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The Battle is Over.

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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Whom do you think will win.

Total: 319 votes (52 blank votes)

  • 3870X2
  • 36 %
  • 9800GX2
  • 36 %
  • Intel Graphics Media Accelerator
  • 29 %
January 27, 2008 5:59:42 AM

http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=229127
Even if those numbers are not real, the 9800 is still underclocked and no more than SLI on one PCI-E lane, lowering bandwith+scalability and causing some nasty heat issues. So far, it's not even beating the 8800GTS in SLI, while the 3870X2 is.
Keep in mind that the 3870X2 is also going to be selling for much less. Also, as the 3870 is also gonna be released before the 9800 (1/28/08), ggnore nvidia.
3870X2 > 9800GX2
Discuss.

More about : battle

a b U Graphics card
January 27, 2008 6:10:17 AM

So if the HD3870X2 is $AU653, how much will this thing be? :heink: 

Oh, and the poll is empty.
January 27, 2008 6:31:09 AM

Sorry about that.
Meh, i heard around 300 bucks.
Related resources
January 27, 2008 7:06:20 AM

quite honestly, i think the 9800gx2 shows just how cheap nvidia is. they couldn't redesign the thing for one board, so it can actually cool itself? quite honestly, what does the dual pcb design actually do besides make it cheaper to produce?
January 27, 2008 7:15:41 AM

Nothing that I can think of Frozenlead. makes things a lot more inconvenient though. I think the 3870x2 was a step in the right direction, where the 9800GX2 is looking like the 7950GX2

I do have one question though, is the 1GB memory shared between the two GPUs or is it 1GB for both GPUs?
a b U Graphics card
January 27, 2008 7:23:12 AM

Unless you play at 2560x1600 with 4xAA, it doesn't generally matter currently.
January 27, 2008 7:50:59 AM

3870 x 2 and 9800GX2, technically, are just more or less the same...
I guess 9800GX2 will end up a little bit faster than 3870 x 2,
just because it will release a bit later...
Intel GMA, of course, will win, for market share. Only those who play
Crysis will need something more than 8800GT or 3870 in the mean time,
and I guess it will be much more economic friendly to buy one card,
and then upgrade to SLI/XFire when needed.
a b U Graphics card
January 27, 2008 7:56:05 AM

The 2900XT was released after the 8800GTX, it wasn't faster.

It's cheaper to get 2 3870s or 2 8800GTs here than an X2 :lol: 
January 27, 2008 7:57:02 AM

Wow... You guys are blind... The Intel Graphics Media Accelerator is clearly the winner! :pt1cable: 
January 27, 2008 8:37:26 AM

Loser777 said:
Sorry about that.
Meh, i heard around 300 bucks.

Where?
a b U Graphics card
January 27, 2008 8:42:08 AM

Yea good question, I haven't seen it less than 485 US
January 27, 2008 11:19:24 AM

I think Nvidia are going to be hurt badly by the 3870X2 release, and if I were in the market for a new video card, absolutely no question I'd go with the 3870X2! I definitely wouldn't be holding out for the 9800GX2.
If the rumours turn out to be true, I think Nvidia have made a real ****-up in thinking that enthusiasts would go for an 8800GTX(X2) renamed and essentially a single-card solution....
January 27, 2008 11:56:38 AM

Quote:
AMD has been pretty impressive on the graphics side lately. Good to know all those engineers they pulled off cpu design, did some good somewhere else.


Nuh uh, AMD sucks, they are going to go out of business and Ruiz is going to be fired, and we're all going to die..
You heard it all here first from the experts! :kaola: 

I think it's a pretty good card with all the numbers I am seeing.
The current price will drop when more start showing up in inventories.
It still beats out the prices of it's competition by a decent clip as is.

I am waiting to see what happens over the next couple weeks and then I think I'll bite.
Just want to make sure I won't be stuck with a card that has dookie drivers.

