Low 3DMARK 06?

[Akifuddin]

System specs:
Q6600 running at stock
2GB Memory DDR2-667 (probably generic considering the computer's an HP)
Visiontek HD2600XT GDDR3 512MB
~300GB HD
Vista Home premium 32

I've played 3 games so far, Warrock, Perfect World and America's Army. People with similar systems to mine are getting 60-90 fps in america's army while I was getting 30-60 so I thought something was wrong. I decided to download tune up, ccleaner, tweakvista and perfectdisk to optimize my system. I didn't notice any performance increase so I decided to download 3dmark06. I ran it and I got 4179 3dmarks...which is pretty low compared to what most people here get. They said my system was similar to 12 other configurations and mine was pretty much the lowest with the highest being 8627. What's wrong? I'm going to be getting a new graphics card after a year and a half maybe? The vid card at the moment can handle what I need. You guys think I should drop the memory for ddr2-800 good brand-name 4gb memory or just add another some more ddr2-667 buffalo/kingston memory? I know that 32bit os won't detect it all but I don't mind. Another question I have is, even though my os won't detect all the memory, will they still be running in dual-channel mode? (for better performance)
Sorry for the wall of text, thanks everyone.

 

[Mousemonkey]

Drop Vista and run DDR800.

 

[Conumdrum]

Methinks it's because you haven't OC anything. 3DMark06 is very CPU dependant, and you have a great CPU. But it's running at stock. The comparisons on 3DMark don't show the overclocks. If you were to take that Q6600 to 3.2 or so you would get a big leap.

Look at your results again on 3DMark for the CPU score and compare to the similar CPU scores.

Better memory will help, but only if you OC it and the CPU.

Lastly, if your running okay in all your apps/games, why worry about a benchmark?

Edit: NM, just noticed it's an HP. Your OC is gonna be pretty limited if able to do it all all with a generic HP Mobo. Your only choice is to get a much better vid card, more mem will barely make a diff.

 

[Conumdrum]

And check this comparison with 3Dmark06. Look where your card sits in relation to others.....

 

[Akifuddin]

The mobo isnt a generic HP, it's an Asus Berkeley or something with the G31/G33 chipset. Here's some more info: http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01077641&cc=us&lc=en&dlc=en&product=3577457&dlc=en&lang=en From that info can someone tell me what power supplies will work? Because when I get a new vid card, I'll need a new PSU as well, the current one is 300W generic. Do you guys think I should try some kind of software overclocking? Also, I'm concerned about the video card because it is NOT running to my expectations. It's a little bit faster than my friend's AMD X2 3600+ with a integrated 6150 64-bit graphics card and 1gb ram.

 

[IndigoMoss]

I'd say your 3DMark score is about what I'd expect from your system. My heavly OC'd system with a 7900GS and a e6300 was only hitting 6,000 with my CPU at 3.4Ghz and my video card at a huge 650/1600 overclock.

Even though your board isn't generic, it's locked down with an HP bios, which means you'll have few options, especially OCing and voltage control. Your ram is most likely is made by Samsung, but it doesn't matter because you can't OC on that board anyways.

Personally, what I'd do is download ATI tool 0.27 and use the Find Max Core and Find Max Memory features to get your video card OC'd. You should see a noticeable gain, since the 2600XT is decently overclockable.

As far as new video card is concerned you'll definitely be needing a new power supply. I'm surprised they threw in such a crappy power supply with a q6600 and whatnot. I'd suggest an Earthwatts 380w. They are cheap, efficient, and will work fine with your system.

