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Crysis makes PC shut down after a while. (Sapphire 3870x2)

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April 9, 2008 10:21:16 PM

OS: Win XP SP.
PC:

Videocard: Sapphire HD 3870 X2
Processor: Q6600 @ 2.40GHz
Mainboard: GIGABYTE DQ6 X38 (Latest BIOS on Gigabyte website)
Memory: GeiL BlackDragon DDR2 2GB @ 800MHz
Soundcard: SB Live 5.1
PSU: Thermaltake Toughpower 750W Modular

Everything at default clocks.


When playing Crysis on very high (DX9) settings my PC shuts down at some point between 5 minutes and 10 (random).

Things checked:

-I have the 6pin + the 8pin connected. (btw, why the Sapphire has only one 6pin while the rest have two 6pin and one 8pin connectors?)

-I have the molex cable that supplies extra power to the PCI slots on the motherboard connected.

-I tried CAT 8.2, 8.3, 8.3+hotfix (using Driver Cleaner when deleting).

-Temp goes at 81ºC max when auto, but I tried with the fan blowing at 50% constantly with RivaTuner and it still shuts down.

The rest of games I've played plays just fine (for example I played Oblivion for an hour straight and nothing weird. Everything maxed out with the QTP3).

I remember I played Crysis on very high (DX9) settings with my 8800gt for hours and it never made my PC shut down just like if someone pulled off the power cable out.

I refuse to belive a Thermaltake 750W is not suppling enought power to a system that has nothing overclocked.

Please, help ASAP.
April 9, 2008 10:23:13 PM

Well, it certainly sounds like power. But I agree that 750 should be plenty. Weird
April 9, 2008 11:01:22 PM

Multiple things could be wrong here. 750W is good and Thermaltake is a good brand, but no one has 100% quality contontrol. The Entire system shutting down is usually a thermal event to prevent damage or the PSU giving out. Swap video cards if possible and see if it still happens. A cheaper power supply tester can tell you if you're getting good voltage. 81C is pretty darn hot! I would start with the video card.
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April 9, 2008 11:49:00 PM

What about cpu temp and vcore? Crysis is cpu intensive too. Do you have an aftermarket cooler? If not, and it runs hot, get one.
April 10, 2008 12:48:14 AM

Steven Bancroft said:
Multiple things could be wrong here. 750W is good and Thermaltake is a good brand, but no one has 100% quality contontrol. The Entire system shutting down is usually a thermal event to prevent damage or the PSU giving out. Swap video cards if possible and see if it still happens. A cheaper power supply tester can tell you if you're getting good voltage. 81C is pretty darn hot! I would start with the video card.



As I said:

Quote:
I remember I played Crysis on very high (DX9) settings with my 8800gt for hours and it never made my PC shut down just like if someone pulled off the power cable out.


Quote:
What about cpu temp and vcore? Crysis is cpu intensive too. Do you have an aftermarket cooler? If not, and it runs hot, get one.


I have an ASUS Silent Square Pro, and I don't remember temps getting weird values. Will get HWMonitor running in the background for the CPU and RivaTuner for the GPU monitorin. BRB with them.
April 10, 2008 12:50:25 AM

Did running the fan at 50% lower the temps? You could try it even higher or with the case side off. It sounds like it is intentionally shutting down for some reason.
April 10, 2008 1:15:03 AM

Here we go:

Catalyst 8.2, Catalyst A.I: Standard. Played for 7 minutes and had a shutdown, so these are the temps after playing 2 minutes (Afaik 2 minutes is enought to get max temps, and I don't want more shut downs in case I **** up my computer).

April 10, 2008 1:29:58 AM

Usually random reboot especially under stress are caused by the PSU. I agree that 750 should be adequate, but as others have said it might not be functioning properly. I would start by having TT replace that PSU under warranty. I assume your not overclocking by the numbers and running stock timings on the ram. My money is on the PSU, if you have a friend with a good computer try swapping supplies and see what happens. Or do like I do, and use it as an excuse to start upgrading everything until you find the problem. There are only 4 things that could even cause the issue: PSU, Heat, Motherboard, Ram.
April 10, 2008 1:51:58 AM

cisco said:
Usually random reboot especially under stress are caused by the PSU. I agree that 750 should be adequate, but as others have said it might not be functioning properly. I would start by having TT replace that PSU under warranty. I assume your not overclocking by the numbers and running stock timings on the ram. My money is on the PSU, if you have a friend with a good computer try swapping supplies and see what happens. Or do like I do, and use it as an excuse to start upgrading everything until you find the problem. There are only 4 things that could even cause the issue: PSU, Heat, Motherboard, Ram.


