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Vista SP1 - 4Gb RAM

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March 21, 2008 9:58:24 AM

Good day all... just to let everyone know... the 3Gb limit with Vista 32 bit is no longer a problem. SP1 allows the system to see and use up to the full 4Gb it was designed to use. I upgraded earlier today on my laptop and have access to all four lovely Gigs of RAM on the system... Desktop will be next!!!!

I dediced to update now because I upgraded the laptop's HD and figured while I was at it I would re-install everything instead of just transfer the data stright across. Figured since I was doing that, why not go all the way and do everything. Figured if nothing else should save me the update hassle after a reformat... it definately did that... was so nice!

They do suggest waiting until Windows Update tells you to update... but you can do it now if you want to. I didn't keep the link I am afraid... but can search microsoft easy enough.

It's a good day for 4 Gb systems everywhere... hehehehe!

More about : vista sp1 4gb ram

March 21, 2008 11:02:50 AM

Don't mean to burst your bubble but vista only sees the 4 gigs you have installed. you still will only have 3-3.5 gigs available to use. Check task manager under the performance tab and i bet you will only see 3000-3500MBs to use
March 21, 2008 11:17:13 AM

If they can get it to run with 8gigs... then i may switch back to a 32bit OS.
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March 21, 2008 11:18:56 AM

LOL. It's funny to see how many people MS' is fool'n with the 4GB on display.
March 21, 2008 11:19:58 AM

hehe the good old 4gb windows 32bit fiasco...
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 11:49:18 AM

This is a Display Change ONLY

The 32 bit limit still exists.
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 12:01:57 PM

They changed Vista to display the full amount of RAM you have plugged in, instead of the amount of RAM that is actually available for use. It's one of Microsoft's little changes that keeps people who don't understand what they are doing from emailing and calling tech support for a "problem" that they don't have.
March 21, 2008 12:31:56 PM

You know I've been wondering...

MS changed it because people were whining and complaining about not seeing the full four gig in windows...

I wonder how much more of a whinefest it will be once folks realize they still aren't using 4 gigs.
March 21, 2008 12:34:30 PM

yea when i installed SP1 i was excited for a total of 3 minutes... then i checked task manager and realized that it was just a trick... jerks
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 12:36:49 PM

jitpublisher said:
They changed Vista to display the full amount of RAM you have plugged in, instead of the amount of RAM that is actually available for use. It's one of Microsoft's little changes that keeps people who don't understand what they are doing from emailing and calling tech support for a "problem" that they don't have.



Quoted for Truth


vangvace said:

I wonder how much more of a whinefest it will be once folks realize they still aren't using 4 gigs.



The answer to this is 'Pi' {Irrational and Infinite}
March 21, 2008 1:40:47 PM

vangvace said:


I wonder how much more of a whinefest it will be once folks realize they still aren't using 4 gigs.


when it rains in hell, thats when they realize.
March 21, 2008 1:56:00 PM

cereal killer said:
Don't mean to burst your bubble but vista only sees the 4 gigs you have installed. you still will only have 3-3.5 gigs available to use. Check task manager under the performance tab and i bet you will only see 3000-3500MBs to use

Agreed.
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 2:10:15 PM

It's just a display change .... MS does a lotta things to make you feel better about it..... the proverbial smoke and mirrors.....it now correctly reports what you have but still doesn't actually use it.

Also watch out for lost nVidia drivers...One Vista blog user wrote:

“In retrospect, not my finest decision,” said SeppDietrich. “What a disaster! It exiled all of my Nvidia drivers to the Bermuda Triangle... they're simply all GONE.”

