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*UPDATED* Endless BSOD. I want to punch my computer! Memtest86+ run

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February 23, 2008 4:56:35 PM

I just build a new PC and am using Vista Home Premium 64. I get about 8 to 10 BSOD per day. I cant run any of the diagnostics that Microsoft provides because they aren't supported by Vista 64. ie. Windows Server 2003 Resource Kit Tools,(Specifically I wanted to use the Cdburn.exe so I could make a bootable CD to run Windows Memory Diagnostic) So I cant even trouble shoot weather or not I have bad hardware components. I curse the day I bought this POS operating system...I was sketchy about vista to begin with...and should have trusted my family member who is an IT specialist...and who has an education from Johns Hopkins. Vista 64 has been a complete and total nightmare! I cant run ANYTHING; no games not even the internet. I get BSOD when I try and run Solitaire. Unless I run it in "administrator" mode. BTW...WTF is Administrator mode? If I don't...it crashes to windows or gives me a BSOD. The only time it doesn't crash is when I let it sit there and don't even move the mouse. If I move the mouse I get a BSOD. And before you ask...I am using safe mode to write this and research how I can fix this stupid PC before having to spend hundreds to have someone else try and fix it.

To let you know what I have tried so far:

1: I have tried starting from scratch 4 times. Each time erasing the drive partition and starting over. For some unknown reason the most recent install has been more stable. I don't get the BSOD for about an hour but still, if I try and run ANYTHING it crashes.

2: ALL of my drivers are up to date. I used all of the software disks that came with all of my hardware components and then went to each website for the different components and made sure to download the latest drivers that were compatible with Vista 64. BUT I am willing to try anything so if you know something that I am missing please let me know.

3:I have checked the temperatures RIGHT after a crash...System temp is always around 40C and CPU temp is always around 25C. As per the BIOS screen. I dont know of any other way to view temps that work easily with Vista 64.

4: I have run all of the diagnostic tools that are part of the Vista Boot Disk. BUT after I ran the test the PC just restarts and gives no clue as to where the results are. and the Repair function has done nothing to help

If ANYONE with ACTUAL experience with Vista 64bit has anymore ideas I am open to hear them and try them out. I am at my wits end. I spent over $1500 on this PC and I am so angry I cant believe it.


Case: Thermaltake ArmorPlus
Power Supply: CORSAIR HX CMPSU-620HX 620W
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS4 rev. 2.1
Processor: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 G0 Stepping
Processor Cooling: Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme with a Scythe S-FLEX 120mm Case Fan, 1600RPM
Memory: 2 X Crucial Ballistix 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2-1066 (Total of 4G of RAM)
Video Card: EVGA 512-P3-N841-A3 GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB
Hard Drive: WD7500AAKS
Optical Drives: SAMSUNG SH-S203N
Operating System: MICROSOFT Windows Vista Home Premium 64bit
Keyboard: Logitech G15
Mouse: Logitech G9
February 23, 2008 5:18:32 PM

In BIOS set the memory voltage to 2.1-2.2v and the timings to 5-5-5-15. Run Memtest. That should solve your problem, but I'm curious what does the Blue screen say?
February 23, 2008 5:18:41 PM

^Agreed.Looks like a RAM issue to me. Try downloading Memtest86+ and run it for about 5+hrs and see if it reports any errors. If it dose your RAM is bad. Also try increasing RAM voltage. Those Ballastix are 2.0-2.2V or higher since you are running 4*1GB. If you list the BSOD error code we could help you better.
February 23, 2008 5:19:26 PM

Am I you?
February 23, 2008 5:23:58 PM

badge said:
In BIOS set the memory voltage to 2.1-2.2v and the timings to 5-5-5-15. Run Memtest. That should solve your problem, but I'm curious what does the Blue screen say?



I would LOVE to tell you what the blue screen said but it only flashes a blue screen and then reboots...I have no time to read it. Is there a place to find the error code or codes rather...there are about 50 of them...

