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Cheap 9600 v. cheaper 8800 gs

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May 15, 2008 8:00:39 PM

Ok, I'm graduating and going to the local university. Since im going to get money for this event, i was wondering how to spend it. I am trying to keep this as close to 100 dollars as possible so keep that in mind.
Here are the contenders so far...
Chaintech 9600 GT http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
and

EVGA 8800 GS Superclocked http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

i have no idea which one to pick. BTW, my monitor res is 1280 x 1024 incase you need to know.

8800 9600

$105 $119
96 stream processors 64
650 core clock 650
1900 mem clock 1800
384 MB 512
194 bit 256


what do i do????
thanks and i encourage any other suggestions or comments.
a b U Graphics card
May 15, 2008 8:31:09 PM

^Agreed. Also the 9600GT can be OCed more than the 8800GS imo.

Edit:
:lol:  I was thinking about the 8800GTS.
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May 15, 2008 8:33:56 PM

They are about same in raw performance now but 8800gs would beat the 9600gt where games get more complex into the future. 9600gt is better at AA performance though. usually 0-20% better frame rates depending on the game.

http://shop1.frys.com/%7B6JGVmTC4QX+nDJ+Y7ehlJg**.node3%7D/product/5592220;jsessionid=6JGVmTC4QX+nDJ+Y7ehlJg**.node3?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Fry's has a deal for 8800gs for $80 after rebate. that is much better performance per $$$ than 9600gt.
May 15, 2008 8:34:17 PM

so the number of stream proccesors doesn't matter?
May 15, 2008 8:35:29 PM

Shadow703793 said:
^Agreed. Also the 9600GT can be OCed more than the 8800GS imo.


Like how?

Check out how much overclock I got out of my 8800gs in my sig.
May 15, 2008 8:37:47 PM

customisbetter said:
so the number of stream proccesors doesn't matter?


It does for some games but game today aren't shader limited with current generation cards. In the future though those extra SP would make substantial difference.

8800gs has massive texture fillrate over 9600gt though so it does beat 9600gt in some games and 9600gt beats 8800gs some. 9600gt has 256bit memory bus so it does better at AA.
May 15, 2008 8:42:19 PM

and the 384 is gonna hurt when things like FSAA are used.
May 15, 2008 8:46:00 PM

8800gs is good upto 1600x1200 with some AA. It takes a nose dive @ 1920x1200 with 4xAA. It can easily play most games at 1920x1200 0xAA without much of a problem though.
May 15, 2008 8:55:04 PM

I'd still go for the 9600, but it depends on the real advantage of shaders in the future, the extra ram for memory intensive appa is real and now though, but either way they are good cards.
May 15, 2008 8:57:24 PM

He may also want to use aa since he cant kick his resolution up high enough for it to not matter.
May 15, 2008 8:57:38 PM

It just depends. What monitor you are running?

I'm on 19" monitor so 9600gt is moot point with a higher price tag that performs about same at current time. However those xtra SP would help in future titles that are more complex.
May 15, 2008 9:00:43 PM

blacksci said:
He may also want to use aa since he cant kick his resolution up high enough for it to not matter.


Really? I play BF2 with 16xAA TRMS 16xAF @ 1440x900 and still get 100fps. :lol: 

Any new titles I play with 4xAA 16xAF or higher depending on the game.

8800gs performs better than 9600gt in Crysis by couple frames at playble resolution where it matters anyway since all these cards play anything you throw at it with fast frame rates.
May 15, 2008 9:12:53 PM

Oh hell yeah, for that price, I'd get it too.
May 15, 2008 9:16:58 PM

thsnks marvelous. that link to your 8800 gs overclock is helpful considering my currents card is in there. i am about to checkout at frys but im waiting a second longer to make sure i can get rid of some stuff to pay for it.
speaking of, this is how i started. 8500 for 140 bucks, total rip off, sold it immediatly for 90. then bought my 8600 gts for 85 and now im getting a 8800 gs gor 80. i love internet shopping.
back to topic...
i am more into FPS titles like halflife and COD4. I just got crysis and it scares me how demanding it is so i figured that this card sould help a little.
thanks for all of your help!
May 15, 2008 9:28:34 PM

In COD4 I can play everything cranked 4xAA 16xAF and still average 70fps.

Half life 2 forget about it. Try more like 100fps with the highest eye candy 16xAA 16AF.

I have a 19" LCD so I can play high settings and pull 37 fps. In very high detail I get 25fps or so with DX9 very high settings.
May 15, 2008 9:29:33 PM

Yeah that price is a great bargain, boy when Frye's clears something out, they do a good job.e
a b U Graphics card
May 15, 2008 9:30:34 PM

marvelous211 said:
Like how?