January 27, 2008 1:15:51 PM

my 2 cents:

Intel media graphics accelerator rules
January 27, 2008 1:47:27 PM

I voted GMA just because I could. After all, it *is* going to have vastly more market share (andeven have more profits) than both of those two cards combined. And it seems that the days of the crap-tacular "Intel Extreme" are long gone... With their current design, it looks as if the upcoming X4000 will become viable for light gaming; i.e, those 10 million World of WarCraft players wouldn't need a discrete graphics card at all if they had that.

Also, @the Kittah: the 3870X2 is out NOW?! How did I miss this?! :ouch: 
January 27, 2008 1:57:10 PM

I voted for the 3870 X2. It looks good, its here, Its not Nvidia. At the moment all my machines have Nvidia cards and I'm ready to try the competition.
January 27, 2008 6:18:04 PM

I never owned an ATI. So I voted for 9800GX2.

Besides, it looks better.
January 27, 2008 6:34:03 PM

The GX2 even if it scales the same as SLI, is gonna be held back by 550 core.
January 27, 2008 6:44:15 PM

I owned a HD 3870 and hated it it was such junk always studdering in games, couldnt play crysis at all, other games like COD4 it was ok in but like i said it would randomly studder, even did a fresh install of XP and no luck the Drivers+Card=Junk i switched over to the 8800GT and like it much better im able to do everything on High no problems.

I agree the 9800GX2(basically two G92's on one PCB) is worthless just like the 7950GX2 was so far Nvidia'a Dual GPU solutions have been horrible to say the best... ATI has been going in the right direction the X1950PRO DUAL GPU was there first step though it wasnt a hit and not many knew about it it faired quite well, the supposed 2600XT dual GPU, never saw the light of day just rumors, so my guess is they scraped it,
All im waiting for is nvidia new High end solution(no dual gpu's) 9800GTX or w/e there calling it these days my money is on that card right there.
January 27, 2008 6:46:21 PM

Loser777 said:
The GX2 even if it scales the same as SLI, is gonna be held back by 550 core.

Crank up fan speeds then OC away.

Although I'm hoping the 9800GX2 will outperform the 3870X2, I'm betting it'll be giving roughly the same or worse performance.
January 27, 2008 8:31:58 PM

When the 9800GX2 is released it will be underclocked by default for obivious reasons (just speculating)
-incredible heat issues
-power requirements
-the cooling solution seems to be in the same boat as the 8800GT
January 27, 2008 10:33:42 PM

kpo6969 said:
-power requirements


Yeah, thats one subject ATI hasn't been very concerned with these days; power. Although you can bite the bullet with ease and give props to ATI for a thought through plan for this board. Like Randomizer always says: multiple cores are the future, not multiple CPU/GPUs.
a b U Graphics card
January 28, 2008 12:58:00 AM

Blacken said:
Like Randomizer always says: multiple cores are the future, not multiple CPU/GPUs.

Are you stalking me? :ouch:  :sol: 

Does anyone think this card will cause a noticeable price drop on the HD3870 or 8800GT? I'm wanting to grab one, not sure which though, and they are both pricey.
January 28, 2008 1:05:51 AM

randomizer said:
Does anyone think this card will cause a noticeable price drop on the HD3870 or 8800GT? I'm wanting to grab one, not sure which though, and they are both pricey.

I would think most people agrees. Perhaps the 8800GT will drop to $190?
January 28, 2008 1:18:53 AM

The way I see it ATI bought AMD and stole all the chip desingers tis 3870x2 looks great but I really think that they should make a dual core GPU I mean even a 65nm one would'nt be that hard considering intels going to make 32nm soon
January 28, 2008 1:28:16 AM

randomizer said:
Does anyone think this card will cause a noticeable price drop on the HD3870 or 8800GT? I'm wanting to grab one, not sure which though, and they are both pricey.