I will try that Memtest86+ right now and see what happens. I am going to try testing one stick at a time...that will save time right?
February 23, 2008 5:30:18 PM

Right click on My Computer
Click on Properties
Click on Advanced
On Start Up and Recovery click 'settings'
Remove the chcek mark from 'automatically restart.

Next time you BS, write down exactly what is posted on the screen and post it. Should be an error code like 0x8000..... Your 4 DIMMS of RAM are undervolted to default 1.8v and not configured properly.
February 23, 2008 5:49:08 PM

Okay...I think I may understand a bit more now...that makes sense about the mems being undervolted. the Mobo hand book says nothing about it. and it flashes red warning messages when you change stuff in bios...lol its all so intimidating for a rookie

Also, I am having trouble with memtest. I downloaded memtest86+-2.01 and used Nero to create a data disk...I must have done something wrong because it wont boot and yes I have set the pc to boot to the cd/dvd rom in bios. hmmmmm?
February 23, 2008 6:08:43 PM

You need to burn it as an ISO image, I think there is a radio button or something. ISO Recorder v 2 for Vista will make it easy. Install it and right click on the ISO and click copy image to CD.

You may want to temporarily run one stick of RAM and see if you still have the crashes, after increasing to 2.2V of course.
February 23, 2008 7:17:18 PM

Okay, I just want to be clear as to what I am doing so I am going to spell out what I have done thus far. BTW THANK YOU FOR THE HELP!!!

I changed the Timings as follows with the Gigabyte BIOS: It will be in a was/now format...ie was=what the system set stuff to. Now= what I changed it to

Standard Timing Control
CAS Latency Time = was 5 / now 5
DRAM RAS# TO CAS# Delay = was 7 / now 5
DRAM RAS# Precharge = was 7 / now 5
Precharge delay (tRAS) = was 24 / now 15

As for the "memory voltage" I wasnt sure what the specific was to change. The only thing that even went up to 2.1 - 2.2 v was the CPU Voltage Control. What is the specific name of the memory voltage control?
Right now the CPU Voltage Control is set to 1.2000v I am not sure if that is what I should change to 2.1 - 2.2v
February 23, 2008 7:22:00 PM

Gigabyte has a specific way to eneter BIOS and set the memory voltage I believe. Check you manual for those instructions or someone who is familiar with Gigabyte boards can give you info. You did good with the timings, now you need to set the voltage to Mfg. Specs for the RAM, 2.1-2.2v.
February 23, 2008 7:58:47 PM

The setting in the mobo is +.x It is added to the base of 1.8V. So 2.1V would be +.3 and 2.2V would be +.4 e.g., 1.8 + .3 = 2.1 etc. By the way, I don't believe that tightening the timings will eliminated BSODs. The loose timings which are set by the mobo by default would throw fewer errors. that's why they are set loose by default. You need to remove all but one stick with the timings set at or looser than the SPD of the RAM and then run memtest86+. Do each stick in succession until you find a bad stick, or not. Again after raising the voltage to spec., although that RAM should run at 1.8V at the stock speed.
February 23, 2008 8:13:30 PM

With Superfetch behind my 8 Gigs of PC28000, the RAM won't run at 1.8v. 2.1v set at 5-5-5-15 @ 1066 mhz. with VISTA 64 works very well. Those figures are Mfg. specs. I th8nk with XP 32 bit OS a lot of installed RAM is just sitting there pretty much 'dead'. With VISTA 64 and Superfetch, the function of system RAM is 'enhanced' to the user.
February 23, 2008 8:18:53 PM

Are we talking about getting a stable base line running for bugspin23, or Superfetch and the ultimate timings he is going to use?
February 23, 2008 8:26:49 PM

Mfg. specs say PC8500 needs 2.2v to run as advertised. I think with four DIMMS OP will have to set the RAM up to Mfg. specs. Although the DIMMS are PC6400 guaranteed to run at 1066 mhz., 2.2v @5-5-5-15 is where they want to be to perform properly.

http://www.crucial.com/uk/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid...
February 23, 2008 8:29:09 PM

I doubt Op can run without errors at anything less than 5 CAS. Maybe not even boot. Most PC8500 will not run or even boot at 4 CAS.
February 23, 2008 8:47:50 PM

As I said earlier, he should run one stick at 2.2V at the RAM SPD timings or looser, and see if the machine crashes. Additionally, he should run Memtest86+ as outlined above. Any more advice at this point is counter productive.