Earthwatts: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371005

 

[Matt26LFC]

Id say your Graphics card is seriously holding u back, its only 256Mb but more importantly its only got a 128 bit memory interface, 256bit is where u wanna me at upgrade to like a Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 3850 Pro 512MB GDDR3 and you'll get a much higher score

depends on wat settings there running that game at, res, detail, AA etc

wat mobo are u running? for dual channel jus put the memory sticks in the same color dimms & yeh some quailty DDR800 wud b nice, b easier to overclock too

 

[Akifuddin]

If I decide to get another 2gigs of ram, should I just get something cheap like this? http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&sku_id=0665000FS10097702&catid= Will it work with the factory sticks? Or should I get something good quality from ncix.com? To me it seems pointless since the good ram will be underclocked to match with the factory memory.

Also, I'll try ati tool after I get a new PSU to avoid overheating. Is there any good software clocking programs to overclock my q6600?

edit: my graphics card is 512mb... I got that because I run at a res of 1680 x 1050 on a samsung 216BW, (not 226bw)

 

[IndigoMoss]

Personally, I really wouldn't overclock the CPU in anything besides the bios. Software overclocking is unstable at best and at worse can really mess things up. That ram will do, but usually you can find DDR2-800 for a few dollars more, which I personally think is worth it.

On the other hand, you can't use all 4GB of ram anyways, because of your 32-bit OS. So you might as well stick with the 2GB or upgrade to 3GB.

EDIT: I'm guessing you live in Canada, so Newegg is out of the question from what I've heard.

 

[Matt26LFC]

oops lol yeh sorry mate so it is 512, but the main prob as i stated though is that the memory interface is 128bit, i went from a 128bit Geforce 8500GT to a 8800GTS (g92) 256bit and more score shot up from 3k to 12k

 

[IndigoMoss]

Matt26LFC, there's a lot more involved in performance that just the memory interface. The 8800GTS has more ROPs, SPs, higher clocks, better memory, and a better architecture.

As far as the 2600XT is concerned, the most important thing would be GDDR2 vs. GDDR3. A 2600XT with 512mb GDDR2 will be considerably slower than a 2600XT with GDDR3 or even the elusive GDDR4.

 

[Matt26LFC]

v true, however, looking at that spec, cant see wat else cud b holding him back so much. maybe hes not running x16 on the pci-e bus?

wat do u think is holding him back indigo? cant imagine its his CPU even at stock could it?

 

[IndigoMoss]

Well it's definitely his GPU, no question about it. DDR-677 will hold him back a bit too though, but for the most part it's his GPU. He's going to need a new PSU to power anything higher than what he has already got. Depending on how much he wants to spend is also a factor though.

Personally, I recommend the HD 3850, since they can be had for about $160 and an Antec Earthwatts 380w can easily power it.

 

[buzznut]

I don't find anything particularly shocking about your scores either.

It seems your pc has it's overclocking locked down for good reason, you ireally wouldn't want to push this hardware with a 300 watt power supply!

Any idea how many watts a Q6600 will pull at max overclock? My guess is too much.

If you want a quick fix to get you by for now, you might invest in ddr2 800 memory which is rock bottom right now. You can get two gigs for about 30, or about double that for 4 gigs. If you plan to eventually upgrade ps, video card etc. you'll want the fastest ram your mobo is capable of running so it will be nice to have already, don't you think?

The 1066 mHz kits are coming down in price too, that would pair with your Q6600 nicely. And your motherboard supports it.

Unfortunately, it sounds like these guys are right and if you really want to tweak your system you'll have to spring for a new motherboard down the road.

My understanding of the 32bit ram limitation is that you will run in dual channel however windows will not "see" the ram and will not utilize over 3 gig. But I am not an expert on this.

Finally, a new video card seems the best way to improve scores or performance in a very big and noticable way. But in your case, I'm not sure I would even skimp on a 380 watt ps. Money may be a concern, but you will be better prepared for future upgrades with something in the 500 watt range.

