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Options to connect my fans? Noob-alert!

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April 23, 2008 8:41:47 PM

I'm coming to you for salvation.

I thought I did enough research for my first build but realize, before the parts get here, that I still have some holes.

Specifically around case fans.

I am replacing the stock fans on the case:
http://lian-li.com/v2/tw/product/upload/image/A70/detai...

With:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N...

and using this PSU:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

This power supply has a 24-pin main connector, a 4-pin 12V connector, an 8-pin 12V CPU connector, 8 peripheral connectors, 6 SATA connectors, a floppy connector, and two PCI-E connectors, two 6-pin to 8-pin PCI-E connectors.

1) The fans, from the pictures, have quite short leads. The mobo can't support 6 fans. What part of that PSU do I use to power up all those 6 fans? Do I need to get extenders so they reach? I just don't visualize what to do...

2) I was also considering the Zalman 9700. Looking at the specs, it has a 3 pin connector. The mobo I'm getting has a 4 pin connector. How does that work? I called Gigabyte and he seemed to say I can still plug it in but don't understand what pin I'm skipping? The manual shows:

Pin No. Definition
1 GND
2 +12V / Speed Control
3 Sense
4 Speed Control

So if I skip pin 4, will the mobo control the CPU fan speed still based on temperature etc? What do I do with the fan speed controller that comes with the Zalman 9700?

I thought this was clear in my head and well, you know how clear it is now! :pfff: 

April 23, 2008 11:03:22 PM

1) I dont know why you are replacing the fans in the A70, the fans that come with it are pretty awesome as is. They have a faster rated RPM and move as much if not more air, at slightly higher noise level.
That aside the SFF21E comes with Molex adaptors so you can use the "8 peripheral" adapters on the PSU to plug them in when you run out of fan controllers on the motherboard, although this will mean they will run at full speed all the time.

2) The Zalman connector will fit fine on the motherboard, they are keyed so that it still connects. however, i think you will loos speed control, dont know why Zalman did it that way
Actually according to the egg its a 4 pin so you wont have a worry
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118020&Tpk=zalman%2b9700
April 23, 2008 11:29:40 PM

Even without the 4th pin, you will not lose speed control. Don't worry. There are two methods of fan control, pwm and voltage. The 4th pin is used for pwm fan control, which basically turns power on and off really fast, the rate and length of this power on/off cycle determines fan speed. With 3 pins, you can still use traditional voltage control. Just go to your motherboard and set fan control method to voltage.

Also, that 120mm case fan, with a airflow rating of 49cfm, is not the best. Consider this one, rated at 133.6cfm. Easy math.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Related resources
April 24, 2008 12:14:34 AM

Thanks Chookman, but I should have listed the Zalman NewEgg model...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

This one has a 3 pin when I look under specs...while the one you posted does indeed show a 4 pin but that model looks to be more specific for NVidia-based boards unless my newbieness is wrong.

As for replacing the fans, many people complain the fan quality on cases are not the best (and I don't blame the mfg. since they need to keep costs down). I don't mind 1200rpm 120mm fans running full speed since the scyth I saw in person was almost unhearable when it was running.

I think the motherboard has at most 3 fan connectors (I think) so I guess I will have to use the peripheral adapters to power them as you mention or get that Zalman fan controller. I read they lose some power and RPMs though through that (not sure if true) so that worried me.

Either way, the connectors on those fans seem short so i guess Ill check NewEgg or Fry's to see if they have 3pin extenders...

Thanks for the info
April 24, 2008 12:35:40 AM

The Zalman i listed is still LGA775 compatible so i dont see why Zalman bothered with the 2 models unless im missing something

dagger: Those Kamakazies are awesome, however, did you notice the dBA level? they are more than twice what the S-Flex's are... with 6 of those in your case it would literally sound like a jet engine... mind you it would prolly fly like one also lol

OP: The zalman controller seems to work fine for me and it comes with extenders as well... not sure too sure about the power loss thing...

but considering the Zalman controller states max 7w per channel and the Scythe's draw 0.15amp at 12v unless my maths are wrong should only need 1.8w
April 24, 2008 12:49:43 AM

dagger said:

Also, that 120mm case fan, with a airflow rating of 49cfm, is not the best. Consider this one, rated at 133.6cfm. Easy math.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


:fou:  :heink:  :non: 

*sigh* now I know why most people pay companies to build their machines. At every turn where I think I learned something, I learn just how much I still have to learn! :) 

But, I went with the 1200RPM for a few reasons, and these might be false assumptions. You tell me.

1) The case has 6 fans. JPL in Pasadena already has a wind tunnel so I didn't want to have two in the same county :p  Joking aside, I was originally looking at the Silverstone TJ09 case. The 120mm fans that has are 1200 RPM and it only comes with 2 but has room for up to 5. So in this case there are _six_ fans and I though/hoped that 1200RPM and 49CFM is ok.

2 intake fans = 100CFM + 2 more per the image linked above blow on the GPU and mobo. Of course I don't know that those help bring in more air through the vent vs. just move what the first two bring in. I'm guessing it's a mix and maybe averages around 150CFU intake? Is that not enough?

Then 2 fans blowing out + PSU fan maybe is about the same 150CFU. That not enough? If so, I'll add more.