@OP if you don't know what the SPD timings are, they can be viewed on the SPD tab of CPU-Z.

It appears that you are running at stock. You may want to force the RAM to run at 533Mhz, by changing the multiplier in the MIT to "2". That will force the RAM to run at 533MHz temporarily for stability testing.
February 23, 2008 8:53:02 PM

If OP can find the switch to set one DIMM to 2.2 John's Hopkins may revolutionize their research and development facilities and become more productive.
February 23, 2008 8:59:29 PM

What?
February 23, 2008 9:01:56 PM

OP's system crashes because His PC28500 defaulted to 1.8v 5-7-8-24.
February 23, 2008 9:04:19 PM

That's why I said that he needs to look at the SPD tab in CPU-Z.

What were you saying in this post?
badge said:
If OP can find the switch to set one DIMM to 2.2 John's Hopkins may revolutionize their research and development facilities and become more productive.
February 23, 2008 10:55:19 PM

Hee hee Okay every thing was set to the way that you both recomended. I still cant get the memtest program to start up on a disk...I know Im probably doing something wrong so I will go over the user guide provided again. However, I did somewhat of a stress test of just trying to play Enemy Territory: Quake Wars at all High Settings online and I was good for about 10 mins and then got another BSOD...BUT, I made the adjustments as reccomended so i could write down everything on the screen. They are as follows:

At the very top it said

Memory_Management

then the error code was:

Stop: 0X0000001A
(0X0000000000041201, 0XFFFFF680000023D0, 0XF8C00000C5056867, 0XFFFFFA8006F9A470)
February 23, 2008 11:26:31 PM

This is for 2000 but I'll bet they are all similar How to Troubleshoot a STOP 0x0000001A MEMORY_MANAGEMENT Error Message. Unfortunately it doesn't really help you isolate the cause. I got 3,120 hits so I suggest you do some Googling.

You really need to run Memtest86+ to try to rule out bad RAM. Check my earlier post about specifying that you are burning an ISO or use ISO Recorder. Additionally, lower your RAM speed to 533. It is done by setting the memory multi to 2 and the base FSB clock to stock which should be 266. That will be running the RAM super slow. You can test all of the sticks at first to see that you get errors, then test each stick one at a time. If they are all good then raise the speed to 3 which should result in DDR2 800 speeds and test again. badge probably mentioned it already but you may need to raise the northbridge voltage a little with 4 sticks. After you determine that the RAM is good you might try checking for stability with 2 sticks before running all 4 sticks. That will confirm that you are having problems related to running 4 sticks.
February 23, 2008 11:35:39 PM

Your timings are correct for that speed. You can run memtest86+ at that speed to check for stability. You may want to lower it and try to boot to Vista to check for stability, as I said earlier. Set it at 2 in MIT and you will be running 1:1 instead of 1:2. Auto probably sets it at 4. The numbers in MIT are the apparent speeds i.e., currently 1066 even though CPU-Z shows the actual frequency of 533.
February 23, 2008 11:56:32 PM

There is no inherent problem with Vista-64 from my point of view. Your system is very much like mine.

This seems like a memory problem so getting memtest to run would seem essential. Until you get memtest going, try running with only two sticks of memory, or possibly even one. If it runs properly, you probably have a bad stick in the other pair. If it fails, see if the remaining sticks work. For testing, leave the voltages alone. The default should run properly.
Increasing the voltages is needed to get you better timings.

Vista keeps a log of events. Go to control-panel/administrative tools/computer management/system tools/event viewer/error There you might get some indication of the problem.





