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Pick NEW CARD 9 vs 8 series

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April 26, 2008 4:17:58 PM


K so I'm debating weather to upgrade my liquid cool 8800 GTX to 2 in sli or the (2) 8800 ULTRA LIQUID COOL, or don’t know if to wait for the new 9 series card that might be coming in the near future. What do you guys think? As long as the ULTRA compete for at least 2 years it won’t bother me spending on it. Also the decision need to be made before next week why cause my VOODOO OMEN is going to repair and I'm debating weather to upgrade, NO I DIDN'T PAY VOODOO PRICE SO STOP SAYING I PAID FOR AN OVERPRICE PC, I pretty much paid the price for parts. ANOTHER THING, I LOVE VOODOO LIQUID COOLING SYSTEM AND IF I GET THE NEW 9 SERIES MIGHT NEED TO TAKE IT OUT, which I will hate. Ohh and if I don’t get it I won't know how to set up the water system myself since I am a noob and learning. I also want to add that this setup is being played in a 1900 x 1200 screen. Right now with a single liquid cool 8800 GTX not overclocked 620 mhz core and 975 mhz memory im getting around 23 FPS in crysis in XP setting high.

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April 26, 2008 4:29:50 PM

gonefast said:
K so I'm debating weather to upgrade my liquid cool 8800 GTX to 2 in sli or the (2) 8800 ULTRA LIQUID COOL, or don’t know if to wait for the new 9 series card that might be coming in the near future. What do you guys think? As long as the ULTRA compete for at least 2 years it won’t bother me spending on it. Also the decision need to be made before next week why cause my VOODOO OMEN is going to repair and I'm debating weather to upgrade, NO I DIDN'T PAY VOODOO PRICE SO STOP SAYING I PAID FOR AN OVERPRICE PC, I pretty much paid the price for parts. ANOTHER THING, I LOVE VOODOO LIQUID COOLING SYSTEM AND IF I GET THE NEW 9 SERIES MIGHT NEED TO TAKE IT OUT, which I will hate. Ohh and if I don’t get it I won't know how to set up the water system myself since I am a noob and learning. I also want to add that this setup is being played in a 1900 x 1200 screen. Right now with a single liquid cool 8800 GTX not overclocked 620 mhz core and 975 mhz memory im getting around 23 FPS in crysis in XP setting high.

Don't upgrade to 8800Ultra, it's still far overpriced for its performance. As you probably already know, there is a very large performance gap between the g92 and g80 gpu. It's not a good idea to get anything with the old g80 gpu. 8800Ultra is just a single g80 pushed to its limit and outfitted with the best possible components. At its core, it's still old and weak.

Your 8800gtx's performance in Crysis should be about right. With single g92 8800gts, I get 50+ fps in Crysis on "high" settings (not "highest") and the smaller 1280x1024 resolutions in Vista 64bit.

Ideally, wait for the 9900 or hd4870 to come out. It shouldn't be long now. If the 9900 use the g200 core as rumored, it should be a monster.
April 26, 2008 4:41:59 PM

Yeah we are talking months away. I am not a fan of the wait around for the next product advice but it sounds like these cards are right around the corner.
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April 26, 2008 4:42:33 PM

^^ wait for G200 or RV770 to come. 4870 = end of may/june
April 26, 2008 4:54:23 PM

I don’t want to be a pessimist but I was reading some articles when the 8800 ultra was coming out there were promising a monster like the g200. It will really bother me if these new g200 cards are just rumors and will only be a little step up from the current 9 series or even the 8 series. Where can I read more rumor info on this new g200 card? Also do you guys think that I will be able to somehow liquid cool these new g200 card like I said I love voodoo liquid system it will really bother me just leaving 1 GTX liquid cool to later find out that if I would have gotten 2 liquid cool gtx I could have used the same liquid cooling system to cool the g200. I’m telling you guys this because if I leave only the 1 GTX liquid cool and if in the future I decide to upgrade graphic cards I will be force to liquid cool only one and put some nasty fan/heat sink or used a different liquid cooling system to cool the voodoo omen setup and than it won't look like the work of art it looks right now (I don’t want to sound tooooo exaggerated but the voodoo omen looks real clean and nice without cables and **** coming our of every corner, you just have to see it to believe it).
April 26, 2008 6:06:46 PM

