok, put the gun down. I have some nice Haldol for you, it will be alright.
First read the posts in order, then you will understand.

I think you got the wrong man here. Do you have something against me personally? I would hope that you would tell me in the open forum, or at least PM me.

It all changes when it is taken in perspective doesn't it?

I probably would have just answered his question. I have thought about saving responses, but alas I only save links to things that I think people would like. Maybe (of course) we should make Scotteq's post a sticky. Everyone can have a whack at it, to embellish the understanding, and then we change the name. The name change is so that it will be on the top of the 2,900 hits. This is to ensure that if anyone actually decided to use Google we could ensure that they were getting accurate information. But they won't look. That was the original frustration that apparently you didn't understand.

Do you understand now?




February 29, 2008 6:52:29 PM

Slobogob said:
Even Microsoft gave up on this. They just changed the displayed amount of RAM or removed it with the new Service Pack.

In other news the price of human brain per gram (Hbpg) went up from 15.20$ to a soaring 1022$ on friday. Gartners analysts predict no end to rising Hbpg cost, pointing at an increase of inbreeding and cultural induced idiocy as one of the reasons for the steep price.
Furthermore the grey cell market was badly shaken earlier this week by rumors about an increasing number of humans born without brainmatter. Even though the rumor was quickly refuted as a marketing ploy of Canlux International Co Ltd (NYSE: CanluxT) to promote their brain substitute the damage was already done.
Obviously analysts base their predictions regarding cultural induced idiocy on research done by austrian neurologist Dr. Glatz von Starkstrom, whose leading research on cranial diseases and the effect of elecronic devices on the human brain were published in the january edition of Science Magazine. In his article Dr. von Starkstrom describes a dangerous relation between the amount of computer memory available in a household and the decline of basic brain functions.
"Our test group consisted of 150 individuals of both sexes, mostly people between 20-35 years of age. We gradually increased the amount of computer memory in their surrounding and monitored their behavior over a period of four weeks", Dr. von Starkstrom explains. The results of the study are nothing less than shocking.
"After we increased the avalable memory to about 3 GB of typical RAM (Ed: legally available at almost all electronic stores!) a small number of subjects showed atypical behaviour, mostly forgetfulness and to some degree a decline in motoric abilities. Once we approached 3.5 GB things turned pretty bad. There was a 32 year old teacher that, after a week of exposure, couldn't recognize his daughter no longer. After two weeks we had to take the teacher out of our testing group since he became unable to move and started to uncontrolably defecate on his computer chair. Another participant was severly injured after he seemingly lost the ability to speak coherently and tried to insert his genitalia into a floppy drive. A lot of people also showed a certain unwillingness to solve even minor problems on their own." Most of the participants had to abort the experiment within the first two weeks, Dr. Starkstrom says. "At 4GB we had to abort the experiment. Most subjects became catatonic and in some cases even basic respitory functions stopped." As Dr. Starkstrom concludes, there is a definite psychological connection between computer memory and brain function. The research conducted also shows an increased aggressive behavior of male participants coupled with an agitated self-confidence and a nearly uncontrolable sexual urge.
This begs an important question: How much RAM can the human brain take before it snaps?
"Luckily," Dr. Starkstrom says," two of the test subjects were unaffected and agreed to continue the test even beyond it's original boundaries. Thanks to these two, a young female student from MIT and a 39 year old computer technician, we could successfully increase the average RAM to 8GB. We didn't dare to go any further, even though both subjects remained unaffected." That's 8192MB or 68.719.476.736 Bits - an astonishing number.
As to why those two remained unaffected is still unclear, but Dr. Starkstrom and his team will continue their research.


Thats awesome Slobogob, i absolutely kacked myself... had to be quiet though GF is asleep behind me
February 29, 2008 8:22:43 PM

supremelaw, you have a strange way with those addressing calculations. In x86 you can address a 8, 16 or 32-bit word just fine. If you do dwords, you just increment the address pointer by 4 bytes (instead of one byte, if you do byte-addressing).

February 29, 2008 10:53:12 PM

chookman said:
Thats awesome Slobogob, i absolutely kacked myself


Given the amount of RAM in your computer and the prolonged exposure i am not surprised. ;) 
March 1, 2008 2:43:32 AM

darn, so many info :)  nice one supreme, although I'm a little bit lost here. I should bookmark this thread ...

Come on guys, put all your guns down :)  Save it for another things or another forums :)  I like this forum since it is the most friendly forum I got so far :)  Most people are helpful and kind :)  Let's keep it like that :) 

Anyway, a li'l out of topic: don't blame someone asking a repetitive question, not all the people have the luxury of time to search :) 
March 1, 2008 1:35:10 PM

antas said:

Anyway, a li'l out of topic: don't blame someone asking a repetitive question, not all the people have the luxury of time to search :) 


That's actually the problem. The truth is, if someone really needed that info, it would be better to use Google. It takes time to register at the forum, start a thread, describe the problem and then people still have to respond.
Putting a few keywords describing the problem into a search-engine, hitting enter and looking at the results is a whole lot easier. Look what i found by just typing "32bit 4GB" into google.

To find solutions for simple and common problems, searching the web is a whole lot faster then asking in a forum.


June 22, 2008 3:22:13 PM

The /3GB switch allocates 3 GB of virtual address space to an application that uses IMAGE_FILE_LARGE_ADDRESS_AWARE in the process header. This switch allows applications to address 1 GB of additional virtual address space above 2 GB.

The virtual address space of processes and applications is still limited to 2 GB, unless the /3GB switch is used in the Boot.ini file. The following example shows how to add the /3GB parameter in the Boot.ini file to enable application memory tuning:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINNT
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINNT="????" /3GB

Note: "????" in the previous example can be the programmatic name of any of the following operating system versions:

Windows XP Professional
Windows Server 2003
Windows Server 2003, Enterprise Edition
Windows Server 2003, Datacenter Edition
Windows 2000 Advanced Server
Windows 2000 Datacenter Server
Windows NT Server 4.0, Enterprise Edition

June 23, 2008 5:06:58 PM

I have a related question and don't want to start another thread on this topic. currently i have (2) 8800 gt in sli and my addressable ram is 2.5 gigs. i play at lower resolutions on my 19 inch monitor and was wondering

if i removed one of the graphcis cards will my ram automatically jump up to 3 gbs addressable?

will i see a performance hit or improvement with the extra ram vs losing a graphics card?
!