Unfortunately I came from "an excuse" which was exchanging a faulty 8800gt for the 3870X2 (I paid the 100€ difference), and I really don't want to spend more money on hardware for a long time now. I'll keep testing a bit more things but I see myself RMA'ing the goddamned PSU. Lets see.
April 10, 2008 1:52:58 AM

P.D: I can't exchange PSU since noone I know needs such ammounts of W to wank arround at msn and stuff.
April 10, 2008 4:04:04 AM

1. Do you have 2x6pin or 1x6pin and 1x8pin connectors?
April 10, 2008 12:05:42 PM

1x6pin and 1x8pin connectors, both connected.
April 10, 2008 1:51:53 PM

Ok, fan at 100% (RIDICULOUSLY HIGH) and I had a shutdown at 9minutes 20 secs of gameplay. I think we can conclude and say this is not an overheating problem.
April 10, 2008 2:21:41 PM

How do you figure running the fan at 100% would eliminate a heat problem? You keep posting how long it ran instead of how high the temp got on the card. You last posted a temp of 81 at 50%. You never posted what case your using and if there isn't the proper air movement through the case that could be keeping the card to hot, after all it exhausts air out the back so it draws are in from inside the case. Play it with the fan at 100% for a few minutes and then check the temp before it crashes.
April 10, 2008 2:29:08 PM

I was having similar issues a while back, except any 3d app would quit after x min. I did a few things at once so I'm not really sure what fixed it.

I had Asus mobo software installed that controlled ACPI, clock settings, etc. This wasn't working properly as I would randomly see high CPU usage from the exe related to the software. So I removed and re-installed that software.

I also turned on load line calibration for my CPU in the BIOS.

After that everything was fine. Se my system specs below.

And BTW, I tried everything from new CCC drivers to running the system at stock settings with no avail.
April 10, 2008 3:07:24 PM

stoner133 said:
How do you figure running the fan at 100% would eliminate a heat problem? You keep posting how long it ran instead of how high the temp got on the card. You last posted a temp of 81 at 50%. You never posted what case your using and if there isn't the proper air movement through the case that could be keeping the card to hot, after all it exhausts air out the back so it draws are in from inside the case. Play it with the fan at 100% for a few minutes and then check the temp before it crashes.


Dude I post a screenshot, look up. That was 50%, and as you can see max temp was 60. Max temp at 100% after 3 minutes was 59º.
April 10, 2008 4:23:16 PM

Btw, I got this response from another forum:

Quote:
The 3870x2 draws the same power as 2 3870s. The 3870 will not run stably on a PSU with less than 20A SUSTAINED on the +12v rails. SUSTAINED A (amperage) is found by multiplying the rated output by the rated efficiency. Your PSU offers 18A (rated) or 14.5A under load (assuming 80% efficiency). Not a good start.

I wouldnt run my 3870 on the PSU simply because there isnt a single +12v line with enough juice.

With Catalyst AI deactivated is the card actually using both cores? If not then you you can conclude that using both cores is unstable...likely because the power draw is too much. Other games cant load your system the way Crysis does.
What you guys have to say about that?
April 11, 2008 8:16:03 PM

I've been looking in the mobo's manual for temperature related options and found this:

CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E):
Enables or disables Intel CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E) function, a CPU power-saving function in system halt state. When enabled, the CPU core frequency and voltage will be reduced during system halt state to decrease power consumption. (Default: Enabled)


CPU Thermal Monitor 2 (TM2):
Enables or disables Intel CPU Thermal Monitor (TM2) function, a CPU overheating protection function. When enabled, the CPU core frequency and voltage will be reduced when the CPU is overheated. (Default: Enabled)

CPU EIST Function:
Enables or disables Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology (EIST). Depending on CPU loading Intel EIST technology can dynamically and effectively lower the CPU voltage and core frequency to drecrease average power consumption and heat production. (Default: Enabled)

Should I try to disable something? (I've search about these options and when overclocking people disables a couple of those).
April 11, 2008 9:10:13 PM

^ Those settings shouldn't effect the GPU. They only effect CPS. And yes, I would have to agree with the guy on the other Forum about the PSU.

Quote:

The 3870x2 draws the same power as 2 3870s. The 3870 will not run stably on a PSU with less than 20A SUSTAINED on the +12v rails. SUSTAINED A (amperage) is found by multiplying the rated output by the rated efficiency. Your PSU offers 18A (rated) or 14.5A under load (assuming 80% efficiency). Not a good start.
He is pretty right. I say you PM Zorg and ask him his opinion, he knows best about PSUs.
April 12, 2008 12:45:13 AM

My system is running on 18A max rails for 12v. I know it's not the same PSU, but specs look similar.
April 12, 2008 1:35:58 AM

I don't think it's the graphics card overheating... normally you get artifacts, screens freezes, juddering etc when it overheats - not a reboot on the basis of my experiences.