Save your money, unless your a die hard cyrsis fanatic, your not going to see a huge diffrence in performance from what you have now, to the g92.
I would take the wait and see stand here, so far the 9xxx series has shown to not be a jump in technology and performance, more like a hop.
April 26, 2008 6:40:37 PM

K you guys are going off in a tangent here. My question is weather to get ANOTHER liquid cool GTX, just so I can keep the VOODOO LIQUID COOLING SYSTEM TO UPGRADE LATER ON IN A YEAR WHEN THE GRAPHIC CARD LEAP IS NOTICIBLE To the SLI ENABLE NEW CARDS in a year..SECOND CHOICE IS TO UPGRADE to 2 ULTRA LIQUID COOL GRaphic CARDS, OR just KEEP MY CURRENT GTX AND UPGRADE WHEN THE NEW NVIDIA 9900 SERIES CARD COME TO THE MARKET and not do THE VOODOO LIQUID COOLING.

Question has possible of 3 answer screw the new rumor graphic cards and get another Liquid COOl GTX just to have your system quiet and liquid cool for the future. SCREW the new graphic cards that no one know about and upgrade to the LIQUID COOL 8800 ultras and sell your current GTX Liquid Cool Card. LAST CHOICE, SCREW THE 8800 ULTRA and the GTX LIQUID COOLING FROM VOODOO. JUST KEEP YOUR Current system (1 LIQUID COOL GTX) and upgrade to the new 9900 series cards when they come out in the future without any VOODOO LIQUID SYSTEM.
April 26, 2008 6:47:23 PM

Seeing as how your seeking advice, and typing in caps at us, because we gave what advice we had, you shouldnt expect a whole lot of great answers from people, calm down, this is not a life or death situation, and your yelling at us isnt going to endure us to you .
April 26, 2008 8:19:25 PM

gonefast said:
K you guys are going off in a tangent here. My question is weather to get ANOTHER liquid cool GTX, just so I can keep the VOODOO LIQUID COOLING SYSTEM TO UPGRADE LATER ON IN A YEAR WHEN THE GRAPHIC CARD LEAP IS NOTICIBLE To the SLI ENABLE NEW CARDS in a year..SECOND CHOICE IS TO UPGRADE to 2 ULTRA LIQUID COOL GRaphic CARDS, OR just KEEP MY CURRENT GTX AND UPGRADE WHEN THE NEW NVIDIA 9900 SERIES CARD COME TO THE MARKET and not do THE VOODOO LIQUID COOLING.

Question has possible of 3 answer screw the new rumor graphic cards and get another Liquid COOl GTX just to have your system quiet and liquid cool for the future. SCREW the new graphic cards that no one know about and upgrade to the LIQUID COOL 8800 ultras and sell your current GTX Liquid Cool Card. LAST CHOICE, SCREW THE 8800 ULTRA and the GTX LIQUID COOLING FROM VOODOO. JUST KEEP YOUR Current system (1 LIQUID COOL GTX) and upgrade to the new 9900 series cards when they come out in the future without any VOODOO LIQUID SYSTEM.

Don't get another g80 8800gtx, it's long since obsolete, and makes no sense.

8800ultra is still too expensive, and is just the same old g80 pushed to its limits. In term of hardware, it's already obsolete, in term of performance, it will very soon. It's still the fastest single core card only when you compare stock speeds. When you slightly oc newer cards, they outperform the Ultra. Ultra itself cannot overclock any further.

Keep your current system, until 9900 or 4870 comes out, then see which one perform better.

