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Genericked!

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Anonymous
July 25, 2005 9:52:27 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Argh. RorShok got GenericHeroed. I used the free tailoring to redo his
outfit pretty much the same. Have a couple of analogue names to submit.
Arrgh Arrgh Arrgh.

Maybe "GM Pounder" will do. Or "SnitchWhacker".

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= *******: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!

More about : genericked

Anonymous
July 25, 2005 10:52:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Shenanigunner" <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote in message
news:Xns969DE8B0CDBECnitropressatnitrosyn@216.168.3.44...
> Argh. RorShok got GenericHeroed. I used the free tailoring to redo his
> outfit pretty much the same. Have a couple of analogue names to submit.
> Arrgh Arrgh Arrgh.
>
> Maybe "GM Pounder" will do. Or "SnitchWhacker".

LOL.

Bummer.

I don't suppose they'd take "Raw Shark"? :) 


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 18 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
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Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 1:27:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 05:52:27 -0000, Shenanigunner
<shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote:

> Argh. RorShok got GenericHeroed. I used the free tailoring to redo his
> outfit pretty much the same. Have a couple of analogue names to submit.
> Arrgh Arrgh Arrgh.

I am only moderately surprised. Personally I never intentionally get
close to known names from superhero history. But I have probably only ever
seen or heard about a minority of all the superhero names that have
existed through the times, so who knows when the Generic hammer will hit.

--
"When someone starts bragging about how much debt they have, it's not a
good sign." -G
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 3:01:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Magnus Itland" <itlandm@online.no> wrote in message
news:o psugkb5apb52ai9@news.online.no...
> On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 05:52:27 -0000, Shenanigunner
> <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote:
>
>> Argh. RorShok got GenericHeroed. I used the free tailoring to redo his
>> outfit pretty much the same. Have a couple of analogue names to submit.
>> Arrgh Arrgh Arrgh.
>
> I am only moderately surprised. Personally I never intentionally get
> close to known names from superhero history. But I have probably only ever
> seen or heard about a minority of all the superhero names that have
> existed through the times, so who knows when the Generic hammer will hit.
>

Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros name.
LIke you said if you can't be similar there would only be 5 different names.

The Inhumane Torche
triumph
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 7:32:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Vorlonagent" <jt@otfresno.com> wrote:
> I don't suppose they'd take "Raw Shark"? :) 

Third choice. We'll see.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= *******: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 7:33:28 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no> wrote:
> I am only moderately surprised.

As am I. I've never been inclined to clone a known hero; this was something
of a lark. I have some good alternate names in for replacement.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= *******: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 7:35:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
> name.

Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 

I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= *******: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 7:35:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

">> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>> name.
>
> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>
> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.
>
I'll bite what was it in.
And I'm 42 sonny
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 7:35:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:35:07 -0000, Shenanigunner
<shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote:

>"gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>> name.
>
>Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>
>I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.

Without trenchcoats and a morphing mask?
Anonymous
July 25, 2005 10:15:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>>> name.

>> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 

>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.

> I'll bite what was it in.

Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
characters in a series full of interesting characters. RorShok was as
close a visual copy as I could make (his mask was a problem, but
everything else was do-able), the name was as close as any available (the
actual name being either taken or blocked) and his backstory was
identical. I won't do it again. :) 

> And I'm 42 sonny

Don't call your elders "sonny," kid. :) 

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= RorShok: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 1:14:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Shenanigunner" <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote in message
news:Xns969E7274F3A07nitropressatnitrosyn@216.168.3.44...
> "gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>>>> name.
>
>>> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>
>>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.
>
>> I'll bite what was it in.
>
> Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
> characters in a series full of interesting characters. RorShok was as
> close a visual copy as I could make (his mask was a problem, but
> everything else was do-able), the name was as close as any available (the
> actual name being either taken or blocked) and his backstory was
> identical. I won't do it again. :) 
>
>> And I'm 42 sonny
>
Like I said its pretty lame when its not spelled the same and it isnt an
exact copy.
Dude in trench coat with a hat come on.
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 5:11:16 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

