I tried out the Phenom 9600 Black Edition (FAIL)

[L1qu1d]

Well about 2 days ago, I bought a Athlon Phenom 9600 Black Edition (2.3 ghz). I upgraded from the Athlon 5000+ Black Edition @ 2.6 ghz (overclocked to 3.4). I was very happy with the Athlon 5000. It was a good overclocker, while still maintaining a good temperature.

I got really excited about getting the Phenom 9600 black Edition, I was thinking this must be insane overclocker. Ummmm... Access Denied.

Lets start.

Stock CPU voltage. Got it to a stable 2.4 Ghz. Yes just 100 mhz.
I put the voltage up bit by bit, hoping that it will soon be safe to overclock it more. Nope

So the max clock setting I could Acheive from the Multicore CPU, was 2.4 Ghz.

All that aside. Ever heard of the TBL patch? Well I did. But I thought it was...pardon my french... B*llsh*t.
Well it wasn't.

I put it to the test:

With TBL patch: Valve Stress test- 155.56 fps.
With out TBL patch: Valve Stress Test- 224.45 fps

Almost a full 100 frames more??? Are you serious???

So my choice was, either performance or Stability. Is that a choice you want to make for a 300$ CPU????

After doing a 3Dmark 2006, I achieved about 2300 Points, while with the TBL patch I acheived about 2100 points.

So if I were you I'd either go Intel ( I did, bought a Q6600 @ 2.4 (oced to 3.4 WOW)) or wait for the revision 9650 which should be coming out soon.

I was an AMD fanboy....not anymore. I was ready to sacrifice perfromance and go with AMD but not keeping a performance promise and not having the balls to recall the damn CPUs ....well you think about that.

They state 5%- 7% decrease...as you can see from the tests its about 30% for some tests. And if you go on the internet you'll see tests showing even as much as a 50-66% decrease.

Well just wanted to warn some people.

 

[L1qu1d]

Thats exactly how I feel. You'd think that since they are in the gutter, they would atleast recall the items so that they wouldn't loose what they have left. Thank god IBM is taking control (hopfully). We'll see where it goes.

 

[jevon]

Well unless you're heavily into running virtualisation software you'll never experience the TLB error. And even if you are a heavy user of virtualisation apps, even AMD could only trigger the error in their lab setting. So really you shouldn't worry at all about leaving the 'fix' disabled. But read more about that to put your mind at ease first because I understand your point about choosing between stability and performance

But on the topic of reading... didn't you read any of the reviews on the processor before you purchased it? When it was launched back in December, it was found to be barely any better for OCing than the locked Phenoms (which are pathetic at OCing of course).

 

[L1qu1d]

Yes I read reviews...but remember nothing is as real as your own experiences. Like I stated before I am an AMD fanboy. I knew that it might not overclock alot but I thought alot ment more than 25%. There are reviews out there that have it at 2.5. While I couldn't, so sometimes you might acheive different results than on reviews Thats why I bought it. Weather or not the Virtualization error is there with home user or at the AMD labs...do u still want to know that ur CPU isn't 100%? for 300$??? nope.

And if you read my post again I did say I did read reviews, but I find some of the reviews out there are very limited. I knew I wasn't get much...but I didn't think that my not getting much was really NOTHING.

The fix needs to be disabled everytime you launch windows. which is a pain on its own.

This CPU is actually worse than the 6400 Black edition, which was also a bad OCer.

 

[jpsolo]

Hey L1qu1d, I read your post and I cannot find any mention of your reading any reviews. I am currently running a X2 5000 BE and I love how easy it is to overclock. I will not buy Intel, that is my own personal problem. I have a friend who wanted to build his own system and I recommended a Q6600 and that is the CPU he purchased. Its your money spend it as you see fit, the Phenom may be a better purchase when the B3 stepping arrives. Just had to add my own $.02.

 

[L1qu1d]

What do u think I meant when I wrote and if you check ont he internet of other tests...and when i was talkin about the TBL patch. I didn't say the word REVIEW...anyways. It will be when the b3 arrives? Who wants to wait for that? I mean Amd and Ati are telling us to wait. When AMD arrives with something new...Intel will just outshine it. I mean I had the 5000 before this cpu...yes its an easy overclocker but I mean thats 1 out of how many cpus did amd release from that Athlon X2;s??? Yes they are cheap but its because their performance is low.

