AMD 5000+ BE vs. Intel C2D E4500

[rspaulding]

I am building a budget rig and I am looking at two very overclockable processors:

AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ Brisbane 2.6GHz:
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?item=N82E16819103194

Intel Core 2 Duo E4500 Allendale 2.2GHz:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115031

I would like to OC to around 3ghz, but I am getting mixed opinions on which of the two I should go with.
What do you think?

 

[trencin]

the brisbane does not come wih a HFS so u would need to buy one and im sure u would buy one anywayz. i would go with Brisbane but allendale is a better performer and both can be OC'd to 3 GHZ no problem.

 

[zenmaster]

The E4500 is quite a bit more.

The E2160/E2180 would be much cheaper and still be able to outperform the X2 5000+ at the same clock speeds.

 

[pat]

budget rig means lower cost. At this point, the AMD780g chipset is the best integrated solution. I would go with the 5000+ and a motherboard with the 780g chipset. Check out Biostar, Gigabyte or even the ECS 780-M.

This will let you more room for more RAM and bigger HDD.

 

[epsilon84]

The E4500 would be about 25 - 30% faster than the X2 5000+ BE when both are clocked at 3GHz.

 

[rspaulding]

The E4500 would be about 25 - 30% faster than the X2 5000+ BE when both are clocked at 3GHz.

How so?

 

[zenmaster]

The Intel Chips do far more work Clock for Clock than the AMD Chips.
Even the Cheaper E2xxx Series which have even less cache are much faster.

 

[zenmaster]

budget rig means lower cost. At this point, the AMD780g chipset is the best integrated solution. I would go with the 5000+ and a motherboard with the 780g chipset. Check out Biostar, Gigabyte or even the ECS 780-M.

This will let you more room for more RAM and bigger HDD.

Having the "Best Integrated Solution" is mostly irrelevent at this point for most users since it's still not good enough to replace a dedicated graphics card if one is needed or desired while if one is not needed or desired other integrated solutions work just fine.

Even at minimal graphics settings as relatively small resolutions, it could not come close to usability with the tested games which are not even the roughest.

http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/03/04/amd_780g_chipset/page11.html

 

[pat]

Having the "Best Integrated Solution" is mostly irrelevent at this point for most users since it's still not good enough to replace a dedicated graphics card if one is needed or desired while if one is not needed or desired other integrated solutions work just fine.

Even at minimal graphics settings as relatively small resolutions, it could not come close to usability with the tested games which are not even the roughest.

http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/03/04/amd_780g_chipset/page11.html

Depend of the purpose. For business, internet, video or movie watching, it is more than enough. As for game, I agree, but at the price the current 780 motherboard are, onboard is more like a bonus.

 

[pat]

The E4500 would be about 25 - 30% faster than the X2 5000+ BE when both are clocked at 3GHz.

it is costing more too. because the BE don't need expensive cooling to OC. a simple 10$ cooler should suffice with good vented case. And in this case, the Intel will still cost 25-30% more than the BE.

That 25$ will be better spend on more RAM. Even a budget PC will benefit from more ram.

 

[zenmaster]

Depend of the purpose. For business, internet, video or movie watching, it is more than enough. As for game, I agree, but at the price the current 780 motherboard are, onboard is more like a bonus.

I think it's a great board, but it will have a more targeted audience than many here will see.

If you toss that into the average reatail system it will be a big setup up.
Then toss in the fact you could toss in a cheap/low power/relatively cool GPU into the system and make older games run OK is nice.

It's also a nice board for "Low Power Systems" that you want cool and quiet due to the low powe usage.
Toss in a real low power AMD chip and it will be good to go.

 

[zenmaster]

it is costing more too. because the BE don't need expensive cooling to OC. a simple 10$ cooler should suffice with good vented case. And in this case, the Intel will still cost 25-30% more than the BE.

That 25$ will be better spend on more RAM. Even a budget PC will benefit from more ram.

Or you could buy the E2160 which is Cheaper, Faster, and even comes with a Cooler that will run the chip at about 3.2Ghz.

 

[pat]

Or you could buy the E2160 which is Cheaper, Faster, and even comes with a Cooler that will run the chip at about 3.2Ghz.

That could be an option, but it will take a better board for FSB OC. The BE OC simply by upping the multiplier, so it is easier.

 

[epsilon84]

it is costing more too. because the BE don't need expensive cooling to OC. a simple 10$ cooler should suffice with good vented case. And in this case, the Intel will still cost 25-30% more than the BE.

That 25$ will be better spend on more RAM. Even a budget PC will benefit from more ram.

The E4500 doesn't require 'expensive cooling' to OC either, it actually runs cooler than the X2 5000+ BE. My E4400 does 3.33GHz on the stock HSF, and guess what, its FREE.

RAM is so cheap nowadays I doubt the OP is getting less than the standard 2GB kit, so your argument is moot unless you are suggesting the OP get 4GB of RAM for a budget build.