You should really wait. There aren't any truely attractive options for high performance right now. The 9800gx2 is just 2 underclocked g92 put together. The 9800gtx is a farce, see benchmark against g92 8800gts:
http://en.expreview.com/2008/04/03/geforce-9800gtx-revi...
April 26, 2008 8:39:57 PM

nonono... The CAPS does not imply yelling in any way... What I put in caps were mainly the items I have or want, and the options I have.... I use it this way as a skiming mechanism so people dont have to read the post in the entirely.... Thank you for pointing it out.
April 26, 2008 8:49:12 PM

Np thanks for the clarification, next time i would try changing the font color so there's no confusion. Aparently your fond of your liquid cooled system. What games do you play? unless you play on a ungodly large monitor, or in the same aspect, ungodly high ratio's, i would keep what i got and wait for a real performance diffrence. Personally i consider the 9xxx series a hop in technology and performance, and not the leap we would all like to see. When ati gets it in gear and starts coming out with cards that are pushing the nvidia ones, well finally see a real performance gain.
April 26, 2008 8:55:26 PM

blacksci said:
Np thanks for the clarification, next time i would try changing the font color so there's no confusion. Aparently your fond of your liquid cooled system. What games do you play? unless you play on a ungodly large monitor, or in the same aspect, ungodly high ratio's, i would keep what i got and wait for a real performance diffrence. Personally i consider the 9xxx series a hop in technology and performance, and not the leap we would all like to see. When ati gets it in gear and starts coming out with cards that are pushing the nvidia ones, well finally see a real performance gain.

Well, the 9800gtx, as you can see on that benchmark, is more like a hop backward in term of performance. Hopefully the 9900 will be the leap.
April 26, 2008 9:00:49 PM

Lol, well i wasnt going to say it, because i hate all the people who cant admit they made a mistake going with it, but yeah i agree.
a b U Graphics card
April 26, 2008 9:01:55 PM

gonefast said:
nonono... The CAPS does not imply yelling in any way...
Yes Yes Yesssssssssss! The Caps were not necessary.

April 26, 2008 9:12:28 PM

Yeah I'll change the font color (remember I'm new I dont even know how to work with these forum yet). I feel the same way as you guys the 9800 that just came out do not amaze me that much. The 9 series I was referring to in my previous post were the upcoming 9900. Yes I play on 1900 x 1200 resolution that's one of the reason I only get 23 average FPS in crysis. I play crysis, world in conflict, supreme commander. Right now what I'm leaning toward just getting another 8800 gtx just to have the Voodoo liquid system for two cards, so in the future I can upgrade on my own. Hopefully they'll make the kit for it cause these Voodoo liquid tubes are big they are not 1/4 more like 3/4.
April 26, 2008 11:59:31 PM

dagger said:
Don't upgrade to 8800Ultra, it's still far overpriced for its performance. As you probably already know, there is a very large performance gap between the g92 and g80 gpu. It's not a good idea to get anything with the old g80 gpu. 8800Ultra is just a single g80 pushed to its limit and outfitted with the best possible components. At its core, it's still old and weak.

Your 8800gtx's performance in Crysis should be about right. With single g92 8800gts, I get 50+ fps in Crysis on "high" settings (not "highest") and the smaller 1280x1024 resolutions in Vista 64bit.

Ideally, wait for the 9900 or hd4870 to come out. It shouldn't be long now. If the 9900 use the g200 core as rumored, it should be a monster.


That might be a bit of a stretch. The Ultra performs better than

8800GT
8800GTS
9600GT
9800GTX in about half of the games
All these cards have newer cores and none are that much faster than G80. The gap is not that big between a 9800GTX and a Ultra. Also I dont think that the G80 was pushed to its limit. G80 was quite memory-starved as i recall, it had a very fast core but the bandwidth was its bottleneck mainly.
So to say it's old and weak is a bit of an exaggeration. it's still a high=end card
April 27, 2008 1:00:58 AM

DarthPiggie said:
That might be a bit of a stretch. The Ultra performs better than

8800GT
8800GTS
9600GT
9800GTX in about half of the games
All these cards have newer cores and none are that much faster than G80. The gap is not that big between a 9800GTX and a Ultra. Also I dont think that the G80 was pushed to its limit. G80 was quite memory-starved as i recall, it had a very fast core but the bandwidth was its bottleneck mainly.
So to say it's old and weak is a bit of an exaggeration. it's still a high=end card


