System Builder Marathon, Dec. 2009: $1,300 Enthusiast PC
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Last quarter, we presented you with four Radeon HD 4850s under $1,250. This time around, we put together a very respectable Core i5 system with a couple of Radeon HD 5850s in CrossFire. Let's see how it compares against the previous "QuadFire" system.
System Builder Marathon, Dec. 2009: $1,300 Enthusiast PC : Read more
System Builder Marathon, Dec. 2009: $1,300 Enthusiast PC : Read more
More about : system builder marathon dec 2009 300 enthusiast
Crashman
December 23, 2009 5:09:20 AM
noob2222
December 23, 2009 5:22:41 AM
Very smoothe build, pretty limited with the 5850s with the pricing once past that, but this thing handles it well, esp since the cpu was lucky enough to stay fast while undervolted.
Not all cpus are the same, this one compared to the $2500 build definatly shows it. Takes a bit of luck sometimes or bad luck.
Not all cpus are the same, this one compared to the $2500 build definatly shows it. Takes a bit of luck sometimes or bad luck.
Score
8
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Tridec
December 23, 2009 5:39:57 AM
Just a thought, but why not use an I7 920 CPU, with an asrock x58 Extreme motherboard? I see a lot of people bought their I7 920 CPU for 199 dollars and the motherboard costs 170 dollars.
Pair that up with OCZ 1333 platinum 7-7-7-24 memory, that can easily be overclocked to 1600 7-7-7-24 and you'll have a powerful system with 36 PCI-e lanes and loads of CPU overclocking room thanks to asrock's great motherboard.
Pair that up with OCZ 1333 platinum 7-7-7-24 memory, that can easily be overclocked to 1600 7-7-7-24 and you'll have a powerful system with 36 PCI-e lanes and loads of CPU overclocking room thanks to asrock's great motherboard.
Score
0
SpadeM
December 23, 2009 6:06:36 AM
Good article, and yes the quadfire setup was sweet back then!! I just have a question/suggestion to make, and if you find worthy of a replay I'd much appreciate it.
Since you are willing to experiment with different setups, and since we see the problem with the Phenom in the application suite, why not try something more exotic like pairing a nvidia based card with the crossfire cards to act like a PPU / video transcoding accelerator (TMPEng supports CUDA at least to act as a filter). I don't know if this makes sense in a marathon build, but I'd like to see something like this benchmarked.
Since you are willing to experiment with different setups, and since we see the problem with the Phenom in the application suite, why not try something more exotic like pairing a nvidia based card with the crossfire cards to act like a PPU / video transcoding accelerator (TMPEng supports CUDA at least to act as a filter). I don't know if this makes sense in a marathon build, but I'd like to see something like this benchmarked.
Score
2
alchemy69
December 23, 2009 6:27:39 AM
shubham1401
December 23, 2009 6:53:31 AM
burnley14
December 23, 2009 6:54:40 AM
optional22
December 23, 2009 7:19:27 AM
kick_pixels
December 23, 2009 7:41:23 AM
More specifically, these guys are trying different things each time we do a round of SBMs--sometimes the results are great, and sometimes they're not as good. The point is that we're putting the machines together and reporting on the results so that you can decide if you want to do the same or not. And hopefully, when we come across a result that doesn't look so hot, we'll call out where our mistake was in building the box.
Just think how boring these would be if every quarter we did a Core i7-920-based machine at $2,500, a Core i5-750 machine at $1,500, and a Phenom II-based box at $700! =)
Just think how boring these would be if every quarter we did a Core i7-920-based machine at $2,500, a Core i5-750 machine at $1,500, and a Phenom II-based box at $700! =)
Score
9
davenjes
December 23, 2009 10:30:58 AM
dingumf
December 23, 2009 11:00:54 AM
zelannii
December 23, 2009 11:40:49 AM
I really don;t understand the choice of using 2X 5850 when you could have gotten a 5970 for $20 less. Yea, i know, the day you built it they were not in stock, but the waiting list was down to a week or less a month ago, and they're readily available now... That $20 would have upgraded the CPU to an i7 or the RAM past 4GB.
Otherwise, great build.
Otherwise, great build.