February 24, 2008 12:33:05 AM

Unfortunately, the Gigabyte mobos will default to the speed that is read off of the SPD, which is 1066. That would require the voltage increase to 2.2V. You can check his screen shots of CPU-Z to confirm that he is indeed running at 1066. That's why I said he should lower the multiplier for stability testing purposes.

I have seen posts that indicate that Vista is indeed more sensitive than XP. Specifically, posts where they were able to run XP with no problems but Vista (dual boot) would crash.
February 24, 2008 1:24:27 AM

Zorg said:
Unfortunately, the Gigabyte mobos will default to the speed that is read off of the SPD, which is 1066. That would require the voltage increase to 2.2V. You can check his screen shots of CPU-Z to confirm that he is indeed running at 1066. That's why I said he should lower the multiplier for stability testing purposes.

I have seen posts that indicate that Vista is indeed more sensitive than XP. Specifically, posts where they were able to run XP with no problems but Vista (dual boot) would crash
.

Another reason why we should save XP!
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/forum2.php?config=tom...
;) 
February 24, 2008 1:28:29 AM

I read something on that recently. Apparently MS still has no comment. It has to be bothering them though. :lol: 
February 24, 2008 7:31:51 PM

Well, I am starting to get frustrated with myself now...I cant get memtest to work...I have created a CD with an ISO image of memtest and when I restart and the screen says..."Boot from CD ROM...it just bypasses it and goes right to windows. I have tried pressing a multitude of keys and still nothing...I tested weather my keyboard was working by putting in the vista boot disk and it works...so I am obviously doing something wrong. I am very mechanically inclined...but when it comes to the software side of the house I know I have a weakness...but I am still trying and will keep at this till I figure it out...

I WAS able to run the provided memory testing tool provided by vista but that only took like 10 mins and it said there weren't any hardware issues and I tested all four sticks, one stick at a time and then combinations of two sicks (rotated with a different stick and then three sticks rotated with different sticks), so either the memory is fine or the vista test is lacking as I am still crashing when I run my more intensive games. Supreme Commander seems to work however...I get the crashes when I play quake wars and Crysis. I will stay vigilant!

I have included a pic of what is saved on the disk...so you can tell me if it is what is supposed to be there.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24073609@N04/2288855987/
February 24, 2008 7:49:36 PM

^Vista RAM testing is just BS. Try Running Memtest86+ from this:
UBCD
February 24, 2008 8:11:19 PM

Quote:
I have included a pic of what is saved on the disk...so you can tell me if it is what is supposed to be there.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24073609@N04/2288855987/

no, you're doing it wrong. When burning the .iso image you should select 'burn cd image' or something in the burning software, and select the image to be burned. The software will then unpack the image and burn its contents to the cd. The end result should contain multiple files.
February 25, 2008 5:31:12 AM

What you are doing is actually burning the ISO file itself, what you want to do is burn an ISO image. Try installing ISO Recorder v 2. Then right click on the ISO file and click on copy to disk. It will burn the image properly. Also instead of memtest86+, download and burn the Ultimate Boot CD like Shadow703793 said. It has memtest86+ and a bunch of other useful utilities for later use.
February 25, 2008 2:53:30 PM

Okay, I was able to get the Ultimate Boot CD burnt to my disk. I put all for sticks in and ran the test over night. When I started the test within about 30 seconds I had several errors. After leaving the program to run over night it made 11 passes. Most of the passes had errors but some didn't... the average number of errors was about 180 something. the first pass had 187 errors...lol I was like, "yeah...Im going to kill you"...lol Anyway, this morning I ran the test again with only one stick at a time. I got errors on all four sticks separately within seconds. Does this mean that ALL four sticks of memory are bad and need to be replaced? or Is there something specific I need to look at to determine weather or not the memory is actually bad. I am going to try running the tests again with the separate sticks in different slots on the motherboard...maybe that will return different results?
February 25, 2008 3:15:41 PM

Quote:
I got errors on all four sticks separately within seconds. Does this mean that ALL four sticks of memory are bad and need to be replaced?