Check out how much overclock I got out of my 8800gs in my sig.

:lol:  I was thinking about the old (non G92) 8800GTS. I stand corrected.
May 15, 2008 9:33:55 PM

When i was talking high, i was thinking 1600x1200, where even if i turn on aa, i cant see the diffrence, but im glad it works well for you. Also as a side note, my p4 system could get 70 fps with a 7600gt with my above mentioned resolution, its really not that great of a game to give a comparison with, and cod4 doesnt really use that much of the gpu also.
May 15, 2008 11:06:22 PM

blacksci said:
7600gt with my above mentioned resolution, its really not that great of a game to give a comparison with, and cod4 doesnt really use that much of the gpu also.


Not with 16xAA it doesn't. My old 8600gts gave me 50fps average with 4xAA in Half Life 2. You probably had AA off.

I only mentioned COD4 because the OP asked for it. What games did you want me to compare it with? There isn't a game other than Crysis 9600gt or 8800gs have trouble with.
May 15, 2008 11:08:07 PM

Indeed i did, like i said, with it on, i dont see the diffrence at that resolution, why kick on aa, when i cant see the diffrence if it is on or off ?
May 15, 2008 11:12:12 PM

blacksci said:
Indeed i did, like i said, with it on, i dont see the diffrence at that resolution, why kick on aa, when i cant see the diffrence if it is on or off ?



8800gs performs fast as 9600gt if not faster without AA. Your original post mentioned that the OP would want higher AA settings. Your logic doesn't make sense. You say 1 thing and say another.
a b U Graphics card
May 15, 2008 11:28:50 PM

As an owner of the evga 8800GS SC and a 9600GT, I agree with Marv. The 8800GS and 9600GT trade blows depending on the game, resolution and fsaa level. At 1280x1024 it's not going to matter which you buy as both handle fsaa well at that res. The expreview link is good too...keep in mind their 384MB GS is clocked lower than the evga SC, so that would shift the results in the 8800GS favor.


edit: I missed the Fry's link. $87 shipped AR? If so then that is the one to go for!!!!!!!

May 15, 2008 11:49:21 PM

Probably because your so busy arguing, you cant see what im saying, here ill try again, at a low res like the op is talking about, hes going to want aa, to smooth out the jaggedness , so im suggesting the 9600, and in another post i said that bf2, and cod4 are not really gpu intensive games, i used to run them both on a p4, and a 7600 gt with great frame rates, and then i later said that i personally dont use aa, because i run everything at a resolution of 1600x1200, now if i ran at a lower res, then i would want aa, but since i run a higher res, i dont need it, i dont see the diffrence with it off, or cranked all the way up, in no way am i being confusing here, sorry your too busy trying to argue with me. Take a breath and reread the posts.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 1:02:17 AM

If I may interupt. :) 

I see the jaggies bigtime at 1680x1050 and 1600x1200. Not sure about 1920x1200.

The 8800GS superclock will pretty much match a stock 9600GT with 4xaa at 1280x1024.
May 16, 2008 1:09:24 AM

ok i bought the 8800 gs from fry's.
now this is going to sound extremely stupid, but, im using a 300 wat psu right now with an oerclocked 8600 gts, 7200 rpm harddrive and a core 2 duo. is this card going to puch my psu over the edge and burn it up?
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 2:10:10 AM

What is the +12v rail(s) rating for that power supply?
May 16, 2008 2:40:06 AM

Boy you just missed. For few hours newegg had dropped the price of Diamond Viper 3870 gddr4 to $129 with free shipping and $15 MIR.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 3:14:19 AM

Is that $129 before or after the $15 rebate? An $87 8800GS superclock is pretty hard to beat. The card should compete with the HD3870.
May 16, 2008 4:18:22 AM

my 12 volt rail is 19 amps. is that ok?
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 4:24:51 AM

yikes....Possibly ok, but too low for my liking. Be prepared to replace it if you have stability issues.

A simple earthwatts 380W has 27 amps on the 12v and would be fine for an 8800GS. Plus it's $30 shipped after rebate, it's quiet, and it's a quality unit made by Seasonic.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
May 16, 2008 5:25:57 AM

blacksci said:
Probably because your so busy arguing, you cant see what im saying, here ill try again, at a low res like the op is talking about, hes going to want aa, to smooth out the jaggedness , so im suggesting the 9600, and in another post i said that bf2, and cod4 are not really gpu intensive games, i used to run them both on a p4, and a 7600 gt with great frame rates, and then i later said that i personally dont use aa, because i run everything at a resolution of 1600x1200, now if i ran at a lower res, then i would want aa, but since i run a higher res, i dont need it, i dont see the diffrence with it off, or cranked all the way up, in no way am i being confusing here, sorry your too busy trying to argue with me. Take a breath and reread the posts.