Score
-2
Crashman
December 23, 2009 11:48:31 AM
zelanniiI really don;t understand the choice of using 2X 5850 when you could have gotten a 5970 for $20 less. Yea, i know, the day you built it they were not in stock, but the waiting list was down to a week or less a month ago, and they're readily available now... That $20 would have upgraded the CPU to an i7 or the RAM past 4GB. Otherwise, great build.
Actually availability was still a guess when these were ordered. They were ordered a week before the 5970 launched, and it was guessed that the 5970 wouldn't be available for several weeks after launch based on availability of 5870's.
What I'd love to see is a comparison of "every possible" 58xx/59xx configuration
Score
1
Ehsan w
December 23, 2009 12:12:17 PM
JohnnyLucky
December 23, 2009 12:21:50 PM
masterasia
December 23, 2009 12:21:57 PM
fozzie76
December 23, 2009 12:32:27 PM
"we have to wonder what four of the new Radeon HD 5750s could do in quad-CrossFire. And with a price tag as low as $480" -- THe cheapest 5750 on NewEgg is $139 x 4 = $556. You had me all excited too.. bout ready to do a new build, was gonna switch my two 5850's to four 5750's but I'd rather pay the extra $50.
Score
0
jcknouse
December 23, 2009 12:37:56 PM
cangeliniMore specifically, these guys are trying different things each time we do a round of SBMs--sometimes the results are great, and sometimes they're not as good. The point is that we're putting the machines together and reporting on the results so that you can decide if you want to do the same or not. And hopefully, when we come across a result that doesn't look so hot, we'll call out where our mistake was in building the box. Just think how boring these would be if every quarter we did a Core i7-920-based machine at $2,500, a Core i5-750 machine at $1,500, and a Phenom II-based box at $700! =)
ARGGGH!!! Chris! Don't put those thoughts in my head!!
This was cool to see what that Intel CPU could do. I am kinda jealous now...kinda. Of course, I got a PII 550BE to go 3.7GHz@1.375 on air for $99. So, I can't be too sad...except...C3 stepping came out 3 weeks later. lol
Another great read and something to consider down the line in building my next rig. I actually am seeing value for the buck now in a line of Intel CPUs. I just wish that i7-920 had been $50 cheaper. I might have gone with them.
Thanks for another good article, guys.
Score
1
xtc28
December 23, 2009 12:46:22 PM
Very impressive I might add. Makes me wish I had kept my i5 and purchased a new MB. Just recently I had an MSI BIG BANG with a i5 750. I tried to run a 4970x2 and a GTX 295 together for some reason both cards, the board and the processor were fried. For the life of me I havent a clue what happened, but it is all good as I have RMA'd all parts but my wall mounted 4870x2. The rest were sold
Score
0
avatar_raq
December 23, 2009 1:01:45 PM
zelanniiI really don;t understand the choice of using 2X 5850 when you could have gotten a 5970 for $20 less.... That $20 would have upgraded the CPU to an i7 or the RAM past 4GB. Otherwise, great build.
I totally agree, The same idea came to me once I started reading the specs. Besides,With the 5970 Don could have saved another 20-25 USD by switching to a single PCI-e 2 16x slot mobo (e.g ASUS P7P55D). This way the build could've sticked to the 1300 USD mark! My only concern is that the PSU then might not be enough if the GPUs are OCed to 5870 clocks, which most 5970s are able to reach!
Score
-1
avatar_raq
December 23, 2009 1:10:00 PM
zelanniiI really don;t understand the choice of using 2X 5850 when you could have gotten a 5970 for $20 less.... That $20 would have upgraded the CPU to an i7 or the RAM past 4GB. Otherwise, great build.
I totally agree, The same idea came to me once I started reading the specs. Besides,With the 5970 Don could have saved another 20-25 USD by switching to a single PCI-e 2 16x slot mobo (e.g ASUS P7P55D). This way the build could've sticked to the 1300 USD mark! My only concern is that the PSU then might not be enough if the GPUs are OCed to 5870 clocks, which most 5970s are able to reach!
