A discussion about Vsync & how it affects your gaming?

Do you play your games with Vsync enabled or disabled

  • Play games with Vsync disabled

    Votes: 34 52.3%
  • Play games with Vsync enabled

    Votes: 31 47.7%

  • Total voters
    65

systemlord

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I have noticed that while playing many games on my computer most of the time its much smoother with Vsync disabled, but then you might get image tearing as a side effect. On the other side of the coin if you enable Vsync the image tearing go's away, but the game doesn't pan left to right as smoothly as it did when disabled. :pt1cable: When I played through Crysis I left Vsync disabled just to see how differently it played, let me tell you it was very smooth but had image tearing. With Vsync enabled the image tearing was gone and the gaming was looking cleaner, but it lost its smoothness.


So what is stopping us from getting the best of both worlds? The perfect world for gaming is having Vsync disabled without image tearing, so why don't Nvidia and ATI have a solution for this nagging issue? Vsync seems to affect something in the system other than simply capping your frame rates to = your refresh rate. Any insight people?
 
From what I understand, vsync doesnt just cap to your refresh rate, it works hand in hand with your monitor. As your monitor is set to x-amount of refreshes per sec, vsync aligns itself with those limatations. Ive heard that triple buffering using vsync helps tho. If the screen isnt ready, vsync holds back your card til it is, thus the delays. I cannot see a workaround for this scenario unless you use something like triple buffer
 

aziraphale

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There's also tripple buffering to be taken into acount. I don't know the details but it also helps with tearing. As for Vsync I have to use it in some games (the witcher for example), but I tent to leave it away if possible since it kills quite some fps.
 

basketcase

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I can't stand games without it. I hate screen tearing. I would rather have lower FPS than the screen ripping on me. But, to each their own :)
 
As i understand it and please correct me if i am wrong is that a card with V-Sync enabled is tied to framerates that are an integer -subdivision of the refresh rate, 60 by default i think in windows, im sure some of you are running differant ones but thats where the skipping jumping comes from. tripple buffering helps but as has been said isnt a complete fix.
The acctual problem comes about when the card cant match or beat the refresh rate of the monitor, so with this in mind it may be worth bearing in mind that there is always the option of turning the refresh rate down if you are running on most LCD monitors its 60 anyway as i understand it. Mine will refresh to 75 so in theory if i had this problem i could come down to 60.
mactronix
 

purplerat

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If you're getting stuttering with VSync try turning on triple buffering. Normally VSync locks the frame rate to some multiple of the monitor's refresh rate. Triple buffering allows for VSync at different frame rates, so you don't get the big jumps in frame rates that cause stuttering.
 
@ purplerat
Your post reads like the tripple buffering some how overrides the V-Sync.
Its not that it allows for differant frame rates its just that as it says on the tin there are now three frames in the buffer. This allows the card to keep up better as it has the extra frame to throw in which helps keep things smooth. This does have the downside of having the card work harder and dosent work with all games, some seem not to like triple buffering.
Mactronix
 

sojrner

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vertical_synchronization

short and simple...

if you tie the FPS to a refresh rate, you had better have hardware that can keep up with those frame requests. i.e. on an LCD if you have a refresh rate of 60Hz you had better be able to get minimum of 60FPS in a game. If not, then you are effectively halving that and will be "capped" at 30. You get a buffer request at each refresh, so r[1] would give you the first frame, and if r[2] happens when there is not a fully drawn frame, then it is a repeat of r[1] and you don't get a "new" frame until r[3].

so, if you are running 60Hz with a card that gets 40 Fps in a given game with vsync off, when you turn it on you effectively get 30Fps and "lose" those 10 frames. If you can get 60Fps or above in the same scenario, then vsync would just drop you to 60 and you "probably" would not notice any difference save the removal of tearing.

An oversimplification to be sure, but that is how it is "smoother" with it off and why most budget gamers (or anyone running crysis) are forced to turn it off.
 

caspian21

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V-Sync is really only an option when your hardware is more than adequate for the games you are running. Since V-Sync will cut your fps by almost half, no current machine can use v-sync effectively on Crysis. A couple years down the road, when new machines can get 120 fps on Crysis without vsynch, you will be able to turn it on and get 60 fps and get the best of both words - great fps AND no screen tearing. Try vsynch with some older games and you will notice it does nothing but improve your image quality, but only because your hardware kicks those old games in the rear.
 

sojrner

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caspian:
does not cut it in half... it "syncs" it with your monitors refresh. The only halving is if you can't meet that refresh mark for FPS... (60, 75 or whatever) then it cuts THAT number in half effectively.

You don't need 120, just need more than what your refresh is for a minimum FPS.
 

Flakes

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i hate it, i have it forced off by driver settings, ive never noticed tearing in any new games, it only really happens in the old games.
 

purplerat

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Since V-Sync will cut your fps by almost half, no current machine can use v-sync effectively on Crysis
Where the hell did you pull that from? I play Crysis with VSync and have tested without. The difference is a few FPS at the most.
 

Gravemind123

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It doesn't cut it in half, you might notice this if you get 60 with v-sync on and 120 with it off, but it is more like a cap at the refresh rate of your monitor. I get tearing on my monitor without v-sync in some games, especially stuff like HL2 and CS:S or original Halo. If I turn it on the issues go away, but my frame-rate gets capped at 75 FPS. The only time I disable v-sync is if I am benchmarking, so my system can run at full potential.
 

systemlord

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Heres where I'm coming from, when playing both Crysis and Ghost Recon Advanced Warefighter 1 & 2 while playing online and offline I seem to notice with Vsync enable its blurry/unsmooth when panning slowly left to right at the same time my FPS is pegged at 75 FPS = to my refresh rate. You see the spec's of my computer in my signature running @1280x1024 @ 75HZ on an Nec 1970GX 8ms GTG, so when I turn off Vsync playing the games listed above they run VERY smooth. Then I have to deal with image tearing, depending on the game.

I used to use a program called NVTweak 1.71 and DXTweaker where you can change this double buffer or back buffer to a Tripple Buffering (giving you two back buffers instead of just one with one primary) in Direct3D games that did give you the best of both worlds, but since I upgraded from my older 7800GTX to my 8800GTX it doesn't work on GF 8 series cards. Playing with my 7800GTX a year ago without this tripple buffering in GRAW 1 & 2 gave me around 25 to 40 FPS, however with this NVTweak 1.71 and DXTweaker running Tripple Buffering I got 45 to 75 FPS use this program.

Go here if image is unreadable, second thought go here anyway. http://www.tweakguides.com/NVFORCE_9.html

nvforce12seg4.jpg

By systemlord at 2008-02-25
 
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I can't stand screen tearing, Vsync + Triple Buffering all the way :D
 

systemlord

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Triple Buffering + Vsync hasn't been done on Direct3D yet, only in open GL games like Doom 3. The only way to truely have Triple Buffering + Vsync is using NVTweak 1.71 and DXTweaker on 7900 series cards or lower. It won't work on 8800 series cards.
 

Flakes

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? as i said before i always use vsync off, and in any new game ive never seen tearing..... old games like Quake 2 and UT do have a little tearing but not enough to be noticable, im far to envolved in the game to even notice a tear though, if they indeed do happen the only game i ever noticed them in was STALKER.
 

bmadd

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sry about this but i dislike vsync with everybit of me and i can't seem to turn it off in CoH. i know there is a no-vsync you add somewhere but i can not get it working. can someone help my pls?

 

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