Because what you said didn't make sense. That would depend on what monitor you have. Usually smaller CRT at higher resolutions, you won't notice much jaggies. If you are talking about LCD you definitely notice jaggies. It won't matter if you are running 1600x1200 or not. Jaggies are still present on LCD no matter how high of a resolution you run. Some people don't get bothered by aliasing. I don't really get bothered by AA either.

At lower resolution 8800gs doesn't have a problem keeping up with 9600gt with AA. Only when you up the resolution where 8800gs runs of vram and start texture thrashing it has a problem. Even at 1600x1200 and AA most of the games don't have a problem with 384mb of vram.
May 16, 2008 6:26:26 AM

I have ran a high end crt and a middle end lcd, they both look the same to me, wait gimme a sec, checking the g.f's monitor now, yep they look the same.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 12:51:55 PM

BTW, notice fry's sale ended and now it's $180 less the $40 rebate. Sold out anyway. http://shop2.frys.com/product/5592220

I ordered one as soon as I saw Marvelous's link yesterday. Hope they ship it as $86.92 is stinkin amazing for that card. I can easily sell it again in a build for that price, but first it will be time to see how they do in SLI vs 8800GT SLI. ;) 

Anyway, still $105 + $7 shipping from newegg.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 1:40:08 PM

For the 9600GT 512MB vs 8800GS 384MB battle, I wanted to add a link. Digitlife has a 680/1600 (XFX alpha dog speeds) 8800GS 384MB. CLoser yet to evga's 650/1900 compared to expreview. Anyway, in their testing, the 8800GS is >= 9600GT, even with fsaa.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/digest3d/index0804....
May 16, 2008 2:21:20 PM

i did get the 8800 for 86 bucks and i think i got the last one. i waited for a few hours and ordered it. then i checked after a few minutes and it said sold out. yay. i just read a review from tech power up that shows an overclocked 8800 gs beating a stock 8800 gt which makes me happy.
thanks for all of your help.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 2:36:16 PM

Good for you. Hey I hope we both gets those Fry's orders. Not to alarm you, but Fry's tends to sell more than they have, so be prepared to find out they are out of stock or back-ordered. I have had this happen a few times with them. Let's hope it's not the case this time. :( 
May 16, 2008 5:48:44 PM

pauldh said:
For the 9600GT 512MB vs 8800GS 384MB battle, I wanted to add a link. Digitlife has a 680/1600 (XFX alpha dog speeds) 8800GS 384MB. CLoser yet to evga's 650/1900 compared to expreview. Anyway, in their testing, the 8800GS is >= 9600GT, even with fsaa.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/digest3d/index0804....


Nice link. :)  Potential of these 8800gs is great. Good overclock and you can easily match a 8800gt.

I decided to do a test to show G92 bottleneck between both pixel and texel fillrate vs memory bandwidth. I lowered my core clocks by 24% which would reduce both my pixel and texel fillrate. My memory clocks lowered by 24% to emphasis on this test...

STOCK OC CLOCKS 729/1728/1040
37.55 fps


CORE REDUCTION 561/1728/1040
34.87 fps -7.2% difference


BANDWIDTH REDUCTION 729/1728/800
33.70 fps -10.1% difference



Conclusion. Memory bandwidth is bigger bottleneck than both pixel and texel fillrate combined on G92.
May 16, 2008 6:02:16 PM

I'd buy the 8800GS, and then upgrade when newer cards come out.
a b U Graphics card
May 16, 2008 6:08:29 PM

Interesting results. Was that Crysis?
May 17, 2008 3:59:29 AM

while im asking questions, is this vard on par with the rest of my system (no major bottlenecks)?
e4400
2gig ddr2 667 dual channel
SATAII 7200 rpm drive.
thanks.
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2008 4:04:50 AM

nice match for your system. That CPU is fine for an 8800GT or GTS G92 even, just depending on the res you want to play at and your budget.
May 17, 2008 3:15:01 PM

i got the backorder message from frys. should i cancel or wait?
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2008 3:19:04 PM

Yeah, same here. Depends if you are in a rush to get a card. I am going to wait it out a week anyway, but then will cancel.
May 17, 2008 3:43:11 PM

im thinking about canceling and getting the xfx from tigerdirect or newegg.
a b U Graphics card
May 17, 2008 5:03:11 PM

The XFX is not as good. I bought that one first when it was the only one available. It's a solid card, but clocked alot lower and has a noisier constant 100% fan. The evag is IMO easily worth $10-20 more than the XFX. 650/1900 vs 550/1400 clocks, and a quieter variable speed fan.

Only thing going for the XFX is it's 1/2 inch shorter.



!