I'm not arguing to buy intel. I'm just saying that Amd better step up. They are releasing Tri- cores...again aiming at mainstream.

And what I love about the current CPU is that I didn't even touch the voltage when I got the Cpu to 3 ghz while on the BE I had to play with the FSB and the multiplier. I managed to acheive 3.4 at 1.450 or so Voltage.

the phenom will not be a better purchase ever. It is flawed. Once a cpu is flawed u can't say its a good purchase unless the price is slashed heavily.
What amd did was the microsoft mistake. Releasing an incomplete product (Even though it wasn't)
I would've stayed with Phenom if they offered a trade in for the 9650 but they are starting to be as money hungry as Microsoft.

Like I said your own personal problems aside AMD is just not at standard. I have AMD stickers on a Intel computer LOL. So you kno I'm an AMD fanboy.

I hope they come back. but it might be too late.


Remember what AMD use to be...CHEAP but GOOD. Remember the XPs???? (aka the new semprons)

They were amazing. They beat the intels and were half the price in some cases. Now they are half the price at more than half the performance.

 

[akhilles]

2500+ Barton reporting for duty... err retirement.

I'm sorry you had to blow hundreds of dollars to find this out. I read forums & overclocking threads. I knew what Phenom could & couldn't do. Buying the black is crapshoot. The best overclocker would be early reportedly unlocked regular 9500+ which is probably sold out. Still 300mhz o/c is elementary. 1-2Ghz o/c then I'm in. The B3 has been previewed. It ain't looking good.

The only chance of survival for Phenom would be that AMD markets it as a budget stock quad. I think HP are putting Phenoms in their PCs. If AMD can cut a deal with the gov or edu, they may not take too much of a loss on this. Unfortunately, even the AMD fans are buying the TBL hype. It's sad.

The best bang AMD overclocker for now is 5000+ Black.

 

[L1qu1d]

agreed. For the record lol I didn't blow the money. I ended up doing a straight trade for the Q6600...So i came it happy since it was actually 20$ more exp

Amd needs to come back so Intel doesn't mess with us and keep the market.

AMD 5000+ is bomb. Like I said 3.4 Ghz overclock. Hard to overclock because I had to mess with chipset voltages and ram plus cpu. but it got the job done.

The Q6600 was easier to overclock at stock Voltage

 

[reddozen]

They'll still sell them no mater what. The average consumer just sees "quad core". The overall market segment that relates to this forum is vastly overshadowed by the general consumers that just buy a computer to surf the net and play a few web games. Those kind of users would never know the difference between the a quad core Intel or AMD.

 

[L1qu1d]

too bad they don't look at these forums. But word gets out Intel is better than even the average (lets call them Easily Influenced Technology Illiterate) will go on board just because its number 1. Most consumers think whats more exp is better. That being said that doesn't mean they will buy it. Although you do have a point. They see quad core for soo low they might not care.

I hope theyc ome back!

 

[reconviperone1]

agreed. For the record lol I didn't blow the money. I ended up doing a straight trade for the Q6600...So i came it happy since it was actually 20$ more exp

Amd needs to come back so Intel doesn't mess with us and keep the market.

AMD 5000+ is bomb. Like I said 3.4 Ghz overclock. Hard to overclock because I had to mess with chipset voltages and ram plus cpu. but it got the job done.

The Q6600 was easier to overclock at stock Voltage

I didnt own a 500be, but the x2-5600(overclocked to 3.2ghz) i had was awesome, i think i actually prefer it over the q6600 for games.

 

[L1qu1d]

lol trust me the 6600 has better benches plus you have a quad core I mean my 3Dmark score was better on the q6600 at 3.0 GHz than the 5000 BE was at 3.4. Although that doesn't mean the BE was bad. As for your 5600 I don't know how the benchmarks came out so I can't comment

 

[EXT64]

I think 3D Mark can do quad thread (so a quad core should crush a dual core even if the dual were faster per core), though I definitely think you made the right choice going with a Q6600 over a Phenom. For me, though, I'll just keep using my FX-60 until something really exciting come out (or my 60 doesn't cut it anymore). Enjoy your Quad!