Score
-3
fozzie76
December 23, 2009 1:27:38 PM
The "study" you guys did a while back shows that 3 cores seem to be the sweet spot for gaming right now. The build I'm about ready to buy from NewEgg is an AMD 720 with a 5850 vid card, apogee extreme watercooling, that crucial 1333 memory, gigabyte mb, case, DVDRW, WD black edition HD, and an 850w ps for under a grand after combo discounts, so one more 5850 = $1300 and I'm betting a 720 running at 4.4ghz on water would kick the snizzle out of this thing.
Score
-1
cknobman
December 23, 2009 1:29:08 PM
notty22
December 23, 2009 1:39:41 PM
fozzie76The "study" you guys did a while back shows that 3 cores seem to be the sweet spot for gaming right now. The build I'm about ready to buy from NewEgg is an AMD 720 with a 5850 vid card, apogee extreme watercooling, that crucial 1333 memory, gigabyte mb, case, DVDRW, WD black edition HD, and an 850w ps for under a grand after combo discounts, so one more 5850 = $1300 and I'm betting a 720 running at 4.4ghz on water would kick the snizzle out of this thing.
Your joking right ?
Score
2
jcknouse
December 23, 2009 1:47:37 PM
Anonymous
December 23, 2009 2:16:43 PM
fozzie76
December 23, 2009 2:17:25 PM
I just built one for a friend, got it to 4ghz on air using a zalman 120mm heatsink. 3.8 to 4ghz seems to be the standard for air on the 720be, just read the reviews on newegg. If you only pulled 3.4 you must be using that crap stock AMD heatsink. Took me all of 5 minutes.. bumped up the vcore and adjusted the multiplier.. runs about 59C with all 3 cores maxed.
Score
0
Someguyperson
December 23, 2009 2:26:41 PM
While the build id impressive, I think it missed the point of a "Mid-range" gaming machine. Graphics performance is outstanding, but this setup just wants a 2560x1600 monitor, which is almost the price of the machine itself! Even with eyefinity, three half decent 1080P monitors with the Displayport to DVI adapter, you're talking $700 worth of monitors, which is half the cost of the machine itself. I'm not saying it's a bad build, it's just the graphical preformance is way beyond the call of duty. I do think the machines should include monitors, keyboard, mouse, speakers, etc. to reflect a much better idea of how much it would cost to play a game at a specific resolution.
Score
4
Crashman
December 23, 2009 2:42:14 PM
AmaneeFor the same build on Newegg's wattage calculator, Newegg is suggesting about 300 watts more than the max CPU/GPU load that Tom's showed on the power/temperature benchmarks. Is Newegg always off on this?
Newegg has lots of "padding" in its numbers to help account for having too much power on the wrong rail and not enough on the rail you need.
Score
2
redgarl
December 23, 2009 2:45:49 PM
uh_no
December 23, 2009 2:47:49 PM
redgarl
December 23, 2009 2:50:04 PM
xtc28
December 23, 2009 3:05:08 PM
billiardicus
December 23, 2009 3:11:51 PM
billiardicus
December 23, 2009 3:15:45 PM
Nice build. But no one builds a $1300 pc, and suddenly discovers they don't have another $50 for a good cooler. That's irritating, because everyone who built this pc would have put in a cooler and got a much better overclock.
I wish you guys would worry less about meeting an exact budget, and instead build 3 different pcs in the 500-700, 1000-1400, and 2000-3000 range.
Not including a aftermarket cooler in this build is just rediculous.
I wish you guys would worry less about meeting an exact budget, and instead build 3 different pcs in the 500-700, 1000-1400, and 2000-3000 range.
Not including a aftermarket cooler in this build is just rediculous.
Score
0
sincreator
December 23, 2009 3:18:40 PM
AmaneeFor the same build on Newegg's wattage calculator, Newegg is suggesting about 300 watts more than the max CPU/GPU load that Tom's showed on the power/temperature benchmarks. Is Newegg always off on this?