gildhaus wrote:
> Shenanigunner wrote:
>> gildhaus wrote:
>>>>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>>>>> name.
>>>>
>>>> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>>>>
>>>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.
>>>
>>> I'll bite what was it in.
>>
>> Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
>> characters in a series full of interesting characters. RorShok was as
>> close a visual copy as I could make (his mask was a problem, but
>> everything else was do-able), the name was as close as any available (the
>> actual name being either taken or blocked) and his backstory was
>> identical. I won't do it again. :) 
>>
>>> And I'm 42 sonny
>
> Like I said its pretty lame when its not spelled the same and it isnt an
> exact copy.
> Dude in trench coat with a hat come on.

By the law, it need only be 80% similar to justify trademark
infringement (alright, not technically "by law," but that is the
percentage generally used as a litmus by courts). Similar-sounding name
and costume would be enough.
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 6:08:36 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Magnus, Robot Fighter." <me@key.com> wrote:
>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.

> Without trenchcoats and a morphing mask?

The suit worked pretty well, and I tried a couple of the masks in black
and white. I got a full image respec and rebuilt the same look, using the
sliders and some new mask choices to make it even better.

They wouldn't let me use:

RawShark
Kovacs
KoVaX

though. (Walter Kovacs is Rorschach's real name.) I thought the last was
ridiculous, but hokay fiiiine.

He's now Mr Cellophane. (After "Chicago.")

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 7:53:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote in
news:Xns969EC2BD688D4nitropressatnitrosyn@216.168.3.44:

>
> He's now Mr Cellophane. (After "Chicago.")
>

It's amazing that RA Heinlein hasn't been name-nerf'd
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 8:54:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

J Anlee <janlee@ameritech.net> wrote:
> It's amazing that RA Heinlein hasn't been name-nerf'd

Neither copyrighted nor a comic book issue; why bother?

Besides, I'd come back with written permission from the estate trustees if
I had to. <fx evil grin>

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 10:19:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

>Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no> wrote:
>> I am only moderately surprised.
>
>As am I. I've never been inclined to clone a known hero; this was something
>of a lark. I have some good alternate names in for replacement.

I almost did one once (pre lawsuit) but never did actually make him.
A certain red and yellow armored fellow, who, since i'd spoken out many
times against the whole cloning thing in game and newsgroups, I was
going to call "Ironic Man."

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
July 26, 2005 11:30:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

George Johnson wrote:
>
> What we really need is a ring tone that’ll increase people’s IQs.
>
>

No no no no. This is way more amusing, except for the bit about not
using tasers on the idiots.

--
I no longer need to punish, deceive or compromise myself. Unless, of
course, I want to stay employed.
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 3:55:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner <shenanigunner@nodgathspam.kom> wrote:
>"gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>>>> name.
>
>>> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>
>>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.
>
>> I'll bite what was it in.
>
>Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
>characters in a series full of interesting characters. RorShok was as
>close a visual copy as I could make (his mask was a problem, but
>everything else was do-able), the name was as close as any available (the
>actual name being either taken or blocked) and his backstory was
>identical. I won't do it again. :) 
>

I have no comment on Rorschach in general, though I agree that anyone
who is a comic book fan who hasn't read Moore's Watchmen should go and
do so. We'll wait.

I did, however, want to tie this thread into the twinkie thread
elsegroup:

http://www.fullyramblomatic.com/features/rorschach.htm

-R

--
Rob Wynne / The Autographed Cat / doc@america.net
http://www.autographedcat.com/ / http://autographedcat.livejournal.com/
Gafilk 2006: Jan 6-8, 2006 -- Atlanta, GA -- http://www.gafilk.org/
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 4:27:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:
>
> Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
> characters in a series full of interesting characters.

I re-read Watchmen a few weeks ago. I still say we were being laughed at,
not with.

And it must really stick in Moore's craw that not only did conservatives not
destroy the world, but we won the cold war, too.

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 26, 2005 7:40:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Rob Wynne <doc@america.net> wrote:
> I have no comment on Rorschach in general, though I agree that anyone
> who is a comic book fan who hasn't read Moore's Watchmen should go and
> do so. We'll wait.
>
> I did, however, want to tie this thread into the twinkie thread
> elsegroup:
>
> http://www.fullyramblomatic.com/features/rorschach.htm

Oh. My. Ghod. Major screen splatter!