 

[reconviperone1]

lol trust me the 6600 has better benches plus you have a quad core I mean my 3Dmark score was better on the q6600 at 3.0 GHz than the 5000 BE was at 3.4. Although that doesn't mean the BE was bad. As for your 5600 I don't know how the benchmarks came out so I can't comment

I know what you mean, 4 is better than 2, now that i have it at 2.8ghz it's a little better in games, but nowadays the only way you can go wrong is picking a single core, everything from the lowly pentium 2100 and x2- 3600 to the qx9600 and x2-6400BE are great for games provided you have a decent gpu. Im about to build a coworker a cheap gaming system, i think im gonna make it 780g based and go with a x2-5000be or 8000 series tri-core, so he can put more money toward memory and gpu.

 

[L1qu1d]

Thank you sir lol. I hate to switch to Intel but its a must....I use to be an ATI fan too...but things change with The times

 

[Mousemonkey]

Thank you sir lol. I hate to switch to Intel but its a must....I use to be an ATI fan too...but things change with The times

Welcome to the Dark Side, bwahahahahah :lol:

 

[L1qu1d]

Hahah thats exactly what I said to myself LOL!

 

[reconviperone1]

Hahah thats exactly what I said to myself LOL!

Ditto, i hadnt had a intel, since i had a old dual socket pentium pro

 

[justjc]

@L1qu1d: I'm sorry to burst your bubble but even your Q6600 has errata, as can be read in ftp://download.intel.com/design/processor/specupdt/31559321.pdf
The difference is that while Intel keeps quiet about errata and fix them in new revisions(usually no software solution for old revisions) AMD was stupid enough to mention the Phenom errata publicly and made a software solution to get around it untill he fixed revision.


About the TBL errata it has only been found two times, once by an external tester and once by AMD themselves, which makes me wonder if those using the fix have failed to read when it should be used.(Only with high use of virtualisation)

 

[L1qu1d]

they didn't MENTION they were discovered by the media...thats not admitting it.

So the TBL patch makes up for everything then I guess??

I'll say it again. INtel atleast has the performance to back it up...what amd have???
An already slow CPU being dragged down even more by the TBL patch, and is also a horrible overclocker and just 20$ cheaper than the Q6600.

And again i ask every1 do u want a CPU that isn't running 100%???? even though chances are low?

Alteast Q6600 fixed the problem if you say it had an errata.

Just face the facts....I liked AMD too...but look at the benchmarks...there is no disccussion

 

[jevon]

Again I have to say for clarity's sake: there is ZERO chance of anyone coming across the errata bug unless they are doing extreme virtualisiation in a controlled enviroment where the goal is to trigger the error.

I would not touch a Phenom with a 10 foot pole, but the errata error is a complete non-factor in that; slow stock speeds and terrible over clocking are all that 99.9999999% of users need to consider. EDIT: Sorry and price of course

Processors are released all the time with errata in them (Including some of Intel's 45nm) but it was a rare case that the Phenom's errata made it into the spotlight because these errors are basically always only triggerable in lab-like settings under extreme testing conditions.

 

[L1qu1d]

So then the TBL patch was the biggest mistake??? lol....I still think they had their reasons.

I have nothing against athlon. I just want my cpu 2 be clean. LIke my old 5000 BE

 

[chiadog]

Again I have to say for clarity's sake: there is ZERO chance of anyone coming across the errata bug unless they are doing extreme virtualisiation in a controlled enviroment where the goal is to trigger the error.

that is not exactly true. http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3260&p=2
Very small chance, not zero chance. Every CPU has errata, but most of them can be get around via BIOS without a performance hit unlike this TLB thing.
I wouldn't buy these chips for anything where performance matters. But then again, if performance isn't main priority, why bother with 4 cores. Save money with low end X2

 

[resonance451]

I refuse to buy such a failed technology.

I'm personally quite happy with my qx9650.

The fanboys can scream "native quad core" and "FSB is outdated" all they want, but I think that the end result is what matters most.

 

[L1qu1d]

lol well its failed for now we'll have to wait for the new phenoms