Liquid cooling, or freon Cooling?

[yaoiboimi]

I just saw an announcement that Thermaltake is making an affordable option that does not use water cooling but yet efficient that they said run a cpu at 38 degrees and run a freon compressor, which is said to be released in the next couple months. The representative indicated that it will not cause any condensation and the compressor is warranted for 10 years backed by the manufacture and expected to cost $200.

What are you thoughts on this, or if you got more information about this explain away. I am curious to know more about this solution, and to know if this can be better. I know personally this sounds good that I don't have to worry about changing the water, and sounds reasonably low cost saving solution.

 

[Zorg]

You are talking about phase change. It works on the same principle as an air conditioner or refrigerator. If it is implemented properly it it a lot better than water. Condensation is the big concern. It also uses more electricity and is generally noisier due to the compressor. I haven't seen the specs on the Thermaltake though. They may have some good sound insulation.

It's only really needed for extreme OCing.

 

[yaoiboimi]

It says it is freon and operates at 60 Watts of Power. If you this video it will tell you it's between 200-250.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX76JodRd1c

 

[Zorg]

I don't know what the Thermaltake spokesman is talking about, with regard to not being phase change, but here are some articles on what I believe is the same thing.

TG Daily - Thermaltake working on affordable compact phase-change cooling
Thermaltake to offer compact, affordable phase change cooling
Thermaltake phase change cooling spotted :: TweakTown

 

[yaoiboimi]

BUMP!

 

[relttem]

as nice as cooling with a compressor is (I used to work for Kryotech for those of you that are familiar with that company) you will have all kinds of headaches. Any time you cool below dew point you will have condensation. You then have to make sure everything is insulated and/or sealed from any kind of moisture. It is great to do if you are goofing off in a lab, but for a home computer it is a nightmare.

 

[phreejak]

It sounds ok but I used to get temps wayyy better than what the video is reporting with my Swiftech TEC waterblock on my CPU. Using a 226watt TEC waterblock I would get -C on idle and never above 5 degrees celsius with a heavily o'clocked CPU. I am not certain if the Thermaltake is a closed unit or not but, if you cannot incorporate it with a cooling loop that will allow you to cool your GPU and, possibly, a NB then it is going to be pretty impractical to use. That is because alot of people who aggresively o'clock their CPU tend to o'clock their GPU (and memory) as well and when you do that you also have to consider cooling the NB.

So, to cool the GPU that means you would have to add a second cooling solution to a case.

 

[rubix_1011]

Phreejak has a good point, and quite possibly a better alternative, although for more money. Yes, I am sure they have some kind of below ambient solution, but it will likely be performance touted and performance limited.

TEC coolers would be a much better alternative, with a cooling loop on them. If you have the cash, you might as well get a good phase change system like a VapoChill unit.

Regardless, any time you are cooling below ambient temps, you always will have the concern with condensation.

Phreejak, I like the idea of TEC...not quite ready to take the financial plunge.

 

[yaoiboimi]

I think Thermaltake strategy was to make an alternative option for OC's to not worry about going into those Ambient temperatures and and hence they claim it will not produce any condensation, and from that video they were saying that this system will fit in (4) 5.25" bays, and be very quiet in operation. A lot of those phase change units are exterior to the case and also relatively loud and inefficient on power consumption (Go Green).

If you were thinking about it for the average person who wants mild OC and create minimal risks. I think this is a fairy good option.

 

[rubix_1011]

Sooo...not going below ambient temps, you can do the same thing with watercooling.

 

[yaoiboimi]

I think the idea is that water-cooling as a solution still requires the maintenance requirement of changing the water, and may appeal to people wanting the same qualities of water cooling but not requiring the regular maintence that you would need. So freon may appeal to more people based upon that once you got it in, your set, and that it is covered by a 10 year warranty and there is a compressor vs a pump that could fail.

 

[rubix_1011]

I'm not trying to argue with you, but compressors fail, also. Changing the water is a once-a-year task...maybe twice depending on hours it is run.

I think if you are trying to make the point that watercooling is a hassle to maintain, then you initially have set it up wrong.

 

[yaoiboimi]

How often do you have to change the water if the computer is on 24/7 unless freak of nature power outage.

 

[rubix_1011]

If you get good additive, they suggest every 6-9 months. Really, if you use distilled water like is suggested, and mix the additive as you should, 1 year, you should be fine with the recommended changing. I would think you would be better off running it than leaving it off most of the time and give the water a change to stagnate and grow crawlies. But, the reverse argument is that the warmth of the fluid will also do the same. Hence, the reason for good additive.

 

[phreejak]

I have been using PCI-ICE as my coolant for about the last 6 years and I have been changing it once a year. I began using Hydrix - Swiftech's coolant - because I had bought one of their kits when I first started out in liquid cooling.

 

[csiguy]

Before the days of 5.1/7.1 when I worked as an electronic technician, some of the high-end esoteric power amplifiers used a closed heatpipe freon cooling system.
Basically the same sort of construction as the various Scythe and Thermalright and Thermaltake heatpipe coolers, but the heatpipe was a closed loop that was angled from the component heat contact plate (thermally connected to the amplifier's output transistors) to the upper cooling fins. Heat caused vaporization from the lower tube area, condensation in the upper tube area caused cooling. There was virtually no moisture build-up issues with this system (otherwise your power amp would have fried...). And the more you turned up the volume, the cooler the outputs ran.
With the popularity of HTPC's and home servers, I'm still waiting for the CPU heatsink manufacturers to get a clue and release this technology. It is totally passive, totally safe, noiseless, and will cool better than almost any other method currently in use, including pumped liquid. Moisture won't be an issue because there is no reason to make the cooler so large that it cools below ambient, plus computers have fans in them from sources such as the power supply, so this will draw sufficient air out of the unit to prevent moisture.

 

[yaoiboimi]

Added a picture of the demo.