K so do you think that ULTRA is better than the 8800 gtx at the moment, or can the GTX be clocked to ultra speed or more??? Can the ULTRA stayed as a performance graphic card for at least 1 or 2 year.
April 27, 2008 1:05:08 AM

I think at the curent pace, honestly, yes the ultra will stay around as a strong competitor. But what the point is that its is price inefficient. You could get a G92 card which performs almost close and is significantly cheaper.
April 27, 2008 1:30:57 AM

DarthPiggie said:
I think at the curent pace, honestly, yes the ultra will stay around as a strong competitor. But what the point is that its is price inefficient. You could get a G92 card which performs almost close and is significantly cheaper.



G92 8800gts vs g80 8800ultra benchmark:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3175&p=3

See that g92 8800gt is behind Ultra in most games, but not by much. In Crysis, it outperforms Ultra on 1280x1024 (60+ fps), and perform about the same on higher resolutions. This is stock, not oced. If oced, 8800gts will outperform Ultra on almost all games

Keep in mind the stock g92 8800gts (as tested) runs at 650mhz core, which can be easily overclocked to at least 750mhz without heat or artifacting problems, often as high as 800mhz. While the Ultra is already pushed to its limit, and the old g80 core just won't go any further.
April 27, 2008 1:42:38 AM

I cant stand those charts, they're so gay (not that being gay is bad).
April 27, 2008 1:43:15 AM

DarthPiggie said:
I think at the current pace, honestly, yes the ultra will stay around as a strong competitor. But what the point is that its is price inefficient. You could get a G92 card which performs almost close and is significantly cheaper.

So do you think the 8800 ULTRA will be a wise investment for a one year/ two year return? Is it a better investment to just get another 8800 GTX and overclocked it, considering they are cheaper and I already have one installed which means I will just need to buy an extra GTX instead of 2 ULTRAS.
April 27, 2008 2:00:15 AM

gonefast said:
So do you think the 8800 ULTRA will be a wise investment for a one year/ two year return? Is it a better investment to just get another 8800 GTX and overclocked it, considering they are cheaper and I already have one installed which means I will just need to buy an extra GTX instead of 2 ULTRAS.

It's not good investment. See chart. Oh yeah, that's a nice chart. :na: 

And gay people are hot. :D 
April 27, 2008 2:04:25 AM

yea us straight guys are just scraps left over from homosexuals
April 27, 2008 3:49:06 AM

The 9900 is slotted to be released in July. If you have a card already I would wait. The G92 series are junk. As with everything in life you get what you pay for. 8800GTX was a $600.00 and is built like one, the (g92) 8800 is a 250.00 card and is built like one. Last year's cards were a joke. I recently bought 2 Asus 9600gt Silents simply to get me by because nothing released lately is worth a crap. If I were looking to get fastest cards for high resolution I would be looking at the 8800GTX or Ultra. And yes you should be able to get 1-2 years out of an 8800Ultra. Regardless of what people say it is still one of fastest single cards on the market.
April 27, 2008 3:57:13 AM

Wow what an insatiable thirst for performance.
April 27, 2008 4:46:05 AM

cisco said:
The 9900 is slotted to be released in July. If you have a card already I would wait. The G92 series are junk. As with everything in life you get what you pay for. 8800GTX was a $600.00 and is built like one, the (g92) 8800 is a 250.00 card and is built like one. Last year's cards were a joke. I recently bought 2 Asus 9600gt Silents simply to get me by because nothing released lately is worth a crap. If I were looking to get fastest cards for high resolution I would be looking at the 8800GTX or Ultra. And yes you should be able to get 1-2 years out of an 8800Ultra. Regardless of what people say it is still one of fastest single cards on the market.