Yes.
February 25, 2008 3:58:46 PM

Did you increase the memory voltage allready? set it to 2.1 or 2.2V (+0.3 or +0.4) and run memtest again. It looks like low voltage problem because theres so damn small chance to get 4 bad sticks that I dont believe it to be the case
February 25, 2008 4:20:51 PM

As weird as it sounds, Memtest is telling you that all 4 sticks of your memory are bad. Either that or your motherboard's dimm slots are defective.
February 25, 2008 5:24:33 PM

Kari said:
Did you increase the memory voltage allready? set it to 2.1 or 2.2V (+0.3 or +0.4) and run memtest again. It looks like low voltage problem because theres so damn small chance to get 4 bad sticks that I dont believe it to be the case



Yes, I change the voltate to 2.1 and I also tried it at 2.2 and ran the test under both voltages. Could it be possible that my mother board is bad???

Are there any tests for the MOBO?
February 25, 2008 5:29:18 PM

Agreed, the chances of 4 sticks being bad at once is very small, but not out of the question. It's either the RAM or the mobo. Or maybe they don't play well together. Here's where another PC comes in handy. First, if you can, swap the memory to a different PC and run memtest. One stick should give you the answer. Then borrow a stick from that one and run it on your mobo and see the results. As I said earlier you could lower the speed of the RAM in MIT as well to see if it runs at 800,667 or even 533. That won't really point the finger at the culprit though.
February 25, 2008 5:43:09 PM

My gigabyte requires you to hit CTrl + F1 when in Bios to open up an extra
page of settings where you can set 'over voltage' to +0.3 or +0.4 for memory. Have you actually changed your voltage setting yet? Use 'Everest' (free download) that will show your 'actual' memory voltage.
February 25, 2008 6:05:34 PM

What Gigabyte mobo do you have? my DQ6 has the voltage settings on the main MIT page and CTRL + F1 is only to add timings.
February 25, 2008 6:08:27 PM

Try running the hotfix from Microsoft for users with more then 3 gigs of ram. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929777 I just installed vista 64bit ult this weekend and haven't had any problems so far. Goodluck either way.
February 25, 2008 6:27:58 PM

It could be memory or it could be memory settings or it could be memory/motherboard compatibility, or it could be the motherboard itself - since all four sticks are testing bad defective memory is probably LAST on that list.

A defective motherboard is not going to pass memtest, or a defective CPU for that matter, so it does not have to be a memory problem exactly that makes memtest fail!

The first thing to try is settings (mem voltage, memory timings - according to mfg. spec., and be sure all else is set to defaults)

if that fails try a differnt brand/model of memory

if that fails try a different MOBO

- or you could also memtest the RAM on a different MOBO
February 25, 2008 6:47:11 PM

Memory speed and timings are correct. It could be a bad CPU, though not out of the question it is very unlikely. It's either bad RAM also unlikely on four sticks, but not out of the question. The mobo and RAM don't play well or a bad mobo are the most likely suspects.

UBCD/ memtest86+ are not affected by the MS hotfix, additionally the ram was tested one stick at a time.

As I said swap the RAM between two machines and test. If you have to, get a couple of sticks of different RAM. If that doesn't work swap the mobo.
February 25, 2008 7:05:39 PM

^Agreed. You can borrow some RAM from another system and test it on the PC with problems. Also see if there are any loose connections,etc and that the RAM is seated properly.
February 25, 2008 7:13:52 PM

When running 4 sticks, you may need to increase the FSB voltage By +0.1.

I bought 2 pairs of corsair CL4 PC6400. Each pair testest fine, BUT when 4 sticks were installed I got Errors with Memtest. Increased MCH and FSB voltage By Plus 0.1 and it worked Don't think it was the MCH, but left it). Have 965DQ6 board. I think 4 sticks loads the signal just a little.
February 25, 2008 7:17:20 PM

Had the exact same problems as you with that mobo but my RAM was the OCZ platinum. Try running your machine on one stick for a while and see if that cures it.
I cured my problems after upping my RAM voltage to 2.1v (after an insightful suggestion by roadrunner here).
!