Also lot of hardware / software specific issues for which Vista SP1 won't install:

http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=948343

Including presence of products by:

Realtek AC'97
SigmaTel
SigmaTel
Creative Audigy
AuthenTec Fingerprint Sensor
UPEK Fingerprint Sensor
Intel Display Drivers
Texas Instruments Smart Card Controller
Sierra Wireless AirCard 580
Symantec software driver for Symantec Endpoint Protection and for Symantec Network Access Control clients
Bit Defender
Zone Labs
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 3:18:44 PM

The questions of 3 vs 4 Gigs Ram in a 32 bit operating system is well documented as to the reason only 3.2 +/- 0.4 is available for program use ( 3.12, or less for Vista 32) on this forum and looking at Microsoft explanation. A real good insight can be gained by reading Dan’s Data www.dansdata.com/askdan00015.htm

However; I still have a question. This relates to the OLD days when 640K was normal and some had a whopping 1 Meg of memory (16 Bit OP). The 384 K above the 640 was called Upper memory. In my case I used a Program called QEMM to access this area.. This added 384K allowed a big performance boost to DOS as the memory mapping could be addressed from faster memory verses a call to BIOS.

Now for the real question that should be asked/addressed IS – where does this memory mapping reside in a system with less than 4 gigs. Is it still a BIOS call, or does XP/Vista 32 bit place this memory Map in virtual memory and if so is there a small performance boast by having it in “Real” main memory.

Note even with 3 Gigs of RAM there is still 536K reserved for DOS.
(3 Gigs equal 3,145,738 vs 3,145,192 available)

If someone has gone from 3 -> 4 Gigs, and compared the performance using a CPU/Memory benchmark, please elaborate.
March 21, 2008 3:52:23 PM

for people who don't already know about the difference between USING and DISPLAYING 4GB of ram, that's fine with me. if by seeing 4GB displayed in windows makes them happy, than so be it.

maybe this will stop all those complaint threads about "how come windows isn't seeing all 4gb of my ram?" which i'm soooo sick of seeing everyday...

ignorance is bliss....
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 5:06:57 PM

pinaplex
I agree about the main question - loss of some memory do to memory mapping of MMIO.

BUT; the real question, IS this of any performance benifit by mapping this to RAM. I do not know, and in none of the comments has this been mention, only the explaination of WHY the memory has is decreased.
March 21, 2008 5:33:25 PM

Before and After vista sp1, the 64 bit version has had virtually no compatibility issues. What are people doing that can't be done in 64 bit? Using the same key you should be able to install 64 bit or 32 bit on your system. (can't say for sure thats the same with OEM supplier copies, but it works with Retail and MSDN Volume keys of ultimate, business, home premium and enterprise)
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 6:26:49 PM

Some I can quickly think of:

Quickbooks
iPhone
Adobe CS2 anything
AutoCAD 2007 and older

http://search.yahoo.com/search?ei=UTF-8&fr=moz2&p=Vista...

here's a list of things that work....it tells you if it's 32 or both 32 / 64 compatible.....lotta stuff is 32 bit only.
http://vistacompatible.blogspot.com/2007/04/windows-vis...

Also the HCL has 192 pages of stuff but a good % is unknown or other comments on 64 bit

http://winqual.microsoft.com/HCL/ProductList.aspx?m=v&g...
March 21, 2008 7:36:14 PM

JackNaylorPE said:
Some I can quickly think of:

Quickbooks
iPhone
Adobe CS2 anything
AutoCAD 2007 and older

http://search.yahoo.com/search?ei=UTF-8&fr=moz2&p=Vista...

here's a list of things that work....it tells you if it's 32 or both 32 / 64 compatible.....lotta stuff is 32 bit only.
http://vistacompatible.blogspot.com/2007/04/windows-vis...

Also the HCL has 192 pages of stuff but a good % is unknown or other comments on 64 bit

http://winqual.microsoft.com/HCL/ProductList.aspx?m=v&g...


The second link says CS2 works in x64 :lol:  Sorry I found it funny.

Third link real quick breakdown:
194 pages total now

176 pages Certified for x64
7 pages Compatible with x64
1 page Works with x64
12 pages unknown

and it that unknown also includes things like dell keyboards and stereo equipment. Seriously though keyboards??? I didn't even think about it when I moved to 64 bit and my keyboard is from '99 and has media keys. Come to think of it I didn't check my mouse for Vista64 certification either and it's just as old :lol: 
with stuff like that the 6.2% unknown doesn't seem too bad at all.