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 12:40:00 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:

>> "We" who? Comix fans? No way.

> Yes, comics fans. Moore portrayed superheroes as, at best neurotic
> busybodies acting out their fantasies because they can't cope with
> their own inadequacies, and at worst as psychopathic fascists.

I don't see that as "laughing at us" unless you take your comic book
heroes very, very seriously and can't tolerate an alternate view. Moore
was doing something quite different from adding to the list of comic
titles: he was postulating that real people turned themselves into real
caped/costumed crusaders instead of reading comics about them.
Fascinating idea, one that's never been really well-explored. Fascinating
and thought-provoking take on it.

I think the concept that "real" costumed crimefighters are likely to be a
little bent, a little off the rails, a little strange - like Batman but
without the kewlness - is a better take than viewing them as completely
normal people who, say, happen to have the strength of a gorilla.

(I'll ignore the rest of this exchange.)

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 5:30:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 11:55:03 GMT, Rob Wynne <doc@america.net> wrote:

> I have no comment on Rorschach in general, though I agree that anyone
> who is a comic book fan who hasn't read Moore's Watchmen should go and
> do so. We'll wait.
>
> I did, however, want to tie this thread into the twinkie thread
> elsegroup:
>
> http://www.fullyramblomatic.com/features/rorschach.htm

My life has been incomplete until this day.

--
"When someone starts bragging about how much debt they have, it's not a
good sign." -G
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 5:30:43 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no> wrote:
>> http://www.fullyramblomatic.com/features/rorschach.htm

> My life has been incomplete until this day.

I had to print it out and file it in my copy of Watchmen.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 3:05:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:

> I don't see that as "laughing at us" unless you take your comic book
> heroes very, very seriously and can't tolerate an alternate view.

Watchmen is not an "alternate view"; it is a deconstruction of comic books
and superheroes. This was deliberate on his part -- he once said in a guest
op-ed in Amazing Heroes that he and Frank Miller had killed the superhero
genre (as if). Comic books are just melodramatic morality plays, though, and
superheroes are metaphors. Attacking them for being metaphors is just silly.


> Moore was doing something quite different from adding to the list of comic
> titles: he was postulating that real people turned themselves into real
> caped/costumed crusaders instead of reading comics about them.

No, he was just using the Charleston characters DC had recently acquired,
only with their names changed. He had wanted to use the originals but DC
wanted to incorporate those characters into the post-Crisis universe. It
happened that except for Captain Atom (Dr. Manhatten) those characters were
pretty much costumed normals.

> Fascinating idea, one that's never been really well-explored.

Are you putting me on? Early comic and pulp characters were more like the
Lone Ranger and Zorro than Superman. Please.

> I think the concept that "real" costumed crimefighters are likely to be a
> little bent, a little off the rails, a little strange - like Batman but
> without the kewlness - is a better take than viewing them as completely
> normal people who, say, happen to have the strength of a gorilla.

Watchman was an explication of all the reasons why superheroes wouldn't
"really" work. Duh, Alan, we knew that -- it's a FANTASY. Perhaps next he
would like to explain that we really can't banish all the evil in the world by
throwing a ring into a volcano.

You're not seeing the forest for the trees. The message of Watchmen is the
same as the message of the "censorship episode" of The Simpsons: one person
can change the world but probably shouldn't. That message puts the book into
the same catagory as Dark Knight: technically brilliant and artistically bankrupt.

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 8:10:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
> You're not seeing the forest for the trees.

If you say so.

(I've written more about Watchmen, its meaning and its milieu, and in
loftier circles than usenet, than I care to list here. I'm not here for the
intellectual wrangling; I get plenty of that nearly everywhere else. I also
don't think comics need the special-pleading defenses you're throwing up.)

Back to bitching about powers slotting.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 8:17:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:

> Back to bitching about powers slotting.

I wish we got 3 x slots a level earlier than 30.