I don't think so. At least from my understanding, the 3870 X2 is about twice the price of a 3870, or about the same as two 3870s, so the single card will probably remain the same cost. I am thinking of getting the 3870 X2 though, because then I can get something close to Crossfire and only take up one slot on the mobo.
a b U Graphics card
January 28, 2008 2:36:47 AM

If you look at the respective speeds of the gpus, the ATI product runs alot faster and runs warm/hot as does the nVidia product at < speeds. If nVidia can solve this problem, then theyll have quite a product (meaning higher clocks on both single and dual gpus)
a b U Graphics card
January 28, 2008 2:46:43 AM

sailer said:
I don't think so. At least from my understanding, the 3870 X2 is about twice the price of a 3870, or about the same as two 3870s, so the single card will probably remain the same cost. I am thinking of getting the 3870 X2 though, because then I can get something close to Crossfire and only take up one slot on the mobo.

Here the 3870X2 is significantly more than twice the price of a 3870, so crossfire is in fact ~$60 cheaper. The only reason I am considering a HD3870 over an 8800GT is the far superior cooling. Both cards are within $10 of each other, $290-300 being the range of the cheapest ones.
January 28, 2008 4:23:33 AM

randomizer said:
Here the 3870X2 is significantly more than twice the price of a 3870, so crossfire is in fact ~$60 cheaper. The only reason I am considering a HD3870 over an 8800GT is the far superior cooling. Both cards are within $10 of each other, $290-300 being the range of the cheapest ones.

Save up for a 8800GTS 512MB :) 

I think the price/performance for the 3870 is similar to the 8800GTS 512MB, so save up. I've seen some dip under the $300 mark.
a b U Graphics card
January 28, 2008 4:25:54 AM

In the US maybe, but here they barely dip under $400
January 28, 2008 4:27:06 AM

Oh that sucks...AU was it?
January 28, 2008 4:37:43 AM

randomizer said:
In the US maybe, but here they barely dip under $400


I guess there is something good about living in the USA. I wonder, if I filled my suitcases full of video cards, could I sell them for enough money to pay for the flight to Australia and a vacation on the beach?
January 28, 2008 4:44:45 AM

randomizer said:


Does anyone think this card will cause a noticeable price drop on the HD3870 or 8800GT? I'm wanting to grab one, not sure which though, and they are both pricey.


I have a 3870 and can say that I am really happy with it. Got it for $229.99 CAN and so far performs great. I would whole-heartedly recommend it for being extremely stable, low on noise, low on heat and for its crisp visuals.

The 3870X2 looks powerful and at a price which is very reasonable. However, since nVidia hasn't released their next-gen offerings yet, it would seem a little rash for ATi supporters to call it a win already, whatever 'win' implies in this situation.

Btw is it just me, or is there anyone else on this board who believes AMD should have stuck with the 512-bit bandwith with the 3800 series? It seems like a peculiar choice to downgrade to 256 considering the 2900XT was using it. Anyone know anymore about this?
January 28, 2008 5:27:05 AM

sailer said:
I guess there is something good about living in the USA. I wonder, if I filled my suitcases full of video cards, could I sell them for enough money to pay for the flight to Australia and a vacation on the beach?


I'm not sure about on the beach... More like Villawood. :kaola:  But hey, it'd be a nice paid vacation, and the return airfair would be free!

Prices here really suck, and I have no reason why. Closer to Taiwan / China / Japan, so shipping should be lower. No tariffs to speak of on electronics, and just the 10% GST, but with the AUD at around 88% USD, we still pay about 50% more on most electronics? All I can figure is 'rape, rob and pillage'.
January 28, 2008 2:30:36 PM

croc said:
All I can figure is 'rape, rob and pillage'.


That sounds like something my Viking ancestors were famous for. I wonder, are governments made up of people who were barbarians in their former lives?

@ Olympian- As to bandwidth, from reading the 3870 X2 article in Tom's this morning, it appears that the 3870 X2 has a 512 bit bandwidth.
January 28, 2008 2:48:03 PM

I dont really understand why someone would buy this or why AMD released this card just to have the "fastest card" title for 2 weeks (beeting a card that has been out for almost a year)..