2) As for the Zalman control thingy, since a million people seem to use that thing, I figured there must be a simple solution and I guess it seems I still just plug it into the 4 pin connector on the MOBO but don't use the 4th pin and it just works somehow?

*starts looking up the number to Dell again* J/K!

I think...
April 24, 2008 12:55:11 AM

chookman said:

OP: The zalman controller seems to work fine for me and it comes with extenders as well... not sure too sure about the power loss thing...


Ok cool, so basically you are saying that those fans draw less than they would need based on the specs so they should be fine. Good. This way it has extenders and I don't need to run a million power connections. Also, since I have exactly 6 fans and that controls 6, it seems...match made in heaven?

What type of power does the Zalman controller need btw? I couldn't find that in terms of which power connection it wants?

NOTE: I forgot to mention to Dagger, what I tried to do is find out just what the CFM is for the current fans in the case and then get equivalent CFM or close with the Scythes just being much quieter. I cant find the RPM/CFM published anywhere and when I tried to contact Lian-Li, they only have a web form contact page that I could find and tried twice - no response.

:fou:  :fou:  :fou:  :fou:  :fou: 
April 24, 2008 1:06:00 AM

If it's quieter, than it doesn't move as much air. There is no fan that
would get equivalent CFM but be "much quieter." You can't have the cake
and eat it too. RPM/CFM scaling should come to around the same, as
they're all 120mm fans.



It's best to get the best possible fan coupled with controller. That
way, you have quietness when you want it, but power if you need it.
April 24, 2008 1:43:42 AM

dagger said:
It's best to get the best possible fan coupled with controller. That
way, you have quietness when you want it, but power if you need it.


Good point you have there...

Lian Li PC-A70 stock fan info:

Model: LI121225BL-4
Size: 120x120x25
Type: Dual Ball bearing
RPM: 1500
CFM: ~56
dB: ~25
Volts: 12
Amps: 0.27
Termination: 3pin with RPM monitoring and adapters for molex included.
April 24, 2008 4:43:36 AM

chookman said:

Lian Li PC-A70 stock fan info:

Model: LI121225BL-4
Size: 120x120x25
Type: Dual Ball bearing
RPM: 1500
CFM: ~56
dB: ~25
Volts: 12
Amps: 0.27
Termination: 3pin with RPM monitoring and adapters for molex included.



I want to make sweet love to you...r reply. Thanks! I tried checking everywhere including calling 'partners' who carried their products and said they didnt know.

I did earlier tonight find another post that said what you said above (~56 cfm) for another case with 120mm fan so hoped it was the same.

Since this is the case, and if I go with the controller, then I'll probably want to look at:
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?item=N82E168...

These are around ~65cfm at 1600 RPM so a tad more and faster but quieter. I did read the fans it comes with are not the quietest but again, for 6 fans included, you cant ask for much.

So only think I dont get is how you did the volts/amp math above.

The 1600rpm fans are 0.20A, Rated Voltage: DC12V. Im guessing that is still ok for the controller from some of what others posted.

Thanks!


April 24, 2008 12:42:02 PM

arrpeegeer said:
I want to make sweet love to you...r reply. Thanks! I tried checking everywhere including calling 'partners' who carried their products and said they didnt know.

I did earlier tonight find another post that said what you said above (~56 cfm) for another case with 120mm fan so hoped it was the same.

Since this is the case, and if I go with the controller, then I'll probably want to look at:
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?item=N82E168...

These are around ~65cfm at 1600 RPM so a tad more and faster but quieter. I did read the fans it comes with are not the quietest but again, for 6 fans included, you cant ask for much.

So only think I dont get is how you did the volts/amp math above.

The 1600rpm fans are 0.20A, Rated Voltage: DC12V. Im guessing that is still ok for the controller from some of what others posted.

Thanks!



Don't replace 56cfm fans with 63cfm ones. That makes no sense at all, especially if you're getting a controller. Use the 133fcm ones. When toned down with controller, they sound about the same.
April 24, 2008 4:14:50 PM

I thought about that but in reading reviews, the others you linked definitely move air but also don't have the same bearings as the flex' (hence being cheaper) and are louder not only because of higher RPM but the bearings.

With 6 fans, just marginally more noice x6 can add up.

I guess that is why the other scyth fans are more expensive (i.e. ones that use Fluid Dynamic Bearings). Also from what I can read on other sites, they stay quieter especially over time.

April 25, 2008 12:21:48 AM

arrpeegeer said:
I thought about that but in reading reviews, the others you linked definitely move air but also don't have the same bearings as the flex' (hence being cheaper) and are louder not only because of higher RPM but the bearings.

With 6 fans, just marginally more noice x6 can add up.

I guess that is why the other scyth fans are more expensive (i.e. ones that use Fluid Dynamic Bearings). Also from what I can read on other sites, they stay quieter especially over time.



Bearings do not make noise, not at a level that you can hear anyway. If you can hear bearing grinding, it's defective. Ask any engineer that dealt with any fans. The noise is from blades on air. If your case is filmsy, and vibrates, that's bad, of course, but it's still not bearing's fault.

What people say are placebo effect.

Also, fans don't normally break down. Trust me, your rig will be obsolete long before fans wear out.
!