--
John Parkinson
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 8:27:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

John Parkinson <jp--usenet--spam--trap@destiny.org.uk> wrote:
>Shenanigunner wrote:
>
>> Back to bitching about powers slotting.
>
>I wish we got 3 x slots a level earlier than 30.
>

Me too. My kat/regen is about halfway to 29, and I'm looking forward to
getting into the 30s so I can finally start slotting up some of the
stuff I haven't been able to slot properly before.

-R

--
Rob Wynne / The Autographed Cat / doc@america.net
http://www.autographedcat.com/ / http://autographedcat.livejournal.com/
Gafilk 2006: Jan 6-8, 2006 -- Atlanta, GA -- http://www.gafilk.org/
Anonymous
July 27, 2005 9:24:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:

> (I've written more about Watchmen, its meaning and its milieu, and in
> loftier circles than usenet, than I care to list here. I'm not here for the
> intellectual wrangling; I get plenty of that nearly everywhere else. I also
> don't think comics need the special-pleading defenses you're throwing up.)

One of the less competent uses of the "so there, nyah!" defenses I've seen.

Next!

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 2:14:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
> One of the less competent uses of the "so there, nyah!" defenses
> I've seen.

*Sigh*. There isn't enough time in the world to take on someone who thinks
their particular area of interest is somehow not subject to the accepted
ground rules of criticism and analysis. Especially someone who cites "The
Simpsons" as a reference.

How 'bout them Ice Blaster nerfs, hmm? Ain't that a bitch?

(Oh, you still want to play? Okay: Explain to me, in detail and with
supporting references, the storyline-shaking implications of panel 1:25:4.)

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 4:02:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:

> *Sigh*. There isn't enough time in the world to take on someone who thinks
> their particular area of interest is somehow not subject to the accepted
> ground rules of criticism and analysis.

And those rules would be...?

> Especially someone who cites "The Simpsons" as a reference.

This is a discussion about a comic book, so there's really no room to get
snitty over popular culture references.

> (Oh, you still want to play? Okay: Explain to me, in detail and with
> supporting references, the storyline-shaking implications of panel 1:25:4.)

Assuming I'm looking at the right panel (I only have the graphic novel),
there aren't any.

> Keep in mind that there are NO loose ends in the series, and that
> Moore and Gibbons never wasted a square centimeter of art space.

I'm sure there are people who have managed to read something into every
square centimeter of art space.

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 8:01:32 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
>> *Sigh*. There isn't enough time in the world to take on someone who
>> thinks their particular area of interest is somehow not subject to
>> the accepted ground rules of criticism and analysis.

> And those rules would be...?

Bzzt. Thanks for playing. Next!

>> (Oh, you still want to play? Okay: Explain to me, in detail and with
>> supporting references, the storyline-shaking implications of panel
>> 1:25:4.)

> Assuming I'm looking at the right panel (I only have the graphic
> novel), there aren't any.

Bzzt. I said, thanks for playing.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 8:25:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Dennis Francis Heffernan" <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:EuKdnb593u9d_3vfRVn-3g@comcast.com...
> Shenanigunner wrote:
>>
>> Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
>> characters in a series full of interesting characters.
>
> I re-read Watchmen a few weeks ago. I still say we were being laughed at,
> not with.
>
> And it must really stick in Moore's craw that not only did conservatives
> not destroy the world, but we won the cold war, too.

Actually, he's bothered more by the morose turn comics took following
Watchmen.


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 17 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
lmpact (F), Level 17 Blaster (Gun/Energy), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 8:31:38 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Dennis Francis Heffernan" <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:AeadnV0UsYplPXrfRVn-rw@comcast.com...

>> Moore was doing something quite different from adding to the list of
>> comic titles: he was postulating that real people turned themselves into
>> real caped/costumed crusaders instead of reading comics about them.
>
> No, he was just using the Charleston characters DC had recently acquired,
> only with their names changed. He had wanted to use the originals but DC
> wanted to incorporate those characters into the post-Crisis universe. It
> happened that except for Captain Atom (Dr. Manhatten) those characters
> were pretty much costumed normals.

Moore has always preferred heroes that are on the more "human" end of the
scale. Just look at he ABC comics lineup for a recent example. He can and
did write other stuff.