Kind of funny you say the G92 were junk, and yet they were only a few frames behind the ultra, and in some tests were ahead of it, for a much cheaper price. Id really be interested to know where you get your information.
April 27, 2008 5:41:37 AM

When I say junk I am referring to build quality. There is a huge difference between the 8800GTS g80 and the 8800GT g92. Its also a lot less money, I know. The g92 GTS is not bad. Even build quality aside, how many times in the past have we seen the lastest gen card come out and not beat the previous generation? Never. If they had stayed true to form the 8800GT would have been faster than the 8800GTX from the previous generation. I know "junk" is strong and a bit overboard, but I am very disappointed that Nvidia crippled a potentially very fast card. My guess is they were trying to save money because ATI announced they were not going to release any high end cards last year. They said they were going to focus on main stream cards.
April 27, 2008 7:23:34 AM

Why not just go quad sli its cheaper than two ultras. If u don't like the gx2 you could sli the 1gb versions of the 9800gtx since that would beat the 8800ultra and the 9800gtx is a better overclocker than the ultra.
April 27, 2008 8:53:34 AM

Could I overclocked my 8800GTX to 8800ULTRA MHZ or Can the Ultras get an even higher MHZ. Im thinking that I might want to go as far as 800 MHZ or 750 MHZ is it too much to ask?? Will a high MHZ reduce the life of the card?
April 27, 2008 8:57:28 AM

darthvaderkenneth said:
Why not just go quad sli its cheaper than two ultras. If u don't like the gx2 you could sli the 1gb versions of the 9800gtx since that would beat the 8800ultra and the 9800gtx is a better overclocker than the ultra.

Let me clear something up. Im not getting any of 9800 GTX or GX2 because I dont think they are any good performance wise at high resolution. Another thing the only cards that VOODOO has in all their build are the 8800 GTX and the 8800 ULTRAS(I Wonder Why????) and I have to pick between one of the twos.
April 27, 2008 9:06:36 AM

wait for the 9900 m8
April 27, 2008 10:48:58 AM

For a REsolution of 1080p, I 'd say go for 9800 GTXs since they are around 300$ each and have the option of going tri sli.

From what results I hear is that the 9 series loose at high res agains the 8800 GTXs and ULtras, but the benchmarks I've seen were in favor of the 9 series even at high resolutions, and where the 9 series lost at high and the 8800 ultras/GTXs won were still barely playable.

You already have 1 GTX and prob the smartest suggestion would be to go with another 8800 GTX since it would save you alot of money and they keep dropping in price. But their resale value is also going down too.

Either way if it were me, and I wanted top of the line for now, I would go with the 9800 GX2, since it has quad possiblities, but for most it would be stay the same and add another GTX or go 9800 GTX.

I don't want to say wait for a new series because we don't know how they will do.
April 27, 2008 2:33:19 PM

The old g80 8800gts 640mb still beats stock g92 8800gts 512mb on higher aa settings. See graph:

http://en.expreview.com/2008/04/02/g80-vs-g92-hi-end-ge...



The g92 8800gts overclocks much more than the g80 8800gtx though ( core@800mhz shown, 650mhz stock).

http://en.expreview.com/2008/04/02/g80-vs-g92-hi-end-ge...



The g92 8800gts overclocked, outperforms 9800gtx, which in turn outperforms g80 8800gtx. (core@675mhz shown, 650mhz stock)

http://en.expreview.com/2008/04/03/geforce-9800gtx-revi...

The g80 8800 ultra still outperforms stock g92 8800gts on nearly all games, except Oblivion and some resolutions of Crysis.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3175&p=3

When overclocked, g92 8800gts outperforms stock g80 8800 ultra on most games. G80 8800gts ultra is already pushed to its limits, and cannot be overclocked.

G80 8800gts (320mb and 640mb) do not perform on par with g92 8800gts, g80 8800gtx, g80 8800 ultra, and are on different leagues at this point.