Sure when you compair this to the ultra, its pretty good. But seriously, who is buying the ultra anymore? Go for 8800 gt and save 200-250 dollars for a 10% speed reduction or buy 2 and SLI and laugh at AMD...
January 28, 2008 2:58:41 PM

asm0deus said:
I dont really understand why someone would buy this or why AMD released this card just to have the "fastest card" title for 2 weeks (beeting a card that has been out for almost a year)..

Sure when you compair this to the ultra, its pretty good. But seriously, who is buying the ultra anymore? Go for 8800 gt and save 200-250 dollars for a 10% speed reduction or buy 2 and SLI and laugh at AMD...


ROFL!! Seriously, I mean, if ATI had delivered another card didn't beat the 8800 Ultra, the ATI bashers would have been out in force talking about how once again, ATI didn't deliver a card that was good enough. So now that they did, you're complaining that though its good, ATI shouldn't have bothered because Nvidia will have a new card out in two weeks. And you claim that Nvidia's card will beat it? How do you know that? Do you have a better crystal ball than everyone else? Sorry, but you come across more as a sore looser than anything else.

And before you go calling me an ATI fanboy, let it be known that I have Nvidia cards in all three of my computers.
January 28, 2008 3:37:10 PM

Quote:
I dont really understand why someone would buy this or why AMD released this card just to have the "fastest card" title for 2 weeks (beeting a card that has been out for almost a year)..
That alone is a stupid argument. The same thing could be said about any card! You just buy when you believe the time is right... otherwise you could always says: "Oh, that's only going to be the best card for another month". Please... I'm no fanboy (I use Nvidia atm and have been thinking about the 3870x2), but your arguments are stupid to the point of just bashing the card because you don't know what else to say.

The fact that they delayed the release a few days to spin out some new drivers that improved Crysis performance 45-55% across the board shows that they're really trying to make a great release product. (The drivers also boosted performance in a handful of other games)

It is the fastest single-card out there and doesn't require equipment change to support it. (No need to worry about Crossfire support, just pop it in) If you bought two GT's, you'd spend $50 more than the 3870x2 to match it's performance... it's a great value, you can't deny that.
January 28, 2008 3:56:48 PM

It seems common sense says that Nvidia will beat the X2 with their next offering. They released the GT and the 512 MB GTS recently. It would seem odd to predict they will all of a sudden do a 180 and release a new card that's the same or slower than the Ultra. Put another way, if Nvidia's new flagship card beats it's old flagship card, based on the benchmarks, it will beat the X2. Further, if the 9800GX2 is even comparable to 2 8800GTs in SLI, there's your winner right there.

I guess I just don't see any major changes here. You have ATI releasing pretty much the exact same thing that was destroyed performance and value wise by the 8800 GT, just 2 of them stuck together. There is no real new technology, no increase in memory bandwidth (which is a huge part of the reason the 8800 Ultra and GTX are still strong cards), and no real innovation, outside perhaps their cooling solution. This is a case of hacking old tech rather than inventing new tech. Exactly the same thing Nvidia did with their 780i chipset (which is why I will never run SLI until Nvidia starts supporting Intel chipsets in their drivers, or they seriously turn around their own chipset design).

If you just love ATI so much you can't stand the thought of putting any other card in your system, then ATI just gave you a nice solution that will allow you to keep using their cards while playing DX10 games (even Crysis) reasonably well. This card strikes me as a gift to the ATI fanboi, not an industry shaking offering by any means.
January 28, 2008 4:08:18 PM

SPC said:
I guess I just don't see any major changes here.



IMO the changes are in the overall direction the drivers will be heading.

R700 is gonna be dual core, RV770 is gonna be dual die, dual core. Thus, it was important for AMD/ATI to get decent scaling going from 1 die to another.


While the X2 is good now, it should go from strength to strength with driver improvements leading up to the RV770 launch.


(Hopefully)
January 28, 2008 4:09:10 PM

thats pretty harsh lol. Theres alot of interest in the card, plus u just need one slot on any pcie motherboard and a psu around 550w. I think the 9800gx2 will be faster, but it might be more power hungry and will probably cost a fair bit more. It'll probably become like a 3870 vs. 8800gt argument, just at a higher price level.