A deconstruction can still be instructive and fresh, the first time.

It also meant that Kurt Busick's Atro City would come as a breath of clean
air when Watchemanesque attitudes became the morose norm in comics. You can
see both Astro City and Top 10 (also by Moore) reflected in Paragon City.


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 17 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
lmpact (F), Level 17 Blaster (Gun/Energy), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 8:33:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Rob Wynne" <doc@america.net> wrote in message
news:0COFe.84$_d1.237@eagle.america.net...
> John Parkinson <jp--usenet--spam--trap@destiny.org.uk> wrote:
>>Shenanigunner wrote:
>>
>>> Back to bitching about powers slotting.
>>
>>I wish we got 3 x slots a level earlier than 30.
>>
>
> Me too. My kat/regen is about halfway to 29, and I'm looking forward to
> getting into the 30s so I can finally start slotting up some of the
> stuff I haven't been able to slot properly before.


I'm crying for powers up to level 20.

Once there, I'm crying for enhancement slots. :) 


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 17 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
lmpact (F), Level 17 Blaster (Gun/Energy), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 28, 2005 9:47:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Vorlonagent" <jt@otfresno.com> wrote:
> It also meant that Kurt Busick's Atro City would come as a breath of
> clean air when Watchemanesque attitudes became the morose norm in
> comics.

Watchmen came out in an era of dark, gloomy, dystopian tales in all
genres. Burton's Batman. Max Headroom. Other movies of the era. I could
think of some novels, too - "American Psycho," I think. One of the
things you have to do is judge it in its era of creation.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 29, 2005 2:16:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Vorlonagent" <jt@otfresno.com> wrote in message
news:SF7Ge.7738$_%4.3339@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
|
| "Dennis Francis Heffernan" <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote in message
| news:EuKdnb593u9d_3vfRVn-3g@comcast.com...
| > Shenanigunner wrote:
| >>
| >> Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
| >> characters in a series full of interesting characters.
| >
| > I re-read Watchmen a few weeks ago. I still say we were being laughed
at,
| > not with.
| >
| > And it must really stick in Moore's craw that not only did conservatives
| > not destroy the world, but we won the cold war, too.
|
| Actually, he's bothered more by the morose turn comics took following
| Watchmen.
|
|
| --
| John Trauger,
| Vorlonagent


Ah, but after that we got the VERTIGO line of comics and some other
"risky" storylines.

Granted, some of the lighthearted fun is missing now (it is not all
gone) and some of the "safe for small children" stories are no longer in
existence, but the stories are often better written now with the characters
having a more realistic personality in a super-powered world.

With any excess of serious drama, the money then is in presenting
alternatives like parody, children's comics, and funny animal tales. The
failure for other comicbook creators to realize this is their own fault. I
am damn happy over the better writing and artistic standards in place in
comicbooks today. I also know that this genre is ripe for some maverick
artist to present "safe for children" comics as there needs to be
transitional reading material in every artistic medium to allow the readers
to gradually mature to the more serious stuff if they desire it.

Alan Moore smartly recognized that a more serious mindset toward
superhero storytelling was long overdue and he ushered in an era of more
mature comics as the customerbase also matured and desired more mature
comicbooks. I think another key event that pushed the comicbook
storytelling into functionally mature zones was the wonderful "Wild Cards"
book series. The overbearing "Comics Code" neutered 2 decades of
illustrated storytelling into a "kids only" zone. If it had stayed that
way, I highly doubt that "City of Heroes" and the soon upcoming "City of
Villains" would be considered as a worthwhile venture. It would have to be
demasculated into the "kids only" zone of tepid crushingly dull blandness.