If I had to bet, I'd say it's the PSU. Crysis is the most demanding game out there... it causes machines otherwise stable to have problems... nothing else will load the rig like Crysis.
April 12, 2008 1:43:26 AM

Right now, this stuff is too murky for me to take a guess. But you should not rule out psu as cause. Any psu, no matter how powerful, can possibly be defective. It's a matter of bad luck. :p 
April 12, 2008 2:41:43 AM

Like I mentioned before, those were the exact symptoms I had when my PSU was insufficient for my 2900XT. How many rails does that PSU have?
April 14, 2008 7:34:28 PM

Goddamn the same happened while playing COD4 :( 
April 14, 2008 7:35:02 PM

EXT64 said:
Like I mentioned before, those were the exact symptoms I had when my PSU was insufficient for my 2900XT. How many rails does that PSU have?



+3,3V 30 A
+5Vsb 3 A
+5V 28 A
+12V1 18 A
+12V2 18 A
+12V3 18 A
+12V4 18 A
+12V Total 60 A
-12V 0,8 A
May 11, 2008 2:18:37 AM

I downloaded the GRID demo and I've been testing out.

All maxed out at 1024, Catalyst 8.4 and Catalyst A.I Standard. The extra HD and the DVD removed just in case.

Fan at auto speed: Start playing and had a shutdown after 3 minutes.

Fan at 50%: Same.

Fan at 100%: After 5 minutes (the same at all).

I removed the case's door just to try and:

Fan at 100%: Played for 15 minutes and everything ok.

Fat at 50%: Another 15 minutes and ok.

Fan at auto: Played up to 40 minutes and ok.

Since I saw it seemed stable, I was going to conclude in that the case's door was making something to overheat (even if it seems a bit weird since my door has a good fan).

Before finnishing testing, I tried to force things a bit more and cranked the resolution to 1280x1024. After a minute or so, again a **** shutdown.

I start again and change the resolution back to 1024, and after a minute, it shutdowns AGAIN, destroying my theory of "if I close the case something overheats".

And thats it, I don't know what to do/think at this point appart from RMA'ing the card again, and paying again for the shipments. Maybe the people at Shappiretech forums are right after all? http://forums.sapphiretech.com/showthread.php?p=121806#post121806 or we are missing something?

Everest pics with Grid running:



Your turn now guys.
May 11, 2008 10:30:53 PM

Ok, this is are the stats min/max stats until GRID makes my PC shutdown (I keep Everest logging)

May 12, 2008 2:04:32 PM

I've had my 3870x2 running over of 90 degrees for several minutes before I had a system crash. the Witcher at 1920x1200 with settings cranked really stresses this card. I never noticed artifacts though. I've recently done some custom air cooling to the card and now I don't get over 72 while playing the same game.

I really don't think your issue is heat on the video card. If I could get these images to load from imageshack though...
May 12, 2008 9:11:21 PM

I downclocked the card with Riva Tuner from 825/900 to 415/450 and had a shutdown after 4 minutes.
May 14, 2008 12:48:03 AM

Do you by chance always have Everest running? I just went through a spell where I couldn't keep my PC running, HDD errors and game crashes. I went through everything I could think of, even a re-install. Things seem to work fine if I don't use Everest. I like it though 'cause it can display on my keyboard.

Just an idea.
May 15, 2008 1:02:52 PM

off topic, but..........

sapphire sux!!!!!!!!!!

I had a sapphire 3870 for 2 months. On the day after the newegg 30 refund period i got blue spots in my graphics. I emailed sapphire support for 5 weeks. They never replied. Not once. Once i told Newegg about the bad support they game me a refund. Newegg rocks, sapphire sux.

read the forums about sapphire. They have the worst support of any gpu card vendor.
May 15, 2008 1:05:07 PM

Quote:
read the forums about sapphire. They have the worst support of any gpu card vendor.


That may be true, but I don't know 'cause every card I've ever had from them has worked just fine.
May 15, 2008 4:59:45 PM

I just thought I'd add:

last night I had GPU-Z running on the 2nd display while I was playing a game and I noticed it has monitoring for voltage on the card. It was indicating the card was using up to 37.9 amps. I don' t know how accurate this is, but that seems on par for the 20 amp rating for the 3870. My P.S. is rated at 18 amps/rail and seemed to handle it just fine.
May 21, 2008 4:47:45 PM

Just a thought...

Did you already check your RAM?
You can download the test software such as memtest86. Also you can test the game with 1Gb only rather than 2Gb, test both RAM for sure.
All the best!