Can't say nothing about quickbook, iphone, or autocad though...
March 21, 2008 7:38:48 PM

The 1 % of people who pay for these products and use them for work related reasons will have the latest versions. Autocad 08 has a 64 bit edition, and adobe CS3 works great on vista 64, its just not certified for it.

The iPhone issue was fixed with itunes 7.6.

Most minor incomatibilities are with less than spectacular 3rd party apps like firewalls and antiviruses. We don't see these sorts of incompatibilities show up for home users and gamers. Our shop not once has had problems with installing vista 64 bit on any system. Its all F.U.D.
March 21, 2008 8:03:54 PM

^^^agreed

other than some VPN connection software (cisco vpn, and sonicwall vpn) i can run everything that i ran in 32bit in vista x64. Vista 64 is a very good OS for home use, IMO.
March 21, 2008 8:32:55 PM

I have both 32 and 64-bit Vista on separate machines and installed SP1 this week via manual download. Did anybody else notice that Vista 32-bit SP1 was ~434MB and Vista 64-bit SP1 was ~726MB? I wonder why the service pack for 64-bit is nearly 2 times bigger.

Also, I recently discovered that we won't be able to slipstream SP1 to our Vista DVD's for some reason. That really sucks.
a b } Memory
March 21, 2008 9:03:28 PM

It's not FUD when Ballmer claims compatibility with 30,000 programs whenever Linux or Mac is brought up and then SP1 advertises that it is now works with 2,000. I'm not saying 2,000 is bad within a year of release but ya can't have it both ways.

Quote:
Autocad 08 has a 64 bit edition, and adobe CS3 works great on vista 64


I have the AutoCAD 2008 version....the new 2009 version will arrive here next month. I share drawings with at least 3 dozen architects and consultants....so far one other has 2008. At $595 a pop per year, not many people upgrade often. I ahve to save about half my drawings as AutoCAD 2004 format before exchanging with others....about 40% more I have t go back to 2000.

Quote:
Most minor incompatibilities are with less than spectacular 3rd party apps like firewalls and antiviruses.


I wouldn't call industry dominators like Bit Defender and ZoneLabs "less than spectacular 3rd party apps".

639 apps are certified compatible.
1765 have earned the 'works with (to some extent) logo

But those number shave to be taken with several grains ...er pounds of salt.

For example...there's:

3 copies of Acronis True Image Home on the list as it's sold under different companies
9 copies of AI on the list
6 copies of Better Homes and Gardens
6 copies of check designer
8 copies of CiF
52 copies of Clinet
5 copies of Corel Paint Shop Pro
6 copies of Delorme Street Atlas
5 Encyclopedia Britannicas
24 Lexware's
24 MYOB's
Up to 8 copies of all the Paragon stiuf like HD Manager, Disk Copy, Disk Backup, Partiton Manager etc
8 Presto Mr. Photos
20 Presto Teaches Stuff titles
12 Quickbooks

Ok I got tired....But some cases it's a basic program with various add-ons, others it's different language versions, some it's like version 3.01, 3.02, 3.03, 3.04 ...or its regular, Deluxe, pro, Enterprise, Site License versions of the same thing....so all in all, it's probably around 1,500 - 2,000 apps if you bump all the doubles. It also includes OS components like MS Net which is weird. Again, not bad for a 14 month old OS. And that is Vista not Vista 64.

This Vista 64 list has 99 programs on it:
http://thevistaforums.com/index.php?autocom=ineo&showar...

But here's the major reason why the TH crowd may think twice before moving from XP to Vista 64

http://planethalflife.gamespy.com/View.php?view=TechCor...

Game FPS WinXPSp2 Min Max Aver
Half-Life 2: Episode 1 53 135 90.3
Counter-Strike Source 39 131 82.6

Game FPS WinXPSp2 Min Max Aver
Half-Life 2: Episode 1 42 103 75.0
Counter-Strike Source 16 102 66.5

I think the best Vista "buy" right now is Ultimate since they took a big whack off the price. Then you can get a free (or S&H costs) copy of XP and dual boot so you can sue whatever works best in any situation.

!