Here's a Thermaltake 500 watt for about 40 after rebate
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153052

 

[Matt26LFC]

i def agree with that, actually recommended a Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 3850 Pro 512MB GDDR3 in an earlier post, and no doubt a new PSU is in order.

as u say depends on his budget

but to b honest if hes happy with his gameplay as it is & enjoys wat hes seeing then i really wouldnt worry about a 3dmark score

 

[buzznut]

In a week the geforce 9600gt will be coming out and looks to be giving the 3850 a run for it's money but I agree, right now the 3850 looks pretty good in that price range.

 

[Matt26LFC]

thought 32bit can address up2 4gigs. which includes memory on graphics cards etc, if u have 32 bit and 4 gig of RAM installed and say 512mb graphics windows will recognise 3.5gig of ram because of the 512 on ur GFX card?

thnk thats how it works, memory mapping i think its called, think vista was meant to be able to do something with this re-mapping (not sure) but was disabled due to compatibility?

correct me if im wrong

 

[buzznut]

yep, I agree matt. If he likes what he has, why worry about 3d mark?

 

[buzznut]

It makes one wonder.. The excuse I've heard for lack of memory addressing above 3gb in xp is that when xp came out, 256 mb of ram was what was required and they didn't foresee the need for over 3gb. But that certainly isn't the case with vista, why is 32 bit vista incapable of addressing 4 gigs+?

 

[IndigoMoss]

You're correct Matt about the ram, you are able to remap the memory in XP to get utilization of 4GB of ram, but you can't in Vista, so I'd only go for 3GB ram.

As far as the PSU I suggested, watts aren't what you need to be worried about, the amps on the 12v+ rails are much more important. Just look that the Newegg reviews to see what they are running on it. It's the perfect PSU for a 3850 and it's very efficient, so you'll save some money on your power bill too.

 

[IndigoMoss]

It makes one wonder.. The excuse I've heard for lack of memory addressing above 3gb in xp is that when xp came out, 256 mb of ram was what was required and they didn't foresee the need for over 3gb. But that certainly isn't the case with vista, why is 32 bit vista incapable of addressing 4 gigs+?

It's an inherent flaw with 32-bit operating systems. Here's a great article by Tom's Hardware that just recently touched on the subject. http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/02/15/vista_workshop/ The first page will explain exactly what you want to know about the issue.

 

[Matt26LFC]

Nice article, shall give it a proper read soon

8Gig! blimey! my 1st PC had 16Mb of RAM lol and now there talking 8192Mb give it 10years and we'll all have 1Tb as the norm lol

 

[Akifuddin]

How is it possible to run 3gb in dual channel mode? Wouldn't it be better to get 4gb so that I get the advantage of dual-channel AND prepare myself for windows 7? Don't worry about the video card, I'm not gonna be getting one for a good 2 years or so. But the problem is, when I do get one, will pci-e x16 hold me back? The solution would be a new mobo but I heard it's not possible to replace the mobo in a hp comp.
Also I'm not a supercomputer genius or anything, 13 years old so I'm not exactly sure how to replace the processor, mobo etc but so far I can do the video card and ram.

Right now I'm just hoping vista sp1 will boost performance a bit.

edit: at the hp website, it says

* Dual channel memory architecture
* Four 240-pin DDR2 DIMM sockets
* Supported DIMM types:
o DDR2-800
o DDR2-667
* Non-ECC memory only, unbuffered
* Supports 2 GB DDR2 DIMMs
* Supports 8 GB on 64 bit PCs
* Supports 4 GB* on 32 bit PCs
meaning ddr2-1066 is not an option as it is not supported.

 

[Matt26LFC]

to carry on dual channel mode with 3gig think u just to buy two 512mb sticks and jus put ur 2x1gb sticks in one colour slots (blue) and both the 512's in the other (black) Jus buy DDR-667 if u dont plan to overclock

up2 u if u wanna go 4gig, dosent cost much these days

 

[IndigoMoss]

Yup exactly what Matt said, just two 512mb sticks will do the trick. You could go 4GB if you really wanted, but you won't get the full amount out of it unless you have a 64-bit OS. Either way, 2GB is fine on Vista-32bit.