May 22, 2008 11:01:44 AM

I RMA'd the card, got it today, played Grid for 3 minutes and had a shutdown. I told them to test the card before sending me another one, so we can confirm now its not the card.
May 23, 2008 12:12:05 AM

Have you checked the Winblows error logs?
May 23, 2008 2:56:05 AM

What error logs? Al I always have is just a shutdown.
May 26, 2008 1:30:24 AM

Window's System or Application logs. You can view them with the event viewer fromt the admin tools under control panel, or in Windows Computer Management.

They might give you a clue as to what is causing your crashes.
June 7, 2008 3:15:25 PM

Couldn't find anything weird before shutdown.
June 8, 2008 2:09:59 AM

It seems to me that every time I've had an issue, it was related to something other than the video card (if you have it at stock speeds that is).

I have found that the Asus AI software can cause shutdowns....

I have found that the Asus OC protection for the NB and SB will reboot the system at 60 degrees, not the 90 that is stated in the BIOS...

I have noticed that overclocking the cards can result in strange behavior, including shutdowns or game crashes (duh)...

My system seems ok when things aren't over clocked and the game and drivers are patched. I wish I could be of more help.
June 11, 2008 5:22:18 AM

I'm having the same problem and I'm very inclined to think it's the power supply in both your case and mine. Here's why:

3 years ago when I built this box, I didn't have enough power. So the damn thing never turned on, until I got a PSU with higher wattage. So it would make sense that, if the PSU is failing, at random intervals the power levels drop and your card doesn't get enough juice, the whole thing shuts down. The drop in power isn't drastic enough to shut down the PC during normal, non-game operation because the GPU isn't using as much power as it does under full load.

Also, I have to UNPLUG my PC from the wall, then plug it back in, in order to reboot. You should check that too.

So there's my 2 cents. I'm going to try a friend's 550W tomorrow and play some Quake Wars. We'll see what happens. I hate troubleshooting this ****, so I feel your pain. Good luck.
June 11, 2008 1:51:06 PM

From looking at your Everest screen shots of temps, I noticed that your mobo doesn't report NB or SB temps. While I can keep my CPU cool easily on my system, I'm always having trouble keeping my SB cool. The heat sink of the stock 3870x2 was right on top of my SB heat pipe cooler, and now that I've modded the cooling, the video card's heat-pipe fins are actually touching the SB. My temps lately have been reached 62 degrees (24 to 25 C ambient) on the SB and then the system will shut off. I haven't been playing Crysis, but playing The Witcher will get the SB that hot.

My SB connects to the NB, which then connects to the power regulators via 1 heat pipe. Last night I put a small fan on my NB heat sink and that kept the temps down quite a bit, but after some gaming the SB quickly heated up to 60 degrees, which then raises the NB temps. There just isn't enough air flow for me to keep it cool with the video card right on top of it.


Another strange thing: I can run 3DMark Vantage without issue, but I had 3DMark06 blue screen on me about half way through. Oh well.

By the way, I'm now running CrossfireX with a Visiontek 3870 OC, for a total of 3 GPUs on my 750 watt PS. I think any issues I've had are chipset temp related and not power.
June 11, 2008 2:37:01 PM

have you tried just installing ATI Drivers without CCC?
June 11, 2008 4:52:48 PM

Everyone is so quick to blame heat. Obviously you've tested the temps.

Power supplies fail. Seriously try to borrow someone's power supply and see if that fixes the problem.
June 12, 2008 12:29:49 AM

I do blame heat alot.

I think though for trouble shooting the P.S. should be the #1 culprit.

I know the Asus X38 chipsets run hot. Not sure about Gigabyte though.
June 12, 2008 6:26:30 PM

OK, it's definitely my power supply. I played a good couple hours each of Pandora Tomorrow and Quake Wars using my buddy's PSU... no shutdowns. :)  Time to order a new one.
June 16, 2008 3:01:43 AM

turn the fan speed on your video card to 100%, could be overheating and try turning down the games visual quality, very high with the fan spped at only 50% could overload the card, the 3870 X2 is definetly not a crysis performer
June 16, 2008 4:02:54 AM

I tend to think it's your PSU or memory. Your temps on your card seem normal. Mine idles at around 70 degrees with stock fan settings, but if I turn the fan up to 35% or 40% my temps stay around 60 degrees under full load (and that's on the hotter core) with my core clock at 870 and my memory at 955. From the screens you posted this seems pretty close to mine, in fact save your ears some trouble and leave the fan at 40%. My 600w power supply also has four 12v rails with 18amps a piece (bought a 6pin to 8pin adapter), which seems pretty close to yours also.

Run memtest, if it passes it's a PSU problem. Might as well RMA it to the manufacturer and see if a new one helps. Seemed to work for deadgopher.
!