I always use the thermaltake PSU calculator: http://www.thermaltake.outervision.com/
Score
0
efficentD
December 23, 2009 3:20:19 PM
someguypersonWhile the build id impressive, I think it missed the point of a "Mid-range" gaming machine. Graphics performance is outstanding, but this setup just wants a 2560x1600 monitor, which is almost the price of the machine itself! Even with eyefinity, three half decent 1080P monitors with the Displayport to DVI adapter, you're talking $700 worth of monitors, which is half the cost of the machine itself. I'm not saying it's a bad build, it's just the graphical preformance is way beyond the call of duty. I do think the machines should include monitors, keyboard, mouse, speakers, etc. to reflect a much better idea of how much it would cost to play a game at a specific resolution.
Maybe even the OS (even thought that is easy for someone to add) if we are going that far. I agree with the idea of building one 2560x1600, one 1920x1200 and one 1650x1050 one month and just let us know what other goodies like water cooling, TV cards, SSD, big storage, etc. you can get and still stay in budget and make great performance in the respective resolution tier. Maybe even bump up the budget to 1,2 and 3K or more to make it work with the peripherals and whatnot. 120 FPS is nice, but I really can't process information that fast, even if my PC can.
Great articles, always. Research is always interesting, especially since Tom's keeps it fresh by mixing it up.
Score
0
rambo117
December 23, 2009 3:28:05 PM
xtc28
December 23, 2009 3:45:13 PM
coldmast
December 23, 2009 4:10:12 PM
coldmast
December 23, 2009 4:18:30 PM
AmaneeFor the same build on Newegg's wattage calculator, Newegg is suggesting about 300 watts more than the max CPU/GPU load that Tom's showed on the power/temperature benchmarks. Is Newegg always off on this?
yeah, according to newegg you need 1100 W power supply for yesterdays $2500 machine - and clearly it doesn't; but hey it's newegg and when you go up 200W that usually means your getting dinged for an extra $50, plus their are a lot of PSUs that can't deliver their advertised wattage or adequate clean power even on a good day.
sincreatorI always use the thermaltake PSU calculator: http://www.thermaltake.outervision.com/
thanks for the tip
Score
0
sincreator
December 23, 2009 4:37:32 PM
@Coldmast. I usually put the CPU utilization(TDP) to 100%, and I also put the system load to 100%. I always put the capacitor aging to 25% as well. I always recommend going about 100w above what the PSU calculator says. So if the calculator says 550w, I would recommend a 650w usually. As you can tell from the suggested PSU's that pop up, Thermaltake themselves recommend one a bit higher as well. Most likely to cover future upgrades I would guess.
Score
-1
jtabler
December 23, 2009 4:41:14 PM
jcknouse
December 23, 2009 5:06:18 PM
fozzie76I just built one for a friend, got it to 4ghz on air using a zalman 120mm heatsink. 3.8 to 4ghz seems to be the standard for air on the 720be, just read the reviews on newegg. If you only pulled 3.4 you must be using that crap stock AMD heatsink. Took me all of 5 minutes.. bumped up the vcore and adjusted the multiplier.. runs about 59C with all 3 cores maxed.
Nah. I have a ZeroTherm Nirvana NV120 on it with AS5. But, I don't get near 59C. I'd never run a CPU that hot. Mine is running 3.4GHz@26Cidle/44Cfull. Plus, mine's unlocked on 4 cores, not 3.
I'm sure I could bump the CPU-V more and raise the mult and the ref clock. Or maybe not. I might just have a weak chip. I really didn't try to OC the 720 that much. 3.4 worked for me at the time.
As for my 550BE in the new rig I just built, I unlocked it to 4 cores and overclocked it to 3.7 right now with a 92mm Zalman HSF and it's only at 1.375V and not hitting 50C full load either. That took me all of 30 mins, with rebooting for fine tuning and all...and of course, 7+ hours of Prime95 64-bit testing to ensure stability.
Besides, I don't have lots of time to sit around and tweak for 4-6 hours and compare CPU-V and its translation to increased clock or mult benefit.
I get a good stable clock right out of the chute, then I'm happy.
But...4.4GHz? C'mon. Guys on OC sites aren't even getting that on water, and they are guys who are overclocking experts.
Score
0
cadder
December 23, 2009 5:09:59 PM
lowguppy
December 23, 2009 6:00:53 PM
Computer_Lots
December 23, 2009 7:14:51 PM
Computer_Lots
December 23, 2009 7:17:01 PM
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