 

[Craxbax]

This board with a 2160 ($69) would OC just fine and give him better upgrade options in a quad at a later date.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128059

 

[sailer]

I'll toss my 2 cents in and give favor to the 5000+ BE. I do have a Intel in my other computer and its been a bit more of a problem then my AMD machine. Just my personal experience.

For now, though, I'm waiting for the new Yorkies to hit the market so I can build a new gaming machine.

 

[epsilon84]

That could be an option, but it will take a better board for FSB OC. The BE OC simply by upping the multiplier, so it is easier.

The E21x0 chips are stock 800FSB (as are the E4x00 chips). This means you don't need a high end mobo to get decent overclocks, an E2160 at 3GHz will be running at 1333FSB, which is the standard FSB speed for the higher end C2Ds anyway. Now clearly you don't need a high end mobo to run a stock 1333FSB C2D... for the same reason you also don't need a high end mobo to run a 800FSB E21x0 or E4x00 chip @ 1333FSB.

 

[pat]

so you only need more expensive memory

 

[pat]

The E4500 doesn't require 'expensive cooling' to OC either, it actually runs cooler than the X2 5000+ BE. My E4400 does 3.33GHz on the stock HSF, and guess what, its FREE.

RAM is so cheap nowadays I doubt the OP is getting less than the standard 2GB kit, so your argument is moot unless you are suggesting the OP get 4GB of RAM for a budget build.

That's the point. I put 4 gigs with Vista now. I mostly built budget machine. And for the difference that cpu gives in budget machine, I always favor RAM and HDD space than CPU.

And to be honest, in all of my build, based on Intel or AMD, the only difference in speed that could be noticed on a day to day basis come from more ram, or faster hdd than a few hundred of MHz.

 

[epsilon84]

so you only need more expensive memory

No you don't, a 1333FSB only needs DDR2-667 when using the 1:1 ratio.

Mate, admit it, you've clearly never overclocked a C2D before, have you? :lol:

I wonder what excuse you're gonna come up with next, I think you're running out man... mobo/FSB/RAM all mythbusted.

 

[epsilon84]

That's the point. I put 4 gigs with Vista now. I mostly built budget machine. And for the difference that cpu gives in budget machine, I always favor RAM and HDD space than CPU.

And to be honest, in all of my build, based on Intel or AMD, the only difference in speed that could be noticed on a day to day basis come from more ram, or faster hdd than a few hundred of MHz.

And who says you can't put 4GB of RAM in an Intel build?

You've actually built Intel machines? You seem to be pretty clueless about the overclocking aspect of them, to say the least. :lol:

The bottom line is that an X2 5000+ BE plus HSF ends up costing the same as an E4500, for far less performance once overclocked. Whether you 'notice' the difference will depend on how CPU intensive the task is.

 

[pat]

No you don't, a 1333FSB only needs DDR2-667 when using the 1:1 ratio.

Mate, admit it, you've clearly never overclocked a C2D before, have you? :lol:

I wonder what excuse you're gonna come up with next, I think you're running out man... mobo/FSB/RAM all mythbusted.

No, I've never since the first core2. Most of my customers simply want cheap functional PC, so I go with the price and I have myself an AMD system that I've stopped OCed it since my socket 939 3000+...

 

[pat]

And who says you can't put 4GB of RAM in an Intel build?

You've actually built Intel machines? You seem to be pretty clueless about the overclocking aspect of them, to say the least. :lol:

The bottom line is that an X2 5000+ BE plus HSF ends up costing the same as an E4500, for far less performance once overclocked. Whether you 'notice' the difference will depend on how CPU intensive the task is.

I build Intel.. I build AMD.. All of them running stock because that what my customers want. I go with price. Sometime, for budget, Intel come first, other time, it is AMD. I don't use the BE in my customer's built. They dont care. They all are happy with their computer and I still have to have one computer fail.

 

[zenmaster]

That's the point. I put 4 gigs with Vista now. I mostly built budget machine. And for the difference that cpu gives in budget machine, I always favor RAM and HDD space than CPU.

And to be honest, in all of my build, based on Intel or AMD, the only difference in speed that could be noticed on a day to day basis come from more ram, or faster hdd than a few hundred of MHz.

Why would anyone buy a Custom Built Entry Level Box configured to run at plain stock?
You could save a ton of money by simply getting a DELL.

Even if I were to buy all of the parts myself including OS/Keyboard/Etc, I likely could not beat Dell's price even if I exclude OS. Toss in the need to Buy the OS and mark up for potential warranty service and then add in a profit, the only folks who would buy the system are the ones who don't understand computers and ones likely not getting a good deal.

Dell and the others start overcharging with upgrades so you can start making up the volume discount the big boys get. Start OCing the System where you can make a $70 CPU outperform a $200-$300 CPU and you are now possibly making a profit.

 

[pat]

because I often upgrade existing machine, reusing the same OS, most part. I could tell them to get a dell too, but that don't give me money. And I do the support for them, and that pay me too.

So, I mostly buy MB, CPU and RAM. I do build gaming machine, but rarely.

As for OC, since I offer support, I rather sell them stock speed.