As for the future of the current political Necro-Con Empire of the
Republican DEATHCULT, well go read "Snowcrash" by Neal Stephenson. Just ask
about the trillions of dollars pissed away to support the Republican
Narco-Terrorists and their National Treasury-raiding schemes and endless
legislated expensive scams (like HMOs over Nationalizing Healthcare for
example). Most people don't even bother to calculate that the last 3
Republican Presidents are responsible for 90% of the current $7.9 trillion
dollar debt. Our nation is heading toward a Argentina-style meltdown with
China holding our IOU's in exchange for our national resources.
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

==================

http://www.wiu.edu/users/mfbhl/480/snow.htm
Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash is one of the central works of the cyberpunk
movement, presenting a singular vision of a future dominated by
privatization, anarchy, and computers. This site collects the hypertext
studies of the novel written by students in English 480, Computers and
Writing, spring 1999 and spring 2000.

http://project.cyberpunk.ru/idb/snowcrash.html
A summation
Anonymous
July 29, 2005 3:51:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Vorlonagent wrote:

> Actually, he's bothered more by the morose turn comics took following
> Watchmen.

First off, that's a retarded position for him to take. He depicted
superheroes as neurotics or murderers (or both) and *then* he wants to
complain about comics being "morose"? (And he *still* bragged about he and
Miller killing the superhero genre.)

Secondly, he's flattering himself. The Plutonium Age of comics began with
X-Men #137 and was in full swing by the time Watchmen rolled around. Watchmen
was a symptom, not a cause.

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 29, 2005 8:21:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
> Secondly, he's flattering himself. The Plutonium Age of comics
> began with X-Men #137...

Ah... but what PAGE of #137?

Time to come up for some air and light, Den.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 12:24:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Shenanigunner wrote:

> Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>Secondly, he's flattering himself. The Plutonium Age of comics
>>began with X-Men #137...
>
>
> Ah... but what PAGE of #137?

Does it matter?

> Time to come up for some air and light, Den.

Quoth someone who thinks it's necessary to analyze a comic book frame by frame.

--
Dennis F. Heffernan CoH: Venture (Virtue) hefferman@comcast.net
#include <disclaim.h> MS Messenger: Venture

"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days
when Victoria reigned!" -- T.S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 5:09:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Dennis Francis Heffernan" <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:D qOdnUeST8hO03ffRVn-sw@comcast.com...
> Vorlonagent wrote:
>
>> Actually, he's bothered more by the morose turn comics took following
>> Watchmen.
>
> First off, that's a retarded position for him to take. He depicted
> superheroes as neurotics or murderers (or both) and *then* he wants to
> complain about comics being "morose"? (And he *still* bragged about he
> and Miller killing the superhero genre.)

My word, not his.

Me, I own softcover versions of Watchmen and Dark Knight Returns, still
think they're some of the best comics ever written.

I haden't heard your Moore quote before, but it doesn't matter much. Comics
are alive and well, thankouverymuch.

I think this is a Larry Niven quote: "last words on any subject, aren't."


> Secondly, he's flattering himself. The Plutonium Age of comics began with
> X-Men #137 and was in full swing by the time Watchmen rolled around.
> Watchmen was a symptom, not a cause.

Watchmen may have been a breakthrough point that set things in high gear,
dunno. I had seen it written in several points that Watchmen was a changing
moment for comics. But then I hadn't heard about the "plutonium age"
before. This isn't a big deal to me either way. I have no ax to grind
against Moore or Miller and generally enjoy their stuff. Still, it's
probably no coincidence that the dawn of the plutonium age about coincides
with the sunset of my interest in mainstream comics beyond
carefully-selected titles.


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 17 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
lmpact (F), Level 17 Blaster (Gun/Energy), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 5:12:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

"Shenanigunner" <shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote in message
news:Xns96A16DB971A49nitropressatnitrosyn@216.168.3.44...
> "Vorlonagent" <jt@otfresno.com> wrote:
>> It also meant that Kurt Busick's Atro City would come as a breath of
>> clean air when Watchemanesque attitudes became the morose norm in
>> comics.
>
> Watchmen came out in an era of dark, gloomy, dystopian tales in all
> genres. Burton's Batman. Max Headroom. Other movies of the era. I could
> think of some novels, too - "American Psycho," I think. One of the
> things you have to do is judge it in its era of creation.

True and good point.

I've seen it read that Watchmen brought this into mainstream comics and I
never quite believed that come to think of it. There always seemed to be
some difference between what became the dark standard for comics and
Watchmen. But it could have been the crack in the dam that let that energy
into comics.