January 28, 2008 4:11:51 PM

sorry that was @SPC btw.

January 28, 2008 4:18:57 PM

Evilonigiri said:
I never owned an ATI. So I voted for 9800GX2.

Besides, it looks better.



Yesterday I just dropped in a 8800gt oc from bfg...coming from an ati 1900xtx

It is much faster than my old trusty 1900 but ntune locks my rig up completely and the dual monitor support isnt as easy to use as ccc (My opinion)

I went with the 8800gt cause I truely believe the 3870x2 would be horribly bottlenecked by my rig
January 28, 2008 4:31:28 PM

spoonboy said:
thats pretty harsh lol. Theres alot of interest in the card, plus u just need one slot on any pcie motherboard and a psu around 550w. I think the 9800gx2 will be faster, but it might be more power hungry and will probably cost a fair bit more. It'll probably become like a 3870 vs. 8800gt argument, just at a higher price level.


Don't get me wrong, ATI has released a great card here. At the end of the day however, I am going to go with what makes the most logical sense. I would love to see ATI take top spot if for no other reason than I can run crossfire on an Intel chipset. I refuse to be forced into an inferior Nvidia chipset just for the privilage of purchasing twice as many of their video cards. So it's not that I am some kind of Nvidia fanboi myself, I just want to make the smartest move.

Being in Canada, the smartest move for me is to buy an EVGA 8800 GTS 512MB card in a week or two, then step-up to the faster Nvidia offering in a few months. Even if the cost is ~550-600, it won't hurt as much paying half now, half in three months. I admit, were it not for the EVGA step-up program, the decision would be quite a bit more difficult. However taking everything into consideration, Nvidia is the smart choice.
January 28, 2008 4:39:10 PM

amddiesel said:
Yesterday I just dropped in a 8800gt oc from bfg...coming from an ati 1900xtx

It is much faster than my old trusty 1900 but ntune locks my rig up completely and the dual monitor support isnt as easy to use as ccc (My opinion)

I went with the 8800gt cause I truely believe the 3870x2 would be horribly bottlenecked by my rig


I have a machine very much like yours, using a FX60 instead of a 4800+ and I get the same reaction from my 8800 GTS 640. Ntune causes an immediate lockup. I looked for answers and found that in Nvidia's release notes, Nvidia says that AMD uses CPU coding that is incompatible with the 8800 series graphics cards. Since my other AMD machine which uses a 7800 GTX has no trouble what so ever, I figured that the problem is not the AMD chip, but that Nvidia purposely made its 8800 series so that it has problems with AMD CPUs. I'm guessing that this was done to cause trouble for AMD since they now own Nvidia's graphics card rival, ATI.

Whatever the real problem is, I found that Rivatuner works with the 8800 GTS and the AMD CPU, so I use that instead.
January 28, 2008 5:03:11 PM

The battle for Vid cards has been going on for years, how can it be over? Just because you think these two cards are the best, what happens in 4 months when something else comes out?

January 28, 2008 5:05:39 PM

In 4 months when something else comes out, the battle starts once again, with fanboys from both sides drawing their proverbial guns to flame each other.
January 28, 2008 5:10:13 PM

OK, is it worth me to upgrade to the HD3870x2 from my BFG 8800 GTX OC2?

My resolution is 1920x1200. I understand the picture quality of the HD3870 is slightly better then the 8800 line and the color representation is better then the 8800 line, which I do care about.

But is the performance worth it?
January 28, 2008 5:12:03 PM

spaztic7 said:
OK, is it worth me to upgrade to the HD3870x2 from my BFG 8800 GTX OC2?

My resolution is 1920x1200. I understand the picture quality of the HD3870 is slightly better then the 8800 line and the color representation is better then the 8800 line, which I do care about.

But is the performance worth it?


Personally? No.

You have a great card from this generation, wait until the next generation to upgrade, then decide on ATI/nV from there.
!