I know many people are still fond of old g80 gpu. It was truely revolutionary back when it came out. The g92 gpu is more of a step forward instead of leap, as with the g80. But it is a solid step forward. And its performance is beyond question. Technology moves forward all the time. This "loyalty" to old technology makes no sense. The g80 had its place in history. But at this point, it IS history. No good thing lasts forever. Let it go.
April 27, 2008 3:52:29 PM

I understand that the G80 is good but it is now part of history. But, 1)I either keep my current card that is GTX liquid cool or I dont liquid cool one more card GTX or ULTRA and will have to add fan and other cooling to the case to add the 9 series. When you guys say that the Ultra are overclock to its limits it confuse me, can the GTX in theory be overclock to higher MHZ than the ULTRAS. Why aren't the ultras overclockable any further, I've seen Ultras at around 700 MHZ and 720 mhz... Remember these cards are I'm referring to are liquid cool I am not sure if you guys are referring to the ULTRAS or GTX that are not liquid cool.
April 27, 2008 4:03:05 PM

gonefast said:
I understand that the G80 is good but it is now part of history. But, 1)I either keep my current card that is GTX liquid cool or I dont liquid cool one more card GTX or ULTRA and will have to add fan and other cooling to the case to add the 9 series. When you guys say that the Ultra are overclock to its limits it confuse me, can the GTX in theory be overclock to higher MHZ than the ULTRAS. Why aren't the ultras overclockable any further, I've seen Ultras at around 700 MHZ and 720 mhz... Remember these cards are I'm referring to are liquid cool I am not sure if you guys are referring to the ULTRAS or GTX that are not liquid cool.

Let's just say Ultras are not further overclockable for the non-1337. Some people have claimed to overclock 8800gtx to ultra speeds. Not sure if they're using volt modding or anything of the kind. The 2 cards use the same memory bandwidth and the same core.

I know it seems like a waste of your liquid cooling, but the stock coolers from 8800gts/gtx/ultra cards (g80 or g92) are very good, and keeps cards cool even while highly overclocked.

It's still best to wait for the 9900 and 4870. :p 
April 27, 2008 4:03:16 PM

I still think your best bet is to wait until July if you can make it. The 9900 is based on the GT200 architecture and should be fast. If I bought the new 9800Gx2, I would be pissed to see it is being replaced in July. They got a whole 4 months out of that model. That is why I just bought to mainstream cards that would run faster than any single card out right now. Then I'll let the prices drop on the 9900 then upgrade at the end of the year. 9600GT SLI runs well enough to get me by. I don't know if I would even qualify the g92 as a solid step forward since it didn't even take the performance crown away. I would call it more of a side step. They made better mainstream cards but they didn't overtake the high end. I think the first clue was the fact they called it the 8800 series. Should have at least called it the 8900 series for nothing else to reduce confusion. There is clearly a difference in the cost of manufacturer, just look at the current prices. I doubt we will see the 8800 (g80) fade away until the new 9900 series. I think it would have been a card of the past had they included the same amount of ram and the higher bit interface found on the G80.
April 27, 2008 4:09:46 PM

cisco said:
I still think your best bet is to wait until July if you can make it. The 9900 is based on the GT200 architecture and should be fast. If I bought the new 980Gx2, I would be pissed to see it is being replaced in July. They got a whole 4 months out of that model. That is why I just bought to mainstream cards that would run faster than any single card out right now. Then I'll let the prices drop on the 9900 then upgrade at the end of the year. 9900GT SLI runs well enough to get me by. I don't know if I would even qualify the g92 as a solid step forward since it didn't even take the performance crown away. I would call it more of a side step. They made better mainstream cards but they didn't overtake the high end. I think the first clue was the fact they called it the 8800 series. Should have at least called it the 8900 series for nothing else to reduce confusion. There is clearly a difference in the cost of manufacturer, just look at the current prices. I doubt we will see the 8800 (g80) fade away until the new 9900 series. I think it would have been a card of the past had they included the same amount of ram and the higher bit interface found on the G80.

The g92 8800gts is crippled with low memory bandwidth. The 9800gtx is a farce, crippled with the same low memory bandwidth. The g92 8800gts is meant to be in the same tier as g80 8800gts, not the elite g80 ultra.

There's a reason for Nvidia to cripple current g92 cards like this. I hope it is not for making 9900 with non-crippled g92. There have been some rumors that the 9900 isn't actually based on the g200. That would suck.
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