Dunno, really.


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent


"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

chat: @vorlonagent

Vorlonagent (M), level 30 Blaster (Electric/Energy), Guardian
RolIing Thunder (F), Level 25 Defender (Storm/Electric), Infinity
NightfalI (M), Level 18 Defender (Dark/Dark), Pinnacle
Steel Night (M), Level 17 Tanker (Invulnerable/Super-Strength), Virtue
lmpact (F), Level 17 Blaster (Gun/Energy), Virtue
MC-2 (F), Level 16 Blaster (Force/Fire), Protector
Girl at the Bar (F), Level 14 Controller (Mind/Empthy), Triumph
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 7:24:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

Dennis Francis Heffernan <hefferman@comcast.net> wrote:
>> Time to come up for some air and light, Den.

> Quoth someone who thinks it's necessary to analyze a comic book
> frame by frame.

I doubt Uncanny Wowzer Amazing X-Men #137 is worth analyzing frame by
frame, progenitor of the Plutonium Age or not. Watchmen contains elements
that are hard to discern and analyze meaningfully unless you do so. Moore
and Gibbons created an intense visual and textual puzzle that bears much
fruit the further you dig.

When you figure out the crucial importance of that frame, let me know.
(You've probably already found that Googling doesn't do a damned bit of
good; all you get are the two or three superficial analyses. AFAIK, the
significance of that panel has only been discussed in correspondence and
in two relatively obscure venues not subject to Googling.)

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 21 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
July 31, 2005 8:30:31 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 18:15:05 -0000, Shenanigunner
<shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote:

>"gildhaus" <gildhaus@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> Thats pretty lame I work in a comic store and thats not a comic heros
>>>> name.
>
>>> Look in the old stacks, kid. :) 
>
>>> I cop to making a too-exact clone, down to the backstory. My baaaaad.
>
>> I'll bite what was it in.
>
>Alan Moore's "Watchmen." Rorschach is one of the most fascinating
>characters in a series full of interesting characters. RorShok was as
>close a visual copy as I could make (his mask was a problem, but
>everything else was do-able), the name was as close as any available (the
>actual name being either taken or blocked) and his backstory was
>identical. I won't do it again. :) 
>
>> And I'm 42 sonny
>
>Don't call your elders "sonny," kid. :) 
and when I saw the name Aronld RorShok I though of The Dork from
Welcome Back Kotter

I also had the problem when I decided to create my current primary on
a different server than the one where I had a char that hit a wall on
Triumph, when I tried to use that name on the new server it was
blocked so I came up with something as close as possible, Desdinova
became desi Nova
Anonymous
July 31, 2005 10:29:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

The artist formerly Known as Bruce In Cleveland
<brucemorrison216@sbclgobal.invalid.net> wrote:
> I also had the problem when I decided to create my current primary on
> a different server than the one where I had a char that hit a wall on
> Triumph, when I tried to use that name on the new server it was
> blocked so I came up with something as close as possible, Desdinova
> became desi Nova

Yeah... but does she eat Twinkies?

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 39 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 31 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F
-= Mr Cellophane: Level 22 Natural Scrapper, MA/SR, M
-= R A Heinlein: Level 19 Science Controller, Ill/Rad, M
-= Justice Server =-
-= Jazz-Man: Level 8 Natural Blaster, AR/Devs, M
-= See you on HEROICA! - http://www.dgath.com/coh/
-= The UPDATED v1.00 Keybind & Macro Guide is now available!
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 4:57:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.coh (More info?)

On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 06:29:50 -0000, Shenanigunner
<shenanigunner@NOdgathSPAM.kom> wrote:

>The artist formerly Known as Bruce In Cleveland
><brucemorrison216@sbclgobal.invalid.net> wrote:
>> I also had the problem when I decided to create my current primary on
>> a different server than the one where I had a char that hit a wall on
>> Triumph, when I tried to use that name on the new server it was
>> blocked so I came up with something as close as possible, Desdinova
>> became desi Nova
>
>Yeah... but does she eat Twinkies?

Touche. Score one for Shenanigunner
!